UpTone Audio EtherREGEN Listening Impressions

[HeeBroG]

On 11/15/2019 at 4:59 AM, Darryl R said:

My new EtherREGEN sounds marvelous.  I had been running from bridged JCAT Net connections on my Linux server directly to the Ethernet Renderer module in the MSB Select II DAC.  Now I'm running out the EtherREGEN and I hear more detail.  I'll no longer need the bridge.

 

Are there any other initial ER users finding benefit if they already had JCAT NET Femto in their endpoint/server?

I may have missed other reports but the above was the only one I could find in this thread.

[Cable Monkey]

3 hours ago, HeeBroG said:

 

Are there any other initial ER users finding benefit if they already had JCAT NET Femto in their endpoint/server?

I may have missed other reports but the above was the only one I could find in this thread.

I use the JCAT card in my server. I use RoonOS so the config tweaks and options such as bridging are not available. But despite the significant difference the JCAT card made, using the ER was still a decent step up.

[djwalter2000]

4 hours ago, HeeBroG said:

 

Are there any other initial ER users finding benefit if they already had JCAT NET Femto in their endpoint/server?

I may have missed other reports but the above was the only one I could find in this thread.

 

Yes, I have a JCAT Net Femto card in my endpoint and have noticed a significant improvement since incorporating the ER. Soundstage width, presence of vocals, quiet background all improved. At the time I purchased the JCAT I thought it was an extravagance that may very likely not pay off in SQ improvement but ultimately wanted to try. What I came to understand was that my thinking was still being influenced by commentary from those who enjoyed theorizing about why something couldn't improve SQ or improve SQ enough to justify the expense rather than from those who actually tried something and offered feedback on the results. 

[LowMidHigh]

On 1/4/2020 at 1:12 AM, cat6man said:

 can you explain what you mean by 'emplyed the a side' and 'next, the b side'?

i don't understand your setup.

 

My ER is placed between my NetGear router (A side) and Aeries G2 streamer (B side).

 

I also have a separate system to watch movies, with a Mac Mini as its brain. 

 

So first, I ran a CAT6 from the ER (A) side to my Mac Mini.

Next, I disconnected the streamer from the B side and plugged in its place the same CAT6 running to the Mac Mini.

 

Hope that helps.

[Ultrarunner]

3 hours ago, R1200CL said:

I’m missing reviews with opticalrendu. Why isn’t anyone writing ?

I think a few have. I didn’t write a review but did mention that using the EtherRegen as a replacement of an opticalModule connected to my opticalRendu, was a significant upgrade. 

[Crom]

I use JCAT Femto network card in my HQ Player PC. My audio chain is as follows:

NUC Roon Rock server > HQ Player PC > ER > Endpoint/DAC

 

Adding the JCat card produced a noticeable improvement a few months ago but the ER provided the more significant improvement.

[elan120]

14 minutes ago, Crom said:

I use JCAT Femto network card in my HQ Player PC. My audio chain is as follows:

NUC Roon Rock server > HQ Player PC > ER > Endpoint/DAC

 

Adding the JCat card produced a noticeable improvement a few months ago but the ER provided the more significant improvement.

That is good to know.  Is the overall improvement a cumulative result from both JCAT Femto Network Card and ER or ER alone is enough to offset the benefit from JCAT card?

[Albrecht]

14 hours ago, Ultrarunner said:

I think a few have. I didn’t write a review but did mention that using the EtherRegen as a replacement of an opticalModule connected to my opticalRendu, was a significant upgrade. 

Hi, 

Thank you. That's very interesting. So, - you used the EtherRegen with no B: side connected, and ran a fiber cable from the SFP of the EtherRegen?

 

Thanks again for your comments.

Cheers,

[Superdad]

3 hours ago, Albrecht said:

So, - you used the EtherRegen with no B: side connected, and ran a fiber cable from the SFP of the EtherRegen?

 

No, I think (hope) he ran into the copper ‘B’-port and “out” of the optical SFP on the ‘A’ side.  The basic architecture and the ultra-low-jitter reclocking flops of the EtherREGEN are symmetrical on the two sides of the differential isolation moat—specifically so that people could run B>A (to an optical endpoint) and still obtain the special performance features of our switch. 

[Ultrarunner]

3 hours ago, Albrecht said:

Hi, 

Thank you. That's very interesting. So, - you used the EtherRegen with no B: side connected, and ran a fiber cable from the SFP of the EtherRegen?

 

Thanks again for your comments.

Cheers,

As Alex said. Copper in on B side / optical out to the opticalRendu.

 

I think it made as significant an improvement as changing from ultraRendu to opticalRendu, although it’s been a couple of months since I made that change. In any case, highly recommended!

