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A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

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5 hours ago, mozes said:

The JSSG 360 really takes the Lush to another level

Does Lush cable already have some shielding ? Is known what kind ?

Curious how much shielding change is JSSG 360 to original.

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On 6/28/2018 at 6:11 PM, R1200CL said:

@lmitche  thanks for all the creative thinking applied to the 360. @austinpop is proud of his newfound DIY abilities, and while inspiring, I’m a little nervous about trying it on my 2 Lush USB cables. Is there a more detailed 360 for Dummies in this thread anywhere?  I’ve searched but couldn’t find anything more detailed than your original post. Thanks 

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8 hours ago, jean-michel6 said:

Hi Moussa 

 

i have already jssg360 my lush !

Great so you know what I am talking about.

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8 hours ago, look&listen said:

Does Lush cable already have some shielding ? Is known what kind ?

Curious how much shielding change is JSSG 360 to original.

I have no idea how the Lush is constructed.

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3 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

@lmitche  thanks for all the creative thinking applied to the 360. @austinpop is proud of his newfound DIY abilities, and while inspiring, I’m a little nervous about trying it on my 2 Lush USB cables. Is there a more detailed 360 for Dummies in this thread anywhere?  I’ve searched but couldn’t find anything more detailed than your original post. Thanks 

 

Hey Bruce, 

 

What - my step by step guide for dummies, written by a DIY dummy, not good enough for ya? ?

 

Kidding aside, I understand your trepidation!

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17 hours ago, Johnseye said:

 

I've found these two characteristics are consistent when doing any emi and RF shielding. Apparently those things impact imaging and bass primarily. 

 

I've had to make other adjustments for bass as I've never had such great response from my speakers. And talk about holographic. I'm getting this from my turntable now as well. Never expected this from vinyl. 

 

You may remember that the bass response was one of the most common improvements mentioned with the first Uptone REGEN and then the ISO R and other isolators.  Seems noise everywhere impacts bass.  I would expect the imaging to improve but I’ve been surprised by the improvements in bass.  Pleasantly, I must say.  ?

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7 hours ago, austinpop said:

With that said, we've never heard the sMS-200ultra config sound this good, and certainly that thinner house sound, that we heard as slightly harsher (comparatively speaking only, of course) was far less evident. Certainly, with the combination of the SR-7 with the SOtM trifecta, the SQ gap between this and a direct SE configuration is quite small.

It will be interesting to visit this again with the sMS-200 ultra Neo with its "deeper midrange" once it's available.

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7 hours ago, austinpop said:
@limniscate is back from his travels, so today I went to drop off his SR-7 at his house. Out of the goodness of my heart, I had volunteered to care for and feed the beast, and burn it in while he was gone. Back-breaking work, but anything for a friend, you know.
 
While there, we did an sMS-200ultra/SR7 vs. SE experiment. The purpose of this experiment was to see if with the addition of the SR-7, did it lift the SQ of the sMS-200ultra to close the gap, or even surpass, the SE? We compared:
  1. Wall (router) > dCBL-Cat7 > SE > Curious > tX-USBulta (SR-4) > Lush > dX-USB HD Ultra (SR-7) > Transparent Reference AES > Yggy, to
  2. Wall (router) > dCBL-Cat7 > SE > dCBL-Cat7 > sMS-200ultra (SR-7) > Curious > tX-USBulta (SR-4) > Lush > dX-USB HD Ultra (SR-7) > Transparent Reference AES > Yggy
In both cases, the Roon Core was on the SE, along with all the music files on the SE's SSD. Mutec Ref 10 was driving the MC input of the sMS-200ultra, the tX-USBultra, and the dX-USB HD Ultra.
 
The sMS-200ultra was the Roon Ready endpoint in 2. Also in 2, we connected the sMS-200ultra to the bridged port on the SE. In other words, we gave the sMS-200ultra the best possible combination of bridging, PSUs, and clocking.
  
Listening Impressions
 
Short answer to the question: no. 
 
Even with these favorable conditions, the SE direct configuration 1 still sounded better than the sMS-200ultra configuration 2. We noticed the same advantages in the SE direct configuration I reported in my initial SE review. This configuration was noticeable more dynamic and punchy, plus there was a sense of calmness (lower noise floor), and a smoother, richer tone. We did this test with Eric sighted and controlling the changes, and me listening blind, but our findings were consistent and similar.
 
