Building a DIY Music Server

[Nenon]

1 hour ago, Rovo said:

Nenon, this will take a while before the connection diagram will be available. Is it possible that you share some photos of your current testing setup. The reason for this is that I will make my own chassis and with the photos I will get a better idea about the size requirements. I have already designed my own chassis (for a different micro ATX motherboard) and would like to get a feeling if the unregulated LPS will fit.

 

Currently the motherboard is in a Streacom FC5 chassis, but will be assembled in the new chassis with the Taiko DC-ATX and a Paul Hynes SR7T or the unregulated LPS.

 

 

 

How big is the chassis? Taiko's chassis is 19” x 15.7” x 6.2”, I don't think v3 would fit. The chassis on the pictures looks much smaller than that. 

Take a look at the BOM I posted. I've listed all the parts there. You can check their dimensions. The only dimensions that you can't find online are the transformer and the Taiko MOSFET rectifier. I don't have their dimensions handy at the moment but will provide them in due time. 

[VaG]

Where is BOM that you posted?

 

[Rovo]

Nenon, the inner dimensions of this chassis are:

- width 450 mm (17.72")

- depth 409 mm (16.10")

- height 125 mm (4.92")

 

With the dimensions of the transformer and the Taiko rectifier I will see if it will all fit.

[ASRMichael]

Sorry to interrupt a last few posts but I’m at my wits end with a problem I have! 
 

I’ve been run successfully my Asus Rog Maximus XII Extreme mobo fine for the last few months!! 
 

What’s the problem? It won’t pass boot it say “Load VGA Bios” out of my 100 times trying its booted twice! 
 

Here’s a list of everything I’ve tried, countless hour in the last week. 

 

Cleared CMOS

Flashed bios with my working version 

Flashed bios with new version 

Removed RAM to 1 stick

Removed M.2 cards

Turned of Turbo & set all bios options to default 

Put bios settings back in that we’re working before. 
Removed Eth & USB card

 

Tried with a PC PSU. Interestingly boots no problem, that indicates maybe my LPS.  But they are working fine, unless an internal fault on the ATX or CPU rail. But maybe because I have a GPU card installed. My mobo doesn’t have internal graphics
 

Usually you can pin point the issue but I have no idea what to do next except chuck the mobo in the bin & start again! Arrrrrr! 
 

any help would be much appreciated! As I said it past post twice in probably 100 attempts! But I rebooted Euphony today and got stuck again! Rebooted it 30 times & gave up! So here I am asking for help! 
 

Hopefully someone can help? 

 

[genvirt]

Did You try install or reinstall bios?

 

To open a ticket at Asus support?

[StreamFidelity]

12 hours ago, ASRMichael said:

Tried with a PC PSU. Interestingly boots no problem, that indicates maybe my LPS.

 

During the boot process, high current peaks can overload weak power supplies. The boot process is aborted or repeated. This can destroy the motherboard. Which CPU are you using?

[ASRMichael]

1 hour ago, StreamFidelity said:

 

During the boot process, high current peaks can overload weak power supplies. The boot process is aborted or repeated. This can destroy the motherboard. Which CPU are you using?

i9 10900k - has been working for 2 months now with turbo on. set to short 150w and long 120w. I have a 10a supply. I turned off Turbo and still the same issue, which leads to me the ATX rail. 

 

Interestingly when I connect my PC PSU and boot it then shutdown and connect my LPS, it works, but only once. 

 

I have my Taiko card, awaiting for my cables to get made. That will resolve the issue I'm sure. 

[StreamFidelity]

1 hour ago, ASRMichael said:

i9 10900k

 

Is the CPU multiplier set to Auto? If so, try a fixed assignment for all cores, for example 42 (4.2GHz).

[ASRMichael]

38 minutes ago, StreamFidelity said:

 

Is the CPU multiplier set to Auto? If so, try a fixed assignment for all cores, for example 42 (4.2GHz).

Tried that also. 👍

[ASRMichael]

@StreamFidelity

 

I got it booted again. Connected pc psu loaded up Euphony. Shutdown. Connected LPS & worked. One thing I noticed was HD button flashes fast with pc psu, but same button lights up but doesn’t flash fast. It gets stuck on 2 flashes, maybe be drive is stopping the boot process.

 

I have added two extra sticks of ram and additional m.2 card. I wonder if ATX is getting enough power on boot. 

