Building a DIY Music Server

[Dev]

22 hours ago, Exocer said:

Probably more during boot, yes. I have not measured that yet.

 

yes, boot time droops are lot more.

 

 

22 hours ago, Exocer said:

i9-9900k OCed to 4.6ghz

 

 

You have all 8 cores running at 4.6GHz with passive cooling and without heat issues ? what chassis are you using ?

[Exocer]

I have updated my BIOS so some settings have changed since my initial measurements (so have the voltages) but during boot my voltages dropped down to about 35.2V (pre bios update) then rose back up from there. I wouldn't call that "a lot" but yeah.

 

12 minutes ago, Dev said:

You have all 8 cores running at 4.6GHz with passive cooling and without heat issues ? what chassis are you using

I've had this running for months with the HDPlex H5 V2 without heat issues, WITH Hyperthreading enabled. 

[Dev]

2 minutes ago, Exocer said:

I have updated my BIOS so some settings have changed but during boot my voltages dropped down to about 35.2 then rose back up from there. I wouldn't call that "a lot" but yeah.

 

I've had this running for months with the HDPlex H5 V2 without heat issues. 

 

I use H5 as well and 3.7GHz all 10 cores, the heat is not well dissipated over time. Initially when you power up, the system runs cool for a day or so but over time the heat just builds up and do not dissipate as well.  

[MarcelNL]

I am about to tackle the passive cooling for my build, I was wondering how you guys handle that chassis, does it sit flush on a closed shelve, stacked on other stuff or do you allow for decent air circulation around it, or whatever? (with passive heat transfer is subject to all the quirks nature throws at us)

 

I think I may end up using two 300W (something like 0.4K/W) heatsinks back to back with the heat pipes sandwiched between them, both sticking up in the air over the case, long ago I used a similar setup for a power amp and it was the best way to keep stable temperature (well, that is unless there is a heat wave or something)

 

[ASRMichael]

25 minutes ago, Dev said:

 

I use H5 as well and 3.7GHz all 10 cores, the heat is not well dissipated over time. Initially when you power up, the system runs cool for a day or so but over time the heat just builds up and do not dissipate as well.  

Did you see my post a few pages ago about new HDPLEX cooler? Really impressive temps. Obviously using decent paste. I’m using i9 10900k 20 core/threads. 

[Exocer]

34 minutes ago, Dev said:

 

I use H5 as well and 3.7GHz all 10 cores, the heat is not well dissipated over time. Initially when you power up, the system runs cool for a day or so but over time the heat just builds up and do not dissipate as well.  

Ive never had this issue. Temps have always leveled out for me after about an hour. I do not perform upsampling. 

[Dev]

12 minutes ago, ASRMichael said:

Did you see my post a few pages ago about new HDPLEX cooler? Really impressive temps. Obviously using decent paste. I’m using i9 10900k 20 core/threads. 

 

Sorry, I haven't seen that post. I am out of touch from this thread for a while. Could you please point me to it ? Btw, the i9 10900k (I also use it) is a 10core and 2 threads per core (or 20 threads). Though 20 cores would have been awesome 😁

[Exocer]

@Dev what voltage is your CPU configured for? Is it set to "auto"? 

[Dev]

4 minutes ago, Exocer said:

@Dev what voltage is your CPU configured for? Is it set to "auto"? 

 

Yes, auto for now. I think I tried playing with voltage earlier but that was before the Taiko DC-ATX. Maybe its worth playing with it again now. What is your setting ?

[Exocer]

13 minutes ago, Dev said:

 

Yes, auto for now. I think I tried playing with voltage earlier but that was before the Taiko DC-ATX. Maybe its worth playing with it again now. What is your setting ?

I'm currently in limbo with the new bios I need to re-tweak. Historically locking in at 1.15-1.2v worked well with the i9-9900k. You have a higher TDP CPU so worth trying to lock in at 1.2v as a start.

[ASRMichael]

49 minutes ago, Dev said:

 

Sorry, I haven't seen that post. I am out of touch from this thread for a while. Could you please point me to it ? Btw, the i9 10900k (I also use it) is a 10core and 2 threads per core (or 20 threads). Though 20 cores would have been awesome 😁

Sorry was on another thread. Yes 10 cores, 20 threads. I leave voltage on Auto. 
 

Mobo turbo settings configured to 350w short & long bursts. I’m using Taiko ATX with DC3 unregulated LPS. 24v @ 16a fuse..
 

 

[magnium]

@JayM Any updates on the Taiko Audio chassis?

[Soul Analogue]

Guys..looking at the photos, I reckon that the Hammond 159zj is way too small for the purpose....

and its only rated at 5A... whats the max target current it is running??

the choke like that will seriously impact the dynamics, and hence the life of music...