With that said, we've never heard the sMS-200ultra config sound this good, and certainly that thinner house sound, that we heard as slightly harsher (comparatively speaking only, of course) was far less evident. Certainly, with the combination of the SR-7 with the SOtM trifecta, the SQ gap between this and a direct SE configuration is quite small.
 
What this underscores once again is that many factors come into play when it comes to the SQ of the digital chain. While the sMS-200ultra/SR-7 has the benefit of superior clocking (Ref 10, sCLK-EX), and a superlative PSU, other factors in the SE design still cause it to achieve better SQ, despite no clocking enhancements.
 
It really makes me wonder how much more something like the Innuos Statement will deliver, albeit at a nosebleed price.
16

An interesting mini-review.  Thank's for posting.  Although reading the comments regarding the SOtM "house sound" begs the question as to how the upcoming sMS-200Ultra Neo would fair.  Things never stand still for long!?

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9 hours ago, austinpop said:

With that said, we've never heard the sMS-200ultra config sound this good, and certainly that thinner house sound, that we heard as slightly harsher (comparatively speaking only, of course) was far less evident. Certainly, with the combination of the SR-7 with the SOtM trifecta, the SQ gap between this and a direct SE configuration is quite small.

 

I wonder if the Neo version of the sMS-200ultra, which (as far as I can tell) is designed to eliminate the thinner house sound, would close the gap entirely in your #2 scenario.

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Update on the Cisco 2960 switch in my system...I removed the AC power supply and am now supplying 12VDC directly from my HDPlex linear.  This change definitely changed the character of the 2960.  Whereas previously, I felt it sounded lush and laid back (not necessarily a bad thing!),  now it sounds more balanced by presenting the music with a bit more energy and clearer delineation of notes.  Compared to my Cisco SG300 switch, I like how the 2960 seems to have more weight in the midrange, presenting vocals a bit more holographically.  On the other hand, the SG300 does a better job of more clearly retrieving lower level details with more precision.  As a lifelong wannabe tube guy, I prefer the 2960 (for now).

 

My next experiment will be to put an LT3045 between my HDPlex and the 12VDC input.  If that proves successful I will perhaps think about powering the switch with an Uptone LPS1.2

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2 hours ago, mozes said:

It will be interesting to visit this again with the sMS-200 ultra Neo with its "deeper midrange" once it's available.

 

2 hours ago, Confused said:

An interesting mini-review.  Thank's for posting.  Although reading the comments regarding the SOtM "house sound" begs the question as to how the upcoming sMS-200Ultra Neo would fair.  Things never stand still for long!?

 

23 minutes ago, auricgoldfinger said:

 

I wonder if the Neo version of the sMS-200ultra, which (as far as I can tell) is designed to eliminate the thinner house sound, would close the gap entirely in your #2 scenario.

 

Agreed, the Neo is intriguing. It depends on how they've altered the tonal balance. And whether it is accompanied by an increase in dynamics and a lowering of the noise floor.

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1 hour ago, austinpop said:

 

 

 

Agreed, the Neo is intriguing. It depends on how they've altered the tonal balance. And whether it is accompanied by an increase in dynamics and a lowering of the noise floor.

May from SOtM is already on record as saying the Neo is less dynamic that the to-be-discontinued 200ultra.  They sacrificed dynamics for a warmer tonal balance. 

 

Everything SOtM has said about the Neo indicates this is a lateral move designed to get them closer to the sonic signature the company wants.  That's great, but it begs the question of why they didn't make the board responsible for the change in sonic signature an option so they don't lose the crowd that desires a more neutral rendition.

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On 6/21/2018 at 1:11 PM, austinpop said:

OK gang - SUCCESS building my very first JSSG 360 cable!

 

image.thumb.png.963fd3ba080e2f4ea42dbe1780a8f47d.png

 

To those DIY-phobic readers like me who've been hesitant to try this - come on in, the water's fine.

