Roon / HQPlayer Integration

[bibo01]

Yes, I confirm that 4.0.0a8-8 is working, where 4.0.0a10-10 is giving that error.

 

There is 4.0.0a11 available now. Have you tried it?

[shadowlight]

There is 4.0.0a11 available now. Have you tried it?

 

Can you provide the link? Did not see a new version in the usual location.

[bibo01]

Can you provide the link? Did not see a new version in the usual location.

Indeed..

I thought I had seen a quote by Miska about a11, but perhaps I am mistaken.

[jsa307]

Sorry if this is a bit of a cross-post from the Roon forum, but I thought the experts here might be able to help ..

 

I've been trying out Roon + HQplayer for the past week. I have both programs residing on a late 2014 mac mini/2.6 ghz intel core i5/8GB ram/ssd. Upsampling to dsd64 was fine- but I couldn't upsample to dsd128 without massive stuttering. A couple of questions for Roon/HQplayer regulars here:

 

a) is it still worth it to upsample the redbook to dsd64? or does the real benefit arise with 2x, and especially 4x, upsampling? What about upsampling hi-res PCM (ie 24/192) to only dsd64 .. worth it?

 

b) how much of my stuttering problem might be due to the Mac needing to do DoP to get the dsd stream to the DAC? If the problem was more DoP related, what if I installed windows via Boot camp, and then used Roon/HQplayer in windows instead - eliminating the need for the extra resources being devoted to DoP??

 

Thanks for any help!

[firedog]

Response of CTO of Roon about integrating HQP and other software controls within the Roon interface:

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/control-of-hq-player-within-roon/21419/12?

 

This is part of a somewhat bigger project to support additional "playback controls". Several Roon Ready partners also want this for switching filters/phase at the DAC, doing channel trimming controls, and other stuff like that. HQPlayer is one of about 10 partners that would benefit from this sort of integration. In addition, we would make the same capabilities available via the Roon API so people could attach extra controls of their own (or integrate with other things).

 

I think we'll add support for this via the Roon API, via the RAAT SDK (for Roon Ready partners), and in all likelihood for HQPlayer, too, using its control interface (and even if we were to de-prioritize the HQPlayer specific piece for some reason, it would be possible to accomplish the same using the Roon API anyways).

 

I noticed some implication that we might "focus on our own DSP" or that there might be business reasons not to do this. I don't really see it that way. We don't lose anything when our users use HQPlayer, and we don't gain anything when they use our DSP. Both should remain viable options and work well. Just because we have a little bit of overlap now doesn't mean we intend to marginalize that integration.

[craighartley]

Response of CTO of Roon about integrating HQP and other software controls within the Roon interface:

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/control-of-hq-player-within-roon/21419/12?

 

Thanks for the link - that's encouraging.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

[mikicasellas]

Greetings everyone

 

I am trying to figure out what kind of PC-MAc-One box solution i need in order to maximize with my Sonore Microrendu using ROON/HQPlayer with it

 

I have A Microrendu with LPS-1 and curious USB cable to my VEGA DAC, i use now a MacMini late 2012 with 8 GB RAM and have an external 4TB, but word out there is that if want to go ROON/HQplayer i will need a BIG machine to run all these heavy duties.

 

I have now the SonciTRasporter i5, but i have been told that it is not going to handle that much operations...:-(

 

Could anyone suggest?

 

Thanks

[R1200CL]

Greetings everyone

 

I am trying to figure out what kind of PC-MAc-One box solution i need in order to maximize with my Sonore Microrendu using ROON/HQPlayer with it

 

I have A Microrendu with LPS-1 and curious USB cable to my VEGA DAC, i use now a MacMini late 2012 with 8 GB RAM and have an external 4TB, but word out there is that if want to go ROON/HQplayer i will need a BIG machine to run all these heavy duties.

 

I have now the SonciTRasporter i5, but i have been told that it is not going to handle that much operations...:-(

 

Could anyone suggest?

 

Thanks

 

Just curious:

What is the maximum you can achieve with that solution ?

 

Your Vega has max DSD 128.

What is is your max rate (processing speed) only using Roon on your i5

 

https://kb.roonlabs.com/DSP_Engine

[mikicasellas]

Hi R1200CL

 

I have been only running ROON in this configuration, but i have heard that ROON/HQplayer takes it to the next level so i am intrigued and interested on going such path. The people from Small Green Computer were i purchased the ST i5 told me that the STi5 would not be enough for such tasks, so he is giving the notion of taking thew STi5 back and sell me this instead:

 

https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/collections/custom-units/products/sonictransporter-roon-server-hqplayer

 

If i don't want to spend that kind of money, Should i dedicate my MacMini for this purpose instead or definitely i will have to go another route buying the above solution from SGC or make my own dedicated computer?

