Building a DIY Music Server

[adamaley]

You can sign me up for a group buy. Definitely interested.

[ASRMichael]

Me too!!

[Downtheline]

Same here! I'd have to abandon the approach I am using for a single 36637 socket mobo though if this is only made for the socket like the Asus Sage. All mobos I see that use a single narrow socket will look like this.

 

Peter do you think you could do the drawings for this general case set up as well?

[Downtheline]

21 hours ago, Nenon said:

getting four HDPlex H5 chassis

Btw Nenon, Larry agreed to sell me an extra cooling heatsink kit with my case. 

[Brianfromspace]

1 hour ago, Nenon said:

Innuos is a great option if you are not into DIY. 

 

Ping me on PM on that. I occasionally do some DC cables for members here but don't always have the time.

 

21V - 5A for the HDPlex 800W DC to DC ATX

12V - 10A for the CPU / EPS

5V - 3A for the JCAT USB XE

5V - 3A for the JCAT Net Femto

5V - 3A for PinkFaun ultra OCXO clock

 

I prefer the JCAT Net Femto in this build. If has better clock and external power. 

Fiber NICs, such as the Startech PEX1000SFP2 card draw power from the PCIe slot, which generates more electrical noise than an externally powered JCAT NICs. I have found that tweaking my network and adding fiber elsewhere is a better approach and works better for me. Tweaking the network is a whole other topic.

 

Yes, it's more than enough in my case. Even 4GB works, but you are too close to the edge.

Thanks for all your clear answers!!

[Peter Avgeris]

2 hours ago, Nenon said:

 

@Peter Avgeris It seems like you have no idea how much you are missing and how much better your digital source can be, but I don't have time or the desire to argue about this. If you are happy with your source that is all that matters. 

 

 

Some members here (including me) can definitely use your mechanical engineering skills and take you on this offer. I suggest we start a new thread to discuss the options. There are a couple of people in Europe that already have the Sage motherboard and are looking for a passive cooling solution. I will refer them to the new thread. Perhaps someone can send you a motherboard, you can do a prototype, and we can do a group buy from you. Thank you for offering this. It's really good that someone can do a more professional heatsink than my ugly mockup. For those of us in the US, I am sure our European friends will help us. You can ship to them, and they can handle the rest (distribute to the US).

 

 

BTW, the Hdplex uses 6mm pipes. 

Really? I am losing so much! WoW! This is very interesting. I am all ears. I do not consider myself a digital guru. I admit that I know quite a lot of things for designing tube amplifiers with exotic transformers, all designed, wound and manufactured in-house, but I am mostly easy going with digital. I tried to use high power streamers but they never gave me that extra magical hint. Whatever I listen through any sources, specially digital, is more or less the same to my ears, as I have been used to the rather extreme differences between power amplifiers and crazy, out-of-this-world field coil loudspeakers, with exotic heat treating procedures for the poles. If you could assist me on this, I would be more than happy 🙂

 

Go ahead, start a new thread and invite me there. My big problems dealing with US is the very strict and very troublesome customs controls. Whatever is imported undergoes taxation no matter if it is a free gift or experimental, or even if it will be sent back. On the other hand, dealing with EU citizens is so easy and fast.

 

I do not know of a friend here that has this MoBo available. I have a friend in Germany, Heidelberg area, he has this board with dual Xeons, dunno if he could send it to me. No need to thank me, this is a bit easy for me to accomplish. So, go ahead start a new thread and if you could send me any hints regarding up-lifting sound quality with digital streamers, I am all yours 🙂

 

All the best from Athens

Peter

[Peter Avgeris]

2 hours ago, Downtheline said:

Peter do you think you could do the drawings for this general case set up as well?

 

 

I have already done drawings for nozzles of proton accelerators and complete mass spectroscopy machines with radioactive strontimum-90 at http://www.inp.demokritos.gr/

Several years ago.

I guess that this won't be any more difficult...

 

[Downtheline]

That is pretty cool Peter. 

[Nenon]

6 minutes ago, Peter Avgeris said:

Really? I am losing so much! WoW! This is very interesting. I am all ears. I do not consider myself a digital guru. I admit that I know quite a lot of things for designing tube amplifiers with exotic transformers, all designed, wound and manufactured in-house, but I am mostly easy going with digital. I tried to use high power streamers but they never gave me that extra magical hint. Whatever I listen through any sources, specially digital, is more or less the same to my ears, as I have been used to the rather extreme differences between power amplifiers and crazy, out-of-this-world field coil loudspeakers, with exotic heat treating procedures for the poles. If you could assist me on this, I would be more than happy 🙂

 

Well, completely offtopic, but since you opened up the subject, here is what I have been working on while waiting for my custom Apacer memory. 

