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  • The Computer Audiophile
    The Computer Audiophile

    Audiophile Style State of the Union

    Over the years the Audiophile Style forum has been an invaluable resource to many audiophiles and music lovers alike. This is all due to the contributions from members of the community from around the world, who freely give their time to help others and enjoy this wonderful shared interest we call audiophilia. Whether one's interests are mainly music or gear or a split between the two, matters not. Audiophile Style is about increasing one's enjoyment of music, gear, and the community in general. Nobody needs more negativity in their lives or more judgement of their personal pursuits. The world is full of that nonsense. Audiophile Style is a place to leave all that behind, to forget about one's mentally or physically draining day, and to immerse oneself in that which has brought joy to so many for so long. 

     

    Recently the scales have tipped a bit too far toward snark, combativeness, imposition, and confrontation. All of this is killing the vibe and the culture of Audiophile Style, pushing it more toward the 4chan of audio rather than a place to learn, share, and have fun. When I don't want to read some threads because I know the usual suspects will be on their high horses, something needs to change. When members of the community can't even have an enjoyable conversation without being rudely interrupted by people with an opposing agenda, something needs to change.

     

    We've had a very limited set of forum rules since our inception in 2007. These rules just keep honest people honest. Others find ways to bend them as far as possible, seeking to impose their own view of how this site should be run and what topics the conversations should include. For the most part, more rules won't change behavior. There are folks on the extreme ends of the audio continuum who just can't live with those who disagree, and that's a problem. 

     

    I've always encouraged people to post whatever opinion they hold or facts they have about all audio topics. However, this has to be done either in its own thread or in a thread where the information is desired. Those on the extreme ends just can't live with this either. When given the opportunity to self-police, the extremists can't stop themselves from posting in topics where the vast majority of people have zero interest in what they have to say. It's the equivalent of walking into a classical music party uninvited and putting on a Rage Against The Machine playlist. Sure, it's fabulous music but the time and place are wrong.  

     

    The bottom line is this, Audiophile Style is about increasing one's enjoyment of this wonderful hobby. I look forward to the 99% of members of this community working toward this goal and having a good time. 

     

     

    What's Changing?

     

    There is a new sub-forum called Objective-Fi. This is the place for objective audio discussions. It will be free from subjectivist appeals to authority, anecdotes, and unscientific experience threads and comments. This will free-up the objective-minded members of this community from going in circles trying to explain why something just can't be, for the 100th time. 

     

    This new sub-forum doesn't mean that the rest of the forum is entirely subjective only. Because audio is an inherently subjective pursuit, it makes no sense to create a subjective-Fi sub-forum equivalent to the Objective-Fi sub-forum either. The reality is that life isn't black & white. The other forum areas will continue on as they've been for years. If there is an objective challenge to one's subjective experience, the comment(s) will be moved to the Objective-Fi sub-forum for the discussion to continue unabated. 

     

    In essence the rules haven't changed, but now there is a place for discussions to be had where people on both sides of an issue can examine it and discuss it without turning everyone off and ruining peoples' days. 

     

    Please remember, the problem isn't what's said, it's the place in which it's said. 


    Thanks to everyone who has provided feedback in an effort to bring the enjoyment and fun back into our pursuit of HiFi and great music. Audiophile Style wouldn't exist without the wonderful members of this community

     


    - Chris
     




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    4 minutes ago, Confused said:

    So when a thread starts to get derailed, perhaps we just need to send the culprits to the pub car park and let them sort things out, the rest of us can then stay in the public bar a continue a civilized conversation.

     

    I struggle to believe that the fight takes place without an audience. 

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    Just now, The Computer Audiophile said:

     

    I struggle to believe that the fight takes place without an audience. 

    There is an audience, of course, just no witnesses when the police arrive.

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    1 minute ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

    If you think there are only a handful of people on Earth capable of debunking MQA and offering technical information, you're incorrect.

     

    True but they will driving traffic to other sites in the future.

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    1 minute ago, kumakuma said:

     

    True but they will driving traffic to other sites in the future.

    I don't think the MQA discussion will fly at ASR. There is a monetary motive to push MQA over there. 

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    3 hours ago, Jud said:

     

    As other folks have said, it doesn't seem nearly so much a matter of objective and subjective as it does people who wish to score points versus people who wish to be helpful. Back a few years this all was new enough that I think more of us felt we needed help where we could find it, and had an obligation to provide it if we could. There was more of a sense of being in this together before we all got so damn swaggeringly confident in ourselves.

     

    In case you haven't noticed, Chris is kind of at wit's end here, because y'all blew right through the past several ACMs (Asshole Coping Mechanisms). Someone even said "we can be assholes on occasion and you've allowed us to get away with it." News flash, Chris ain't your mommy. My wife works in an after school program with a couple of dozen kindergarteners through fifth graders, and that's plenty exhausting enough. Dealing with adults who want to act like grade schoolers is a little too much.