 

Thanks for the help here

 

This is how isa setup my system now:

 

 

 

Just curious:

What is the maximum you can achieve with that solution ?

 

Your Vega has max DSD 128.

What is is your max rate (processing speed) only using Roon on your i5

 

https://kb.roonlabs.com/DSP_Engine

[HardrockInMiniMac]

Sorry if this is a bit of a cross-post from the Roon forum, but I thought the experts here might be able to help ..

I've been trying out Roon + HQplayer for the past week. I have both programs residing on a late 2014 mac mini/2.6 ghz intel core i5/8GB ram/ssd. Upsampling to dsd64 was fine- but I couldn't upsample to dsd128 without massive stuttering. A couple of questions for Roon/HQplayer regulars here:

a) is it still worth it to upsample the redbook to dsd64? or does the real benefit arise with 2x, and especially 4x, upsampling? What about upsampling hi-res PCM (ie 24/192) to only dsd64 .. worth it?

b) how much of my stuttering problem might be due to the Mac needing to do DoP to get the dsd stream to the DAC? If the problem was more DoP related, what if I installed windows via Boot camp, and then used Roon/HQplayer in windows instead - eliminating the need for the extra resources being devoted to DoP??

Thanks for any help!

 

Important information for you maybe: I am using the same MacMini version with Roon + HQP and upsampling to 2.8/5.6 MHz (DSD64/DSD128) and not stuttering whatsoever.

Chris

[R1200CL]

Hi R1200CL

 

I have been only running ROON in this configuration, but i have heard that ROON/HQplayer takes it to the next level so i am intrigued and interested on going such path. The people from Small Green Computer were i purchased the ST i5 told me that the STi5 would not be enough for such tasks, so he is giving the notion of taking thew STi5 back and sell me this instead:

 

I'm very interested in you try your i5 with Roon DSP engine.

 

And from the answer you just got you do not need to spend any money at all. But maybe 2 computers is better than one.

 

Also maybe consider upgrade your Mac ;

https://uptoneaudio.com/products/mac-mini-dc-conversion-linear-fan-controller-kit-mmk

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile

[mikicasellas]

I am running ROON core from the STi5, what i have not done is purchasing the HQplayer and since HQplayer can be purchased for MAC/LINUX or WiNdows, i really don't want to go and expend money on such platforms and then realize that i have to purchase again another license for a windows one, i will try to see if the people of HQplayer can switch my platform to windows if the first one does not work with my actual system (Linux/Mac).

 

What do you think?

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm very interested in you try your i5 with Roon DSP engine.

 

And from the answer you just got you do not need to spend any money at all. But maybe 2 computers is better than one.

 

Also maybe consider upgrade your Mac ;

https://uptoneaudio.com/products/mac-mini-dc-conversion-linear-fan-controller-kit-mmk

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile

[R1200CL]

I am running ROON core from the STi5, what i have not done is purchasing the HQplayer and since HQplayer can be purchased for MAC/LINUX or WiNdows, i really don't want to go and expend money on such platforms and then realize that i have to purchase again another license for a windows one, i will try to see if the people of HQplayer can switch my platform to windows if the first one does not work with my actual system (Linux/Mac).

 

What do you think?

Are you actually saying the Andrew at SMG more or less misinformed you ?

Did he state that the SonicTransporter i5 can't do Roon DSD128, and you are doing it ?

 

Strange he did not try to sell you this one then

https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/products/sonictransporter-i7-for-roon-1-3-dsp

 

About HQPlayer, I think what you risk is maximum around $70. Cause if you for any strange reason would like to do windows, that second license is half price.

 

And you have already got a confirmation that you can even run everything on your Mac. And I suppose Mac or Linux is considered best OS for audio.

 

The question is more will you hear any sonic improvement, and the only way to find out is to spend the $140

(Well why not just start with the Mac trail).

Since I run windows I could test it out for free in one month. (Or 3 months, on three different PC's, or just reinstall windows every month).

 

So can you do. Install windows (bootcamp) on your mac. Not that I can guarantee that the sonic will equal on Mac OS. But you would be able to play with it, and get an idea.

