Which one to buy: UpTone USB REGEN or Intona USB Isolator?

[musickid]

I own a schitt modi multibit and imac 27 late 2013. i would like to give the intona standard version a go but i am hesitant after reading compatibility issues with usb cables etc. i am a relative newcomer to pc audio and the usb cables and connects i use are standard £20 ones. qed, cambridge audio etc. at present i don't have the means for expensive audiophile cables. the regen usb seems to work well but the intona seems to yield better results across the board. however with the problems the intona faces i don't know what to do? any advice would be great.

[Abtr]

I own a schitt modi multibit and imac 27 late 2013. i would like to give the intona standard version a go but i am hesitant after reading compatibility issues with usb cables etc. i am a relative newcomer to pc audio and the usb cables and connects i use are standard £20 ones. qed, cambridge audio etc. at present i don't have the means for expensive audiophile cables. the regen usb seems to work well but the intona seems to yield better results across the board. however with the problems the intona faces i don't know what to do? any advice would be great.

I use the Modi multibit and the Uptone Audio Regen (with iFi iPower 9V PS) and the standard Intona USB isolator and a MacMini (2015) for streaming computer audio without any problems. USB cables are AQ Cinnamon but I can also use 'standard cables'..

[Middy]

 

Not a Schitt but I have otg to Supra to cheap USB 2 modded for battery 5v into a IFI IPURIFIER 2 ..into the standard intona. All works great.... Where people said they had issues ....was very expensive or very cheap nasty I believe.... cables need to match the usb standard...Not all but The cobbled together mess I use is great

 

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[musickid]

many thanks i am moving towards the intona. can i guarantee that if i buy a intona standard and use entry level usb cables around the £20 mark each (my budget can't go further than that) my imac will still recognise the modi dac and see through the intona with no issues? also from middy's reply if a usb cable is very expensive surely they would match the usb standard, so why are some of them not working? regards too all

[Middy]

That's what I thought ...but Schitt mentioned this issue a while ago..

Expensive don't mean good....

Ask Donald Trump's hairstylist....?

 

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[robocop]

many thanks i am moving towards the intona. can i guarantee that if i buy a intona standard and use entry level usb cables around the £20 mark each (my budget can't go further than that) my imac will still recognise the modi dac and see through the intona with no issues? also from middy's reply if a usb cable is very expensive surely they would match the usb standard, so why are some of them not working? regards too all

 

Something you should take up with Daniel at Intona. They have improved the compatibility of the Intona with DAC's and cables. I don't think it will be a problem for you. I started with 2 cheap(About $10US each) entry level USB cables and it worked fine. I now have 2 better cables($300US for both). I did have a problem with the USB windows driver using a separate Silverstone USB card but since reverting back to MOBO no problems whatsoever. Works every time.

 

My concern now is although Intona improves the sound it does cast a glaze over the sound some what similar to some power filter products in my system.

 

I'm still using it but I don't see it lasting in my system. Is system dependent and may well improve yours, you won't know till you try it.

 

Robert

[musickid]

Thanks Robert the advice gained here can literally save mega pounds. would the wired for sound recovery achieve similar improvements in overall SQ? It is a much easier prospect with regards to setting up. however if the intona performs better it would make no sense to pursue the recovery especially as the price difference is marginal. at the end of the day i want my computer to see the dac if i get the intona. as i said before reports to the contrary worry me.

[sandyk]

Thanks Robert the advice gained here can literally save mega pounds. would the wired for sound recovery achieve similar improvements in overall SQ? It is a much easier prospect with regards to setting up. however if the intona performs better it would make no sense to pursue the recovery especially as the price difference is marginal. at the end of the day i want my computer to see the dac if i get the intona. as i said before reports to the contrary worry me.

 

Why not wait a little longer and see what rabbit Uptone pulls out of the hat ?

John and Alex aren't the type to rest on their laurels.

[musickid]

i emailed daniel at intona and he reassured me the usb cable issue is no more. with regards to high speed usb data what is the relevance here to audio and say streaming hifi tidal for eg. when i get the intona as its bus powered does that mean the mac will switch it on or does the dac switch it on.if the computer switches it on and im working and not listening to music doesn't that means it is powered on for no reason. finally what is the lifespan in years of the intona to provide maximum performance at say 3/4 hours per day normal use. many thanks to all as i'm still learning i appreciate everyone's assistance.

