Which one to buy: UpTone USB REGEN or Intona USB Isolator?

[genjamon]

Interesting, thanks genjamon. You may want to try powering the REGEN behind the Intona with a battery to preserve Galvanic Isolation.

 

How are people powering their Regens by batteries?

[sandyk]

How are people powering their Regens by batteries?

 

You could use a 7.2V Li Ion battery, but you will need to replace the output plug with the correct connector.

I am using the attached which receives power from a rechargeable 12V Li Ion battery ,regulated down to +9V then followed by a shunt regulator. It's DIY though.

 

[genjamon]

Hmm. I don't really do DIY - and it's not that big of a priority for me to invest the time/energy in figuring out how either. Any off the shelf options?

 

 

You could use a 7.2V Li Ion battery, but you will need to replace the output plug with the correct connector.

I am using the attached which receives power from a rechargeable 12V Li Ion battery ,regulated down to +9V then followed by a shunt regulator. It's DIY though.

 

[Blake]

Wait, what? Batteries are de rigueur now? ugh, my head hurts...

[lmitche]

If you want the benefits of galvanically isolated power, there is really no other way.

[sandyk]

If you want the benefits of galvanically isolated power, there is really no other way.

 

At least not with USB, where any kind of minor coupling back to mains earth appears to cause some degradation. Even via the capacitance between primary and secondary sides of a transformer in a Linear PSU to some extent.

As they are suggesting in another thread, perhaps the E.E.s should have stuck with BNC ,or even F Type connectors which are also used with Broadband, Cable TV etc.

[johnVO]

Hi,

it's my first post here and I'm pleased to have the opportunity to share my thoughts and my audio experiences with the CA members.

 

I have been reading this thread from the beginning so i would like to ask if someone has tested this isolator that it seems to be like Intona but in lower price.

It's a high speed usb isolator with interesting features and it provides an input for external power. So it solves the issues that coming from power hungry usb inputs...

[Superdad]

If you want the benefits of galvanically isolated power, there is really no other way.

 

Well, as you know, there will be in just another couple of months.

[One and a half]

Hi,

it's my first post here and I'm pleased to have the opportunity to share my thoughts and my audio experiences with the CA members.

 

I have been reading this thread from the beginning so i would like to ask if someone has tested this isolator that it seems to be like Intona but in lower price.

It's a high speed usb isolator with interesting features and it provides an input for external power. So it solves the issues that coming from power hungry usb inputs...

 

Cool, comes complete with industrial locking USB cables. I can see the debate to rage about Boutique USB cables being outfitted with locking connectors. Thanks for the tip on the product. Quite a large box isn't it, the DC connector is for downstream support, so this should be clean 5V or discarded if DAC doesn't use it, like Auralic Vega.

 

FYI. The Intona creates an I2S stream from the incoming USB, transverses the barrier by capacitive coupling and re-creates the USB waveform.

 

Had a thought to obtain a bare-bones Intona, and mount a Regen in the same enclosure. Avoids several USB cables which can be expensive and cause impedance problems. Power supply for the Regen can be then battery, LPS built in the same enclosure, like an Acopian, whatever you like, quite few choices there.

[Superdad]

Hi,

it's my first post here and I'm pleased to have the opportunity to share my thoughts and my audio experiences with the CA members.

 

I have been reading this thread from the beginning so i would like to ask if someone has tested this isolator that it seems to be like Intona but in lower price.

It's a high speed usb isolator with interesting features and it provides an input for external power. So it solves the issues that coming from power hungry usb inputs...

 

Hi John:

 

Welcome to CA!

And great find for what looks to be only the second high-speed USB galvanic isolator, USB 2.0 High Speed Isolator Adapter and Screw Lock Cable - CoolGear. Just $149 and includes provision for injecting higher-current capable downstream bus power for devices that need it (though the cleanliness of that power is not known).

Wondering if they are doing it with an FPGA ala Intona, or some other method.

[sandyk]

Had a thought to obtain a bare-bones Intona, and mount a Regen in the same enclosure. Avoids several USB cables which can be expensive and cause impedance problems. Power supply for the Regen can be then battery, LPS built in the same enclosure, like an Acopian, whatever you like, quite few choices there.

 

If you are thinking of DIY using a linear PSU to avoid battery charging hassles, then a dual bobbin transformer which has less capacitive coupling through the primary and secondary windings back to mains earth, may be a better choice than even an r-core. In your case though, with your set up you shouldn't have mains earth loop problems at, all which is possibly why the Curious cables were far from an improvement, by opening up the possibility of RF/EMI ingress ?

[Superdad]

FYI. The Intona creates an I2S stream from the incoming USB, transverses the barrier by capacitive coupling and re-creates the USB waveform.

 

Actually, that is not correct. The SiliconLabs Si866X isolators used by the Intona use tiny RF transmitters and RF receivers separated by a semiconductor-based isolation barrier (see: http://www.silabs.com/Support%20Documents/TechnicalDocs/Si866x.pdf).

 

[bTW, those isolators add 350ps of jitter which needs to be reclocked out. John Swenson greatly prefers the NVE GMR (giant-magneto-resistive) isolators as they are quieter and add less jitter.]

[One and a half]

Actually, that is not correct. The SiliconLabs Si866X isolators used by the Intona use tiny RF transmitters and RF receivers separated by a semiconductor-based isolation barrier (see: http://www.silabs.com/Support%20Documents/TechnicalDocs/Si866x.pdf).

 

[bTW, those isolators add 350ps of jitter which needs to be reclocked out. John Swenson greatly prefers the NVE GMR (giant-magneto-resistive) isolators as they are quieter and add less jitter.]

