MQA is Vaporware

[Archimago]

1 hour ago, Rt66indierock said:

Lynbrook is reorganizing their business activities to reflect that they have separate hardware divisions and a software division based on BluOS, MQA and Scl6. This makes sense to categorize these activities separately. I doubt the hardware teams wanted the development and operating costs of BluOS in their financial reporting. Adding MQA Ltd staff they brought over brought over as part of the deal to acquire MQA and SL6 assets would not fit well into their hardware divisions.

 

The number of people who can decode an MQA file was probably never over 300,000 and is now less because Roon no longer automatically decodes MQA files and Tidal is switching to FLAC.

 

Tidal has laid off 40 people and according to a Resident Advisor source the company is making a clear shift from "being music-centric to product-centric–pushing tech initiatives instead of anything related to music, labels, distributors or artists."  The quality of this source is unknown, but this would make sense considering Tidal has had virtually no growth since 2020. Tidal will need to show $54 million of revenue in the fourth quarter of 2023 or they will show a loss of revenue from the prior year.

 

What doesn't make sense to me is for Lynbrook to create a streaming service with MQA. High-resolution streaming has not shown that it can attract enough customers to make it worthwhile with Tidal’s numbers, Qobuz’s small numbers and no one talking about how successful high-resolution streaming was at either Apple or Amazon. You must consider that the market may be saturated and there is no room for more growth.

What looked like a relatively risk-free acquisition of MQA and SCL 6 ow looks a lot riskier.

 

 

Thanks @Rt66indierock.

 

I'd be surprised if Lynbrook is seriously considering their own MQA-encoded streaming service as well. That's a lot of work to launch and more than likely losing money in the attempt - I would hope everyone can see that; including Lee and Veth. Who knows, maybe they can contract Sypnios Growth Capital and achieve: "alignment of purpose (that) transforms culture to capture both personal satisfaction & financial rewards". Good luck with that. 🤔

 

Depending on what handcuffs Lynbrook bought with MQA (Mike Jbara came with the deal?). Otherwise, ~USD$135k total and only £20k for SCL6 seem pretty insignificant even if they just walk away and their already-under-development SCL6-based headphones bomb.

[Rt66indierock]

1 minute ago, Archimago said:

 

 

Thanks @Rt66indierock.

 

I'd be surprised if Lynbrook is seriously considering their own MQA-encoded streaming service as well. That's a lot of work to launch and more than likely losing money in the attempt - I would hope everyone can see that; including Lee and Veth. Who knows, maybe they can contract Sypnios Growth Capital and achieve: "alignment of purpose (that) transforms culture to capture both personal satisfaction & financial rewards". Good luck with that. 🤔

 

Depending on what handcuffs Lynbrook bought with MQA (Mike Jbara came with the deal?). Otherwise, ~USD$135k total and only £20k for SCL6 seem pretty insignificant even if they just walk away and their already-under-development SCL6-based headphones bomb.

 

The added payroll they took on when they brought over several employees including Mike Jabra. These costs may exceed the revenue generated from royalties and licensing fees.

[botrytis]

Lenbrook Media Group Created to Commercialize MQA, BluOS and SCL6 Across the Hi-Res Music Category - ecoustics.com

 

Just received this in email......

[The Computer Audiophile]

3 minutes ago, botrytis said:

Lenbrook Media Group Created to Commercialize MQA, BluOS and SCL6 Across the Hi-Res Music Category - ecoustics.com

 

Just received this in email......

Ahem. 
 

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/30381-mqa-is-vaporware/?do=findComment&comment=1266032

 

[botrytis]

25 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Ahem. 
 

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/30381-mqa-is-vaporware/?do=findComment&comment=1266032

 

 

I was just posting it as it was from ecoustics 😁😇 It is the start of the audio press pushing it again.

[firedog]

I'm still thinking they were really interested in SCL6 for their own products, and not so much MQA.

[Confused]

17 minutes ago, firedog said:

I'm still thinking they were really interested in SCL6 for their own products, and not so much MQA.

I thought the same when I first read the announcement.

 

Looking now at Lenbrook's own website, I am not so sure.

https://lenbrook.com/

 

[firedog]

3 hours ago, Confused said:

I thought the same when I first read the announcement.

 

Looking now at Lenbrook's own website, I am not so sure.

https://lenbrook.com/

 

Maybe they know something I don't, but who is going to care about MQA? Pretty soon there's not even going to be a readily available source for it. It's already been shown that Tidal streaming of it wasn't enough to make it viable. What manufacturers are going to put decoders in their products? 

If they really think they are going to make something of it, I think they are only going to find out what a black hole it is for their cash.

[UkPhil]

5 hours ago, Confused said:

I thought the same when I first read the announcement.

