Article: CAPS Twenty | Part One

[The Computer Audiophile]

Just now, 57gold said:

what does the HQ Player up conversion with the new filters/modulators at high rates like DSD256+?

 

The other PC that I mentioned in the article and video will do the heavy lifting. All components are here and assembly has begun.

 

 

1 minute ago, 57gold said:

why does the JCAT USB unit have such a big heatsink?  What does it do?

 

I can only guess it dissipates heat :~)

[57gold]

So, what is the high powered computer you would use to send this guy music from if this guy is just a player like a Rendu?

[The Computer Audiophile]

7 minutes ago, 57gold said:

So, what is the high powered computer you would use to send this guy music from if this guy is just a player like a Rendu?

Same one that I will use in CAPS Twenty

[gionaz]

great things! in the end it is like an intel NUC but with the possibility of providing a better USB and Ethernet connection?
one question, is there the possibility to use an AESEBU card instead of the usb card ?.
my dac supports usb but i prefer a digital XLR connection, if yes, for example which audiophile AESEBU card could be used?

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 minute ago, gionaz said:

great things! in the end it is like an intel NUC but with the possibility of providing a better USB and Ethernet connection?
one question, is there the possibility to use an AESEBU card instead of the usb card ?.
my dac supports usb but i prefer a digital XLR connection, if yes, for example which audiophile AESEBU card could be used?

You can absolutely use a PCIe AES card like those from RME or Lynx.

[57gold]

2 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

Same one that I will use in CAPS Twenty

Which one is that?  

 

Didn't see a description in the article nor in the video.

[firedog]

1 hour ago, 57gold said:

Which one is that?  

 

Didn't see a description in the article nor in the video.

. 

"CAPS Twenty, What is it?

 

CAPS Twenty is a two PC system. One PC is the server and the other is the endpoint. The official names are as follows.

 

CAPS Twenty - The high horsepower server.

 

CAPS Twenty.One - Pronounced twenty point one like a 5.1 multi-channel audio system, this is the audio endpoint. "

[barrows]

On 6/22/2020 at 8:14 PM, The Computer Audiophile said:

Intel sent me two options :~)

 

Ahh, so I9-10900K, that will get the job done.  A very expensive option of course, and I think this means that your main board choice will not be compatible with I9-9900K, which is entirely capable and a lot less money.  Oh well...  I am still looking forward to the next installment.

[vortecjr]

Chris you said, "In fact, if there was more Linux support for native DSD playback with HiFi DACs, I would've never gone down this path. I would use my Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical for one half of this CAPS design. Unfortunately manufacturers like Sonore can only do so much in their efforts to support native DSD. Because of these efforts there is support for many DACs, but if hardware manufacturers are unwilling to work with the Sonore team, there is little they can do."

 

The term "support" can mean different things. We support almost all DACs on the market without the customer having to do anything and new devices are being added all the time. The work we do is mostly trivial taking place after the fact because DAC companies don't reaching out to us in advance. Recent changes to the Linux Kernel have added automatic discovery for some devices simplifying things further. To say, "Sonore can only do so much in their efforts to support native DSD" in light of all that we have done without their support is very misleading.   

[firedog]

I'd suggest that you add prices to the parts list, and a  total price for the build.

Yes, people can click the links and poke around, but I think the prices should be displayed in the article as a service to readers. 

I think many people will see a go/no go just from the price, and they should have that information in the article.

[The Computer Audiophile]

33 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

Chris you said, "In fact, if there was more Linux support for native DSD playback with HiFi DACs, I would've never gone down this path. I would use my Sonore Signature Rendu SE optical for one half of this CAPS design. Unfortunately manufacturers like Sonore can only do so much in their efforts to support native DSD. Because of these efforts there is support for many DACs, but if hardware manufacturers are unwilling to work with the Sonore team, there is little they can do."

 

The term "support" can mean different things. We support almost all DACs on the market without the customer having to do anything and new devices are being added all the time. The work we do is mostly trivial taking place after the fact because DAC companies don't reaching out to us in advance. Recent changes to the Linux Kernel have added automatic discovery for some devices simplifying things further. To say, "Sonore can only do so much in their efforts to support native DSD" in light of all that we have done without their support is very misleading.   

It was a compliment to you Guys @vortecjr  and all your team does behind the scenes to make it happen. 

 

If you don’t get support from some manufacturers, there is nothing you can do. Thus, you can only do so much. 

[vortecjr]

Chris, you preface it with, “In fact, if there was more Linux support for native DSD playback with HiFi DACs, I would've never gone down this path” How many devices are not supported on Linux....2 or 3. It’s misleading and a poor excuse for having to make this device. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

2 minutes ago, vortecjr said:

Chris, you preface it with, “In fact, if there was more Linux support for native DSD playback with HiFi DACs, I would've never gone down this path” How many devices are not supported on Linux....2 or 3. It’s misleading and a poor excuse for having to make this device. 

I don’t see it as “how many devices” but rather how many people could use a device like this and how many may be interested in it. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 hour ago, firedog said:

I'd suggest that you add prices to the parts list, and a  total price for the build.

Yes, people can click the links and poke around, but I think the prices should be displayed in the article as a service to readers. 

I think many people will see a go/no go just from the price, and they should have that information in the article.

Great point. Done. 

