Sonore opticalRendu

[octaviars]

3 minutes ago, jabbr said:

Yes, the Finisars are awesome (I use) — they are OEM for Intel (as well as Avago)

 

I asume they are SFP+ modules as they support both 1G and 10G and if am not mistaken the products from @vortecjrand @Superdad are regular SFP ports so only 1G modules can be used.

 

[jabbr]

SFP+ modules/slots are backwards compatible with SFP

 

Most 10G modules don’t support 1G but the Finisar modules do.

[octaviars]

20 minutes ago, jabbr said:

SFP+ modules/slots are backwards compatible with SFP

 

I know that but the spec sheet from Finisar have this written in it.

 

"This product is for applications specifically designed for 10G SFP+ ports and 1G/10G SFP+ ports and not 
native 1G SFP ports."

 

 

[JohnSwenson]

11 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

So this means the opticalRendu won't feature your 'Clock Blocking' feature?

 

Correct, first off it is still in development, it is very expensive, it takes a lot of room.

 

The upshot is that to put it in an opticalRendu would mean a bigger case, Two power supplies, and cost a LOT more. This did not seem like a good way to go for something that may or may not make a difference depending on the users system.

 

John S.

[jabbr]

51 minutes ago, octaviars said:

 

I know that but the spec sheet from Finisar have this written in it.

 

"This product is for applications specifically designed for 10G SFP+ ports and 1G/10G SFP+ ports and not 
native 1G SFP ports."

 

 

Yes, the commercial product which uses the Finisar SFP(+) module in question is Intel NIC eg x520 ... I don’t know if other commercial / professional implementations which specify this but there might be. 

 

I would defer to Sonore about which modules have been tested with their hardware. The SFP(+) spec and associated standards 802.11ae for example, have considerably more requirements (including end-to-end jitter) than the older 1000base-X / SFP / 1G fiberoptic Ethernet specifications/standards and it is entirely possible that 1G modules may not meet expectations the 10G requirements. 

 

The 

thread was specifically created so that folks can post setups and configurations that they have found to work — and avoid potential incompatibilities.

 

That is to say it is safest to use what Sonore specifies but there may be products outside their specs that work in practice.

[asdf1000]

8 hours ago, vortecjr said:

I'm starting to like that the other thread a lot...where they don't seem to worry about anything anymore:) You can also use an opticalModule as an alternative.

 

Lol, someone asking a technical query does not mean they are worrying about anything. It’s nothing more than just a technical query 😉

 

[Foggie]

I don't recall the exact issue, but several of us using optical had a few quirks with a speed issue ("too fast") using NAA with microU (I think) which was remedied very nicely with a 10/100/1000 FMC - this Trendnet that @jabbr recommended.  I believe @The Computer Audiophile had a similar issue and used a dumb 10/100 switch to address the too fast issue.

 

@vortecjr do you think this may be a possible issue with the opticalrendu?

 

Also for FWIW, this Cisco SFP + cable I also referenced seem to be a good match.  

 

[Dutch]

15 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

Ha, yup it'll happen.

 

Already did! 😄

 

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/the-1st-sgm-server-evo-edition-in-hong-kong.26130/post-537160

 

Quote

Ben of Volent Audio Hong Kong has advanced even further on SFP module testing, he has a whole range in his shop where you can compare them. There's personal taste involved on these, bugger!

 

[vortecjr]

15 minutes ago, Dutch said:

 

Already did! 😄

 

https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/the-1st-sgm-server-evo-edition-in-hong-kong.26130/post-537160

 

 

That is great...I hope he will be kind enough to support our customers when they start asking a bunch of questions:)

[vortecjr]

37 minutes ago, Foggie said:

I don't recall the exact issue, but several of us using optical had a few quirks with a speed issue ("too fast") using NAA with microU (I think) which was remedied very nicely with a 10/100/1000 FMC - this Trendnet that @jabbr recommended.  I believe @The Computer Audiophile had a similar issue and used a dumb 10/100 switch to address the too fast issue.

 

@vortecjr do you think this may be a possible issue with the opticalrendu?

 

Also for FWIW, this Cisco SFP + cable I also referenced seem to be a good match. 

 

Sounds familiar, but I'll have to research it to see what it was. Maybe it was related to managed vs standard switches....

[Dutch]

1 minute ago, vortecjr said:

That is great...I hope he will be kind enough to support our customers when they start asking a bunch of questions:)

 

Haha, Hope so too for you. You must now think something like ‘oh no, what did I get myself into’. 😄

[vortecjr]

48 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

 

Lol, someone asking a technical query does not mean they are worrying about anything. It’s nothing more than just a technical query 😉

 

No worries...

[vortecjr]

In regards to some of these fancy SFP modules...I think we will let you guys sort this all out. From our perspective we will recommend things we know work, but we don't plan to experiment to much.

[Albrecht]

59 minutes ago, jabbr said:

Yes, the commercial product which uses the Finisar SFP(+) module in question is Intel NIC eg x520 ... I don’t know if other commercial / professional implementations which specify this but there might be. 

 

I would defer to Sonore about which modules have been tested with their hardware. The SFP(+) spec and associated standards 802.11ae for example, have considerably more requirements (including end-to-end jitter) than the older 1000base-X / SFP / 1G fiberoptic Ethernet specifications/standards and it is entirely possible that 1G modules may not meet expectations the 10G requirements. 