 

Try a bigger size choke...at least 10A spec...I am sure there would be a breath-taking improvement 

 

This is the unregulated LPS I build for my friend FYR

[Exocer]

45 minutes ago, Soul Analogue said:

Guys..looking at the photos, I reckon that the Hammond 159zj is way too small for the purpose....

and its only rated at 5A... whats the max target current it is running??

the choke like that will seriously impact the dynamics, and hence the life of music...

 

Try a bigger size choke...at least 10A spec...I am sure there would be a breath-taking improvement 

 

This is the unregulated LPS I build for my friend FYR

Terrific job.

 

Which choke do you recommend?

 

Cheers,

-Rob

[Soul Analogue]

9 minutes ago, Exocer said:

Terrific job.

 

Which choke do you recommend?

 

Cheers,

-Rob

While I usually build the choke myself...

I check out Hammond page...i think 195k12 would do the job ok...by just looking at the specification

[Dev]

Hi Folks,

 

I am trying to find ways of reducing heat to the CPU in the Hdplex H5 case through Bios/sw driven configuration but apparently not been able to succeed much and still maintain the sound quality at the same time. I use a i9-10900k which has a significant 125 watts TDP. When booted from cold, it reaches early 40Cish and slowly keeps rising over days as the heatsink panel of the H5 is only rated modestly for 65watts TDP processors. The gradual rise of temperature do depend on the ambient room temperature as well. I can turn off Hyperthreading and Turbo mode and cut back on heat but I loose the sound quality, especially the 3d'ness, dynamics and air. I have also noticed that when booted cold, it sounds better than after couple of days if leaving the server running 24x7. Running the CPU cool has a natural advantage of not only the sound quality but also extends the processor life.

 

One way to do this is to use external blowing fans which@ASRMichael has been successfully using but I am not quiet sure how much noise it creates of its own or how loud it gets. I did order couple from Amazon just to test it out myself.

 

On the side, I have also been thinking if there are ways to utilize the left side panel heatsink with the H5 case itself. So 4 heat pipes goes to the right heatsink and 4 to the left, effectively providing a total of 130watts of heat dissipation. The left side heat sink would really need long heat pipes and the maximum length I could find is 300mm. If you are aware where to find longer length, it would be useful and I am willing to give it a shot. Furthermore, even if you get pipes which are longer, you would have to bend it yourself. This lead me to converse with Larry from Hdplex and it seems like he has a design for it but his supplier needs a minimum of 500pcs order. Larry quoted $30 + shipping for 4 appropriately bent heat pipes to fit the H5 case. So this would be mostly plug and play. If there is enough interest here, we can see if we can make this happen. Any thoughts ?

 

[Exocer]

14 minutes ago, Dev said:

If there is enough interest here, we can see if we can make this happen. Any thoughts ?

I'd be interested!

As for where to get longer round pipes, I've seen several AliExpress links to heatpipes.

[Exocer]

On 5/21/2021 at 10:43 AM, Nenon said:

A 10A choke would require a lot more capacitance not to overshoot. We need to be careful not to kill the Taiko ATX. I already killed one and have been super careful since that. I know Emile added protection after my incident, so maybe you won't kill the production units, but you would not have a reliable PSU unless you add that extra capacitance with a 10A choke. 

@Soul Analogue - I vaguely remembered the above comment from @Nenon.

 

From this, I can deduce that an inductor with 5A capability was deliberately chosen. As for dynamics, I do not have any less dynamics than I did with the PH SR7T so dynamics are certainly not an issue with the 5A choke in play, both are absolute beasts per my subjective experience. I would think the larger bank of caps post choke would be capable of delivering far more than 5A. But yeah, I'll let those more knowledgeable than I explain what is happening here.

 

I'm always willing to experiment if I know I won't be frying my system :D.

 

Cheers,

-Rob

[Soul Analogue]

2 minutes ago, Exocer said:

@Soul Analogue - I vaguely remembered the above comment from @Nenon.

 

From this, I can deduce that an inductor with 5A capability was deliberately chosen. As for dynamics, I do not have any less dynamics than I did with the PH SR7T so dynamics are certainly not an issue with the 5A choke in play, both are absolute beasts per my subjective experience. I would think the larger bank of caps post choke would be capable of delivering far more than 5A. But yeah, I'll let those more knowledgeable than I explain what is happening here.

 

I'm always willing to experiment if I know I won't be frying my system :D.

 

Cheers,

-Rob

My friend has been using my unreglated LPS on Taiko ATX for over 2 months, no issue has been reported

The "overshoot" issue should not come from a properly designed choke and power supply topology.....

the PH LPS is not a last word for good sound and dynamics on Taiko ATX due to the regulated nature of the PS

Capacitor bank would not help delivering more current than the upstream components....

the reason for the 5A choke killing the dynamics is due to the DCR (internal resistance) ... imagine a water supply pipeline with a constricted sections in the middle... which will affect the speed of water going thru .... there is no way water can go thru with speed higher than the limited constricted sections allowed (the choke)

 

 

 

[elan120]

10 minutes ago, Soul Analogue said:

My friend has been using my unreglated LPS on Taiko ATX for over 2 months, no issue has been reported

The "overshoot" issue should not come from a properly designed choke and power supply topology.....

the PH LPS is not a last word for good sound and dynamics on Taiko ATX due to the regulated nature of the PS

Capacitor bank would not help delivering more current than the upstream components....

the reason for the 5A choke killing the dynamics is due to the DCR (internal resistance) ... imagine a water supply pipeline with a constricted sections in the middle... which will affect the speed of water going thru .... there is no way water can go thru with speed higher than the limited constricted sections allowed (the choke)

 

 

 

That sounds good.  Do you have a design you can share with us and the parts that can be purchased from places like Mouser / Digikey, and the like?