 

This is an Extreme, cost no object, version of the Audio Mirror Reflection 45W Set monoblocks with custom transformers, Mundorf Mtube and Mlytic capacitors in the power supply, Z-foil resistors all over, Duelund CAST PIO tinned copper capacitors, exotic wiring, WBT Nextgen connectors, Furutech NCF inlet, etc. The list goes on. I use four of these to bi-amp my high efficient speakers, which have 18'' woofers. I tried Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amps for the woofers thinking that might be the ultimate bass amplification. But those SET monoblocks outperformed the Jeff Rowland by a huge margin in the bass section. It's unbelievable how much more detailed and vibrant bass I got with those. That was one of those shocking and completely unexpected moments. I was so biased towards the Jeff Rowland that it took me quite some time to believe it. But it sounds like this is a small toy compared the stuff you are talking about :). 

 

Digital, on the other hand, is completely different. You really have to tune your listening differently to identify the small differences in the digital domain. Needless to say, the power supply is the most important component in the digital source. And the power supplies that do miracles for analog gear don't necessarily work that good for digital. A high powered server with not so optimal power supply can sound pretty bad. But once you nail down the power, the magic starts. 

 

The Asus ROG Crosshair VII Hero build mentioned earlier in this thread with the upgraded motherboard ultraOCXO clock sounds amazing. This dual Xeon Asus SAGE will surpass the Asus ROG build but it takes a lot more effort. One is running Euphony, the other one is running Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC. They are tuned completely different. One sounds better playing music from a NAS. The other does not sound good from NAS and needs local storage. It also takes quite a bit of effort to tweak your network. But when it all clicks, it's magical. 

 

47 minutes ago, Peter Avgeris said:

Go ahead, start a new thread and invite me there.

Perhaps one of the people who are interested here can take case of this? If there is no volunteer, I can do it later this week.

 

48 minutes ago, Peter Avgeris said:

I have a friend in Germany, Heidelberg area, he has this board with dual Xeons, dunno if he could send it to me.

If this is Dirk, that's one of the people I had in mind as well. Haven't talked to him lately, but I believe he would be willing to send you the motherboard. 

 

 

[ray-dude]

10 minutes ago, Nenon said:

This is an Extreme, cost no object, version of the Audio Mirror Reflection 45W Set monoblocks with custom transformers, Mundorf Mtube and Mlytic capacitors in the power supply, Z-foil resistors all over, Duelund CAST PIO tinned copper capacitors, exotic wiring, WBT Nextgen connectors, Furutech NCF inlet, etc. The list goes on. I use four of these to bi-amp my high efficient speakers, which have 18'' woofers. I tried Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amps for the woofers thinking that might be the ultimate bass amplification. But those SET monoblocks outperformed the Jeff Rowland by a huge margin in the bass section. It's unbelievable how much more detailed and vibrant bass I got with those. That was one of those shocking and completely unexpected moments. I was so biased towards the Jeff Rowland that it took me quite some time to believe it. But it sounds like this is a small toy compared the stuff you are talking about :). 

 

...and this is EXACTLY why I'm in complete denial about the existence of SET monoblocks...something like this in the house would become a full time job (obsession?)  Gorgeous work Nenon!

[Peter Avgeris]

28 minutes ago, Nenon said:

 

Well, completely offtopic, but since you opened up the subject, here is what I have been working on while waiting for my custom Apacer memory. 

 

 

This is an Extreme, cost no object, version of the Audio Mirror Reflection 45W Set monoblocks with custom transformers, Mundorf Mtube and Mlytic capacitors in the power supply, Z-foil resistors all over, Duelund CAST PIO tinned copper capacitors, exotic wiring, WBT Nextgen connectors, Furutech NCF inlet, etc. The list goes on. I use four of these to bi-amp my high efficient speakers, which have 18'' woofers. I tried Jeff Rowland 625 S2 amps for the woofers thinking that might be the ultimate bass amplification. But those SET monoblocks outperformed the Jeff Rowland by a huge margin in the bass section. It's unbelievable how much more detailed and vibrant bass I got with those. That was one of those shocking and completely unexpected moments. I was so biased towards the Jeff Rowland that it took me quite some time to believe it. But it sounds like this is a small toy compared the stuff you are talking about :). 