 

The 

thread was specifically created so that folks can post setups and configurations that they have found to work — and avoid potential incompatibilities.

 

That is to say it is safest to use what Sonore specifies but there may be products outside their specs that work in practice.

hey....

Your optical network configurations thread was a fun thread and I learned a lot... Thanks....

[vortecjr]

2 hours ago, jabbr said:

Again not important for home audio but from a piece of electro-optical physical beauty sort of thing the ability to stuff these bits into a single fiber one and then recover them miles away is a true technical feat. 

Thanks for posting this.

[jabbr]

1 hour ago, Foggie said:

I don't recall the exact issue, but several of us using optical had a few quirks with a speed issue ("too fast") using NAA with microU (I think) which was remedied very nicely with a 10/100/1000 FMC - this Trendnet that @jabbr recommended.  I believe @The Computer Audiophile had a similar issue and used a dumb 10/100 switch to address the too fast issue.

 

We like to think of networks as plug and play (literally) but there can be edge issues when mixing network speeds eg 1G and 100m. Equipment designed to handle this will have ample buffer space. 

[JohnSwenson]

The opticalRendu runs at gigabit, period. It will not run at 100Mbit or 10G.

 

The technical details are that the protocol used by most of the optical SFP modules runs at gigabit without auto-negotiation. Theoretically it could run at 100Mbit, but without auto-negotiation there would have to be a switch to select which speed. I considered that to be way too confusing for most situations.

 

There is a different protocol that runs over SFP that DOES implement auto-negotiation so it can automatically deal with different speeds, but the number of modules that use this protocol is very small. The problem is that it is very difficult if not impossible to tell which type of module you have. So it was decided to make it work with just the vast majority of modules which will be what most users will be using.

 

John S.

[vortecjr]

This post has the dos and don'ts. Most people will not need to worry about anything if they stick to the hardware we provide them.  

[matthias]

9 hours ago, vortecjr said:

This post has the dos and don'ts. Most people will not need to worry about anything if they stick to the hardware we provide them.  

 

Do you provide the optical cables as well, if yes in which lenght?

 

Matt

[Miska]

On 1/3/2019 at 11:53 PM, Foggie said:

I don't recall the exact issue, but several of us using optical had a few quirks with a speed issue ("too fast") using NAA with microU (I think) which was remedied very nicely with a 10/100/1000 FMC - this Trendnet that @jabbr recommended.  I believe @The Computer Audiophile had a similar issue and used a dumb 10/100 switch to address the too fast issue.

 

Root is that if your network gear (switch, etc) doesn't support 802.3x (flow control) spec, then you will likely have issues.

 

On smart switches you practically always have a configuration option for this feature, whether it is enabled by default is about 50/50 these days. If it is disabled, the smart switch usually discards flow control packets which causes buffer overflow at receiver which cannot manage full network speed (for example iMX6 SoC is internally limited to about 400 Mbps), which in turn causes lot of re-sends which in turn makes situation just worse. So overall, first thing to look is that network gear supports 802.3x, and secondly don't assume that smart (configurable) networking gear is plug-and-play. For managed/smart switches you will need to configure it properly or otherwise you will have problems. If you are not familiar with intricate details of network configuration, it is better to stick with unmanaged switches that state support for 802.3x (flow-control).

 

[MagnusH]

Whats the power requirement for the opticalRendu? Input voltage range and mA? Can a battery pack handle it?

[vortecjr]

12 hours ago, matthias said:

 

Do you provide the optical cables as well, if yes in which lenght?

 

Matt

We plan to offer a limited selections of optical cables with the purchase of our optical series.

[vortecjr]

11 hours ago, Miska said:

 

Root is that if your network gear (switch, etc) doesn't support 802.3x (flow control) spec, then you will likely have issues.

 

On smart switches you practically always have a configuration option for this feature, whether it is enabled by default is about 50/50 these days. If it is disabled, the smart switch usually discards flow control packets which causes buffer overflow at receiver which cannot manage full network speed (for example iMX6 SoC is internally limited to about 400 Mbps), which in turn causes lot of re-sends which in turn makes situation just worse. So overall, first thing to look is that network gear supports 802.3x, and secondly don't assume that smart (configurable) networking gear is plug-and-play. For managed/smart switches you will need to configure it properly or otherwise you will have problems. If you are not familiar with intricate details of network configuration, it is better to stick with unmanaged switches that state support for 802.3x (flow-control).

 

What he said! This is it exactly including the part about 802.3x which I had forgot about:) Thanks for posting this. I’ll add it shortly to our optical dos and don’ts and to our FAQ here on AS. 

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, MagnusH said:

Whats the power requirement for the opticalRendu? Input voltage range and mA? Can a battery pack handle it?

6-9 VDC with center positive single pin connector. Similar to the ultraRendu. I don’t have the current usage information yet.

[MagnusH]

That's a very good range though, either 6 1.2V AA batteries with around 2500 mAh, or even a 6V sealed lead acid battery (it will have around 7V when charged). 6V sealed lead acid batteries is available up to over 10 Ah so that should last a while.

 

Or maybe those 123 LiFePo4 batteries talked about in this thread (for another transport): https://community.roonlabs.com/t/digione-signature/47638/264?u=magnus