 

Steps:

  1. I started with this generic Pasternack RG-400 50Ω cable
    image.thumb.png.89b41874284ffd9ed3558674810519f4.png
  2. I first masked the protruding ends of the BNC connector into the cable with electric tape (green in the picture).
  3. I then used a pencil to shape the flat Electriduct 3/8" flat tinned copper braid into a cylindrical form, and then slid the braid over the BNC connector onto the cable.
  4. Following which, I applied electric tape over the bulk of the braid, leaving only the ends exposed, as shown below. Note: I used some tension while applying the tape to mimic the effect of the heat shrink tubing. It seemed to work fine. Also, this particular brand tape as shown is quite flexible and did not cause the cable to become resistant to bending as I had feared.
    image.thumb.png.bd701173ca8b63fa16ab786fafea0796.png 

    image.thumb.png.7f3bc93afeb208b0440b0bb2df5b513a.png
  5. Next, slide on the 2nd layer of braid:
    image.thumb.png.4992bbdb2c24d607135802343732970a.png
  6. After this, I "encouraged" the exposed ends of the inner and outer braids to fuse together - not hard, just peel away from the cable and then finger twist the wires of both braids together. I then used the silicone rubber fusing tape - awesome stuff, excellent hint by @mozes - to seal the fused ends of the braid. This tape is stretchy, so it helps to apply some tension when applying it, and it just fuses nicely.
  7. Final step, slide on the wire sleeve for a nice finished look, and seal with the fusing tape.

End result:

image.thumb.png.963fd3ba080e2f4ea42dbe1780a8f47d.png

 

I'll be doing some listening this evening, and will report on how it sounds. Exciting stuff!

 

Rajiv -- How did I miss this?!  Very helpful. As an official dummy, I have more than a few questions for clarification:

1. Although I cannot tell for sure from the pix, it appears the Lush I am targeting for a 360 has considerably more "girth" than the Pasternak. Is this right? Will the tin copper braid you used stretch sufficiently/readily a second time over the Lush after adding a layer of electrical tape, and a first layer of copper braid? Or do I just need a bigger size copper braid or finishing wire braid?

2. Your step 2 is simply covering whatever the connector ends of the cable are with electrical tape in order to prevent shredding of the copper braid as pull it over?

4. In step 4 above, the idea is simply to unravel a group of multiple strands from each the two braids and retwist them so the braids are now connected at each end, just as you would twist two electrical wires together.

5. It is hard for me to see exactly how the fusion tape works, but even though it looks like tape (on the link-to-purchase site), I do not detect anything that looks like tape on the final pic of the 2 twisted, braided ends. ?

6. It appears you are making an effort to keep the 2 new twisted braids away from the end of the cable to avoid touching it?

7. Although several people have posed questions suggesting cables need to cut to implement the 360, that does not appear to be the case, I'm happy to say. Consequently, there is no danger of harming the Lush or any other cable in the process of doing this. And if I dont like the sound for whatever reason, the braids would seem to be easily removed. Is this right?

7. Are there any other differences between doing the 360 on a Lush vs. coaxial?

 

Thanks once again for your patience, Rajiv.

 

Bruce

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13 hours ago, austinpop said:

It really makes me wonder 

An interesting result, thanks for sharing. 

 

As the power section of the sMS-200 Ultra (SR7) is probably on a similar profound level as the SE, now I also wonder if the streaming section of the SE is that good, or is the streaming section of the Ultra in for a significant upgrade? Taking into account that the Ultra also has a serious REF10 feed, the sum of the SOtM front-chain-combination (dCBL-CAT7/sMS-200 Ultra/SR7/REF10) exceeds the price of a single SE, by some margin.. (I'm also looking forward to the first hand Statement experiences, you'll probably have seen the Munich video comparison between the SE and Statement, these are quite promising..!!)

 

 

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Lush jssg 360 . I have now put some more hours listening to this cable. 

It is really a small miracle . It is so musical and organic sounding . Some digital harshness that I still had with my previous usb cable is completely gone .

Kudos to the designer !

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6 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

 

 

Agreed, the Neo is intriguing. It depends on how they've altered the tonal balance. And whether it is accompanied by an increase in dynamics and a lowering of the noise floor.

Hopefully it is a step up not sideways 

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10 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

 

 

Agreed, the Neo is intriguing. It depends on how they've altered the tonal balance. And whether it is accompanied by an increase in dynamics and a lowering of the noise floor. 

 

I wonder, since the website states "the original sMS-200 presents more dynamics compared to sMS-200ultra Neo."

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9 hours ago, aggielaw said:

May from SOtM is already on record as saying the Neo is less dynamic that the to-be-discontinued 200ultra.  They sacrificed dynamics for a warmer tonal balance. 