 

Looking now at Lenbrook's own website, I am not so sure.

https://lenbrook.com/

 

I see MQA is only assisting “acoustic musical performances” now 🙄, at least my death metals safe 😉

[Confused]

18 minutes ago, UkPhil said:

I see MQA is only assisting “acoustic musical performances” now 🙄, at least my death metals safe 😉

Excellent, the same for my Techno.

[Stereo]

On 1/4/2024 at 8:27 AM, The Computer Audiophile said:

When I got to the part about Mike Jbara’s “excellent people skills” my eyes were like 😳

Here’s a reminder of my view on that from RMAF (link).

 

Wow, life is rich. 

 

 

 

 

 

JANUARY 4, 2024, CONSUMER ELECTRONICS SHOW, LAS VEGAS – The Lenbrook Group of Companies, owner of globally recognized hi-fi brands like NAD Electronics, PSB Speakers, and Bluesound and the renowned BluOS hi-res multiroom platform, has created a new business unit, Lenbrook Media Group. The new entity will more effectively enable the commercialization and development of Lenbrook’s content management solutions, as well as pursue new opportunities that fit Lenbrook’s vision to offer increased choice to music fans and enthusiasts for quality audio. With the BluOS content management platform at its core, this group will also oversee the growth of content encoding solutions MQA and SCL6 which Lenbrook acquired in the autumn of 2023.

“The acquisition of MQA’s assets complemented our existing BluOS platform and supports creators in the recording studio with capturing and delivering directly and in the highest quality, their art into the homes of music lovers. Creating the Lenbrook Media Group allows us to fully capitalize on this unique position by giving it focus, and putting the right strategies, structure, and resources in place,” explains Gordon Simmonds, President and CEO of The Lenbrook Group of Companies.

 

Lenbrook Media Group will be led by newly-appointed Vice-President and General Manager, Mike Jbara, the former MQA CEO and Warner Music executive.

“We worked closely with Mike when he led MQA and were impressed by his understanding of the complete content chain from creation through playback,” Simmonds adds. “His excellent people skills, his deep understanding of the music industry and his knowledge of music technology and licensing-oriented business activities, makes the leadership role at Lenbrook Media Group a perfect fit for both parties.”

Jbara says, “Once you combine Lenbrook’s vision for advancing choice and innovation in the performance audio industry with the assembly of some of the best minds in audio hardware and software engineering, it results in substantive opportunity to empower creators, distributors, fans, and broadcasters in addition to hardware manufacturers. It is an exciting list of possibilities that we believe will benefit both the music and the specialty audio industries.”

Jbara and Lenbrook Media Group colleague, Andy Dowell, Head of Licensing, will attend the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas, January 9-12, 2024, and will be taking appointments to discuss licensing, integration, and other opportunities.

Anybody that has time to waste yet is going and hates MQA should book all the appointment times Lenbrook has at CES so they get to talk to nobody about anything! Better yet someone lock them in their room maybe get them really drunk real late every night too.

[Stereo]

19 hours ago, MikeyFresh said:

I'm hoping Lenbrook's CES 2024 dance card is relatively void of interested parties. I don't see why other manufacturers would want to help Bluesound/NAD/PSB in any way, and with TIDAL's pivot to hi-res FLAC, why anyone would spend time and money doing any further integration of MQA in their products.

 

[The Computer Audiophile]

11 minutes ago, Stereo said:

 

The answer to the question asked  is no. 

[MikeyFresh]

4 hours ago, Stereo said:

 

 

I'd like to think that's just due to limited resources/lousy financial conditions at TIDAL, as well as the reliance on the record labels to provide replacement files, TIDAL is at their mercy with that and can't dictate what happens or exactly when.

 

If there were to be an uncooperative record label I'd expect that to be Warner Music Group, though none of the big 3 are likely to be easy to work with. 

[bobfa]

Lenbrook + MQA == Walled Garden ??

 

Maybe a garden full of Triffids!

 

The triffid is a fictional tall, mobile, carnivorous plant species, created by John Wyndham in his 1951 novel The Day of the Triffids, which has since been adapted for film and television. The word "triffid" has become a common reference in British English to describe large, invasive or menacing-looking plants.

 

 

[botrytis]

39 minutes ago, bobfa said:

Lenbrook + MQA == Walled Garden ??

 

Maybe a garden full of Triffids!

 

The triffid is a fictional tall, mobile, carnivorous plant species, created by John Wyndham in his 1951 novel The Day of the Triffids, which has since been adapted for film and television. The word "triffid" has become a common reference in British English to describe large, invasive or menacing-looking plants.

 

 

 

I think mqa is more like a chigger...

 

Or maybe a bed bug....

