Building a DIY Music Server

[Exocer]

1 hour ago, vhs said:

Yes ....I am using your unregulated LPS on Taiko ATX too.......

 

 

no issue at all and sounds very impressive.......

Thanks for the testimonial. I'm sure @Soul Analogueproduces a solid well thought out product. Cheers to you both.

 

[ted_b]

@Dev what sort of top do you have on the H5 case?  @StreamFidelity was prototyping an acrylic glass lid with holes which looked pretty cool (pun intended). 

[elan120]

On 8/4/2021 at 12:00 PM, ASRMichael said:

Did you see my post a few pages ago about new HDPLEX cooler? Really impressive temps. Obviously using decent paste. I’m using i9 10900k 20 core/threads. 

Is the new cooler come standard on the new HDPlex H5 case or need to order separate?  I could not find information on their website.

[davide256]

Recently switched from an 8i7BEH NUC to MSI PRO Z390-A ATX Motherboard with Intel Core i5-9600K Coffee Lake, trying to sort out a case + ATX power supply.

Went this route because (a) wanted MOBO that could be run headless without on board graphics  card (b) I eventually plan to add a JCAT FEMTO USB card, wasn't practical with NUC

 

Is the JS-2 LPS I was using now superfluous or is there a sensible way to reuse it powering the system?

[bit01]

12 hours ago, Dev said:

This lead me to converse with Larry from Hdplex and it seems like he has a design for it but his supplier needs a minimum of 500pcs order. Larry quoted $30 + shipping for 4 appropriately bent heat pipes to fit the H5 case. So this would be mostly plug and play. If there is enough interest here, we can see if we can make this happen. Any thoughts ?

 

If Larry's design circumvents the expansion cards area then I am interested too, though in current usage I can't say I have a cooling issue.

[ASRMichael]

1 hour ago, elan120 said:

Is the new cooler come standard on the new HDPlex H5 case or need to order separate?  I could not find information on their website.

It’s really new. Will be part of new H5 design I believe. Ask Larry if you can buy one. 

[elan120]

10 minutes ago, ASRMichael said:

It’s really new. Will be part of new H5 design I believe. Ask Larry if you can buy one. 

Tbank you, will do.  It looks very cool.  🙂

[Raypok]

This is my first post, but long time reader.

Just want to share my music server using HDplex H5 case with extended heat pipes to the left heat sink. Maybe this can give you ideas how to install additional heat pipes. I bought 50cm 6mm heat pipes from Aliexpress long time ago.

Be careful about clearance of USB & Network Card. I am using JCAT USB XE & Network Card Femto, MB is Gigabyte Aorus Master.

[Dev]

2 hours ago, ted_b said:

@Dev what sort of top do you have on the H5 case?  @StreamFidelity was prototyping an acrylic glass lid with holes which looked pretty cool (pun intended). 

@ted_bI am using the stock top. I think I saw acrylic top by @StreamFidelityand they do look pretty nice. 

[Dev]

1 hour ago, elan120 said:

Is the new cooler come standard on the new HDPlex H5 case or need to order separate?  I could not find information on their website.

yes, it’s very new. I am not sure if it comes with the H5 case as standard. Send an email to Larry. I just installed two days back. It’s bigger and slightly taller which clears the VRM heatsink, which otherwise was just touching the heat pipes. However, the temps have remained the same - I think the biggest bottleneck is the side panel heatsink. If they are getting hot with the old (smaller) cooler, it would mean that the old heatsink has been effectively able to drain the heat out of the CPU. In my case since the temps remained the same, the cpu copper heatsink, either new or old, is not the bottleneck. This is why I am trying to see if the left side panel can be used as well.

[Dev]

44 minutes ago, bit01 said:

If Larry's design circumvents the expansion cards area then I am interested too, though in current usage I can't say I have a cooling issue.

I think so but I can double check. I had asked for some pictures of it installed or some drawings. 

[Dev]

20 minutes ago, Raypok said:

This is my first post, but long time reader.

Just want to share my music server using HDplex H5 case with extended heat pipes to the left heat sink. Maybe this can give you ideas how to install additional heat pipes. I bought 50cm 6mm heat pipes from Aliexpress long time ago.

Be careful about clearance of USB & Network Card. I am using JCAT USB XE & Network Card Femto, MB is Gigabyte Aorus Master.

