A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[bobfa]

23 hours ago, bobfa said:

Observations from network “isolated” or “filtered” endpoints.

 

I am going back re-listening to multiple configurations with the new version of MoOde 6.4.  I have found that it is a lot better than the previous version in the MPD/UPnP mode.  I am now testing with Roon ROCK and Squeezelite.  This is turning out to be a worthwhile test!  More later.

 

I may be "disproving my theories from above". 😂  I love it when things keep getting better!

 

[matthias]

On 11/29/2019 at 6:02 PM, bobfa said:

As an example: I have been trying to see if I can hear any difference between say playing a track using A+ running on a Mac in the basement vs using MoOde only running on the USBridge Sig.

 

You mean UPnP streaming from Audirvana to USBridge Sig running MoOde vs MoOde only on UBS?

If yes, what was the outcome?

Thanks

 

Matt

[bobfa]

7 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

You mean UPnP streaming from Audirvana to USBridge Sig running MoOde vs MoOde only on UBS?

If yes, what was the outcome?

Thanks

 

Matt

That is one of the tests I have been doing.  I am having a lot of trouble hearing any differences on that specific test.  

[matthias]

2 hours ago, bobfa said:

That is one of the tests I have been doing.  I am having a lot of trouble hearing any differences on that specific test.  

 

I would exspect that streaming from Audirvana has the edge because MoOde has then to work as renderer only but the proof is in the listening.

 

Matt

[bobfa]

2 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

I would exspect that streaming from Audirvana has the edge because MoOde has then to work as renderer only but the proof is in the listening.

 

Matt

I think that MPD is just a handoff of traffic so it should make no difference.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Player_Daemon

 

 

[matthias]

6 minutes ago, bobfa said:

I think that MPD is just a handoff of traffic so it should make no difference.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_Player_Daemon

 

 

 

Did you compare with stored files or streaming (Qobuz?)?

 

Matt

[bobfa]

4 hours ago, matthias said:

 

Did you compare with stored files or streaming (Qobuz?)?

 

Matt

Matt,

 

I was comparing stored files.  For Tidal and Qobuz you have to use an app such as MConnect.  You cannot stream from those services inside of MoOde any more. 

 

Bob

 

[matthias]

16 minutes ago, bobfa said:

I was comparing stored files.  For Tidal and Qobuz you have to use an app such as MConnect.  You cannot stream from those services inside of MoOde any more. 

 

Bob,

thanks for clarification.

As I do streaming from Qobuz only Audirvana UPnP to MoOde UBS makes sense then.

 

Matt

[ASRMichael]

Hi, I have two box setup

 

1) Server - Running Euphony, JCAT Ethernet, Apacer RAM (thanks Nenon)

2) end point The linear solution DB7 with two LPS

 

Here’s my plan for 1 box setup

- I’ve just ordered 7 rail LPS from Dr Sean Jacobs for my server. 
- Add Innuos Phoenix

- Fidelity Audio - add OCXO clock to cpu/chipset. 
 

So this leaves me surplus to requirement TLS db7 with 2 LPS. I’ve been struggling to sell the TLS (not surprising) so was thinking how best to use this...

 

What’s people’s thoughts on using the TLS instead of NAS? I’ll need to add an M2 SSD, don’t think it supports normal SSD. 
Would it simply be my server running euphony being able to mount the TLS streamer data drive? also running Euphony, could use windows as option if required? 
 

I’ve attached TLS MB for reference
 

Presume this is doable?
 

appreciate comments?

 

[seeteeyou]

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/337859-shanti-dual-lps-5v-3a-5v-1-5a-102.html#post5987404

Quote

When designing the unit we looked at every possible noise incoming , outgoing and generated on board. We filtered , decoupled , and filtered again while having the 10 layers PCB for best EMI.

 

USbridge Sig was meant to be the best streamer on the market. As a bonus , we did not overcharge the price .