[bogi]

5 hours ago, botrytis said:

I think mqa is more like a chigger...

 

Or maybe a bed bug....

 

Tidal, do you continue with bed bug disinfestation, or are you going to collaborate on on bed bug invasion?

[DuckToller]

Sounds like Tidal should come to the Summer Olympics in Paris this year ... 🥸
Bed bugs are the real favorite to beat there ...

[Currawong]

On 1/7/2024 at 4:53 AM, Rt66indierock said:

Lynbrook is reorganizing their business activities to reflect that they have separate hardware divisions and a software division based on BluOS, MQA and Scl6. This makes sense to categorize these activities separately. I doubt the hardware teams wanted the development and operating costs of BluOS in their financial reporting. Adding MQA Ltd staff they brought over brought over as part of the deal to acquire MQA and SL6 assets would not fit well into their hardware divisions.

 

The number of people who can decode an MQA file was probably never over 300,000 and is now less because Roon no longer automatically decodes MQA files and Tidal is switching to FLAC.

 

Tidal has laid off 40 people and according to a Resident Advisor source the company is making a clear shift from "being music-centric to product-centric–pushing tech initiatives instead of anything related to music, labels, distributors or artists."  The quality of this source is unknown, but this would make sense considering Tidal has had virtually no growth since 2020. Tidal will need to show $54 million of revenue in the fourth quarter of 2023 or they will show a loss of revenue from the prior year.

 

What doesn't make sense to me is for Lynbrook to create a streaming service with MQA. High-resolution streaming has not shown that it can attract enough customers to make it worthwhile with Tidal’s numbers, Qobuz’s small numbers and no one talking about how successful high-resolution streaming was at either Apple or Amazon. You must consider that the market may be saturated and there is no room for more growth.

 

What looked like a relatively risk-free acquisition of MQA and SCL 6 now looks a lot riskier.

Pure speculation on my part:

I'm going to guess that they might try and push devices with SL6, and get manufacturers on board, using what little revenue MQA brings in. All they have left are a few companies that have it built into the hardware, such as XMOS. So, a few manufacturers, mostly in China, can throw the MQA logo on devices for the few people who still care. 

In the Bluetooth realm, APTx Lossless is starting, very slowly, to make an appearance. I don't see why any manufacturer would really want to deal with an unknown protocol over something from Qualcomm, or Sony for that matter, which has already been very successful with LDAC. 

I strongly suspect part of the reason Apple came out with high-res was, in part, to kill MQA. They hate being beholden to other peoples' software, as it burned them in the past, and it was entirely in their interest to ensure that MQA didn't become mainstream.

In the end, the separation means that if their MQA and SL6 efforts tank, it wont drag down the hardware division with it.

 

But, let's take a guess at what Lenbrook might do with the IP that could attract interest. 

Given the Bluesound Node is a big deal, I wonder if they aren't planning to create a lifestyle-component ecosystem of NAD/Bluesound components (streamers, receivers, DACs and headphones) that stream using MQA and SL6?  They could call it "BlueStream" (if someone hasn't already taken that, then "BlueSound Stream" or similar) and leverage the BlueSound brand. Requiring compatible components, if they get enough interest, other manufacturers might want to licence it. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

4 minutes ago, Currawong said:

Pure speculation on my part:

I'm going to guess that they might try and push devices with SL6, and get manufacturers on board, using what little revenue MQA brings in. All they have left are a few companies that have it built into the hardware, such as XMOS. So, a few manufacturers, mostly in China, can throw the MQA logo on devices for the few people who still care. 

In the Bluetooth realm, APTx Lossless is starting, very slowly, to make an appearance. I don't see why any manufacturer would really want to deal with an unknown protocol over something from Qualcomm, or Sony for that matter, which has already been very successful with LDAC. 

I strongly suspect part of the reason Apple came out with high-res was, in part, to kill MQA. They hate being beholden to other peoples' software, as it burned them in the past, and it was entirely in their interest to ensure that MQA didn't become mainstream.

In the end, the separation means that if their MQA and SL6 efforts tank, it wont drag down the hardware division with it.

 

But, let's take a guess at what Lenbrook might do with the IP that could attract interest. 

Given the Bluesound Node is a big deal, I wonder if they aren't planning to create a lifestyle-component ecosystem of NAD/Bluesound components (streamers, receivers, DACs and headphones) that stream using MQA and SL6?  They could call it "BlueStream" (if someone hasn't already taken that, then "BlueSound Stream" or similar) and leverage the BlueSound brand. Requiring compatible components, if they get enough interest, other manufacturers might want to licence it. 