[Rovo]

Would this be the diagram for the unregulated LPS v3:

 

[elan120]

36 minutes ago, Rovo said:

Would this be the diagram for the unregulated LPS v3:

 

While waiting for confirmation from @Nenon, your schematic is the same as mine from the written description earlier.

[prinz]

I am also burning in a simple PSU recently:

 

Toroidy 300VA transformer with 17VAC output --> shottky bridge --> 33.000uf Epcos Sikorel *B41550 --> Hammond 195G10 choke (5mH, 10A) --> 100.000uf Epcos Sikorel B41550

 

this is the unregulated part and then is a PCB board with 10A LT1083 voltage regulator board with additional 66.000uf Mlytic at the input,  pair of original LT1083 high current regulators followed by Elna Silmic 1000uf on the output.

 

Currently under burn in period.

It already makes amazing difference in low frequency response, bass control and sound authority. It's quite surprising to see and hear how a computer transport power supply creates an illusion, like I would replace power amplifier with a stronger one.

 

 

 

 

*(I advise you to read about these on the internet, mainly diyaudio, still 9pcs available on mouser: https://pl.mouser.com/ProductDetail/epcos-tdk/b41550e5339q000/?qs=yE89RSRv7gKTkC1o8%2bPmmQ%3D%3D&countrycode=PL&currencycode=PLN )

 

 

[bit01]

Anyone ever try these caps? I see them used in some pricy LPS (NAIM 555PS)

Exxelia - FELSIC 039 (Capacitors > Aluminum Electrolytic > Screw Terminals)

 

Datasheet

felsic-039-v4.pdf (exxelia.com)

[MarcelNL]

good old sic-safco used to make some great capacitors, I used quite a few in my Le Monstre amp build decades ago (1.5F capacitor bank at 12V-0-12V). Generally it's recommendable to parallel more small caps than a few whopping large ones. Low ESR and noise current at your target voltage and high current capability are key, there probably are a few members here who can compare with other current caps.

 

[Nenon]

2 hours ago, Rovo said:

Would this be the diagram for the unregulated LPS v3:

 

 

Yes, that's about right. 

I will end up using 3 x 47,000 uF caps at the end (instead of 1 x 22,000 uF + 2 x 47,000 uF). That will keep all 3 caps the same height and make it easier to use a thick pure copper busbar instead of wires.

 

Also, let me open a can of worms here. Don't assume v3 is better than v2. It's better in some ways but not in others. I think you guys should listen to both and decide which one you prefer. V2 gives you better clarity. V3 gives you crazy expansive sound (i.e. there are no wall boundaries in my room anymore type of thing) but you lack some clarity. I wish it was safe to add a switch and switch between the two, but it's probably not! I would encourage people to try both and decide what they like more. 

[ted_b]

4 minutes ago, Nenon said:

V2 gives you better clarity. V3 gives you crazy expansive sound (i.e. there are no wall boundaries in my room anymore type of thing) but you lack some clarity.

Thanks....so, V3 lacks clarity compared to what?  V2 obviously...but how about V1 or other psu/ATX combos?  I ask cuz I am a Tesla M3 owner, and when I purchased it back in 2018 the sales folks said mine (the dual motor all-wheel long range edition) lacked a bit of torque compared to the performance model.  HA!!  Mine will break your neck if not careful so "lack of torque" is hilariously misleading for my needs; I can get around ANYTHING and more torque would simply ruin my tires faster.  🙂  Anyway.....you get my question....the lack of clarity in V3 may even be less than rounding error in even our most revealing systems (sans Taiko).

[blackswan]

On 5/16/2021 at 11:44 AM, Nenon said:

I mentioned doing a potential group order in the past. I can try to organise that and get the entire BOM. If anyone is interested in that, please contact me on PM before the end of May indicating if you want v2 or v3 and if you want someone to build it for you.

@Nenon Sorry if I'm jumping the gun here.  Since there is a likely a "v4" (for the Taiko chassis) down the line, would this indication of interests for the group buy include the v4 as well?  I understand you don't have all the parts fleshed out for v4 yet - I am just thinking along the lines of the long lead times for some parts, would it make sense to size the demand for that as well.  I, for one, would likely opt for the one chassis for the music server and power supply. 

