So I've had an EtherRegen in rack for 2 weeks...

[plissken]

Here's my setup:

 

Playback Machine:

Dell Optiplex with Intel Dual Port Server NIC (Pro 1000), Win7 Pro X64, Kingston SSD, 4GB RAM. Using Intel's ANS to run both ports in a static LAG (so not using LACP negotiation). The team is running VLAN 2 tagged.

 

JRiver 26 set @ defaults

 

Port 1 goes to the B side EtherRegen and the other side goes to port 23 on my Aruba 2530

 

Port 2 goes direct to port 24 on the Aruba

 

On the Aruba: trunk 23-24 trk1 trunk (at the end it's either trunk (on) or LACP (negotiated) ) so two physical cables but seen at layer 2 MAC as a single connection.

 

File Server:

HP Laptop connected to port 1 on the 2540. Port one is in VLAN 2 also. Win10 Pro X64. So on the Aruba it's 'VLAN 2 untagged 1'. This places the port in VLAN 2. The Cisco equivalent is 'Switchport mode Access' then 'Switchport access vlan 2'.

 

DAC:

Emotiva DC-1

 

Transducers:

Audio Technica ATH-M50X and AKG 701's

 

Music:

http://www.2l.no/hires/

 

I simply used the EtherRegen for the first week. No veils lifted, no more slam, no more air around the highs.  During this 2nd week while queuing up and letting tracks play I started to use the static LAG that I built.

 

I'm able to pull either cable and have zero drops in ping. So the LAG is working as intended. There are also zero drops in music and if I pull both connections for a few seconds. For even modern streamers this could mean a minute or more of buffered playback. For JRiver I can option the entire track be buffered. Even at 11MB/s that the EtherRegen handicaps me at 24/192 tracks will load in 10-15 seconds on average.

 

It all sounded great regardless.

 

My 1st issue is that streamers and computers buffer data, we aren't playing in real-time off the Ethernet port. When I pull both cables I'm able to still experience playback. Using the 'Leakage Currents' argument that is when the audio should have taken an appreciable, and readily apparent, uptick in quality.

 

My 2nd issue is that GBe Ethernet gives us a 1000% improvement in transfer speeds therefore reducing any theoretical exposure to gremlins and we get 802.3az.

 

My 3rd issue, and this is mostly for people with DIY computer head end and nodes, is that for the money I can go and get an MikroTik switch for $240 with eight 10GBe SFP+ ports , 10GBe SR LC/LC SFP+'s for $19 a piece, MM OM4 cabling, and 10GBe PCI-E SFP+ NICs for about the same $640. The fiber piece also takes care of any current leakage and I get a modern, feature rich switch in the process.

 

 

 

 

 

[plissken]

Here is a quick video going through the config and showing play back while I'm removing one cable or the other and then finally both.

 

What is the EtherRegen doing when the music is playing but no cables are plugged in?

[mansr]

How does it perform as a switch? Throughput, latency, packet loss, etc.

[plissken]

4 hours ago, mansr said:

How does it perform as a switch? Throughput, latency, packet loss, etc.

 

I'll go into port counters on the switch and post a screen shot.

 

Throughput was typical of a 100Mbit connection. Pings where good and sub 1ms. For the money I think it's a terrible value proposition.

 

 

[mansr]

3 minutes ago, plissken said:

Throughput was typical of a 100Mbit connection.

What about between the gigabit ports?

 

3 minutes ago, plissken said:

Pings where good and sub 1ms.

They'd better be. Between my machines, I get around 0.2 ms, and very little of that is due to switches. Going through one or two makes no measurable difference.

 

3 minutes ago, plissken said:

For the money I think it's a terrible value proposition.

We already knew that.

[plissken]

1 minute ago, mansr said:

What about between the gigabit ports?

 

I didn't even bother to test since that isn't the problem it's positioned to solve. I'll take a look.

 

[Blackmorec]

8 minutes ago, plissken said:

 

Here is a quick video of everything in action. I'll go into port counters on the switch and post a screen shot.

 

Throughput was typical of a 100Mbit connection. Pings where good and sub 1ms. For the money I think it's a terrible value proposition.

 

 

Use your money back guarantee. Nothing won, nothing lost. 😉

[plissken]

2 minutes ago, mansr said:

We already knew that.

 

With so many subjectivists asking "Did you try it" and pointing out there is a 30 day MBG I wanted to give it a shot even though it flies in the face of logic and buffered systems.

 

 

[plissken]

Just now, Blackmorec said:

Use your money back guarantee. Nothing won, nothing lost. 😉

 

I think an additional data point and demonstration is a positive. And yes I'll be returning the unit.

[plissken]

 

 

[plissken]

Try watching the video Sandy and answering the question of what happens to the audio when both cables are pulled and by some magic the audio still plays.