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ropiee-on-allo-usbridge-signature/79652/27

Quote

You‘ll enjoy the USBridge Sig! I‘ve got mine, along with the Shanti LPS. The combo beats my Aurender N100H hands down (this unit costs 3,000 €!)! In my system, Roon sounds very sweet with this unit!

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ropiee-on-allo-usbridge-signature/79652/48

Quote

I can confirm Paul_Jeno’s comment. I also have the USBridge Sig + LPS with a Gustard U16 DDC. It now replaces a $4k streamer… so much so I have put these with more parts and built a streamer around it inside a slick ali case with screen as a single unit. Looking at a OXCO clock and this will play with the big brands.

 

Pretty funny to see how they're beaten by another $250 streamer while both Bob and Greg were writing about that as well

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/reviews/allo-usbridge-sig-review-r858/

http://www.tirnahifi.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=4541&p=89933#p89933

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/57754-finding-that-goldilocks-moment/

 

And then you just need a single 5V/3A rail so that adding something like Farad Super3 still wouldn't break the bank.

 

Getting a second unit and it's gonna work as an audiophile NAS without any switching regulators whatsoever, put BubbleUPnP Server on that and it's giving us OpenHome instead of UPnP

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/56228-open-home-vs-upnp/

 

Keep an eye on GentooPlayer since even ramroot could be supported

 

https://github.com/antonellocaroli

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/57751-article-allo-usbridge-sig-review/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-1007706

https://www.nexthardware.com/forum/pc-top-software/90075-gentooplayer-immagini-x86_64-raspberry-pi-3b-3b-allo-sparkyusbbridge-beaglebone-black-botic-driver.html

[bobfa]

59 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/337859-shanti-dual-lps-5v-3a-5v-1-5a-102.html#post5987404

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ropiee-on-allo-usbridge-signature/79652/27

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ropiee-on-allo-usbridge-signature/79652/48

 

Pretty funny to see how they're beaten by another $250 streamer while both Bob and Greg were writing about that as well

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/reviews/allo-usbridge-sig-review-r858/

http://www.tirnahifi.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=4541&p=89933#p89933

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/57754-finding-that-goldilocks-moment/

 

And then you just need a single 5V/3A rail so that adding something like Farad Super3 still wouldn't break the bank.

 

Getting a second unit and it's gonna work as an audiophile NAS without any switching regulators whatsoever, put BubbleUPnP Server on that and it's giving us OpenHome instead of UPnP

 

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/56228-open-home-vs-upnp/

 

Keep an eye on GentooPlayer since even ramroot could be supported

 

https://github.com/antonellocaroli

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/57751-article-allo-usbridge-sig-review/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-1007706

https://www.nexthardware.com/forum/

 

-top-software/90075-gentooplayer-immagini-x86_64-raspberry-pi-3b-3b-allo-sparkyusbbridge-beaglebone-black-botic-driver.html

I have been running for a few days with the new MoOde 6.4 as a Squeezelite renderer.  I have had a couple of glitches where music stopped.  Two new software releases in one week,  GAAK!  I am very happy with what MoOde 6.4 did to sound quality.  Roon 1.7 may have improved things on that also.  Seems to round out the edge I was getting on UPnP.  A lot more listening to do.  

 

Remember that the Shanti Power Supply is an interesting bargain.  I have a second USB-Sig and Shanti on the way for my headphone listening.

 

 

[Nenon]

I just tried the SR orange fuses on my DAC and computer power supply, and I quite liked them. Thought I would share. 

[Middy]

I tried the red/ black and converted me...but the cost.... I'd need £900 in oranges but I am the one being Squeezed.... The wife From Del monte says ...No..

[auricgoldfinger]

1 hour ago, Middy said:

I tried the red/ black and converted me...but the cost.... I'd need £900 in oranges but I am the one being Squeezed.... The wife From Del monte says ...No..

 

The orange is way better though. 

[Middy]

You met the wife then...

[elan120]

11 hours ago, Nenon said:

I just tried the SR orange fuses on my DAC and computer power supply, and I quite liked them. Thought I would share. 

I wonder if their UEF Blue Power Cable having similar effect, since the DAC I have doesn't have fuse so no way to try out SR fuses.

