The $3K all in exercize.

[davide256]

2 minutes ago, GUTB said:

 

Well that is definitely no fun. I was under the impression I was criticizing a $3k system as per the thread title.

I have both MG 1.7's and LS50's.  You can't build as good a system under $3k with the MG 1.7s as  you can with the LS50's because they require a very good

amplifier. I doubt I'll put the 1.7's back into play until I'm ready to spend over $4k on new amplifiers

[Ron Scubadiver]

23 minutes ago, Jud said:

 

Your correspondent makes outrageous statements his stock in trade. As you have very unfortunately found out, there are much more important things in life to be concerned with.  So if you don't worry about what your correspondent thinks, rather than being outraged and engaging with him (familiar turf for him on which he is quite happy), your life will be simpler and more pleasant.

Good advice.

[Ron Scubadiver]

18 minutes ago, davide256 said:

I have both MG 1.7's and LS50's.  You can't build as good a system under $3k with the MG 1.7s as  you can with the LS50's because they require a very good

amplifier. I doubt I'll put the 1.7's back into play until I'm ready to spend over $4k on new amplifiers

I like Maggies, but probably don't have enough room for them.  Some have had good results with Crown XLS2 amps.  You could get an XLS 2002 from any pro audio outlet which allows returns, and see what happens.  

[Nordkapp]

38 minutes ago, Ron Scubadiver said:

@GUTB  I looked at the photo of your system.  It's gear I wouldn't mind having, but I don't have the desire to spend that much for the small improvement it would provide.  In the end, it's just a couple of bookshelf speakers with all their limitations.  In fact the LS50's are vastly superior and there are tons of reviews out there to prove it.  You would be better off if you had a pair.

 

Your room is tiny, so I can see why you can't utilize a decent pair of full range speakers.  I'm so sorry you are stuck with that space.

 

I am not cheap, tight or poor.  However, my house and most everything in it was destroyed by flooding from Hurricane Harvey last August.  We just bought another house which used up a chunk of our resources.  Furniture is being replaced bit by bit, so I will just have to limp forward with my toy DAC and totally unacceptable Class D amp until that process runs it's course.  Those components were designed for pro audio, and those guys obviously must be deaf from making music all day long.

 

So, after what I have been through since last August, I really don't appreciate how I am being treated.

My advice-quit worrying about what a total internet stranger thinks about your possessions. By GUTB's ideas, most members rigs are inadequate....As long as you like it.....who cares. 

[GUTB]

1 hour ago, davide256 said:

I have both MG 1.7's and LS50's.  You can't build as good a system under $3k with the MG 1.7s as  you can with the LS50's because they require a very good

amplifier. I doubt I'll put the 1.7's back into play until I'm ready to spend over $4k on new amplifiers

 

I picked the Magnepans because those are desirable to less experienced audiophiles on a budget. I can't educate people against Magnepans, they won't listen so if they're going to go that direction anyway I might as well figure out how to get best out of them with a super tight budget. They are low-sensitivity speakers, and they require amps to work hard for them; the low-experience low-budget audiophile look to class D but that is a huge mistake. You want a legitimate, serious, big linear amplifier with a lot of current and the muscle to hang on to large ribbons.

 

The LS50s are fine mini-monitors, but they're not real speakers for actual listening rooms. The powered versions suck because they use class D.

[davide256]

2 hours ago, GUTB said:

 

I picked the Magnepans because those are desirable to less experienced audiophiles on a budget. I can't educate people against Magnepans, they won't listen so if they're going to go that direction anyway I might as well figure out how to get best out of them with a super tight budget. They are low-sensitivity speakers, and they require amps to work hard for them; the low-experience low-budget audiophile look to class D but that is a huge mistake. You want a legitimate, serious, big linear amplifier with a lot of current and the muscle to hang on to large ribbons.

 

The LS50s are fine mini-monitors, but they're not real speakers for actual listening rooms. The powered versions suck because they use class D.

Full size Magnepans are a problem in a room smaller than 25x25. Smaller than that, listening feels like you are inside the worlds largest headphone or

in the ape and monolith scene out of the movie 2001.

The passive LS50's aren't Zu Druids but they work for the price point/ the size environment they are designed for, a bedroom or a typical apartment sized living room and allow freedom of choice in system selection.  The active LS50's  design looks like "forklift upgrade" to me for any future upgrade... not the best choice for an audio hobbyist. More for the kind of buyer that gravitated to B&O systems years ago.