 

13 minutes ago, auricgoldfinger said:

I wonder, since the website states "the original sMS-200 presents more dynamics compared to sMS-200ultra Neo."

 

Yes, the only question is whether they and we mean the same thing by the word dynamic. Given the language barrier, I think we won't know this until we've tried it.

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9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

 

1. Although I cannot tell for sure from the pix, it appears the Lush I am targeting for a 360 has considerably more "girth" than the Pasternak. Is this right? Will the tin copper braid you used stretch sufficiently/readily a second time over the Lush after adding a layer of electrical tape, and a first layer of copper braid? Or do I just need a bigger size copper braid or finishing wire braid?

 

I'm pretty sure I used the 3/4" braid https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MEG9V2R/ for both layers. I used the 1/2" sleeving for the outermost sheath. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B072M98HTV/

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

2. Your step 2 is simply covering whatever the connector ends of the cable are with electrical tape in order to prevent shredding of the copper braid as pull it over?

 

That was due to the BNC connector. This is a non issue with the Lush. Just make sure to start and end the braid a bit into the cable, well past the 2 USB connectors. Since the connectors are already covered by the Lush heatshrink, you shouldn't have any issue.

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

4. In step 4 above, the idea is simply to unravel a group of multiple strands from each the two braids and retwist them so the braids are now connected at each end, just as you would twist two electrical wires together.

 

Yeah, it'll be obvious when you get there. There's enough fraying and unraveling of the braid during the act of pulling it over the cable, that there's enough strands. You're essentially pressing the ends of both the inner and the outer braid together. A bit of a twist gets enough contact.

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

5. It is hard for me to see exactly how the fusion tape works, but even though it looks like tape (on the link-to-purchase site), I do not detect anything that looks like tape on the final pic of the 2 twisted, braided ends. ?

 

Again - obvious when you have it in hand. It has a taffy-like consistency. Use some tension to stretch it when you wrap, and it just adheres when you press it in. Magic!

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

6. It appears you are making an effort to keep the 2 new twisted braids away from the end of the cable to avoid touching it?

 

Yup.

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

7. Although several people have posed questions suggesting cables need to cut to implement the 360, that does not appear to be the case, I'm happy to say. Consequently, there is no danger of harming the Lush or any other cable in the process of doing this. And if I dont like the sound for whatever reason, the braids would seem to be easily removed. Is this right?

 

I haven't done it, but I see no earthly reason why it wouldn't be completely reversible.

 

9 hours ago, Bruce Orr said:

7. Are there any other differences between doing the 360 on a Lush vs. coaxial?

 

Nope - it's even simpler since the connector and cable are similar in diameter - as opposed to the BNC where the connector is quite a lot bigger. And with the Lush you don't need to worry about insulating the metallic end of the connector that is close to the shield.

 

Just try it. The first one may not be too pretty, but you'll get the hang of it.

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14 hours ago, aggielaw said:

Everything SOtM has said about the Neo indicates this is a lateral move designed to get them closer to the sonic signature the company wants.  That's great, but it begs the question of why they didn't make the board responsible for the change in sonic signature an option so they don't lose the crowd that desires a more neutral rendition.

 

The answer to this might be because it is the Neo that has the more natural rendition.  The reason I state this is because earlier this year I performed detailed A/B tests between the sMS-200Ultra and both the microRendu and Devialet's built in AIR streaming.  The thing I found is that the sMS-200Ultra subjectively sounded brighter than both the microRendu and Devialet's AIR.  OK - This is my system and my ears, but this is all I have to go on, and to me it is the sMS200Ultra that is the "odd one out" in terms of neutral rendition, so I would speculate that maybe the Neo addresses this issue.

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 This is my  Sondheimm regulator. Is the area with the orange circle the positive or the negative?Is the area with the orange circle the positive or the negative?

8D0184C4-D780-446B-ABC4-B5430ED41ADA.jpeg

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16 minutes ago, Forehaven said:

 This is my  Sondheimm regulator. Is the area with the orange circle the positive or the negative?Is the area with the orange circle the positive or the negative?

8D0184C4-D780-446B-ABC4-B5430ED41ADA.jpeg

 

If that is a Stammheim LS-HPULN without rectifier diods (DC only) the orange circle should be -Ve. The -Ve is on the same side on input and output so you can double check it by checking the -Ve on the output which are marked.

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