 

You may also find this thread interesting :

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/novel-way-massively-improve-sq-sms-200-and-microrendu-31110/

[Miska]

I thought I had seen a quote by Miska about a11, but perhaps I am mistaken.

 

Previous was a10, now a11 is up...

[mikicasellas]

No in fact he never misinformed me, i do ROON without a problem with the Sti5 the thing that i am saying is that for using ROON/HQPlayer he is telling me now that the STi5 would not do such tasks and that i would need a more powerful engine.

 

I was to believe that Mac was better SQ than PC but lately i have ben reading in lots of forums that a good PC running windows 10 is better...??

 

Anyway i will try to exchange words with HQplayer people and see where this goes

 

Thanks a lot for the tips and suggestions, any other tip is welcome always

 

Kind regards

 

Are you actually saying the Andrew at SMG more or less misinformed you ?

Did he state that the SonicTransporter i5 can't do Roon DSD128, and you are doing it ?

 

Strange he did not try to sell you this one then

https://www.smallgreencomputer.com/products/sonictransporter-i7-for-roon-1-3-dsp

 

About HQPlayer, I think what you risk is maximum around $70. Cause if you for any strange reason would like to do windows, that second license is half price.

 

And you have already got a confirmation that you can even run everything on your Mac. And I suppose Mac or Linux is considered best OS for audio.

 

The question is more will you hear any sonic improvement, and the only way to find out is to spend the $140

(Well why not just start with the Mac trail).

Since I run windows I could test it out for free in one month. (Or 3 months, on three different PC's, or just reinstall windows every month).

 

So can you do. Install windows (bootcamp) on your mac. Not that I can guarantee that the sonic will equal on Mac OS. But you would be able to play with it, and get an idea.

 

You may also find this thread interesting :

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/novel-way-massively-improve-sq-sms-200-and-microrendu-31110/

[R1200CL]

No in fact he never misinformed me, i do ROON without a problem with the Sti5 the thing that i am saying is that for using ROON/HQPlayer he is telling me now that the STi5 would not do such tasks and that i would need a more powerful engine.

 

I was to believe that Mac was better SQ than PC but lately i have ben reading in lots of forums that a good PC running windows 10 is better...??

 

Anyway i will try to exchange words with HQplayer people and see where this goes

 

Thanks a lot for the tips and suggestions, any other tip is welcome always

 

Kind regards

 

You are aware of that Roon 1.3 do DSD upsamling ?

And I'm asking you if you tried it ?

 

Cause as said I'm curious how well the i5 is doing Roon DSD.

(I have a i5 myself, but not a DSD DAC yet).

[arglebargle]

Previous was a10, now a11 is up...

 

Thanks for the new default hqplayerd.xml, very instructive. Slotted in my filter preferences and network playback with Roon / NAA worked straight away.

 

Still having problems with playlist advancing when samplerates change, even running Debian Stretch. Stumped on that one though, if I think of something I'll pass it along. Anyone else running Roonserver and Embedded on the same Linux machine experiencing this?

[mikicasellas]

Unfortunately my Vega does not do Native DSD, so when it go thru Microrendu it down samples to PCM 384 i believe, not sure of the number but it down samples.

 

Regarding the new ROON 1.3 i have not tried yet cause i have all my system in a house where i have two months away from, for familiar circumstances until next month that i am back again.

 

Do you do ROON + HQPlayer with your STi5?

 

 

 

You are aware of that Roon 1.3 do DSD upsamling ?

And I'm asking you if you tried it ?

 

Cause as said I'm curious how well the i5 is doing Roon DSD.

(I have a i5 myself, but not a DSD DAC yet).

[jsa307]

Important information for you maybe: I am using the same MacMini version with Roon + HQP and upsampling to 2.8/5.6 MHz (DSD64/DSD128) and not stuttering whatsoever.

Chris

 

That is interesting. What do you make of it? My Mac Mini is only used for music, nothing else should be competing for resources

 

A few things I could think of: I have a large music library, about 110,000 songs - which i've heard can start to tax Roon's performance. Also what hqplayer filters are you using? I also have the music on a NAS (less likely to be the problem). I've only been playing around with Roon and HQplayer for a few days, so I'd appreciate any opinions ..

[R1200CL]

Do you do ROON + HQPlayer with your STi5?

 

No, that is more or less impossible.

I do Roon upsamling of cause.

 

I think you have a lot of testing and changing of settings in your present system to do [emoji3]

 

Your Vega do DSD 128 according to Auralic specifications.