 

[GUTB]

4 hours ago, Ron Scubadiver said:

My bias, the bias of Absolute Sound or the bias of those who push Chi-Fi?  Absolute sound also put the Grace M9xx in their recommended list of sub $1000 DAC's.  I probably would not have bought one for $500, but I only had to pay $280.

 

There is a long thread in one of the headphone forums with many satisfied users.  I guess they are all biased too.  I guess you support all the trolling going around here.

 

 

I’m sorry you were mislead by Reddit and Massdrop. I can’t be everywhere at once.

[Ralf11]

15 minutes ago, davide256 said:

Full size Magnepans are a problem in a room smaller than 25x25. Smaller than that, listening feels like you are inside the worlds largest headphone or

in the ape and monolith scene out of the movie 2001.

 

 

 

Maggie 3.7's have a SMALLER acoustical 'footprint' than the 1.7's - that is b/c of the different technology used.  Call up Wendell if you don't trust me.

 

You might however want to think about how easily you can load up and evacuate your HiFi system (or at least the stored music) the next time a flood hits.

 

I'm sorry for your loss, but NoLa residents had it worse, small consolation I know...

 

also, it's best to regard Gutb as a source of humor...

- the only real damage he does is to new members who need help, not people who have been on here a while

[Ron Scubadiver]

2 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

 

Maggie 3.7's have a SMALLER acoustical 'footprint' than the 1.7's - that is b/c of the different technology used.  Call up Wendell if you don't trust me.

 

You might however want to think about how easily you can load up and evacuate your HiFi system (or at least the stored music) the next time a flood hits.

 

I'm sorry for your loss, but NoLa residents had it worse, small consolation I know...

 

also, it's best to regard Gutb as a source of humor...

- the only real damage he does is to new members who need help, not people who have been on here a while

I think you meant to quote one of my posts.  GUTB is confused.

[Ron Scubadiver]

2 hours ago, davide256 said:

 

The passive LS50's aren't Zu Druids but they work for the price point/ the size environment they are designed for, a bedroom or a typical apartment sized living room and allow freedom of choice in system selection.  The active LS50's  design looks like "forklift upgrade" to me for any future upgrade... not the best choice for an audio hobbyist. More for the kind of buyer that gravitated to B&O systems years ago.

 

LS50's and most smaller speakers work best in smaller rooms.  They their maximum output will not fill larger rooms and they benefit greatly from room effect boosting bass.  In another thread here people were very enthusiastic about the LS50w as is John Darko.  My take is most of the improvement is from boosting the bass, after having tried it myself. I don't see trading for the LS50w to be a worthwhile idea either.

 

I was stuck in an apartment for 7 months.  The living room opened into the kitchen and dining areas, so it wasn't so small.  Right now I have them in a finished attic bedroom which is 13.5'x18 which opens into a 15'x5' hallway.  The ceiling is 9' in the center and 6' at the walls, averaging a bit over 8'.  I am still experimenting with placement, but they definitely sound better than the apartment.  I have owned a lot of other speakers, large and small, and I really like the LS50's.

 

25'x25' is a huge room.  It's hard to find anything larger than 22'x22' which is a finished 2 car garage.

 

 

[Ralf11]

there a guy out in the desert who has a large warehouse which has 4 Maggie 20.2's in it 

 

a lot bigger than 25x25 - not sure but he must do a lot of near field listening - he also has 3.7's and some small desktop Maggies...

[fas42]

9 hours ago, Blake said:

 

 

What surprises me is how easily some in the hobby write off low bass.  If you really are interested in hi-fidelity sound, you should not be neglecting content in any frequency.

 

What you are describing is boomy home theatre sound, and it seems you you are claiming the addition of subwoofers always has a negative impact on sound quality.  I completely disagree if that is your position.  

 

It is possible to properly integrate subwoofers into any system and when they are properly integrated, subwoofers very much add to the "realism" of the musical experience.  See Jim Smith's "Get Better Sound" series for additional info.

 

  

 

It's neglected in my case because it's such a tiny, tiny part of what conveys the impact of the sound experience. Very low frequency rumblings are part of the acoustics of the building at times, may be a special effect in modern pop - but are almost zero in terms of the content of a musical score of normal music. I lost interest in recordings which have a stream train coming through my lounge room decades ago - and any recording which has some bass walloping for the same reason, I don't tune in to.