[auricgoldfinger]

12 minutes ago, elan120 said:

I wonder if their UEF Blue Power Cable having similar effect, since the DAC I have doesn't have fuse so no way to try out SR fuses.

 

The UEF blue power cable is an excellent cable.  In my opinion, it punches above its weight.  However, based on my experience, I don't think they have as much influence on the sound as a good fuse.

[Hardinge]

@romaz et al, i’m about to build a fanless case music computer as per the latest summaries on the intro post. I need it to be an all in one box that i can take to work each day (leaving LPS’s at work and home so only the computer is transported). I need internal library storage to the tune of 6tb though. I had been assuming 2x 4tb SSDs would do the trick but seeing talk that they could be noisy. Considering playback is via RAM though would a cheaper spinning drive have any worse SQ when all considered? 

[austinpop]

Apacer Industrial non-ECC DIMM update

 

I had acquired 2x 4GB Apacer D11.2318FS.04 DDR4 DIMMs from @Nenon's awesome group buy, but had not had a chance to test it out until today.

 

Well - color me impressed. This replaced a HyperX Fury 8GB DIMM, and I had just listened to a test track before powering down the server and swapping DIMMs. Forget burn-in - the improvement is evident in the first note. There is a weight and richness to the music that just wasn't there before. Wow. I'm assuming this only gets better.

 

The only bummer for me is I discovered my mobo has a bum DIMM 'B' slot, which Roy had discovered back when he built the server for himself. I will try a hail mary with a can of compressed air tomorrow, but chances are I will need to just buy an 8GB DIMM, and make do with a single channel.

 

If I do, my 2x 4GB DIMMs will be available to anyone who wants to buy them. Drop me a PM if you're interested and I'll let you know. Remember these are not SODIMMs for NUCs, but full-sized DDR4 DIMMs.

[Chopin75]

3 hours ago, Hardinge said:

@romaz et al, i’m about to build a fanless case music computer as per the latest summaries on the intro post. I need it to be an all in one box that i can take to work each day (leaving LPS’s at work and home so only the computer is transported). I need internal library storage to the tune of 6tb though. I had been assuming 2x 4tb SSDs would do the trick but seeing talk that they could be noisy. Considering playback is via RAM though would a cheaper spinning drive have any worse SQ when all considered? 

Hmm, interesting project - portable huh. Do you want convenience vs max performance ?  I suppose you want something like the NUC (though I am not familiar with it's size), so I can't help you with the hardware. My HDPlex is too bulky but you can look at the smaller model they have. There are a bunch of other small quiet PC you can choose. You don't want a fan!.   

 

I recomend  the software Euphony as single box solution, presumably you are not connecting this with many boxes and bridges. It is easy use, no need to fuss around much. (Library management is terrible, though).

You can use a 2.5' SATA drive and store 4 TB of music in same drive as the euphony OS, run RAmroot and hopefully not too noisy (SATA is supposedly noisier and slower than e.g the Optane M2 which numerous use here).

Or I suppose you can use M2 but the memory is not as big and so you need to store music on another drive. E.g to use other SATA drive for music storage attached to the MB but that would create more noise. You would need some SATA drive filter and nice data cable etc. not sure if that is cost effective. But ff you don't mind using external drive (any drive), then just stick the external drive, load the music into the Ecache and then detach the external drive. This way you can use M2 drive to store the euphony, though there won't be lot of cache memory. But you have no noise at all from a large storage drive. 

 

Then you would also need some nice internal cables for the PC, e.g get from Ghentaudio or DIY yourself. 

And some nice Apacer RAM

 

Depending on your budget, you may want a nice USB bridge in it with good good internal clock (check out pink faun) This way you may not need any galvanic isolation devices. (though you may still need if your office has dirty AC current, but again depends on your LPS)

Intona may be a good and easy to carry single galvanic isolation device. 

 

Hope this helps. 

