Unpopular opinion... I don't think Eric Clapton is very great.

[audiobomber]

1 minute ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

Ok, but this is subjective...

Eminence is not subjective. 

[Samuel T Cogley]

Just now, audiobomber said:

Eminence is not subjective. 

 

So by extension, neither is your opinion?  Didn't Pete Townsend sing that eminence is a "put-on"? 🙂

[audiobomber]

Clapton is great (eminent) because he is almost certainly the best-known guitar player in the world. That is not subjective.

[Foggie]

On 3/4/2021 at 10:12 AM, AudioDoctor said:

Like alcohol, drugs can be a truth serum of sorts when the person loses the filter they normally have in place, you get to see the truth.

Hmm, I think going to try this method for testing cables😉

[AudioDoctor]

4 hours ago, audiobomber said:

Clapton is great (eminent) because he is almost certainly the best-known guitar player in the world. That is not subjective.

So, you’re saying Britney Spears is also a great musician?

[audiobomber]

42 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

So, you’re saying Britney Spears is also a great musician?

She's great at marketing and wiggling.

[ShawnC]

50 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

So, you’re saying Britney Spears is also a great musician?

If she’s still selling albums and selling out venues into her late 50s 60s and 70s she might be. 

[AudioDoctor]

55 minutes ago, audiobomber said:

She's great at marketing and wiggling.

 

But by your own criteria, she is also a great musician because she is well known...

[audiobomber]

1 hour ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

But by your own criteria, she is also a great musician because she is well known...

You would have a point if fame were the only reason I believe Clapton is great... but it's not. I highlighted eminence in the definition of "great" because it is not subjective. He's been a star for almost sixty years, collaborated on some the greatest blues and rock albums ever recorded, plays guitar with the best, sings, composes and innovates, has millions of fans around the globe. There isn't a "best guitar player" list anywhere that doesn't have him at or near the top. He's inspired legions of guitarists and increased the popularity of blues music. I have to wonder if you've even heard much Clapton.

 

Unpopular opinion... I don't think Eric Clapton is very great.

So, you know your opinion is unpopular, which means you realize that most people disagree. Even including the word "very" means you know he's great, you just don't think he's very great. Having a reputation as the greatest guitarist is bound to elicit negativity among some. I don't think he's the greatest, if such a thing even makes sense, but to deny he's a great guitarist and artist is just trolling.

[AudioDoctor]

41 minutes ago, audiobomber said:

You would have a point if fame were the only reason I believe Clapton is great... but it's not. I highlighted eminence in the definition of "great" because it is not subjective. He's been a star for almost sixty years, collaborated on some the greatest blues and rock albums ever recorded, plays guitar with the best, sings, composes and innovates, has millions of fans around the globe. There isn't a "best guitar player" list anywhere that doesn't have him at or near the top. He's inspired legions of guitarists and increased the popularity of blues music. I have to wonder if you've even heard much Clapton.

 

Unpopular opinion... I don't think Eric Clapton is very great.

So, you know your opinion is unpopular, which means you realize that most people disagree. Even including the word "very" means you know he's great, you just don't think he's very great. Having a reputation as the greatest guitarist is bound to elicit negativity among some. I don't think he's the greatest, if such a thing even makes sense, but to deny he's a great guitarist and artist is just trolling.

 

So Britney isnt a great musician only because she's younger?

 

 

[AudioDoctor]

I have heard a lot of Clapton, and yet I am unimpressed...

 

In fact, if you consider the fact that so many people rushed out to sound like Clapton, he is directly responsible for the boring sameness in guitar players these days...

[ShawnC]

17 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

I have heard a lot of Clapton, and yet I am unimpressed...

 

In fact, if you consider the fact that so many people rushed out to sound like Clapton, he is directly responsible for the boring sameness in guitar players these days...

The only problem then with this thread is just change the name of the artist and or genre of music and there we go.  I don't think Frank Sinatra is very great because, I don't think Louis Armstrong is very good, and here we go.  Obviously this was meant to get reactions form both sides of the court.  I don't think anyone is trying to change anyone else's opinions but maybe just trying to enlightening them as to why others think they were or are great, not greatest. 