 

I took particular interest in noting that the owner of another audio forum who has spent large sums of money, and insisted on using high quality subwoofers for years, has finally evolved his rig to a high level of performance - but wasn't 100% happy. People suggested, and he did it - switched off his subwoofers: the light dawned, and they've been put out to pasture.

 

The "realism" is because they add a sense of grunt to the sound, when the latter is a bit lacking - it's somewhat of a band-aid to make up for less than competent SQ. Technically, the full range should be there, but you get 99.999% of the music without it in place.

[fas42]

Last audio show one setup, intelligently done, used low end Magnepans - this was capable of very good sound, but suffered as all capable rigs do - it ruthlessly exposed problems in the playback electronics; the wrong source device being used degraded the quality severely.

[One and a half]

On 14/05/2018 at 9:09 AM, GUTB said:

 

That system is "very entry level".

 

The Grace M9xx sucks — I base that assessment on the topology:

 

 

No real power supply.

No critical component isolation.

Junk IC-based output stage.

Digital volume control.

Essentially a toy DAC.

 

My assessment of the LS50:

16 lbs class D mini monitors, not for audiophiles. More for millennials in a near field configuration, bedroom systems, etc.

 

$3k is tough, but that doesn’t mean you have to recommend crap.

Your opinion is worth zero.

[GUTB]

27 minutes ago, One and a half said:

Your opinion is worth zero.

 

Yes I know that truth is a popularity contest. But why not pursue better sound?

[kumakuma]

9 minutes ago, GUTB said:

 

Yes I know that truth is a popularity contest. But why not pursue better sound?

 

Neither of these statements is correct.

[Ron Scubadiver]

9 hours ago, GUTB said:

 

I’m sorry you were mislead by Reddit and Massdrop. I can’t be everywhere at once.

That's hilarious coming from a source who relishes making misleading statements.

[GUTB]

47 minutes ago, Ron Scubadiver said:

That's hilarious coming from a source who relishes making misleading statements.

 

I’m neurotypical. I’m reality-based. Obviously I make mistakes but I’m a better source for audiophile advice than Massdrop.

[Ralf11]

just admit you're a rogue perceptron and be done with it

[AudioDoctor]

18 minutes ago, GUTB said:

 

I’m neurotypical. I’m reality-based. Obviously I make mistakes but I’m a better source for audiophile advice than Massdrop.

 

Do you know what those words mean?  The fact you keep telling us you consider yourself "neurotypical" makes me think you aren't.  Maybe you should go get some professional help.  I am not even saying this to be mean, I am being serious here GUTB.  Perhaps you have an as yet undiagnosed neuro non typical thing going on.  That's okay, I know a lot of high functioning people with autism, but you have to learn how to communicate better with others that see the world differently than you do.  Otherwise, you'll get nowhere.  Especially with arrogance and condescension grounded in nonsense.

[Rexp]

8 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

Do you know what those words mean?  The fact you keep telling us you consider yourself "neurotypical" makes me think you aren't.  Maybe you should go get some professional help.  I am not even saying this to be mean, I am being serious here GUTB.  Perhaps you have an as yet undiagnosed neuro non typical thing going on.  That's okay, I know a lot of high functioning people with autism, but you have to learn how to communicate better with others that see the world differently than you do.  Otherwise, you'll get nowhere.  Especially with arrogance and condescension grounded in nonsense.

Gutb criticizes a system recommedation and your response is to question his sanity?? You are the one who is nuts, get some help!

[rickca]

Everyone who spends time here at CA eventually decides whose opinion they trust.  There are definitely some users who make recommendations about products they have never heard, and they tend to be very prolific with their comments.  Figuring out whose advice is valuable isn't always simple because some people love to put their personality out there along with their observations.

[Ron Scubadiver]

7 hours ago, GUTB said:

 

I’m neurotypical. I’m reality-based. Obviously I make mistakes but I’m a better source for audiophile advice than Massdrop.

ROFLOL

[AudioDoctor]

14 hours ago, Rexp said:

Gutb criticizes a system recommedation and your response is to question his sanity?? You are the one who is nuts, get some help!

 

Do you honestly think I said that after reading one post?  Also, being on the autism spectrum doesn't make a person insane.

[Ralf11]

You are responding to an accessory support bot for Gutbot