     

    Just be helpful. That means meeting people where they are, not where you figure they ought to be.

     

     

    I thought Sandy was removed from this thread - why are you addressing him?

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    23 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

     

    Mans has already left and I expect most of the other folks with technical chops to either leave soon or scale back their participation in this site.

     

    Will you be stepping in to fill their shoes?

     

    Nope, I sure won't. Thats not my area of knowledge. However if it were I see no reason why that is still not welcome here?

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    16 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

    I don't think the MQA discussion will fly at ASR. There is a monetary motive to push MQA over there. 

     

    MQA is done. I was thinking of the future.

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    5 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

     

    MQA is done. I was thinking of the future.

     

    With other topics it isn't much different over there. If there's a financial interest, it won't be measured and compared to the least expensive options and talked about the same way as products from manufacturers that aren't liked. It's really all about using the term science as a mask, cherry picking the clap traps, and protecting one's own business. Fine with me, but I'm not willingly blind to it.

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    1 minute ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

     

    With other topics it isn't much different over there. If there's a financial interest, it won't be measured and compared to the least expensive options and talked about the same way as products from manufacturers that aren't liked. It's really all about using the term science as a mask, cherry picking the clap traps, and protecting one's own business. Fine with me, but I'm not willingly blind to it.

     

    You seem to assume that the refugees are going to Amir's place. 

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    11 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

     

     

    I thought Sandy was removed from this thread - why are you addressing him?

    I thought you were gone. Why are you still here? 

     

    Nobody has been banned from the comment section of an article. 

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    6 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

     

    You seem to assume that the refugees are going to Amir's place. 

     

    I'm going by what they've said. 

     

    I they are looking for a place that allows them to be rude and piss into a punch bowl, I don't know where they'll find it. 

     

     

    6 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

     

    Sure, OK.  But I don't think your recent actions will be seen as rolling out the red carpet for them.  This is a win for MQA Chris.  I know it seems like I'm trolling but based on the history of MQA here, a strong case could be made that you've handed a huge win to MQA by raising up the "subjectivists" above everyone else.

     

    You mark my works, Quint and his ilk we be back in spades, reveling in their "win".

     

     

    Quint can say whatever he wants. I don't care if he declares victory. 

     

    Suggesting that only objectivists can "fight" MQA isn't a logical argument. The facts have been out for years. It's all about other stuff now. MQA doesn't care about the facts.  

     

     

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    3 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

     

    Evidence. please? As far as I know, Amir doesn't sell to the audiophile community. What is it that he needs to protect for his own business which is generally high-end home theater, and integrated security installations?

     

    There is plenty of crossover in high end home theater and audiophile products. I've been to countless installations and seen it in a majority of cases. 

     

    Because he has access to everything he sells, and more, it should be pretty easy to march that stuff out to the test bench and compare it to the new holy grail of the minute. He constantly rails against high end mfgs, but of course none of them who are his venders and he would never measure his gear and tell a customer to stop buying the expensive stuff because the cheap stuff is just as good. Yet, he does this all day long when it's someone else's business thats effected. 

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    10 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

    Suggesting that only objectivists can "fight" MQA isn't a logical argument. The facts have been out for years. It's all about other stuff now. MQA doesn't care about the facts.

     

    I completely understand the spin you're putting on the de facto purge.  But I'm talking about the actual history of MQA dissent that started on this very forum, not some non sequitur hypothetical. 

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    6 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

    There is plenty of crossover in high end home theater and audiophile products. I've been to countless installations and seen it in a majority of cases. 

     

    Because he has access to everything he sells, and more, it should be pretty easy to march that stuff out to the test bench and compare it to the new holy grail of the minute. He constantly rails against high end mfgs, but of course none of them who are his venders and he would never measure his gear and tell a customer to stop buying the expensive stuff because the cheap stuff is just as good. Yet, he does this all day long when it's someone else's business thats effected. 

     

    So, no evidence, just a suspicion of impropriety? Can you give just a few brand names of what he uses in his business that he refuses to measure? Because I'm pretty sure he measured some expensive digital processors he claims he uses, and they did not measure well.

     

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    35 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

     

     

    I thought Sandy was removed from this thread - why are you addressing him?


    Ah, ever the scamp. 😀

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    2 minutes ago, pkane2001 said:

     

    So, no evidence, just a suspicion of impropriety? Can you give just a few brand names of what he uses in his business that he refuses to measure? Because I'm pretty sure he measured some expensive digital processors he claims he uses for his business, and they did not measure well.

     

    I've been down this path countless times, naming brands etc... not going down it again for you to ignore the evidence. Plus, you don't seem to want the information so I will not force it down your throat.

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    6 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

     

    I completely understand the spin you're putting on the de facto purge.  But I'm talking about the actual history of MQA dissent that started on this very forum, not some non sequitur hypothetical. 

    No worries. 

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