 

It's actually an interesting title to a column that someone could start.  Explain why someone maybe considered great in other people's eyes.  Even Britney Spears can be included in this, even though most of us might consider her music bubble gum and insignificant.  That's why we're the in 1% audiophile club.

[AudioDoctor]

2 minutes ago, ShawnC said:

The only problem then with this thread is just change the name of the artist and or genre of music and there we go.  I don't think Frank Sinatra is very great because, I don't think Louis Armstrong is very good, and here we go.  Obviously this was meant to get reactions form both sides of the court.  I don't think anyone is trying to change anyone else's opinions but maybe just trying to enlightening them as to why others think they were or are great, not greatest. 

 

It's actually an interesting title to a column that someone could start.  Explain why someone maybe considered great in other people's eyes.  Even Britney Spears can be included in this, even though most of us might consider her music bubble gum and insignificant.  That's why we're the in 1% audiophile club.

 

I don't think very many here would disagree if I had stated that I didn't think Britney was very great...

 

My only point was, so many fawn over Clapton and he's just meh IMO.

[lucretius]

3 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

But by your own criteria, she is also a great musician because she is well known...

 I always considered Britney more of a performer than a musician, not that there's anything wrong with that.

[AudioDoctor]

Just now, lucretius said:

 I always considered Britney more of a performer than a musician, not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

 i agree, but i was trying to make a point .

[RHSims]

The problem with this thread is you have no point to make. It is entirely, a gigantic troll. Is the goal to get the longest thread on AS?

 

You find EC to be meh. So what? As at least one one other poster mentioned this title could apply to any musician/band be it rock, jazz or classical. The Beatles aren’t very great, Ringo isn’t very great, Bill Wyman isn’t very great, Bob Dylan can’t sing, Coltrane should never have played soprano sax, blah blah blah.
 

Your opinion is based on your opinion. There is no analysis or reasoned argument, just slagging boomers, middle America, EC, and all the guitarists and great blues songs that EC seemed to ruin somehow. No doubt your taste is impeccable, but it is your taste, however poorly articulated.

 

Obviously no one can change your mind based on the thread title. So you are just encouraging those that enjoy EC and those that find your brush a bit broad to respond, but to what end? Essentially, responses have to prove the negative, which is impossible. 

I know I would be much more interested in your posts if they expanded on what I already know, rather than criticizing someone who has been around for 50+ years.  For example, what guitarists do you think are worthy of more commercial success/attention today and why? Educate me.
 

I am not a huge fan of EC, but I find his work in the 60’s and very early 70’s hard to dismiss as meh. Seconding previous posts, if you have listened to Layla Derek and the Dominos album Layla and are not moved, well, please tell us what makes the grade.

 

 

[audiobomber]

14 minutes ago, RHSims said:

Seconding previous posts, if you have listened to Layla Derek and the Dominos album Layla and are not moved, well, please tell us what makes the grade.

Britney Spears, apparently.

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 hour ago, RHSims said:

The problem with this thread is you have no point to make. It is entirely, a gigantic troll. Is the goal to get the longest thread on AS?

 

You find EC to be meh. So what? As at least one one other poster mentioned this title could apply to any musician/band be it rock, jazz or classical. The Beatles aren’t very great, Ringo isn’t very great, Bill Wyman isn’t very great, Bob Dylan can’t sing, Coltrane should never have played soprano sax, blah blah blah.
 

Your opinion is based on your opinion. There is no analysis or reasoned argument, just slagging boomers, middle America, EC, and all the guitarists and great blues songs that EC seemed to ruin somehow. No doubt your taste is impeccable, but it is your taste, however poorly articulated.

 

Obviously no one can change your mind based on the thread title. So you are just encouraging those that enjoy EC and those that find your brush a bit broad to respond, but to what end? Essentially, responses have to prove the negative, which is impossible. 

