MQA is Vaporware

[Jud]

54 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

And @Jud deserves a BIG shout out for putting that together! 👍

 

53 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Absolutely!

 

Thanks folks, but @mansr in particular and @Miska did all the heavy lifting.

[Samuel T Cogley]

21 minutes ago, Jud said:

 

 

Thanks folks, but @mansr in particular and @Miska did all the heavy lifting.

 

Yes, Jud, but (no disrespect to @mansr or @Miska) you made it accessible to many more people, increasing the signal to noise ratio in the thread! 

[Tintinabulum]

46 minutes ago, Paul R said:

this wonderful place dragged down with it

 

[rando]

1 hour ago, crenca said:

What would a mature discussion past the technical stage look like? 

 

Dignified distress?

 

I'm afraid it would either resemble letting all the monkeys out of their cage until they settle down. Or such an airtight box three people here would be inside expounding at length while everyone else tried their hand at reading lips and body language.  

 

If you want to draft a formal body of words repelling MQA. You should separate those looking for a fight from those acting as the new guard. Let them lock the leading lights in a room and stand over it until the amount of bloodshed has grown unbearable () or a reasonable and factual assemblage of your complaint has been assembled which all present can put their name to.  Basically what I said yesterday.  

[MikeyFresh]

50 minutes ago, Paul R said:

You certainly did.

 

Indeed I did, however an isolated post here or there doesn't represent an endemic malady afflicting this thread on the whole.

 

51 minutes ago, Paul R said:

Not if you want a thread that may actually influence people to at least think about the facts and draw sane judgements. 

 

With respect, that's a bridge too far. The very thing you describe has certainly already been accomplished here, please don't try to diminish that in any way.

[mansr]

9 minutes ago, rando said:

Basically what I said yesterday.

If only it were possible to somehow discern what meaning your verbiage is intended to convey.

[Axial]

I've read parts of this thread. It's nice ... to be free of listening to what we like, how we like, the source we like, the people with who we like. 

 

Everyone seems to agree, that's nice, even when they don't always. 

 

Also, I would like to thank my best half, my family, my children, grandchildren, Mom, RIP Dad, my neighbors, and thank you dear lord for the bright shining light every day. 

 

You guys are a good bunch of troopers and god bless you all. 

 

Too much MQA music not enough time. 

[mansr]

I didn't intend to invite a competition.

[crenca]

LOL!  I spit out my hotdog on that one...God bless my 3rd cousins.....BAAHHAAAA!

[crenca]

Seriously, would @Jud (and in my opinion @mansrand @Miskarecent summaries as well)be willing to have their posts copied into "MQA technically summarized" thread?  I believe @The Computer Audiophilewill have to enable the OP moderation as I can see astroturfers and speculators derailing things quickly.  I can do it, but I am (quite willingly) tainted with partisanship to a high degree.  That said the OP should be someone who knows the difference between a technical question and speculation, trolling, moral/civility objections, business/market arguments, etc. etc.

[John Dyson]

1 hour ago, Tintinabulum said:

 

Somewhere I saw a post about anti-MQA cabal.  Actually, there isn't really anyone who is anti-MQA or HATES anything.  it is more of an issue that those who are technically competent know what the MQA thing is going to lead to if it is universally adopted.  The general quality of the audio signal will be poorer, and there will be zero sense of owning a copy of a piece of music.  Everything will tend to be transient -- not just MQA alone, but the power that MQA takes away from the userbase.

Any time a large corporation that gains excessive control, even with good intents initially (e.g. Google), will abuse their power in name of profits.  I am a true capitalist -- to the nth degree, but also realize that capitalism has to be moderated by the rule-of-law, and common decency.  The user base is just not strong enough to hold back the power of those who are focusing on pure profit (not really considering anything artistic or enjoyable).

MQA represents a power-grab, and a decrease in general quality.  The mumbo-jumbo being espoused by the advocacy should be considered either specious or manipulative.  I am NOT claiming that everything that they espouse is wrong, but rather it is done with a purpose that is NOT necessarily in the interest of the user base.

I love new technology, but adoption of technology needs to be moderated, or we get things like atom bombs in the hands of madmen (NK, for example.)  MQA and its ilk is the smaller scale, audio oriented analogy to an atom bomb - and unrestrained control of such technology kind of reminds me of something very dangerous.

 

John

 

[Jud]

35 minutes ago, crenca said:

Seriously, would @Jud (and in my opinion @mansrand @Miskarecent summaries as well)be willing to have their posts copied into "MQA technically summarized" thread?  I believe @The Computer Audiophilewill have to enable the OP moderation as I can see astroturfers and speculators derailing things quickly.  I can do it, but I am (quite willingly) tainted with partisanship to a high degree.  That said the OP should be someone who knows the difference between a technical question and speculation, trolling, moral/civility objections, business/market arguments, etc. etc.

 

Sure.

 

Edit: Oh BTW, I've got nothing like the time needed to moderate such a thread, so I'm not volunteering for that.

[christopher3393]

[KeenObserver]

The whole problem with this MQA mess is that the whole cycle of BS just starts over again.  MQA has not been deterred in trying to implement their control over the music industry.  If left unanswered,  will MQA implement their plan?