It's somewhat surprising Lenbrook hasn't come out and made its intentions really clear. For a business that will rely on others adopting its technology, one would think a clear roadmap would be nice for the other manufacturers and potential customers. That is unless it's going to be a closed system.

[botrytis]

1 hour ago, Currawong said:

Pure speculation on my part:

I'm going to guess that they might try and push devices with SL6, and get manufacturers on board, using what little revenue MQA brings in. All they have left are a few companies that have it built into the hardware, such as XMOS. So, a few manufacturers, mostly in China, can throw the MQA logo on devices for the few people who still care. 

In the Bluetooth realm, APTx Lossless is starting, very slowly, to make an appearance. I don't see why any manufacturer would really want to deal with an unknown protocol over something from Qualcomm, or Sony for that matter, which has already been very successful with LDAC. 

I strongly suspect part of the reason Apple came out with high-res was, in part, to kill MQA. They hate being beholden to other peoples' software, as it burned them in the past, and it was entirely in their interest to ensure that MQA didn't become mainstream.

In the end, the separation means that if their MQA and SL6 efforts tank, it wont drag down the hardware division with it.

 

But, let's take a guess at what Lenbrook might do with the IP that could attract interest. 

Given the Bluesound Node is a big deal, I wonder if they aren't planning to create a lifestyle-component ecosystem of NAD/Bluesound components (streamers, receivers, DACs and headphones) that stream using MQA and SL6?  They could call it "BlueStream" (if someone hasn't already taken that, then "BlueSound Stream" or similar) and leverage the BlueSound brand. Requiring compatible components, if they get enough interest, other manufacturers might want to licence it. 

 

Apple is about total control. That means supposedly better integration, etc. The point was when Apple allowed clones, in the past, the clones were better designed and faster also. Like all-in-one designs, something has to give.

[RichardSF]

2 hours ago, Currawong said:

I strongly suspect part of the reason Apple came out with high-res was, in part, to kill MQA.

 

You give MQA way too much credit. If Apple cared about MQA, they could have bought it and bend it to their own needs. Apple going lossless was a brilliant move against Spotify, and hi-res was icing on the cake.

[yahooboy]

The ever MQA supporting Hi-Fi Choice has review of an wifi DAC.

 

The reviewer listens to lossless AAC an MQA (lossless the same way as AAC?)

[Archimago]

1 hour ago, yahooboy said:

The ever MQA supporting Hi-Fi Choice has review of an wifi DAC.

 

The reviewer listens to lossless AAC an MQA (lossless the same way as AAC?)

 

You must be talking about this article.

 

Quote

 

"Listening to my lossless AAC recording of Thomas Tallis’ sublime devotional Spem In Alium, the Diablo displays the lightest of touches. Each voice seems to rise gently during the quiet introduction, creating an impressive, soaring sense of space. The sheer clarity of detail is outstanding as the 40-voice choir gradually builds, and then the Diablo delivers the vast crescendo with an uplifting sense of awe.

 

Switching to the MQA streaming of my Tidal account, I’m delighted by the taut, pounding drum and chopping guitar intro to Didn’t Want To Be This Lonely, by The Pretenders, with the jangling guitar and crisp, cymbals creating a wonderfully loose and relaxed rhythm, driven along by the high-speed bass riffing."

 

 

Imagine that! An audiophile reviewer using a recording with the nuances of a "40-voice choir" that "gradually builds" - great - but the best he could do was AAC?! I bet he (whoever it was) miswrote and should have said FLAC, or ALAC. Typos happen, but it certainly does not convey confidence to the knowledgeable audiophile reader when this kind of thing happens, presumably not even picked up by the editor/proofreader!

 

Then again, I wonder if we were to take an honest poll of all Hi-Fi Choice readers, how many would have been perceptive and knowledgeable enough to pick up the issue! Or can appreciate the nature of the various codec options out there; beyond perhaps MP3 as the prime example of the "bad", lossy, non-audiophile codec.

 

[botrytis]

1 hour ago, Archimago said:

 

You must be talking about this article.

 

 

Imagine that! An audiophile reviewer using a recording with the nuances of a "40-voice choir" that "gradually builds" - great - but the best he could do was AAC?! I bet he (whoever it was) miswrote and should have said FLAC, or ALAC. Typos happen, but it certainly does not convey confidence to the knowledgeable audiophile reader when this kind of thing happens, presumably not even picked up by the editor/proofreader!

 

Then again, I wonder if we were to take an honest poll of all Hi-Fi Choice readers, how many would have been perceptive and knowledgeable enough to pick up the issue! Or can appreciate the nature of the various codec options out there; beyond perhaps MP3 as the prime example of the "bad", lossy, non-audiophile codec.

 

Then just throw in dead lossless codecs like *.ape (monkey audio). That will really throw them.