Looks very nice. What CPU are you using ? Did the left heatsink help with the temps ?

[Nenon]

13 hours ago, Soul Analogue said:

the reason for the 5A choke killing the dynamics is due to the DCR (internal resistance) ... imagine a water supply pipeline with a constricted sections in the middle... which will affect the speed of water going thru .... there is no way water can go thru with speed higher than the limited constricted sections allowed (the choke)

A more appropriate way to describe this would be to have a water supply pipe filling up a big water tank. If you need to get a quick burst of high pressure water, you can easily get it from the water tank. You can get much higher pressure output from the water tank compared to the pipe filling up the water tank if you just need it for a short period of time. 

You can think of the 5A choke as the pipe filling up the water tank and the bank of big Mundorf caps as the water tank. 

Our computers don't work as Class A amplifiers that draw all the power they may need all the time. It's the exact opposite of that. They need an instantaneous peak of power for a very short period of time. That's the equivalent of a high pressure water stream out of the water tank for a very short period of time. As long as the tank remains full with water, It's not a problem that the pipe filling up the tank does not have the water pressure needed at the output of the water tank. 

Of course it's more complex than that, but given the water pipe analogy provided, I wanted to make sure people understand it's not literally as constricted as described in the quotes text. 

 

The choke is in series in this circuit and has a big influence on the sound. All chokes in that position have a sound signature. This 5A choke was just right in my experiments. I used it with the ASUS Sage / dual CPUs server, which draws more power than all my previous builds. I suspect unless you do heavy upsampling with 120W+ TDP CPUs this choke in the design I have provided will be just fine. Also, keep in mind the super high efficiency of this design (including the Taiko ATX) and the high voltage used. 5A at 5V gives you only 25 Watts. But 5A at 40V gives you 200 Watts. It's a well balanced designed that took a lot of listening.

But this is DIY. I am really hoping someone will take my design, improve it, and share. There is no perfect design, and I am sure it can be improved. I encourage people to try it and use it as a baseline and improve on it. 

 

@Soul Analogue Having seen some impressive stuff from you, I was actually hoping that you would do that and improve on the initial design provided. 

 

14 hours ago, Soul Analogue said:

I check out Hammond page...i think 195k12 would do the job ok...by just looking at the specification

That choke will need way more capacitance than what I provided for v2 and v3. 

For those thinking to try it - if you are not sure what you are doing, don't just replace the 5A choke in my design with this one. The entire circuit will need more careful consideration. 

[Raypok]

CPU i9 9900K. I haven’t done any comparison, because I installed this extended heat pipes when I first build this music server.

Temperature when using euphony is around 38 degree, with CPU set at 4.8 GHz and room temperature using air conditioner on around 24 degree.

 

[elan120]

1 hour ago, Dev said:

yes, it’s very new. I am not sure if it comes with the H5 case as standard. Send an email to Larry. I just installed two days back. It’s bigger and slightly taller which clears the VRM heatsink, which otherwise was just touching the heat pipes. However, the temps have remained the same - I think the biggest bottleneck is the side panel heatsink. If they are getting hot with the old (smaller) cooler, it would mean that the old heatsink has been effectively able to drain the heat out of the CPU. In my case since the temps remained the same, the cpu copper heatsink, either new or old, is not the bottleneck. This is why I am trying to see if the left side panel can be used as well.

I am using i9900KS CPU, a bit older, and lower in TDP, so hopefully it will keep the overall temp lower also...I will check with Larry.

[Soul Analogue]

7 hours ago, Nenon said:

A more appropriate way to describe this would be to have a water supply pipe filling up a big water tank. If you need to get a quick burst of high pressure water, you can easily get it from the water tank. You can get much higher pressure output from the water tank compared to the pipe filling up the water tank if you just need it for a short period of time. 

You can think of the 5A choke as the pipe filling up the water tank and the bank of big Mundorf caps as the water tank. 

Our computers don't work as Class A amplifiers that draw all the power they may need all the time. It's the exact opposite of that. They need an instantaneous peak of power for a very short period of time. That's the equivalent of a high pressure water stream out of the water tank for a very short period of time. As long as the tank remains full with water, It's not a problem that the pipe filling up the tank does not have the water pressure needed at the output of the water tank. 