[Nenon]

1 minute ago, ted_b said:

Thanks....so, V3 lacks clarity compared to what?  V2 obviously...but how about V1 or other psu/ATX combos?  I ask cuz I am a Tesla M3 owner, and when I purchased it back in 2018 the sales folks said mine (the dual motor all-wheel long range edition) lacked a bit of torque compared to the performance model.  HA!!  Mine will break your neck if not careful so "lack of torque" is hilariously misleading for my needs; I can get around ANYTHING and more torque would simply ruin my tires faster.  🙂  Anyway.....you get my question....the lack of clarity in V3 may even be less than rounding error in even our most revealing systems (sans Taiko).

 

Haha, good point! Let's say the V3 has the potential to break your neck (in terms of clarity) but with V2 you would need neck protection when you drive :). 

 

When I say v3 lacks some clarity, it is in comparison to v2. We are on the cutting edge technology with both of these. For most people, v3 would have more clarity than anything else they have tried before. But at this level, the power supply is so transparent and revealing, that you can easily hear the impact of adding an extra choke. The choke is a coil of wire and it costs less than $30. How good can that wire be (1 meter of the Mundorf silver/gold wire a lot of us use here is ~$160)? Not very good obviously, and you can hear the impact. I wonder if @Peter Avgeris or someone else here can build us a similar choke with silver wire or just better quality copper wire? However, thanks to this choke and the other components in the circuit we reduce the ripple from 5mV to 5uV. For high current draw servers like the dual Xeon I am using that has a huge positive impact (larger than the lost of clarity). Everything is a compromise, so you guys need to decide what your compromise is. 

 

I personally would not go with v1. This is an option if you are hardly trying to build this on a budget. For me the two options are v2 and v3. There is about $500 difference between the two. It's actually a lot of fun to compare the two versions. It's worth the $500 admission fee. If you don't need the experimenting-entertaining value, then start with V2. When you are ready to have some fun, spend the extra $500 and enjoy the ride. 

[Rovo]

Nenon, thank you for all the information. I know we are "squeezing" you for information at the moment.

 

Blackswan, I also want to use one chassis for the endpoint (in my case) and the power supply. My current chassis design is not the right layout for the unregulated LPS v3. Luckily my motherboard is a micro-ATX, with some rearranging I think I can fit it within my current chassis dimensions but it will be a tight squeeze. With the dual processor motherboard I do not think it will be possible to put it all in one chassis or you will have to be creative (using the height more optimal). I will first continue with my current design putting a SR7T in. I already have my aluminium cut to size in house.

[RickyV]

4 hours ago, Nenon said:

I wonder if @Peter Avgeris or someone else here can build us a similar choke with silver wire or just better quality copper wire?

How about these?

https://www.hificollective.co.uk/catalog/000-7527-5mh-jantzen-cross-coil.html

[Tatomek7]

On 5/16/2021 at 5:44 PM, Nenon said:

The second version (aka v2) consists of: IEC inlet --> Fuse --> Soft start --> Transformer --> Mosfet rectifier --> Hammond choke --> 3 x Mundorf HC 22,000 uF (each bypassed with VCAP ODAM 0.1 uF film cap) --> Output connector.

 

Hi @Nenon, Do you know what is power requirement to boot C621 MB? Hammond choke is rated with 5A, do you know, what current is taken from PSU by Taiko ATX board? In the meantime ( waiting for final information ) I'm considering to base rectifier on diodes, do you know what amperage will be needed?

[Gavin1977]

Potential new solution around the corner:  

https://www.fudzilla.com/news/pc-hardware/52893-noctua-confirms-its-passive-cpu-cooler-is-coming-soon

[RickyV]

1 hour ago, Tatomek7 said:

 

Hi @Nenon, Do you know what is power requirement to boot C621 MB? Hammond choke is rated with 5A, do you know, what current is taken from PSU by Taiko ATX board? In the meantime ( waiting for final information ) I'm considering to base rectifier on diodes, do you know what amperage will be needed?

 
max dc current is rated at 10A.

 

https://nl.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hammond-Manufacturing/195G10/?qs=xaYn2CMR%2FYz%2FNwLgL4s0Cw%3D%3D

[prinz]

I made some comparisons between CLC and CLCLC filtering using PSU Designer and have to confirm that CLCLC provides much better voltage ripple smoothing and filtering.

Better in terms of numbers of course.

 

1,68mV   on the output of CLC filter and 70nV after CLCLC filter.  Not sure how it influence the sound, but math wise - CLCLC is 24x times less ripple. Hmmm....