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Rendu Support Thread

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vortecjr

vortecjr

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, jrg said:

 

Its certainly possible that this issue (whatever exactly it is, see point below) it might well be solvable with a firmware update from PS Audio but alas the Gain-Cell-DAC does not offer field/user firmware updates.  Their focus is certainly on Mac and Windows, which is too bad.   If all OS's perfectly implemented the USB sound profile that wouldn't matter, but alas its an imperfect world.

Just to make this thread complete, my Gain-Cell-DAC firmware version is CPU: 1.1.0.38  FPGA: 1.04

 

I would expect however that such things could be worked around by sw on the ultraRendu as well.   I would love to see PS Audio engage to wok on the issue (or such issues). Its also true that throwing the issue over the fence to the other end of the cable, no matter which end you are on, does not provide much help to customers.  

 

Just to further confuse things:   Once I realized that I needed to fully power off the DAC to get something to reset to get past this,  now I can not mange to get back to the error state (despite having seen it under both version 27 and 27 on the uR).  If the DAC is fully powered off the uR does not see it as expected.  But as long as the DAC is partially or fully powered up it appears visible to uR no matter what sort of rebooting has occurred in the meantime on the uR side.   This is no particularly surprising, I've run into plenty of such things in my sw carreer, but they are notoriously difficult to get to the root cause.

 

So until it happens again, I that's it from me.  Back to being a  happy camper.

 

I've pinged PS-Audio support on the issue as well.

Companies that focus on Mac and PC only are out of touch IMHO because most all servers and endpoints are Linux based. I would love to fix all DACs in the world in software, but we can't buy every DAC out on the market and dedicate resources to every issue. However, DAC manufactures can download Linux live disks for free and do their part on their end. They can fix the issue on their DAC or submit code to Linux for consideration. Some DAC companies are taking an active role and some could careless, but in every case they are in the best position to fix the issue. You said you had software experience....are you able to implement a fix in the Linux code?

SONORE computer audio

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firedog

firedog

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, vortecjr said:

Companies that focus on Mac and PC only are out of touch IMHO because most all servers and endpoints are Linux based. I would love to fix all DACs in the world in software, but we can't buy every DAC out on the market and dedicate resources to every issue. However, DAC manufactures can download Linux live disks for free and do their part on their end. They can fix the issue on their DAC or submit code to Linux for consideration. Some DAC companies are taking an active role and some could careless, but in every case they are in the best position to fix the issue. You said you had software experience....are you able to implement a fix in the Linux code?

Some of these companies have told me that since Linux isn't standardized and they can't be sure their implementation will work on various streamers with different versions of Linux, they don't want to be responsible for a device not working with a specific streamer and it's software. 
Even several companies whose products do work with Linux streamers don't make that part of their specs, as they say all they can say with confidence is that their product "should" work with a given Linux steamer. I've personally been told this by 2 well known DAC makers.

Main listening (small home office):

Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments.

Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three BXT

Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup.
Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. 

All absolute statements about audio are false :)

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vortecjr

vortecjr

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, firedog said:

Some of these companies have told me that since Linux isn't standardized and they can't be sure their implementation will work on various streamers with different versions of Linux, they don't want to be responsible for a device not working with a specific streamer and it's software. 
Even several companies whose products do work with Linux streamers don't make that part of their specs, as they say all they can say with confidence is that their product "should" work with a given Linux steamer. I've personally been told this by 2 well known DAC makers.

All they have to do specify which version of the Linux Kernel they tested their DAC to work with. 

SONORE computer audio

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Superdad

Superdad

Posted
Posted

If music is now playing, then no, you did not damage your microRendu or your UltraCap LPS-1.  

Having seen the photo of your modified cable and understanding where you had it plugged in, I would say you are lucky not to have done damage to you units.  

The person who made that cable and advised its use was clearly misguided.

Please use the DC cable we sent you—along with the new version charger and you will be fine.

UpTone Audio LLC

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Jud

Jud

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, firedog said:

Some of these companies have told me that since Linux isn't standardized and they can't be sure their implementation will work on various streamers with different versions of Linux, they don't want to be responsible for a device not working with a specific streamer and it's software. 
Even several companies whose products do work with Linux streamers don't make that part of their specs, as they say all they can say with confidence is that their product "should" work with a given Linux steamer. I've personally been told this by 2 well known DAC makers.