[jrobbins50]

Chris, you should have a separate price shown for the HDPlex supply, as it is an option that is considerably less expensive than the JCAT. JCR 

[The Computer Audiophile]

12 minutes ago, jrobbins50 said:

Chris, you should have a separate price shown for the HDPlex supply, as it is an option that is considerably less expensive than the JCAT. JCR 

Major oversight on my part. Fixed and thank you :~)

[57gold]

So the CAPS Twenty is in the works with the new i9-10900K?  

[botrytis]

7 minutes ago, 57gold said:

So the CAPS Twenty is in the works with the new i9-10900K?  

 

More than likely NOT. The amount of power needed for that CPU is in the range of ~70 watts idle and ~275 watts at full bore use. It cannot be passively cooled either.

 

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/05/intels-new-i9-10900k-fast-yes-competitive-not-so-much/#:~:text=The%20good%20news%20is%2C%20although,145W%E2%80%94it's%20still%20no%20Threadripper.

 

I would be looking at the little Ryzen all in one boards, like the UDOO Bolt - https://www.udoo.org/udoo-bolt/

 

Low power and has plenty of horsepower.

 

 

[barrows]

8 minutes ago, botrytis said:

 

More than likely NOT. The amount of power needed for that CPU is in the range of ~70 watts idle and ~275 watts at full bore use. It cannot be passively cooled either.

 

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/05/intels-new-i9-10900k-fast-yes-competitive-not-so-much/#:~:text=The%20good%20news%20is%2C%20although,145W%E2%80%94it's%20still%20no%20Threadripper.

 

I would be looking at the little Ryzen all in one boards, like the UDOO Bolt - https://www.udoo.org/udoo-bolt/

 

Low power and has plenty of horsepower.

 

 

Go back in the comments a bit, and you will see the picture Chris posted of the 10th Generation Intel processors Chris has for the build.

Chris has stated that his intent is to build a powerful server to take full advantage of HQPlayer 4 processing, that basically requires an active cooling system to work well with the EC modulators.  There is no problem using an active cooling system when the two machines are going to be connected over the Network and the Twenty can be located far from the audio system in another part of the home. 

[botrytis]

9 minutes ago, barrows said:

Go back in the comments a bit, and you will see the picture Chris posted of the 10th Generation Intel processors Chris has for the build.

Chris has stated that his intent is to build a powerful server to take full advantage of HQPlayer 4 processing, that basically requires an active cooling system to work well with the EC modulators.  There is no problem using an active cooling system when the two machines are going to be connected over the Network and the Twenty can be located far from the audio system in another part of the home. 

 

I would still use a Ryzen over Intel, because except for gaming and single-threaded use, Ryzen's are better and use less power. My main desktop at home is a Ryzen 5 2600 which runs with simple cooling, at 35C even under stress. It is  mt video card that is the temperature monster. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

13 minutes ago, botrytis said:

 

I would still use a Ryzen over Intel, because except for gaming and single-threaded use, Ryzen's are better and use less power. My main desktop at home is a Ryzen 5 2600 which runs with simple cooling, at 35C even under stress. It is  mt video card that is the temperature monster. 

On paper Ryzen is great but not in reality for stuff like HQPlayer. 

[botrytis]

18 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

On paper Ryzen is great but not in reality for stuff like HQPlayer. 

 

Have you tried? I actually tried a R5-2600 to a i5-10500, at work, for some 3D modeling from some mass spec data (OK Science GEEK here  ). The Ryzen was a tad faster (same amount of memory and speed as well as HD space). For computations, unless it is specifically designed for an Intel CPU, either would work.

 

Also the security issues with Intel processors, that gives me a huge pause. Most computers at work are Intel CPU's. 

[The Computer Audiophile]

6 minutes ago, botrytis said:

 

Have you tried? I actually tried a R5-2600 to a i5-10500, at work, for some 3D modeling from some mass spec data (OK Science GEEK here  ). The Ryzen was a tad faster (same amount of memory and speed as well as HD space). For computations, unless it is specifically designed for an Intel CPU, either would work.

 

Also the security issues with Intel processors, that gives me a huge pause. Most computers at work are Intel CPU's. 

I completely get what you're saying, but tons of apps just don't work as well on AMD processors. There are strange issues that pop up even though both "should" work great. 

 

There is evidence of this in the AS forum for people running HQPlayer. 

[Le Concombre Masqué]

Analog gauges are a gorgeous marketing concept ! Although some would say that CPU load is too global and that per core load is desirable... There's a whole concept there: does a CPU load in the red right hand means anything in terms of SQ ?

My main concern, though, would be that such a server built with HQPlayer in mind could not play HQP at SOTA, that is ext2 or Sinc S filters, ASDM7EC modulator, SDM 256 output, not to mention full range convolution. Does it ?

[The Computer Audiophile]

18 minutes ago, Le Concombre Masqué said:

Analog gauges are a gorgeous marketing concept ! Although some would say that CPU load is too global and that per core load is desirable... There's a whole concept there: does a CPU load in the red right hand means anything in terms of SQ ?

My main concern, though, would be that such a server built with HQPlayer in mind could not play HQP at SOTA, that is ext2 or Sinc S filters, ASDM7EC modulator, SDM 256 output, not to mention full range convolution. Does it ?

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough when I described this as a two PC system and this is the audio endpoint that's the NAA?