[Exocer]

21 minutes ago, Soul Analogue said:

My friend has been using my unreglated LPS on Taiko ATX for over 2 months, no issue has been reported

The "overshoot" issue should not come from a properly designed choke and power supply topology.....

Terrific, other than the choke, what else is there in the circuit?

 

21 minutes ago, Soul Analogue said:

the PH LPS is not a last word for good sound and dynamics on Taiko ATX due to the regulated nature of the PS

I'm certain everyone who still follows this thread is well aware of the benefits of using an unregulated LPS with the Taiko DC-ATX. Also, I don't think anyone claims the SR7T is the last word in anything, just a high performance option at a fair price which is no longer available 😁.Totally agree on that front. That being said, have you actually heard the SR7T with the Taiko? It is glorious and far from "restricted" in the dynamics dept for what it is. I have listened to both (unregulated LPS v2 and SR7T) back to back in my system. Where the V2 clearly walks away from the SR7T is transparency and PRAT (to some degree) but alas it is far to early to provide a worthwhile comparison as these caps take a very long time to break-in. 

 

21 minutes ago, Soul Analogue said:

the reason for the 5A choke killing the dynamics is due to the DCR (internal resistance) ...

Hmmm, I'll let those with more knowledge weigh in. Thanks for your explanation.

[elan120]

1 hour ago, Dev said:

If there is enough interest here, we can see if we can make this happen. Any thoughts ?

 

1 hour ago, Exocer said:

I'd be interested!

 

I am interested also!

[ASRMichael]

4 hours ago, Dev said:

Hi Folks,

 

I am trying to find ways of reducing heat to the CPU in the Hdplex H5 case through Bios/sw driven configuration but apparently not been able to succeed much and still maintain the sound quality at the same time. I use a i9-10900k which has a significant 125 watts TDP. When booted from cold, it reaches early 40Cish and slowly keeps rising over days as the heatsink panel of the H5 is only rated modestly for 65watts TDP processors. The gradual rise of temperature do depend on the ambient room temperature as well. I can turn off Hyperthreading and Turbo mode and cut back on heat but I loose the sound quality, especially the 3d'ness, dynamics and air. I have also noticed that when booted cold, it sounds better than after couple of days if leaving the server running 24x7. Running the CPU cool has a natural advantage of not only the sound quality but also extends the processor life.

 

One way to do this is to use external blowing fans which@ASRMichael has been successfully using but I am not quiet sure how much noise it creates of its own or how loud it gets. I did order couple from Amazon just to test it out myself.

 

On the side, I have also been thinking if there are ways to utilize the left side panel heatsink with the H5 case itself. So 4 heat pipes goes to the right heatsink and 4 to the left, effectively providing a total of 130watts of heat dissipation. The left side heat sink would really need long heat pipes and the maximum length I could find is 300mm. If you are aware where to find longer length, it would be useful and I am willing to give it a shot. Furthermore, even if you get pipes which are longer, you would have to bend it yourself. This lead me to converse with Larry from Hdplex and it seems like he has a design for it but his supplier needs a minimum of 500pcs order. Larry quoted $30 + shipping for 4 appropriately bent heat pipes to fit the H5 case. So this would be mostly plug and play. If there is enough interest here, we can see if we can make this happen. Any thoughts ?

 

I’m in. 

[MarcelNL]

I bought my heatpipes and everything here, they have loads different ones available not sure what the max length is: 

https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/32831982529.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.c6374c4di3DGB4

[vhs]

6 hours ago, Soul Analogue said:

My friend has been using my unreglated LPS on Taiko ATX for over 2 months, no issue has been reported

The "overshoot" issue should not come from a properly designed choke and power supply topology.....

the PH LPS is not a last word for good sound and dynamics on Taiko ATX due to the regulated nature of the PS

Capacitor bank would not help delivering more current than the upstream components....

the reason for the 5A choke killing the dynamics is due to the DCR (internal resistance) ... imagine a water supply pipeline with a constricted sections in the middle... which will affect the speed of water going thru .... there is no way water can go thru with speed higher than the limited constricted sections allowed (the choke)

 

 

 

Yes ....I am using your unregulated LPS on Taiko ATX too.......

 

 

no issue at all and sounds very impressive.......