 

Linux to my mind is far more standardized than Windows, especially regarding USB audio. Frankly, this sounds more like a lack of Linux knowledge.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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jrg

jrg

Posted
Posted

First  i don't know what causes this issue and and can not currently reproduce it and I don't know anything specific about the ALSA driver (but fooled around with Linux and drivers at various times over the years).  Maybe ALSA or USB does have a  bug.  in theory a bug could be in all the apps, including the DAC DIAGs (i.e. not interacting with the ALSA driver properly), but that seems very unlikely.

 

If a driver bug an be found, then getting a fix accepted by the community would be key (@vortecjr, yes I can do all that but am not setup with a raspberry Pi dev env (what I assume runs the uR) and am not sure I want to get into it, but maybe).   However its also possible that in the meantime that it might be fixable by a separate daemon that would just look for this issue regularly (a sort of watchdog).

 

So the first question is: is there an open ssh or telnet port on the uR I can log into and poke around if/when this happens the next time?

 

Note that at least for PS-Audio the only server/streaming sw consideration (at least in the Gan-Cell-DAC) seem to be what is in the doc about what you need to feed the usb port from your home PC.  So it may be be more of a doc/suppot issue than anything else.  They say for MacOS you need to nothing and give a url for a windows driver you can (but might not need to) install.    The Linux flavors DO have different installation/mgt/admin UIs and I can understand not wanting to get into that. On the other hand something along the lines of just what kernel and driver they have tested, and state up front that you're on your own with linux at present, would be a lot better info than nothing.

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vortecjr

vortecjr

Posted
Posted

A couple of things. We would not utilize a watchdog type application. Instead the fix would need to be part of the Linux Kernel. Giving people access via ssh is not feasible for warranty reasons. We have to guarantee a specific user experience and if someone changes the OS and then sells the unit we can inherent all kinds of issues unrelated to the original configuration of the unit. I'm thrilled that you wan to take on as a project, but have to build a separate linux test unit to work off of. I would not use a ARM processor based device as a build environment because it can take all night to build a new release to test.   

SONORE computer audio

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the_doc735

the_doc735

Posted
Posted

OK, so I got the USB firmware reinstalled on the 004, and now the USB works and is recognised by my laptop using USB>USB connection. But I have a problem!
As soon as I switch to the microrendu 1.4 the LKS 004 USB switches to unlock, and stays that way even if I reboot everything!
The music is playing from my server on WLAN through the router and coming out the speakers on the laptop OK, but the amanero has disappeared from the sound selector?
Both LAN lights are on; on the rendu, but there is no communication to the 004 DAC?
Anyone have experience with this or knowledge/suggestions etc?
The rendu is using the MPD/DLNA app in the device "ACTIVE"!

Thanks in advance!

 

925341222_sonicorbiteractivity.thumb.jpg.28d3a76bf57c2c09d1eca826b2db4394.jpg

869860426_sonoreapps.thumb.jpg.3cfd7ebe7de126be4993a6bbbf80020e.jpg

544662774_synologyfilestationscreenshot.thumb.jpg.2a765e3fc9dd38127785df1cf6b298c0.jpg

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rickca

rickca

Posted
Posted

What does it show in DAC diagnostics in the microRendu GUI.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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the_doc735

the_doc735

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, rickca said:

What does it show in DAC diagnostics in the microRendu GUI.

the laptop accesses the rendu, NAS & router through a web browser page. (for control).

 

DAC Diagnostics

This is a list of audio output devices attached to this player.

USB output

DAC description: Combo384 Amanero      16d0:071a

Diagnostic information for this DAC 

Amanero Technologies Combo384 Amanero at usb-ci_hdrc.1-1.1, high speed : USB Audio

Playback:
  Status: Stop
  Interface 2
    Altset 1
    Format: S32_LE
    Channels: 2
    Endpoint: 5 OUT (ASYNC)
    Rates: 32000, 44100, 48000, 88200, 96000, 176400, 192000, 352800, 384000
    Data packet interval: 125 us
Status: Unknown (status not available when device is not playing)
Simple mixer control 'PCM',0
  Capabilities: pvolume pswitch
  Playback channels: Front Left - Front Right
  Limits: Playback 0 - 32767
  Mono:
  Front Left: Playback 32767 [100%] [0.00dB] [on]
  Front Right: Playback 32767 [100%] [0.00dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'PCM',1
  Capabilities: pvolume pvolume-joined pswitch pswitch-joined
  Playback channels: Mono
  Limits: Playback 0 - 32767
  Mono: Playback 32767 [100%] [0.00dB] [on]
Simple mixer control 'Combo384 Amanero Validity',0
  Capabilities: pswitch pswitch-joined
  Playback channels: Mono
  Mono: Playback [on]
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rickca

rickca

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, the_doc735 said:

the amanero has disappeared from the sound selector

Looks like the microRendu can see your DAC.  What 'sound selector' are you talking about ... what software (UPnP controller) are you using?