I know I would be much more interested in your posts if they expanded on what I already know, rather than criticizing someone who has been around for 50+ years.  For example, what guitarists do you think are worthy of more commercial success/attention today and why? Educate me.
 

I am not a huge fan of EC, but I find his work in the 60’s and very early 70’s hard to dismiss as meh. Seconding previous posts, if you have listened to Layla Derek and the Dominos album Layla and are not moved, well, please tell us what makes the grade.

 

 

Nobody needs to meet your criteria or educate you in order to post a new thread. Sometimes people just want to post opinions and get a conversation going.  

[Allan F]

1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Nobody needs to meet your criteria or educate you in order to post a new thread. Sometimes people just want to post opinions and get a conversation going.  

 

Perhaps, but he does raise a valid point in that, apart from "not hear[ing] anything special in his guitar playing", the OP offers nothing in terms of specific criticisms, e.g. what is lacking compared to other guitarists. Nor does he provide any examples of songs or performances in support of his opinion. Moreover. we have no idea of how much of EC's extensive catalogue of studio albums, live albums, soundtracks or compilations he is even familiar with.

 

I happen to be among those who consider Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs to be one of the truly great rock albums of the seventies, in not all time, with the title track an absolute "classic".

[mevdinc]

I think many will agree that Clapton is a great guitar player. 
I personally think he is not as innovative and creative as some of the other great guitar players. I find his style too repetitive.
I prefer his acoustic guitar playing, and listen to his is Unplugged album quite often.

 

[Bill Brown]

10 hours ago, RHSims said:

Coltrane should never have played soprano sax

 

I know this isn't necessarily your position, but oh my, that would have been a huge loss to me.

 

Bill

[Bill Brown]

22 hours ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

Roky Erickson of the 13th Floor Elevators was sentenced to a mental hospital for drug possession.  There, he received quite a bit of ElectroConvulsive Therapy, and a lot of Thorazine.  It destroyed his mind.

 

Just watch the documentary You're Gonna Miss Me if you're curious to see the results of ECT.  I think the only people advocating ECT are ones that have never received it.

 

I don't want to be argumentative, and it may be too far off topic, but I note that from a scientific perspective you are citing anecdotes and these can be strongly affected by mistaking/erroneously ascribing a relationship between cause and effect.

 

And I have seen many patients who have undergone ECT and think it was very valuable, so I don't think your last statement is accurate.  Not to mention young catatonic schizophrenics I have seen whose only activity was wiping their feces on the wall who "woke up" and did well, truly disease changing.

 

Bill

[Rt66indierock]

On 3/3/2021 at 7:22 PM, AudioDoctor said:

In fact, I find him boring, I don't hear anything special in his guitar playing, I have no idea why he is so famous, and his music is easy listening for aging boomers...

 

He took a superior art form, polished all its rough edges, packaged it for middle america, and IMO, ruined every blues song he ever sang.

 

Fine but for me Tulsa Time and his work with Delany & Bonnie would are enough.

[Allan F]

14 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

I have heard a lot of Clapton, and yet I am unimpressed...

 

In fact, if you consider the fact that so many people rushed out to sound like Clapton, he is directly responsible for the boring sameness in guitar players these days...

 

It's gross generalizations like this one that, IMO, seriously undermine your opinions on the subject. How about offering some examples of the "boring sameness" you allude to. It's one thing to like or dislike a performer's work. That's a matter of personal taste. But, when you use that bias to paint with such a wide brush that provides no insight by way of detail, you lose me and others completely. In your initial post you complain that he "took a superior art form...[and] packaged it for middle America". Given that he is English and at various times was a member of a number of revered English bands, - John Mayall & the Bluesbreakers, Cream, Blind Faith - who earned their fame before English audiences, that statement is nonsense and simply does not accord with historical fact.

[kumakuma]

@audiobomber

@Allan F

@RHSims

 

Why don't you post your least favorite flavor of ice cream and we'll all take a go at convincing you to change your mind about it?

 

Be sure to provide a detailed explanation as to why you don't like it and proof that you've tried it on numerous occasions.