 

Digital, on the other hand, is completely different. You really have to tune your listening differently to identify the small differences in the digital domain. Needless to say, the power supply is the most important component in the digital source. And the power supplies that do miracles for analog gear don't necessarily work that good for digital. A high powered server with not so optimal power supply can sound pretty bad. But once you nail down the power, the magic starts. 

 

The Asus ROG Crosshair VII Hero build mentioned earlier in this thread with the upgraded motherboard ultraOCXO clock sounds amazing. This dual Xeon Asus SAGE will surpass the Asus ROG build but it takes a lot more effort. One is running Euphony, the other one is running Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC. They are tuned completely different. One sounds better playing music from a NAS. The other does not sound good from NAS and needs local storage. It also takes quite a bit of effort to tweak your network. But when it all clicks, it's magical. 

 

Perhaps one of the people who are interested here can take case of this? If there is no volunteer, I can do it later this week.

 

If this is Dirk, that's one of the people I had in mind as well. Haven't talked to him lately, but I believe he would be willing to send you the motherboard. 

 

 

Very nice project. So you're a SET guy! At least it seems that we speak the same language 🙂

It seems you became a SET guy after your comparison with JF designs... Hehe, I am a bit older than you 🙂

It seems we're going to be communicating here a bit more frequently...

I know that PS is probably the 80% of sound qualities everywhere. I'm going to build my supplies but now I'm into other things so I have left this project for the future.

Yes, it's Dirk. You know him? Amazing! Send him a message and ask him about me. I don't like talking about myself. You'll have some info...

 

All the best,

Peter

 

[adamaley]

Hi Peter. Thanks for letting us know of your really valued skillset, and we are thankful you are willing to help a couple of interested folks here out. Just so you don't run afoul of the powers that be here, be sure to disclose your commercial standing, IF ANY. I would hate for things to go sour down the road due to that. 

 

Again, thanks for making yourself available to assist in our DIY efforts here.

 

 

[Downtheline]

3 hours ago, Nenon said:

Perhaps one of the people who are interested here can take case of this? If there is no volunteer, I can do it later this week.

 

I'll try to get this done tonight. 

[LTG2010]

4 hours ago, Nenon said:

They are tuned completely different. One sounds better playing music from a NAS. The other does not sound good from NAS and needs local storage.

Try Audirvana 3.5 on your Windows setup, it plays from ram like euphony, way better sounding than Roon.

[Nenon]

7 hours ago, ray-dude said:

 

...and this is EXACTLY why I'm in complete denial about the existence of SET monoblocks...something like this in the house would become a full time job (obsession?)  Gorgeous work Nenon!

 

LOL. Ray - I was thinking about you when I posted that (but there was no option to hide my post from you).

No, forget about SET. It's a horrible thing. The tubes awfully distort the sound. You have to do a lot of tube rolling to find a tube with less distortion (with limited crackling and hum). The tubes need 500 hours to break-in and die at around the 510 hour mark. If you are even that lucky. Sometimes they die at the 495 hour mark, just 5 hours before the burn-in process is completed. A big percentage of the tubes just explode - it's very dangerous. 

Note: this message is just for @ray-dude. Please ignore if you are not @ray-dude 

[Nsxturbo]

Sorry Nenon,

 

I know your post was for Ray’s benefit, but I just couldn’t help myself to respond😉 And I promise to get back on topic soon and post my own developing experience of my current Sage WS C621E build (which is sounding quite splendid right now with the transplanted Xeon 4116 & 6 sticks of RAM from my Supermicro build & the 2nd Xeon 4116 & 6 more sticks of RAM added!)🤗 Ugly open case build as it is right now.

 

You know Ray, the warm glow of the tubes really clashes with cool display of the Dave anyway! My Dave drives my 115db/w Bd Orphean horns brilliantly but for some reason that SET amp keeps finding its way back in-line, even with the clashing glow🤔!

 

Cheers,

Todd

[ray-dude]

Maybe I'll get a nice Class D with switching supply and have that remind me what I don't pay attention to amps any more   If I waver, I need you guys (as my sponsors) to call me out and help me hold the line...

 

That being said, I would be delighted to foster any SETs that are looking for a home during these troubled times

 

 

 

 

[Hauser]

20 hours ago, Downtheline said:

Same here! I'd have to abandon the approach I am using for a single 36637 socket mobo though if this is only made for the socket like the Asus Sage. All mobos I see that use a single narrow socket will look like this.

 

Peter do you think you could do the drawings for this general case set up as well?