 

So it is,as described on page 22. Where did I get the capacitive info from them? Now you need to quantify "less jitter" akin to "whiter than". Anyway, it may not be important if the data is treated with re-clocking on the output side, doesn't matter (for audio) if the delays are through the barrier.

[One and a half]

If you are thinking of DIY using a linear PSU to avoid battery charging hassles, then a dual bobbin transformer which has less capacitive coupling through the primary and secondary windings back to mains earth, may be a better choice than even an r-core. In your case though, with your set up you shouldn't have mains earth loop problems at, all which is possibly why the Curious cables were far from an improvement, by opening up the possibility of RF/EMI ingress ?

 

The dual bobbin is a good idea, perhaps in combo with a Microphone transformer. We don't need that large current draw, and the mic transformer has high CMRR, saw one with 98dB rejection. The turns ratio is a little difficult quite a few are high gain jobs, saw one with 1:4 ratio, which means a 36V secondary on the bobbin down to 4 gives 9Vac, through a regulator. Getting a bit OT here. Just some ideas.

[Superdad]

So it is,as described on page 22. Where did I get the capacitive info from them? Now you need to quantify "less jitter" akin to "whiter than". Anyway, it may not be important if the data is treated with re-clocking on the output side, doesn't matter (for audio) if the delays are through the barrier.

 

You were probably thinking of the Texas Instruments digital isolators. Those do use a capacitive barrier.

 

[As for the clocking--and I really don't want to get into picking apart someone else's product (nor do I have the expertise to do so)--I just wonder if the reclocking (which Intona says they do inside the output-side FPGA) can be very effective if it is based on same one clock that is used for the entire device (both PHYs, both FPGAs) and located on the "dirty" upstream side. I know (from our considering such project over a year ago) that that is not how John would have done it.]

 

Ciao,

 

--Alex C.

 

P.S. I just ordered one of those new CoolGear high-speed USB2.0 isolators. Just too curious!

[audio.bill]

Alex - That CoolGear isolator certainly looks intriguing, please share your impressions with us once you've checked it out. TIA!

[jexby]

Wait, what? Batteries are de rigueur now? ugh, my head hurts...

 

apparently with the new LH Labs Lightspeed Revive it (battery) is.

complete with 10Gbps bidirectional.

[lotriwer]

Has anyone tried Intona with Mytek Manhattan?

[ChrisG]

 

Technology doesn't sit still, great minds must think alike and develop ideas at the same time. Mutec have released their USB to 5 way AES3, S/PDIF, AES3id, Optical et al converter, Mutec MC-3 + USB. This device isolates the USB to the other outputs to 2500V. Throw in a super clocking mechanism discussed here at CA of a sister product, and there's one less cable to buy...! USB straight into the Mutec and out with super reclocking, yum. Does this get any better?

 

 

Mutec MC-3 + USB.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]23639[/ATTACH]

 

The Mutec 3+USB is the real deal. FWIW, I had the REGEN & LPS in the chain prior to getting the Mutec. Is still need to play around with the REGEN out of the chain to see if there is any impact on SQ.

 

Win10 PC --> Curious Cable --> REGEN (powered by Uptone JS-2) --> Curious Cable --> Mutec 3+ USB --> Triode Labs AES/EBU --> Yggy

[johnVO]

 

P.S. I just ordered one of those new CoolGear high-speed USB2.0 isolators. Just too curious!

 

Me too!

 

I would like to know your impressions!

[PhilR]

I was able to get my Itona working with my Berkeley Alpha USB converter by feeding it into an Uptone Regen as others here have done sucessfully. I plugged it into the Regen using the hard adaptor that comes with the Uptone product.

 

Compared to the Regen running solo, I found that the soundstage narrowed a bit, becoming deeper and more focused instead. It was easier to isolate particular instruments across the stage, but ultimately was not as engaging as the wider soundfield. Not a night & day difference, but enough to generate a preference.

 

Daniel at Itona told me via email that they are working on a fix, I will keep waiting for the opportunity to try the Isolator by itself when they get the issue solved.

[SwissBear]

The Mutec 3+USB is the real deal. FWIW, I had the REGEN & LPS in the chain prior to getting the Mutec. Is still need to play around with the REGEN out of the chain to see if there is any impact on SQ.

I very much support Chris' views : Mutec MC-3+ USB is well worth trying. It made for a huge positive impact on the SQ of my system.

[audio.bill]

P.S. I just ordered one of those new CoolGear high-speed USB2.0 isolators. Just too curious!

I have no experience with this product but found a cheaper source. For anyone interested in trying it, it's available at cooldrives.com for only $129.95 with free (standard) shipping.

[Superdad]

I have no experience with this product but found a cheaper source. For anyone interested in trying it, it's available at cooldrives.com for only $129.95 with free (standard) shipping.

 

That is funny since cooldrives.com is really the same company, run from the same offices. Same for at least a dozen other USB and accessory sites that CoolGear owns. I had a long chat with the owner today. He said they used to operate over 300 e-commerce sites all selling similar stuff.

 

The product is brand new and they only ever had a trial run of a few in. More are on the way from overseas and will be available in about 3-weeks--after the Chinese New Year holiday is over.

[OldBigEars]

That is funny since cooldrives.com is really the same company, run from the same offices. Same for at least a dozen other USB and accessory sites that CoolGear owns. I had a long chat with the owner today. He said they used to operate over 300 e-commerce sites all selling similar stuff.

 

The product is brand new and they only ever had a trial run of a few in. More are on the way from overseas and will be available in about 3-weeks--after the Chinese New Year holiday is over.

 

Touche