[HardrockInMiniMac]

That is interesting. What do you make of it? My Mac Mini is only used for music, nothing else should be competing for resources

A few things I could think of: I have a large music library, about 110,000 songs - which i've heard can start to tax Roon's performance. Also what hqplayer filters are you using? I also have the music on a NAS (less likely to be the problem). I've only been playing around with Roon and HQplayer for a few days, so I'd appreciate any opinions ..

 

Well, I am on a business trip so I can't tell my exact setup right now as I have only had the Lyngdorf for 2 weeks and did not get to PCM-DSD Upsampling before last weekend. It worked right away is all I can say, but I will post the detailed settings at the end of this week.

 

With the MacMini I have Bluetooth, IR and WLAN disabled, headless HDMI adapter, OS X from SD Card and all music on an internal SSD, which is not the most perfect solution (I would buy one without a hard drive now), but at that time I did not know too much about it. At least internal SSD is short distance and fast.

 

One thing which caused me trouble was that I had the Lyngdorf selected as the primary output device under OS X and I also had an output device enabled under Roon, both is wrong. There should only be HQP as network device enabled under Roon and then in HQP you got to select your DAC as output device and deselect your DAC under OS X.

 

In fact Lyngdorf TDAI is not even a DAC but all digital end to end, maybe that is also not a bad thing for resources(?).

 

While searching for other topics I found a number of comments on this forum where people have also been successful with their Minis and PCM-DSD upsampling. So it will be a specific setting on your end. I agree that the NAS should not be an issue and the huge number of songs in your library, why would that cause Roon an issue when playing just one song?

 

Chris

[HardrockInMiniMac]

That is interesting. What do you make of it? My Mac Mini is only used for music, nothing else should be competing for resources

A few things I could think of: I have a large music library, about 110,000 songs - which i've heard can start to tax Roon's performance. Also what hqplayer filters are you using? I also have the music on a NAS (less likely to be the problem). I've only been playing around with Roon and HQplayer for a few days, so I'd appreciate any opinions ..

So I have checked my settings for you: poly since shrt mp; ASDM7; Auto; SDM(DSD) on the main window. Then Preferences: DoP (does not work without); Auto rate family (also works without), Highest bitrate according my DAC= 5,6; No direct SDM, nothing else.

Playback of 44,1 to DSD128 begins after 5sec, hot switch between songs afterwards immediately, no stuttering.

CPU usage in playback 78%.

Just don't know why I need DoP enabled as my DAC should be able to play native DSD, but will find out later.

Hope this helps,

 

Chris

[SwissBear]

@Miska

A short bug report:

Environment: MacMini OS 10.11.6 / Roon 1.3 (build 209)

When moving from HQPlayer 3.15.1 to HQPlayer 3.16, playlists which include multiple original sampling rates stop playing back when changing sampling rate. This does not occur when the playlist is played back directly in HQPlayer, nor does it happen when the playlist is played back in Roon+HQPlayer 3.15.1

 

[arglebargle]

55 minutes ago, SwissBear said:

@Miska

A short bug report:

Environment: MacMini OS 10.11.6 / Roon 1.3 (build 209)

When moving from HQPlayer 3.15.1 to HQPlayer 3.16, playlists which include multiple original sampling rates stop playing back when changing sampling rate. This does not occur when the playlist is played back directly in HQPlayer, nor does it happen when the playlist is played back in Roon+HQPlayer 3.15.1

 

 

Same here. Just tested because I haven't really used 3.16 yet as Embedded has been working so well. It was a problem for me in a bunch of versions of Embedded 4.* but cleared up with the most recent. This is the first time I've experienced it on the desktop version.  Before now I hadn't seen another person mention this issue, so if it's reproducible somehow maybe that will help. I'll generate some logs with 3.16 later to see if there is anything of interest. 

[Dr Tone]

5 hours ago, SwissBear said:

@Miska

A short bug report:

Environment: MacMini OS 10.11.6 / Roon 1.3 (build 209)

When moving from HQPlayer 3.15.1 to HQPlayer 3.16, playlists which include multiple original sampling rates stop playing back when changing sampling rate. This does not occur when the playlist is played back directly in HQPlayer, nor does it happen when the playlist is played back in Roon+HQPlayer 3.15.1

 

 

What length of delay do you have set in Roon for sample rate changes?  I don't do playlists but always found .5 sec helped Air work properly when changing sample rates.