[wgscott]

1 hour ago, plissken said:

Try watching the video Sandy and answering the question of what happens to the audio when both cables are pulled and by some magic the audio still plays.

 

Maybe the power supply noise is stored in the buffer.

[Ralf11]

will it work without audiophile cables?

[emcdade]

How did you control for sighted bias against the Etherregen?

 

EDIT:  actually who gives a crap, I'm not buying one of these either.  I can't think of anything less fun in the audiophile hobby than networking gear.

[plissken]

6 hours ago, emcdade said:

How did you control for sighted bias against the Etherregen?

 

I didn't. My setup is showing that you don't play music off the cable. You play it out of RAM, or possibly the hard drive if the block of RAM holding music data gets written to the swap file.

[pkane2001]

2 minutes ago, plissken said:

 

I didn't. My setup is showing that you don't play music off the cable. You play it out of RAM, or possibly the hard drive if the block of RAM holding music data gets written to the swap file.

 

So the conclusion I draw is that you need specialized RAM and  better hard drive, powered by an LPS, using audiophile DC cables and a beeswax fuse. And, of course, a specialty power cord. Is that your conclusion as well?

 

[tapatrick]

On 1/26/2020 at 3:25 PM, mansr said:

We already knew that.

we already knew that you knew that....

[m3lraaHnevetS]

On 1/26/2020 at 2:53 AM, plissken said:

It all sounded great regardless.

I guess what you are saying is that using a 500 USD DAC and a 130 USD headphone you can not hear the benefit of the etherregen, right?

So people in the same position as you might consider spending their money on a better DAC and or headphone, before getting an Etherregen correct?

Interesting, thanks for the data point.

[plissken]

15 minutes ago, m3lraaHnevetS said:

I guess what you are saying is that using a 500 USD DAC and a 130 USD headphone you can not hear the benefit of the etherregen, right?

So people in the same position as you might consider spending their money on a better DAC and or headphone, before getting an Etherregen correct?

Interesting, thanks for the data point.

 

"I guess what you are saying is that using a 500 USD DAC and a 130 USD headphone"

The ATH-M50X are $149, the AKG 701's were $449.

 

I picked up the Emotiva specifically because the headphone amp is killer and it can also act as a multi source pre-amp.

 

So as far as Headphone listening it's right up there with other high fidelity setups. Now if your personal preference isn't for the AKG's that's fine. And if it isn't for the DC-1 headphone amp that's fine also. You're welcome to that. But empirically they are both top shelf components.

 

"So people in the same position as you might consider spending their money on a better DAC and or headphone, before getting an Etherregen correct?"

 

What position would that be? Not being gullible? You care to place a wager using your own system? I can setup in your system what what I showed in the video and I can change cables out at any given moment. You'll be blind to that however. I'll provide the computer end point and you provide the USB cable and everything downstream of it.

 

I'm sure the above will shut you up.

 

I saw in your signature that you are using Paradigm S8's. I wouldn't go calling out other peoples setups with those speakers as my reference.

 

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

Thanks for posting this @plissken. Different points of view are great for people to read.

[plissken]

11 hours ago, wgscott said:

 

Maybe the power supply noise is stored in the buffer.

 

I've actually seen a 'fast transient' noise argument used. I honestly had a hard time not laughing.

 

 

Kind of scary.

[charlesphoto]

It seems to me that expectation bias that objectivists so bemoan can perhaps work both ways - maybe some don't want to hear improvements just so they can prove a point. I'm not saying the OP is lying, because we all hear differently in our different systems and ears/brains, but it should be recognized bias can be both positive and negative. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 minutes ago, charlesphoto said:

It seems to me that expectation bias that objectivists so bemoan can perhaps work both ways - maybe some don't want to hear improvements just so they can prove a point. I'm not saying the OP is lying, because we all hear differently in our different systems and ears/brains, but it should be recognized bias can be both positive and negative. 

This is absolutely true. 

[PYP]

Just my observation from using the eR since mid-November.  It took at least a month to settle in.  I'm not saying it didn't do anything during that time, it actually degraded the sound of my setup for much of that time (cycling bad to good, but steadily improving the sound).  I've had similar experiences with new DACs. 

 

My own experience is using 5e in-wall copper ethernet (that is, not fiber).  It would have been interesting (to me), if I had used something like FMCs before trying the eR.  The only think I tried before getting the eR was a passive filter and a different patch cable, both positive.  

[Ralf11]

2 hours ago, charlesphoto said:

It seems to me that expectation bias that objectivists so bemoan can perhaps work both ways - maybe some don't want to hear improvements just so they can prove a point. I'm not saying the OP is lying, because we all hear differently in our different systems and ears/brains, but it should be recognized bias can be both positive and negative. 

 

This is absolutely not reflected in the scientific literature.

 

It -could- be true but so can many things.

 

How about a blind test with very expensive gear?  Any volunteers?