[incus]

Hi - I've been meaning to post more about my experiences with my 2 ERs with power supplies. I do want to present more data, but I will say, in answer to many questions I have received since, that the LPS 1.2 at 12V and the Farad Super3 at 7V have quite different sound signatures.  I preferred the Farad for its more open, airy sound-stage and more silver-like detail. The LPS, by contrast, was more like copper - perhaps a bit fleshier, but a bit darker and not quite as detailed. Then I thought about voltage and switched the LPS 1.2 to 7V and took at Farad 12V from another application and compared like to like and unlike to unlike and things changed. The ER and SOtM both maintained their sound signatures but I believe I found that I like the sound of 7V feeding the ER over 12V, no matter which power supply, with a preference still for the ER as the last in the chain. I believe there are technical reasons for this to do with available current. And since I am jumping ahead of myself and giving some results based on tests with my SOtM switches, I will say that I still very much needed the SOtM switch coming BEFORE the ER. I will not change that.  So my signal passes through two re-clocked SOtM switches (SE versions) connected inevitable by copper ehternet (through the wall), then through a SOtM ethernet cable to the B side of the ER, then out through optical A side to my Signature Rendu. In this configuration I preferred only one ER after the two SOtM switches, which allowed me to use my second ER for the opticalRendu on my desktop. Based on my testing, I am next going to try SOtM - ER - SOtM - ER into the Sig Rendu as I believe this may be the ultimate because things sound best with the ER last with a SOtM before it - so this would be like doubling that goodness. I also have a 7V 4A Plixir PSU on order to see if balanced power and more current changes anything with the ER. By the way, I also tried SOtM sPS-500 and that didn't make the cut compared to either of the ultra-capacitors. I forget to mention that the SOtMs are powered by 12V Farads. And I will also mention that the Farads definitely have a burn-in time - they just keep getting better and better. That's it for now. Cheers

[incus]

Also, by the way, it bears mentioning that going copper into the B side of the ER and out A side optical to either of my optical Rendus is the best sound I've ever had through speakers and/or headphones. And I've tried a lot of things in my time... Hurts to think about, in fact... But I am at a place with these endpoints where it becomes absurd for me to think about tweaking too much more. Waiting for an Intona USB cable to arrive to test against my Lushes but other than that, I am feeling quite good about where things are... So thanks!!

[incus]

Also bears mentioning that I found I preferred the ERs NOT re-clocked with the SOtM master clock. The SOtM switches, yes, but the ERs no. I think the way the clocks in the ER are powered has something to do with this. Obviously their proximity to the signal as well...

[Albrecht]

2 hours ago, Ultrarunner said:

As Alex said. Copper in on B side / optical out to the opticalRendu.

 

I think it made as significant an improvement as changing from ultraRendu to opticalRendu, although it’s been a couple of months since I made that change. In any case, highly recommended!

thank you again for your clarification.

 

Also,- great to know that you got a significant performance boost when moving to the optical from the ultraRendu. I plan to move from the ultra to the optical as well.

 

 

 

[Albrecht]

2 hours ago, Superdad said:

 

No, I think (hope) he ran into the copper ‘B’-port and “out” of the optical SFP on the ‘A’ side.  The basic architecture and the ultra-low-jitter reclocking flops of the EtherREGEN are symmetrical on the two sides of the differential isolation moat—specifically so that people could run B>A (to an optical endpoint) and still obtain the special performance features of our switch. 

Hi Alex,

Thanks very much for commenting. And I do apologize, - I may have missed some details in the threads surrounding the topology of the etherRegen. 

 

I suspect that this may have been asked before, - but, - if you use the "B" side as an "input" will the "A" ports be forced to be 100MB or will they/can they be gigabit?

 

Cheers,

[JohnSwenson]

17 minutes ago, Albrecht said:

Hi Alex,

Thanks very much for commenting. And I do apologize, - I may have missed some details in the threads surrounding the topology of the etherRegen. 

 

I suspect that this may have been asked before, - but, - if you use the "B" side as an "input" will the "A" ports be forced to be 100MB or will they/can they be gigabit?

 

Cheers,

When going from B to A, the CONNECTION characteristics of the RJ45 A ports don't change, they are still auto-negotiated to 10-100-1000, BUT since the B side is 100 the overall throughput is limited to 100. So if you connect to an A port at gigabit, the bits in a packet are traveling at gigabit protocol, but there is more time between packets.

 

The A side SFP interface is ALWAYS gigabit only.

 

John S.

[Albrecht]

16 hours ago, JohnSwenson said:

When going from B to A, the CONNECTION characteristics of the RJ45 A ports don't change, they are still auto-negotiated to 10-100-1000, BUT since the B side is 100 the overall throughput is limited to 100. So if you connect to an A port at gigabit, the bits in a packet are traveling at gigabit protocol, but there is more time between packets.