[ElviaCaprice]

My concern now is although Intona improves the sound it does cast a glaze over the sound some what similar to some power filter products in my system.

 

At first, installing the Intona, I was thinking the same thing. But now I think, not. After messing with different components outside the Intona, I've managed to rid my system of what I thought could be attributed to the Intona. I think what happens is when we apply something like the Intona galvanic isolation, it cleans up our sound so well that now it reveals other problems in SQ. Immediately we think these issues are attributed to the new component, in this case Intona. When really it was something else. Of course it could be the new component. Every one has to hear it for themselves and test.

[One and a half]

Thanks Robert the advice gained here can literally save mega pounds. would the wired for sound recovery achieve similar improvements in overall SQ? It is a much easier prospect with regards to setting up. however if the intona performs better it would make no sense to pursue the recovery especially as the price difference is marginal. at the end of the day i want my computer to see the dac if i get the intona. as i said before reports to the contrary worry me.

 

The Intona and Recovery do different things. The Intona kills leakage currents from the computer to DAC. The Recovery works on the Signal Integrity of the USB signal. Use both items, unless someone makes one unit that can do both functions.

[musickid]

I understand the function of the intona as a galvanic isolator. after a quick search on wiki being new to this. i assumed all of these devices regen, recovery, intona were providing a clean power supply and reclocking the usb signal. i didn't appreciate the different functions. my budget can only stretch to one of these miraculous little boxes right now and i have come to the conclusion that the intona would deliver the greatest bang for buck SQ improvement. it is unlikely i would add another device to it such as regen or wfs. that is overkill for me. am i right to go for the intona here? my system that i've built since the start of the summer purely by the advice of reviews on forums is earmaxpro 2 amp, schitt modi multibit, beyer dt880 600 with some medium level cables and a tacima mains conditioner. with electronic music and contemporary rnb/reggae is good. with instrumentals jazz and vocals is a level of refinement beyond all my expectations.

[r_w]

If you can afford one, the Intona industrial or JCAT (same device) is 'the one'.

 

 

I understand the function of the intona as a galvanic isolator. after a quick search on wiki being new to this. i assumed all of these devices regen, recovery, intona were providing a clean power supply and reclocking the usb signal. i didn't appreciate the different functions. my budget can only stretch to one of these miraculous little boxes right now and i have come to the conclusion that the intona would deliver the greatest bang for buck SQ improvement. it is unlikely i would add another device to it such as regen or wfs. that is overkill for me. am i right to go for the intona here? my system that i've built since the start of the summer purely by the advice of reviews on forums is earmaxpro 2 amp, schitt modi multibit, beyer dt880 600 with some medium level cables and a tacima mains conditioner. with electronic music and contemporary rnb/reggae is good. with instrumentals jazz and vocals is a level of refinement beyond all my expectations.

[One and a half]

If you can afford one, the Intona industrial or JCAT (same device) is 'the one'.

 

Agreed.

[musickid]

Thanks again for feedback. on the intona website it states some possible advantage for the industrial model vs standard for home audio. alongside this it does also state that intona std. does in fact reclock the usb signal. is the intona std. therefore doing the combined job of galvanic isolator and usb reclocker so no need for an added device such as regen, especially for those seeking a solution on a budget? the jcat requires pricey usb cables intona doesn't. from intona website for 7054 std model:

 

"It does not translate or distort data packets like a hub but does reproduce and reclock the original data by 100%."

 

"nearly all customers seem to hear a difference in audiophile-grade environments in favour of the Industrial one"-ok so it seems to be the way, but for my medium level system (earmax pro 2, modimultibit, dt 880 600 ohm) would i actually hear anything that i wouldn't with the std. version?

 

thanks to all.

[musickid]

one a half said "unless someone makes a unit with both functions?" my first quote above from intona surely confirms this. ie the intona std., does fulfill both functions. (apologies for double post)

[One and a half]

one a half said "unless someone makes a unit with both functions?" my first quote above from intona surely confirms this. ie the intona std., does fulfill both functions. (apologies for double post)

 

Ahh OK, please refer to this post from John Swenson about leakage currents and what the regen and intona as well as just a USB cable does in playback from a computer.

[Middy]

I have a battery feeding my intona 5v and an IFI Ip2. I have made a dual cable as I mentioned before..Ifi now have released a 5V bypass looking like a micro USB port... It's what their version of ISO ground adds extra....