MQA will ultimately levy a major "tax" on all aspects of the music industry which will in the end be paid for by the music consumer.  The music consumer gets nothing for his money except a crippled music system and DRM.  The music consumer gets screwed.  Does the music consumer lay down and take it?  Does MQA's BS go unanswered?

There are knowledgeable people that understand what MQA is trying to do.  There are many more that believe and espouse the MQA BS.

[Ralf11]

the whole cycle of BS just starting over again is us being trapped on the wheel of samsara

 

 

[Samuel T Cogley]

To me, the argument is stupid simple:

 

• Tidal has lossy MQA
• Qobuz has (mostly) the same lossless material that has not been adulterated by MQA

Wouldn't pretty much everyone pick the lossless choice?

[daverich4]

2 hours ago, crenca said:

Seriously, would @Jud (and in my opinion @mansrand @Miskarecent summaries as well)be willing to have their posts copied into "MQA technically summarized" thread?  I believe @The Computer Audiophilewill have to enable the OP moderation as I can see astroturfers and speculators derailing things quickly.  I can do it, but I am (quite willingly) tainted with partisanship to a high degree.  That said the OP should be someone who knows the difference between a technical question and speculation, trolling, moral/civility objections, business/market arguments, etc. etc.

 

I realize this is off-topic but you frequently use the term “astroturfer”. Can you tell me who or what that means? I’d like to get on the same page but this is the only place I’ve ever run across that. 

[mansr]

1 minute ago, daverich4 said:

I realize this is off-topic but you frequently use the term “astroturfer”. Can you tell me who or what that means? I’d like to get on the same page but this is the only place I’ve ever run across that. 

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/astroturfing

"The deceptive practice of presenting an orchestrated marketing or public relations campaign in the guise of unsolicited comments from members of the public."

[Samuel T Cogley]

1 minute ago, daverich4 said:

 

I realize this is off-topic but you frequently use the term “astroturfer”. Can you tell me who or what that means? I’d like to get on the same page but this is the only place I’ve ever run across that. 

 

Astroturfing

 

Quote

Astroturfing is the practice of masking the sponsors of a message or organization (e.g., political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from and is supported by grassroots participants. It is a practice intended to give the statements or organizations credibility by withholding information about the source's financial connection. The term astroturfing is derived from AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to resemble natural grass, as a play on the word "grassroots". The implication behind the use of the term is that instead of a "true" or "natural" grassroots effort behind the activity in question, there is a "fake" or "artificial" appearance of support.

 

[daverich4]

2 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

Astroturfing

 

 

 

Thanks, makes sense why Crenca uses it so frequently. 

[Shadders]

Hi,

I know this may be regressing, but, has MQA Ltd or the supporting Hifi press ever presented evidence of ringing in an audio file ? (by which i mean CD's)

 

It has been claimed that the ringing of a filter causes blur, and everyone seems to have accepted this as fact, when those making these claims have never provided proof.

 

Are the AES and Hifi press so lame in capability, that they believe everything that they are told ???, where the Hifi press repeat it as fact, and seem to not understand what they are saying.

 

Surely the MQA Ltd website would have real world examples that people could, if they have the relevant CD, analyse and confirm the ringing. Why is this basic fact or prove, never been presented ?

 

Regards,

Shadders.

[crenca]

24 minutes ago, daverich4 said:

 

Thanks, makes sense why Crenca uses it so frequently. 

 

The Roon forums even more than this one clued us in to how much of this was (and still is, though the volume seems lower lately) going on.  When seemingly half of posters suddenly are "very excited" about a product or have uniform "birth of a new world" experiences, then it is all probably too good (for said product) to be true.  Contrast those alleged experiences with the known members here who, though a handful of which genuinely like the sound of MQA most of which report "meh" experiences, and it all become too obvious even before the full technical picture was known...

[Ishmael Slapowitz]

Got a bit a chuckle out of this post I found on Twittering Machines:

 

"I didn’t die, the MQA police did not knock down the barn door and steal all of my non-MQA music, I didn’t have to pay anyone anything more than I was paying them before, and, this may be irrelevant to some people who spend a lot of time on hifi forums talking about MQA, the music I listened to sounded damn good. How good? Damn good. For those getting all uncomfortable with that fact, I’ll ease your mind by letting you know this was not a test."

 

https://twitteringmachines.com/news-tidal-mqa-iphone-24-96/

[Shadders]

24 minutes ago, Ishmael Slapowitz said:

Got a bit a chuckle out of this post I found on Twittering Machines:

 

"I didn’t die, the MQA police did not knock down the barn door and steal all of my non-MQA music, I didn’t have to pay anyone anything more than I was paying them before, and, this may be irrelevant to some people who spend a lot of time on hifi forums talking about MQA, the music I listened to sounded damn good. How good? Damn good. For those getting all uncomfortable with that fact, I’ll ease your mind by letting you know this was not a test."

 

https://twitteringmachines.com/news-tidal-mqa-iphone-24-96/

Hi,

I saw that the author of the article is known on this site. Something, something, mother.....

 

Anyway - is that your real name ??? or a pseudonym ?? or an anagram ???

 

Regards,

Shadders.

[Jud]

37 minutes ago, Shadders said:

Anyway - is that your real name ??? or a pseudonym ?? or an anagram ???

 

It's after the famous first line of Moby Dick: "Call me Slapowitz."