 

Why did you reinstall the firmware on the DAC?  Sorry if you documented this on another thread I wasn't following it.

 

Did you go to Settings -->MPD/DLNA and click Save?

 

Time maybe for @vortecjr to jump in.  I think I've asked you what he would ask you.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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the_doc735

the_doc735

Posted
Posted
12 hours ago, rickca said:

Looks like the microRendu can see your DAC.  What 'sound selector' are you talking about ... what software (UPnP controller) are you using?

 

Why did you reinstall the firmware on the DAC?  Sorry if you documented this on another thread I wasn't following it.

 

Did you go to Settings -->MPD/DLNA and click Save?

 

Time maybe for @vortecjr to jump in.  I think I've asked you what he would ask you.

this is the sound selector:

233977538_soundcontrolpanel.thumb.jpg.9d72ecb5dcf471cb027d99d323895cbe.jpg

The LKS 004 DAC has amanero USB driver. The Rendu has sonictransporter SW/OS, the NAS 218+ has DSM 6.2.1. O/S.

I reinstalled firmware because the amanero USB crashed and wouldn't recognise any device connected by USB cable.

No I didn't save MPD/DLNA settings.

Many Thanks!

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rickca

rickca

Posted
Posted
25 minutes ago, the_doc735 said:

this is the sound selector

That Windows Sound panel only shows playback devices that are directly connected to your PC.  It's never going to show a DAC connected to the microRendu that is network attached.

 

If you want to use MPD/DLNA on your microRendu, you need a DLNA server and control point.  So what DLNA server do you have running on either your PC or NAS and what are you using as the control point?

 

Did you install MinimServer on your Synology NAS?  I've never had a Synology NAS so I'll leave it to someone else to help you with installation/configuration.

Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs

 

i7-6700K/Windows 10  --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's 

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the_doc735

the_doc735

Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, rickca said:

1) That Windows Sound panel only shows playback devices that are directly connected to your PC.  It's never going to show a DAC connected to the microRendu that is network attached.

 

2) If you want to use MPD/DLNA on your microRendu, you need a DLNA server and control point.  So what DLNA server do you have running on either your PC or NAS and what are you using as the control point?

 

3) Did you install MinimServer on your Synology NAS?  I've never had a Synology NAS so I'll leave it to someone else to help you with installation/configuration.

1) LOL! ~ Yes I just realised 3 or 4 hours ago! Doh! ...what am I like? Never mind, not done this headless thing before so as it's all new to me I guess I have a learning curve? Learn by your mistakes! (me that is).

2) These are the apps installed on the NAS:

1648546210_packagecenter.thumb.jpg.9cba84039450c293ebca123809f92e50.jpg

My HP Pavilion G6 laptop is the control point with window 10 pro and I think windows O/S has DLNA built in?

Microrendu is the endpoint.

3) Yes!  There are several packages/apps. available to install on the synology NAS.

Many Thanks!

 

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jrg

jrg

Posted
Posted
On 1/22/2019 at 3:03 AM, vortecjr said:

A couple of things. We would not utilize a watchdog type application. Instead the fix would need to be part of the Linux Kernel. Giving people access via ssh is not feasible for warranty reasons. We have to guarantee a specific user experience and if someone changes the OS and then sells the unit we can inherent all kinds of issues unrelated to the original configuration of the unit. I'm thrilled that you wan to take on as a project, but have to build a separate linux test unit to work off of. I would not use a ARM processor based device as a build environment because it can take all night to build a new release to test.   

Ok, a couple of responses :-)  If a specific driver or kernel issue an be found then it can be fixed there, but that might not be the case with this issue.  If all we know is that sometimes things get stuck.   Changes to the driver or kernel might still be able to deal with it but, a watchdog type solution might also work quite well in this case.  Ruling out out possible solutions before the problem is even clearly known seems like jumping the gun a bit.