But then in my case I transport of a phone.... Their other new toy seems like a jitterbug but they state EMI reduction. Can these improve the Intona and or the Regen .....

 

Forgive me if it's a touch off topic but I plan to get one for use with my intona and see if this orange Trinket works...

 

 

http://ifi-audio.com/home/products/accessory/

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[musickid]

HELLO THERE,

 

So John states that there is no real need for intona's regene's or any similar devices from what i understand (when considering the rendu not across the board). he highlights signal integrity and electrical noise elimination as the end goal here. he then shows us how by introducing one component and ridding the system of one problem in effect leads to a open one door shut another door syndrome, i.e. solving one problem causes another to arise concerning signal integrity and electrical circuit leakage. his solution was the Microrendu with the right PSU. The problem here is that postgrad students like myself here in the UK don't have upwards of 700 sterling pounds to spend on such rigs!! meant in the nicest possible way!! the one part of John's breakdown i did not get was when he referred to there being no need for the intona? any clarification here would be great and also any ideas for a more realistic usb signal integrity/electrical leakage solution. the std intona seemed ideal but now i do admit to being slightly lost as i have only been aware of such things for about 10 days now!!lol / all for the love of loud horns.....my idea would be something like jitterbug or ifi usb silencer for the signal and intona std to cover leaks. thats the budget i've got for a solution. my new system is described above. good day and best wishes to all.

[NAIDIVER]

Easy to say, but hard to prove. Not all galvanic isolation is equal. I wouldn't trust what the manufacturer claims.

 

Agree. My Brooklyn DAC also Galvanic isolation built in. SQ is still improved after Intona connected inbetween.

[Middy]

Hey NAIDIVER were is the info on the Brooklyn galvanic isolation? I concur though the Intona has improved the SQ to my ears....

 

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[Indydan]

I would like to know if anyone is using the Intona with a Rega DAC R? Your impressions, and especially that they work together glitch free. It seems the earlier models of the Intona did not work with the Rega DAC R, because the DAC USB drew too much power.

 

I know the Intona has been revised, but would be happy to hear from Rega DAC R owners that they work well together.

[Superdad]

Agree. My Brooklyn DAC also Galvanic isolation built in. SQ is still improved after Intona connected inbetween.

 

John and I have posted in detail about this--and he about exactly what digital isolators in DACs do and do not do, and how they also add jitter of their own, some worse than others. But the important point to remember is that digital isolators inside DACs (used quite often, but only some manufacturers highlight their use as "galvanic isolation") are ALWAYS placed AFTER the USB PHY and processor/FPGA USB protocol engines. They are placed in the I2S signal lines after the USB input stage.

 

But since it has been proven (at least by those with ears) that USB signal integrity, impedance match, and galvanic isolation into the DAC matters (because it helps the DAC's USB input stage generate less ground-plane and packet-data noise--which can sail on the data lines right through the DAC's isolators to affect the master clock), devices such as the Intona and REGEN still make a difference.

 

SI, impedance, and ground issues are also why USB cables still make a difference with DAC's that claim galvanic isolation of their USB input. So if a crappy USB cable makes any difference with an exaSound or Mytek or whatever DACs (most these days) have digital isolators at the output of their USB inputs, then you have the proof of what I am saying right there.

[musickid]

With regards to the intona standard it states that it does work at all speeds low , medium and high with regards to usb data transfer. would this then benefit someone who uses tidal hifi//i'm assuming it must if it works at all speeds and that high speed usb data transfer is mainly for 24/192 files and similar. still learning!! For the given quality below what speed would usb data transfer utilise here?

Flac 1411 kbps - Lossless : TIDAL HIFI(16/44.1 khz)

[One and a half]

With regards to the intona standard it states that it does work at all speeds low , medium and high with regards to usb data transfer. would this then benefit someone who uses tidal hifi//i'm assuming it must if it works at all speeds and that high speed usb data transfer is mainly for 24/192 files and similar. still learning!! For the given quality below what speed would usb data transfer utilise here?

Flac 1411 kbps - Lossless : TIDAL HIFI(16/44.1 khz)

 

The Intona standard or industrial can throughput DSD256 (44.1Khz x 256) that I know of reliably, perhaps it can do DSD512(?), so certainly 192 or 358 is easily achievable.