Maybe spending stupid amounts of money on power cords isn't entirely harmless

[kumakuma]

This is so completely juvenile....Nordost has done nothing that has been proven except antidotal evidence from a man known to have a particular animus towards audiophile cables. Nordost have built a worldwide network supplying numerous satisfied customers...what have you done that even gets close to that scale?

Weasel? Kid!

 

Juvenile?

 

Pretty rich coming from someone who makes racial slurs like this:

 

Mansr,

You are too obvious to respond to.

Herr Mansr,

Squareheads are so predicable.

Wdw

[wdw]

Juvenile?

 

Pretty rich coming from someone who makes racial slurs like this:

Totally silly response....you guys have, without a wiff of evidence nor any substantiation, totally jumped overboard with glee...my commemts to Mansr stand..besides, making comment upon national culture, one that I am a part of, isn't racism.

[wgscott]

antidotal evidence

 

Perhaps you mean anecdotal evidence?

[wdw]

Perhaps you mean anecdotal evidence?

 

Trudat..thanks, wdw

[lucretius]

This is so completely juvenile....Nordost has done nothing that has been proven except antidotal evidence from a man known to have a particular animus towards audiophile cables. Nordost have built a worldwide network supplying numerous satisfied customers...what have you done that even gets close to that scale?

Weasel? Kid!

 

Nordost has done something -- they initiated the cease and desist order. Now, they could have instead presented their arguments. In my view, the cease and desist order is the weasel way out.

[elcorso]

BTW I'm a believer in cables, just not that they improve anything. Good cables simply get out of the way and don't add anything to the mix, the same as good DACs. To me good cables are really no cables, that's why I'm so big on wireless and streaming, and of course based on real life experience.

 

Agree with the above statement, but I believe we need trained ears and "transparent" gear (that do no remove or are add nothing to the music) to give an opinion.

 

Regarding Mark Waldrep what could I say? If his hearing system (ear + brain) is like his recordings, in his case, I would remain in silence

 

I guess this guy is always trying to draw attention to see if he can sell some of his bad recorded music, even with all his PhDs not a great gurú to follow in our hobby But he is like the common cold, always present in all events regarding recorded music.

 

Just my opinion.

 

Roch

[Priaptor]

Sorry, George, it's not quite that simple. Oral testimony is evidence. The person who did the demonstration could testify about the procedure he followed, indicating that nothing was done to alter the volumes. He might tender the CD he used in evidence. Other Nordost employees who assisted might testify to the same thing. Nordost could possibly present a witness to testify that that he had tested the CD with tracks of identical content but different track numbers, and found that the volumes were the same. Of course, the foregoing is just speculation on my part.

 

The onus of proof in a civil case is on a "balance of probabilities" or a "preponderance of evidence". Of course, Nordost's witnesses would be subject to cross-examination, but it would be quite difficult to cast doubt on their evidence. It is unlikely that Waldrep could offer more than his opinion regarding volume levels to counter Nordost. Unless there was also evidence upon which a judge could rely to make a finding of credibility against Nordost and its witnesses, he would most likely have to rule in the latter's favour. I say "likely" and "probably" because the outcome of a trial can seldom, if ever, be predicted with certainty.

 

Regardless, I doubt that it was Nordost's intention to go as far as to file a lawsuit and take the matter to trial. Their strategy more likely was to intimidate Waldrep to get him to remove his piece and issue a retraction - which is exactly what he did. They might not be able to present the evidence imagined in the first paragraph. Had Waldrep refused to do so and decided to fight Nordost, we don't know what Nordost's next step would have been or how things might have turned out. Waldrep might have saved himself a lot of money and aggravation by doing what he did, although I would expect that he wasn't very happy about doing so.

 

Too bad. In the good old days this could have been settled with a duel if the parties chose to ignore the arbitrary outcome of a civil trial.

[master]

Too bad. In the good old days this could have been settled with a duel if the parties chose to ignore the arbitrary outcome of a civil trial.

 

Hilarious... but I just had to picture all the high end manufacturers settling the argument about their products being the best this way.

 

Even funnier - they are all probably laughing their way to the bank - and we folks do the fighting for them on the forums.

[junker]

Rune the Nordost sales guy... nice shirt dude.

 

[r_w]

That's my take on it. The right way would be to make him look stupid by presenting the evidence that supports the 'engineering' and 'quality' of the product and it's 'positive effect' on systems.