Of course it's more complex than that, but given the water pipe analogy provided, I wanted to make sure people understand it's not literally as constricted as described in the quotes text. 

 

The choke is in series in this circuit and has a big influence on the sound. All chokes in that position have a sound signature. This 5A choke was just right in my experiments. I used it with the ASUS Sage / dual CPUs server, which draws more power than all my previous builds. I suspect unless you do heavy upsampling with 120W+ TDP CPUs this choke in the design I have provided will be just fine. Also, keep in mind the super high efficiency of this design (including the Taiko ATX) and the high voltage used. 5A at 5V gives you only 25 Watts. But 5A at 40V gives you 200 Watts. It's a well balanced designed that took a lot of listening.

But this is DIY. I am really hoping someone will take my design, improve it, and share. There is no perfect design, and I am sure it can be improved. I encourage people to try it and use it as a baseline and improve on it. 

 

@Soul Analogue Having seen some impressive stuff from you, I was actually hoping that you would do that and improve on the initial design provided. 

 

That choke will need way more capacitance than what I provided for v2 and v3. 

For those thinking to try it - if you are not sure what you are doing, don't just replace the 5A choke in my design with this one. The entire circuit will need more careful consideration. 

Hi Nenon

so your design is a 200w sourcing power from the capacitor bank (water tank) … and assume the user would not utilitize the full power of CPU or from their system

 

my design is a 350w supply sourcing power straight from the power source (the transformer)

 

200w is enough if you consider it is only the cpu(s) that draws power…

but in fact many user, like my friend vhs here, on top of having dual xeon, also use dual optane Pcie, and other add on cards….300w is just barely enough… not to mention we need dynamics swing for music to sound good

 

my design with high current rating choke does not overshoot and do not need extra capacitance to work with Taiko .. i always keep capacitance to a minimal ;)

 

i have many years of experience designing power supplies for digital and analog devices… including tube and solid state power amps..

And agree that the chokes plays a major role in sound quality 

i have tried transformers and chokes from all over the world… lundahl, AE, intact audio, Tamura and some from Germany, Israel and Russia…i can show you my stock of them =D

But now i build chokes by myself… thats the only way that fits my needs and requirements with my design

 

Choke building is an art….a good sounding choke is a lot more than just looking at the inductance, current rating, dc resistance…the core size, material, thickness, wire winding method, mounting and varnish techniques all play significant roles

 

Honestly i do not think much about Hammond, it is only an industrial manufacturer

 

yes i also do not encourage someone to try if they do not know what they are doing

[Exocer]

8 hours ago, Nenon said:

A more appropriate way to describe this would be to have a water supply pipe filling up a big water tank. If you need to get a quick burst of high pressure water, you can easily get it from the water tank. You can get much higher pressure output from the water tank compared to the pipe filling up the water tank if you just need it for a short period of time. 

You can think of the 5A choke as the pipe filling up the water tank and the bank of big Mundorf caps as the water tank. 

Our computers don't work as Class A amplifiers that draw all the power they may need all the time. It's the exact opposite of that. They need an instantaneous peak of power for a very short period of time. That's the equivalent of a high pressure water stream out of the water tank for a very short period of time. As long as the tank remains full with water, It's not a problem that the pipe filling up the tank does not have the water pressure needed at the output of the water tank. 

Of course it's more complex than that, but given the water pipe analogy provided, I wanted to make sure people understand it's not literally as constricted as described in the quotes text. 

Thanks for validating my understanding. This is clear as day. It is evident that the choke was not limiting the output to 5A, at least not from what my ears are telling me. Although I accept that it is technically limiting the rate of which the tank can be "refilled". Interesting stuff.

 

9 hours ago, Raypok said:

This is my first post, but long time reader.

Just want to share my music server using HDplex H5 case with extended heat pipes to the left heat sink. Maybe this can give you ideas how to install additional heat pipes. I bought 50cm 6mm heat pipes from Aliexpress long time ago.

Be careful about clearance of USB & Network Card. I am using JCAT USB XE & Network Card Femto, MB is Gigabyte Aorus Master.

 

Very nice job with bending those pipes. Can you share information about the tools used to bend the pipes so well? I am contemplating doing something similar. Cheers and thanks for sharing.