[Bricki]

4 hours ago, austinpop said:

Apacer Industrial non-ECC DIMM update

 

Well - color me impressed. This replaced a HyperX Fury 8GB DIMM, and I had just listened to a test track before powering down the server and swapping DIMMs. Forget burn-in - the improvement is evident in the first note. There is a weight and richness to the music that just wasn't there before. Wow. I'm assuming this only gets better.

Yes, I found that things improved further and settled down after a week or so. 👍

[Hardinge]

9 hours ago, Chopin75 said:

Hmm, interesting project - portable huh. Do you want convenience vs max performance ?  I suppose you want something like the NUC (though I am not familiar with it's size), so I can't help you with the hardware. My HDPlex is too bulky but you can look at the smaller model they have. There are a bunch of other small quiet PC you can choose. You don't want a fan!.   

 

I recomend  the software Euphony as single box solution, presumably you are not connecting this with many boxes and bridges. It is easy use, no need to fuss around much. (Library management is terrible, though).

You can use a 2.5' SATA drive and store 4 TB of music in same drive as the euphony OS, run RAmroot and hopefully not too noisy (SATA is supposedly noisier and slower than e.g the Optane M2 which numerous use here).

Or I suppose you can use M2 but the memory is not as big and so you need to store music on another drive. E.g to use other SATA drive for music storage attached to the MB but that would create more noise. You would need some SATA drive filter and nice data cable etc. not sure if that is cost effective. But ff you don't mind using external drive (any drive), then just stick the external drive, load the music into the Ecache and then detach the external drive. This way you can use M2 drive to store the euphony, though there won't be lot of cache memory. But you have no noise at all from a large storage drive. 

 

Then you would also need some nice internal cables for the PC, e.g get from Ghentaudio or DIY yourself. 

And some nice Apacer RAM

 

Depending on your budget, you may want a nice USB bridge in it with good good internal clock (check out pink faun) This way you may not need any galvanic isolation devices. (though you may still need if your office has dirty AC current, but again depends on your LPS)

Intona may be a good and easy to carry single galvanic isolation device. 

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Thanks @Chopin75 yes portable just for the computer (so server and drives (ideally in one box). Then an HDPlex at home and one at work. 

Good tips there for the Apacer and I had been looking at SotM's USB card but Pink Faun looks good too. 

 

Not sure i understand the ecache suggestion as the ecache would need to be 6tb??

 

Thanks

[Chopin75]

1 hour ago, Hardinge said:

 

Thanks @Chopin75 yes portable just for the computer (so server and drives (ideally in one box). Then an HDPlex at home and one at work. 

Good tips there for the Apacer and I had been looking at SotM's USB card but Pink Faun looks good too. 

 

Not sure i understand the ecache suggestion as the ecache would need to be 6tb??

 

Thanks

Sorry ecache is a way in the

Euphony program to allow u to load a few albums from another storage drive onto the internal hard drive and play then u can play the music after detaching the storage drive. This avoids the need to

have an external storage drive attached all the time. But space is limited depending on how big the internal hard drive is. U can also load remotely via file manager. Or i think via a network drive. So basically if u have say 4-6 TB of music u don’t have to put all into the internal drive

[Hardinge]

7 hours ago, Chopin75 said:

Sorry ecache is a way in the

Euphony program to allow u to load a few albums from another storage drive onto the internal hard drive and play then u can play the music after detaching the storage drive. This avoids the need to

have an external storage drive attached all the time. But space is limited depending on how big the internal hard drive is. U can also load remotely via file manager. Or i think via a network drive. So basically if u have say 4-6 TB of music u don’t have to put all into the internal drive

Ah ok gotcha. Yes sounds like a good option thanks. 

 

 

[seeteeyou]

Thanks @hols and @CKKeung for testing Cybershaft flagship OP21A with ER × ER as well as fully-loaded sNH-10G × sNH-10G

 

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/sotm-snh-10g-network-switches-x2-the-new-king-of-usb-network-gadget-setup.27758/page-12

 

Apparently the cable between NAS and the first switch still mattered, even if both switches were disciplined by OP21A.