 

Personally I can't take anyone seriously who charges crazy prices for bits of wire. I believe that all wiring needs to be of a certain quality but there is a line between offering value and taking advantage of vulnerable people.

 

If a bit of wire merits thousands of £/$ you better show me how this is the case and quickly shout down your detractors with evidence of their stupidity when challenged... or your credibility = ZERO!

 

Nordost has done something -- they initiated the cease and desist order. Now, they could have instead presented their arguments. In my view, the cease and desist order is the weasel way out.

[MikeJazz]

Rune the Nordost sales guy... nice shirt dude.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]25792[/ATTACH]

 

Not anymore, he's now selling gryphon.

[mordante]

While I do not agree with the anti-cable brigade. I'm happy that they are hear in such large numbers. Since they have the need that everything should be scientifically proven I can rest assured none of them will vote Trump. It has been independently proven that Trump lies and cheats the most of all presidential candidates. So not many Trump supporters here.

[mansr]

Where there is smoke...

 

Wonder if the sales rep who demoed is still working there.

 

I have been at demos where they would do A/B of some tweak (can't remember the company) and also noted that they did not play back the exact song and portion of a song. Red flags went up immediately.

 

That's pretty much what Waldrep reported seeing.

[sbgk]

That's my take on it. The right way would be to make him look stupid by presenting the evidence that supports the 'engineering' and 'quality' of the product and it's 'positive effect' on systems.

 

Personally I can't take anyone seriously who charges crazy prices for bits of wire. I believe that all wiring needs to be of a certain quality but there is a line between offering value and taking advantage of vulnerable people.

 

If a bit of wire merits thousands of £/$ you better show me how this is the case and quickly shout down your detractors with evidence of their stupidity when challenged... or your credibility = ZERO!

 

I'm glad you've mentioned the vulnerable people, the number of people I pass on the way to work with threadbare clothes and a lost look in their eyes holding up cardboard signs saying spare a dollar, Nordost habit to feed. It's heartbreaking.

[r_w]

Vulnerability comes in many forms... man's ego and greed being some of the easiest to prey on.

 

You don't need to be poor to be vulnerable, you are vulnerable by default if you are unable assess a value proposition before parting with your money.

 

I'm glad you've mentioned the vulnerable people, the number of people I pass on the way to work with threadbare clothes and a lost look in their eyes holding up cardboard signs saying spare a dollar, Nordost habit to feed. It's heartbreaking.

[wgscott]

While I do not agree with the anti-cable brigade. I'm happy that they are hear in such large numbers. Since they have the need that everything should be scientifically proven I can rest assured none of them will vote Trump. It has been independently proven that Trump lies and cheats the most of all presidential candidates. So not many Trump supporters here.

 

I checked with everyone else. We are all voting for Bernie.

[lucretius]

Every day I get down on my knees and thank the lord for the Blue Jeans Cable company.

 

Or Cable Solutions or Ram Electronics or just about any pro-audio shop that assembles cables.

[Allan F]

Too bad. In the good old days this could have been settled with a duel if the parties chose to ignore the arbitrary outcome of a civil trial.

Should we infer from this that you agree with a certain presidential candidate's stand on using nuclear weapons in Europe and elsewhere?

[master]

Should we infer from this that you agree with a certain presidential candidate's stand on using nuclear weapons in Europe and elsewhere?

 

Well with Cruz gone, he's one step closer to getting it.

[michaelD]

I was not going to comment on this thread but since I was at Axpona (which many of you were not) I could maybe add a little perspective. Not that it will help nor sway any opinion as the vast majority of you are just disbelievers almost to a religious fervor. Similar to those who believed the world was flat, evolution did not happen, non - moon landing or more recently that global warming is not happening - take your pick. There are always people shown - in this this case hear - good evidence that just won't come to the logical conclusion - this thread is full of them. But just like the examples I mentioned above they do eventually - some are just slow on the uptake. Is it you can't afford higher priced cables or your system will not benefit from them who knows but your head in the sand attitude needs a little attitude adjustment. Cables do make a difference - most of us with two ears know that others just can't seem to get past some burned in opinion of theirs. I personally saw no such "tricks" but did hear benefits specifically at the demo. However there was a seminar on this very subject it turned out but he was bashing AQ cables specifically. The actual seminar was advertised as something else once I started to hear its true purpose I just walked out shaking my head yet many with similar attitudes as displayed here just keep listening to his BS. I suggest that for those that don't hear the benefits maybe there are still some flat earth people left on planet earth for your altered universe of reality to continue your rants.