[Vivling2021]

On 8/4/2021 at 2:29 PM, Gavin1977 said:

Can you detail the use of the  Microtik CRS305, perhaps some photos of your chain?

just use is as a switch and connect to the solarflare

[ASRMichael]

9 hours ago, Soul Analogue said:

Hi Nenon

so your design is a 200w sourcing power from the capacitor bank (water tank) … and assume the user would not utilitize the full power of CPU or from their system

 

my design is a 350w supply sourcing power straight from the power source (the transformer)

 

200w is enough if you consider it is only the cpu(s) that draws power…

but in fact many user, like my friend vhs here, on top of having dual xeon, also use dual optane Pcie, and other add on cards….300w is just barely enough… not to mention we need dynamics swing for music to sound good

 

my design with high current rating choke does not overshoot and do not need extra capacitance to work with Taiko .. i always keep capacitance to a minimal ;)

 

i have many years of experience designing power supplies for digital and analog devices… including tube and solid state power amps..

And agree that the chokes plays a major role in sound quality 

i have tried transformers and chokes from all over the world… lundahl, AE, intact audio, Tamura and some from Germany, Israel and Russia…i can show you my stock of them =D

But now i build chokes by myself… thats the only way that fits my needs and requirements with my design

 

Choke building is an art….a good sounding choke is a lot more than just looking at the inductance, current rating, dc resistance…the core size, material, thickness, wire winding method, mounting and varnish techniques all play significant roles

 

Honestly i do not think much about Hammond, it is only an industrial manufacturer

 

yes i also do not encourage someone to try if they do not know what they are doing

Hi, it would make sense for you to send your choke to someone that is willing to try it. Sure plenty people here would take up the offer. 

[Exocer]

20 hours ago, davide256 said:

Recently switched from an 8i7BEH NUC to MSI PRO Z390-A ATX Motherboard with Intel Core i5-9600K Coffee Lake, trying to sort out a case + ATX power supply.

Went this route because (a) wanted MOBO that could be run headless without on board graphics  card (b) I eventually plan to add a JCAT FEMTO USB card, wasn't practical with NUC

 

Is the JS-2 LPS I was using now superfluous or is there a sensible way to reuse it powering the system?

You could perhaps use it to power the JCAT Femto USB card down the line.

[Soul Analogue]

2 hours ago, ASRMichael said:

Hi, it would make sense for you to send your choke to someone that is willing to try it. Sure plenty people here would take up the offer. 

Yes
send me a message if anyone is interested… i think it is not appropriate to talk about deals in this thread

thanks

[Raypok]

13 hours ago, Exocer said:

Very nice job with bending those pipes. Can you share information about the tools used to bend the pipes so well? I am contemplating doing something similar. Cheers and thanks for sharing.

I am using heat pipe bender like below which I bought from local IT shop. actually the heat pipes are not so rigid (buy high quality one with pure copper) and easy to bend with your thumb. You can also use any hard circular object like wooden stick or water pipe with diameter around 1.5 inch as a alternative tool.

[MarkusBarkus]

...if you find you repeatedly kink the pipes when you bend them, you may consider filling them with sand, and packing it tightly in the tube.
 

Some of this kinking depends upon your wall thickness.
 

Packing them keeps the walls from kinking as you *slowly* draw them around the mandrel.
 

You can pull a small piece of rag through or use compressed air to clean any residual grit. 

[ASRMichael]

I think this answered the question 50 posts ago. 
 

https://audiobacon.net/2021/08/06/the-worlds-best-audiophile-linear-power-supplies/2/?amp=1

 

DC4 is technicaly superior – by a large margin. Imaging, depth, soundstage, contouring, detail. The Optimo 3 has more of a “coating” for easy listening.

[Raypok]

46 minutes ago, MarkusBarkus said:

...if you find you repeatedly kink the pipes when you bend them, you may consider filling them with sand, and packing it tightly in the tube.
 

Some of this kinking depends upon your wall thickness.
 

Packing them keeps the walls from kinking as you *slowly* draw them around the mandrel.
 

You can pull a small piece of rag through or use compressed air to clean any residual grit. 

From what I understand the heat pipes for CPU cooling is airtight and they have sealed both end to protect chemical inside from leaking. This different from heat pipe use for air conditioner that hollow inside. Please correct me if I am wrong.