 

The A side SFP interface is ALWAYS gigabit only.

 

John S.

Hi,

thank you John for that clear and concise explanation. For someone who wants to hang their TV, BluRay, AppleTV etc off of their etherRegen, - it may require some creativity in setting the proper location of their etherRegen. I believe that Alex mentioned this before, - but the etherRegen seems to belong on the audio rack.

 

[cat6man]

21 hours ago, incus said:

Also, by the way, it bears mentioning that going copper into the B side of the ER and out A side optical to either of my optical Rendus is the best sound I've ever had through speakers and/or headphones. And I've tried a lot of things in my time... Hurts to think about, in fact...

 

THAT is what I wanted to hear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

plus, my eR was in Alex's van today and I just received my shipping notice

[Superdad]

33 minutes ago, cat6man said:

plus, my eR was in Alex's van today and I just received my shipping notice

 

Yes, I just posted a progress update with pics here:

[Audioclyde]

My Regen arrived today. Simple setup with NAS where music files reside to modem/router, then to Regen, then Regen to Aurender, Aurender to USB input of Aesthetix Audio Romulus Signature DAC. Regen is powered by JS-2 pwr supply (set to 12v). All ethernet cables are Supra Cat 8 except the cable between EtherREGEN and Aurender—that is a The Linear Solution Cat7a (great cable for the $ IMHO). 
 

Fired up and listened briefly. Seems more immediate but no glare, pleased with my initial reaction. Going to let it all play a few hours and then give it a longer listen. 

[Audioclyde]

So I have about 5 hours on the Ether Regen at this point. Serious listening for the past 30 minutes.   WOW!  This is a significant improvement. My system consists of Manley Neo-Classic 300B pre, Audio Note Quest Silver Sig 300B mono amps driving Daedalus Audio speakers—fairly resolving but very musical for my tastes; the Ether Regen appears to be a fantastic addition.  Great job John & Alex. 
 

The naysayers out there just need to give it a listen. 

[sandervdp]

10 hours ago, Audioclyde said:

The naysayers out there just need to give it a listen. 

 

Could not agree more. Years ago, I ordered an Aqvox audiphile switch and returned it after a couple of weeks of listening. It did not make a meaningful difference compared to a netgear with a proper power supply for example and I thought money was better spent elsewhere.

 

Then almost two years ago, the story broke about the EtherRegen. Based on all the thinking that went into it, and that was described in detail here, I decided to give the idea of a special switch one more try with the EtherRegen, and I'm happy I did.

 

I'm actually contemplating purchasing a second one, replacing the other switch in my setup (which is JS-2 mac mini  > JS-2 powered netgear FS105 > 10m JSSG cable > Farad-powered EtherRegen > .3m JSSG360 cable > Metrum Ambre streamer)

 

 

[Ponkbutler]

4 minutes ago, sandervdp said:

I'm actually contemplating purchasing a second one, replacing the other switch in my setup (which is JS-2 mac mini  > JS-2 powered netgear FS105 > 10m JSSG cable > Farad-powered EtherRegen > .3m JSSG360 cable > Metrum Ambre streamer)

 

Two are working well in my system and I have a custom PSU on order from Sean Jacobs for them. My understanding is that because the JS-2 outputs are not totally isolated you may need two power supplies. The best option for earthing still remains to be seen - totally floating or just earthing the second. I'm sure Alex or John can elucidate.

[Audioclyde]

52 minutes ago, Ponkbutler said:

 

Two are working well in my system and I have a custom PSU on order from Sean Jacobs for them. My understanding is that because the JS-2 outputs are not totally isolated you may need two power supplies. The best option for earthing still remains to be seen - totally floating or just earthing the second. I'm sure Alex or John can elucidate.

I'm powering both the EtherRegen and USB Regen (USB Regen between B side and my DAC's USB input) with my JS-2, without connecting any external ground to the EtherRegen, and cannot discern any hum or noise issues at this point.

[Ponkbutler]

1 minute ago, Audioclyde said:

I'm powering both the EtherRegen and USB Regen (USB Regen between B side and my DAC's USB input) with my JS-2, without connecting any external ground to the EtherRegen, and cannot discern any hum or noise issues at this point.

 

Thanks, that's great to know. I think some of the issue is whether, with 2 EtherRegens, this may defeat the moat. As far as I am aware (which isn't saying much), both of the rails on the JS-2 are floating, so it could be that earthing the second EtherRegen from the terminal is all you would need. But don't take my word for it. I have no practical experience as yet and am unsure whether the earth shunt on the bundled PSUs is able to stop loops.