[Paul R]

I'm glad you've mentioned the vulnerable people, the number of people I pass on the way to work with threadbare clothes and a lost look in their eyes holding up cardboard signs saying spare a dollar, Nordost habit to feed. It's heartbreaking.

 

 

Okay, this is getting a little ridiculous -

 

Nordost as a company, makes between $500,000 and $1M per year in revenue, according to ZoomInfo. Add that they between 5-10 employees, and you can pretty quickly see, they ain't getting Rich B'ys!

 

When you look at it in that light, they took appropriate action to at least try and ensure the company continues to exist and provide those families with an income.

 

-Paul

[wgscott]

the vast majority of you are just disbelievers almost to a religious fervor

 

I don't even know where to begin with this...

[wgscott]

I don't even know where to begin with this...

 

OK, I will give it a shot:

 

1. The thread has nothing to do with belief or disbelief in magical cable properties, but rather the gag order used to suppress skepticism.

 

2. Cable skeptics on CA are not in the majority. Only a believer with a persecution complex would see it otherwise.

 

3. Belief in gods, creation myths, etc, is based upon faith, not empirical evidence. Belief in magical properties of cables whose differences defy physical measurement is also based upon faith, not empirical evidence. Therefore the cable believers are the ones who should be classified as being intellectually allied with Creationists, Flat-Earthers, conspiracy theorists, and so on.

 

I can keep going, but I doubt reason and logic will hold much sway.

[mansr]

Okay, this is getting a little ridiculous -

 

Nordost as a company, makes between $500,000 and $1M per year in revenue, according to ZoomInfo. Add that they between 5-10 employees, and you can pretty quickly see, they ain't getting Rich B'ys!

 

When you look at it in that light, they took appropriate action to at least try and ensure the company continues to exist and provide those families with an income.

 

-Paul

 

Some companies shouldn't exist. Nordost may be one of them. That the owners and employees have families to feed doesn't justify immoral actions.

[Priaptor]

I was not going to comment on this thread but since I was at Axpona (which many of you were not) I could maybe add a little perspective. Not that it will help nor sway any opinion as the vast majority of you are just disbelievers almost to a religious fervor. Similar to those who believed the world was flat, evolution did not happen, non - moon landing or more recently that global warming is not happening - take your pick. There are always people shown - in this this case hear - good evidence that just won't come to the logical conclusion - this thread is full of them. But just like the examples I mentioned above they do eventually - some are just slow on the uptake. Is it you can't afford higher priced cables or your system will not benefit from them who knows but your head in the sand attitude needs a little attitude adjustment. Cables do make a difference - most of us with two ears know that others just can't seem to get past some burned in opinion of theirs. I personally saw no such "tricks" but did hear benefits specifically at the demo. However there was a seminar on this very subject it turned out but he was bashing AQ cables specifically. The actual seminar was advertised as something else once I started to hear its true purpose I just walked out shaking my head yet many with similar attitudes as displayed here just keep listening to his BS. I suggest that for those that don't hear the benefits maybe there are still some flat earth people left on planet earth for your altered universe of reality to continue your rants.

 

Michael,

 

I am a person who believes cables do make a difference but I have a different perspective than most in this regard and in how they make a difference as well as the cost effectiveness and what kind of cables are most important.

 

HOWEVER, you can't make comments about so called scientifically based conclusions, such as round earth, global warming, evolution and equate them to a totally subjectively based conclusions of "here I am going to switch cables and let you LISTEN to how much better this is". You sound like you are part of the flat earth society with your comments.

 

The way I see this thread is two fold.

 

First is the veracity of Nordost's claim, the manipulation of an easily manipulated legal system and morons on both sides of this fight; in this case Nordost and the blogger.

 

Second, is how when every single time this topic is brought up on one of these threads, the bone up people's asses for how others spend their money, on what they spend their money on and the never ending hubris of the critics. Then the same people on these threads, depending upon who is claiming the absurd, fawn over the author's claims about "SQ/airiness, tightness, timbre, blah blah" regarding an equally ridiculous and scientifically unproven claim.

 

Last thing:

 

Michael, I knew he was head-strong, talking loud, saying stupid things. So when he turned up dead, I let it go. And I said to myself, this is the hobby we've chosen; I didn't ask who gave the order, because it had nothing to do with the hobby!