 

You can't allow ssh access for warranty reasons?  Really?  Given these problems you do not seem to be doing al that well at "guarantee[ing] a specific user experience" at present.  You could easily have incorporated a "return to factory specs" method (as is very common in consumer devcies) if this was a big concern, but you did not do that. 

 

So generally you're thankful for my interest, but no thanks.  Which leads me to wonder why did you ask "You said you had software experience....are you able to implement a fix in the Linux code?" in the first place?  As I originally said I'm not prepared at this time to take this on anyway and wanted the SSH access just to see if I could poke the driver to get out of this entirely in sw without power cycling the DAC, which seems like it would be very useful to know.

 

And finally the issue has yet to re-occur so I still do not have a clear idea of what situation (power off this or that, then that or this, or ...) leads to this issue.  Maybe we will be lucky and it just will go away.  In my youth such things annoyed me as I wanted to figure out just what had happened, but these days I just want it to work :-).
 

 

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vortecjr

vortecjr

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, jrg said:

Ok, a couple of responses 🙂  If a specific driver or kernel issue an be found then it can be fixed there, but that might not be the case with this issue.  If all we know is that sometimes things get stuck.   Changes to the driver or kernel might still be able to deal with it but, a watchdog type solution might also work quite well in this case.  Ruling out out possible solutions before the problem is even clearly known seems like jumping the gun a bit.

 

You can't allow ssh access for warranty reasons?  Really?  Given these problems you do not seem to be doing al that well at "guarantee[ing] a specific user experience" at present.  You could easily have incorporated a "return to factory specs" method (as is very common in consumer devcies) if this was a big concern, but you did not do that. 

 

So generally you're thankful for my interest, but no thanks.  Which leads me to wonder why did you ask "You said you had software experience....are you able to implement a fix in the Linux code?" in the first place?  As I originally said I'm not prepared at this time to take this on anyway and wanted the SSH access just to see if I could poke the driver to get out of this entirely in sw without power cycling the DAC, which seems like it would be very useful to know.

 

And finally the issue has yet to re-occur so I still do not have a clear idea of what situation (power off this or that, then that or this, or ...) leads to this issue.  Maybe we will be lucky and it just will go away.  In my youth such things annoyed me as I wanted to figure out just what had happened, but these days I just want it to work :-).

A watch god solution is out of the question. Based on the number of units in the field we are doing very well. I appreciate your feedback..enjoy.

SONORE computer audio

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gsquared

gsquared

Posted
Posted

I'm experiencing a problem that I've isolated to my ultraRendu and I'm hoping someone can offer some advice or suggestion on the easiest way to troubleshoot this.

 

I am using an Intel NUC as a Roon server and ultraRendu as the endpoint. The ultraRendu is powered by an Uptone Audio LPS 1. I am losing signal to my DAC intermittently. The signal drops for about a minute then comes back. When the signal drops, I can still ping the NUC but I cannot ping the ultraRendu. So that leads me to believe the issue is either with the ultraRendu or the LPS 1 PSU.... or perhaps something else I'm not considering?

 

Anyone have any advice on the easiest way to troubleshoot this? Is there a way to look at error logs in the ultraRendu that might indicate what is happening? Or is there something else that might give me some insight into what's going on? I plan to swap out the LPS 1 with another PSU for testing to narrow down the problem even further.

 

Any ideas or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

Gary

Intel NUC NUC8i7BEH Roon Server running Audio Linux in RAM -> Sonore UltraRendu (Roon Endpoint) -> Uptone ISO Regen -> Singxer SU-1 KTE -> Holo Audio Spring Level 3 DAC -> Nord One UP Monoblocks -> Spendor LS3/5as | Music controlled via iPad (Power Conditioning: Audience adeptResponse aR12).  Twitter: @hirezaudio

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gsquared

gsquared

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, JohnSwenson said:

What is happening to the LEDs on both the ultraRendu and the LPS-1?

 

John S.

Hi John - It just happened again and the LED on the LPS-1 goes red, then amber then green. But when it went red, all of the lights on the ultraRendu went out.

 

Gary

Intel NUC NUC8i7BEH Roon Server running Audio Linux in RAM -> Sonore UltraRendu (Roon Endpoint) -> Uptone ISO Regen -> Singxer SU-1 KTE -> Holo Audio Spring Level 3 DAC -> Nord One UP Monoblocks -> Spendor LS3/5as | Music controlled via iPad (Power Conditioning: Audience adeptResponse aR12).  Twitter: @hirezaudio

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