Hi Downtheline,

 

Just noticed your Frankenstein heatpipe implementation.  I intend using the same Supermicro board.  Recent mention had me look at the Turemetal cases and they seem to have a solution to your problem.  They use a third heatsink between the two case heatsinks.  Running the heatpipes parallel to the Ram cards to the third heatsink allows access to the cards without dismantling the pipes.  The socket base doesn't look overly complicated; a machine shop should be able to copy the Dynatron base in a lump of 12 x 108 x 78 copper and machine some parallel half radius slots in the top with a matching clamp down lid.  I'm thinking of four 8mm diameter pipes and using additional pipes to connect to the outside heatsinks as done by Turemetal.  Taiko Extreme looks to be using three 8mm heatpipes per CPU connected to a custom copper heatsink.  On line metals have 1.5 x 6 x 12inch copper bar for sale.  A more affordable option in extruded alloy from Marston 150 x 300 x 40.  Some DIY is called for.

 

Martin.

[Peter Avgeris]

I have started a new thread, as any guys here would be interested in this.

You can visit this thread at

 

[Mr Morris]

Can I ask a basic question? Apologies if it is answered elsewhere, but I have been inspired by this thread and put in an order to  Sean Jacobs! My question relates to the motherboard wiring. I was intending to wire all common voltage pins together, but notice you have not used them all. Is this because you are not using a SSD and so wiring the alternative separately? Thanks 

[Nenon]

16 hours ago, Mr Morris said:

Can I ask a basic question? Apologies if it is answered elsewhere, but I have been inspired by this thread and put in an order to  Sean Jacobs! My question relates to the motherboard wiring. I was intending to wire all common voltage pins together, but notice you have not used them all. Is this because you are not using a SSD and so wiring the alternative separately? Thanks 

 

I have done it both ways. Some cheap ATX cables are so thin that two wires (plus and minus/ground) cannot provide the necessary current. Doubling those wires is quite necessary. If you use better (and thicker) wires, like the ones you see here, and your motherboard does not draw a lot of current, you don't need all. Having said that, running multiple wires to each voltage is a good idea. Go for it. 

All 3 voltages on the ATX combined together need less than 30W. That's why it did not really matter that much. If I was adding PCIe cards such as powerful video cards that need a lot of power, it would have been a different story. But the PCIe cards in this case are externally powered and there is nothing else connected to the motherboard (besides the small m.2 Optane card of course). The CPU/EPS is where most of the current draw happens. And I use all 8 wires there. 

Good luck with your build. Feel free to post some pictures and feedback here when done. I think most people reading this threat enjoy looking at other people's DIY builds. 

[Mr Morris]

5 hours ago, Nenon said:

 

I have done it both ways. Some cheap ATX cables are so thin that two wires (plus and minus/ground) cannot provide the necessary current. Doubling those wires is quite necessary. If you use better (and thicker) wires, like the ones you see here, and your motherboard does not draw a lot of current, you don't need all. Having said that, running multiple wires to each voltage is a good idea. Go for it. 

All 3 voltages on the ATX combined together need less than 30W. That's why it did not really matter that much. If I was adding PCIe cards such as powerful video cards that need a lot of power, it would have been a different story. But the PCIe cards in this case are externally powered and there is nothing else connected to the motherboard (besides the small m.2 Optane card of course). The CPU/EPS is where most of the current draw happens. And I use all 8 wires there. 

Good luck with your build. Feel free to post some pictures and feedback here when done. I think most people reading this threat enjoy looking at other people's DIY builds. 

Thanks. I'll see what it turns out like first! You have set a very intimidatingly high standard.

 

I didn't realise that the grounds are all common. I wanted to keep them separate back to the caps. Or Do different ground pins correspond with particular voltages?

[Nenon]

2 minutes ago, Mr Morris said:

I didn't realise that the grounds are all common. I wanted to keep them separate back to the caps. Or Do different ground pins correspond with particular voltages?

The entire ground plane is common on every motherboard I have seen. 

[Downtheline]

Just a head's up, looks like Apacer ECC RAM deliveries are delayed. Here is a quote from Matt at FullySilentPCs: 

 

"I want to let you know, this PO was delayed. We apologize. This was due to Samsung had changed ETD on our orders and we were not able to fulfill this order by the 25th. As of right now, we don’t have an ETD. Samsung will let us know on the 28th about our orders. We will provide you an ETD then."

So I expect to receive an update tomorrow and will pass the info on to you then. Samsung supplies the dies that Apacer uses in their ECC RAM.

 

Anyone have another source?

[ASRMichael]

@Nenon I see you are using HDPlex 800w card again in your build. What benefits are you hearing versus direct connection from SJ LPS?