The EtherREGEN thread for various network, cable, power experiences and experiments

[Iving]

10 hours ago, MarkS said:

I’m thinking really hard about the Musec Ref 10 clock and look forward to hearing from anyone with one connected to the ER. 

Just a 2c fwiw

It's poss that the ER raises brightness depending on which cable or whether optic follows it.

Also ...

I found WC from my Dangerous Convert-2 instead of RedNet D16 AES internal (i.e. better clock) had similar effect even if prat, space and thud improved. So I turned it off.

Better clocking after the ER may brighten in unwanted ways.

Offsets may re-balance but you have to ask what's going on with the ER.

The ER is a strange animal but, tweaked, my system is more listenable than ever.

 

[Iving]

1 hour ago, LewinskiH01 said:

 

Thank you. Indeed, it's mayhem. My sister lives in Beijing and fled 4 weeks ago with the kids. No fun.

 

From reading around, I'm understanding the JSSG360 boils down to a metal mesh throughout the length of the cable with a thin cable running along and connected at both ends to the mesh. A long Faraday cage with a connective link to allow any potential differential to flow from one end to the other. Am I understanding it right? So a DIY JSSG360 treatment is fairly easy to try on any std CAT6 or 7 and hear if it makes any difference vs a plain version. Fun to test while I wait for my eR to be shipped end of next week or so.

 

Looking forward to your experience with the Ghent!

 

I'm on a learning curve myself with JSSG - about to build DC cables for an SR7. The DC Cables thread [https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/31554-diy-dc-power-cables/] is excellent. I only post really to say that there is a "360" version of JSSG which I understand to involve the replacement of the outer wire with a further braid/mesh (credit @lmitche if I'm not mistaken). On the DC thread there are great soldering tips (sic) courtesy @Middy if you are not already a dab hand. Of course JSSG can be used for ethernet cables whether the plugs are DIY or unmolested (in which case a lot trickier).

[Iving]

3 minutes ago, mourip said:

I will try it again when my ER arrives, hopefully in a week or so.

 

Can't wait for your listening impressions.

 

I knew ER was sig. immediately but could hear "cooking" improvements over 2-300 hrs.

 

Cable swaps esp. audible *post*'-ER.

[Iving]

39 minutes ago, mourip said:

 

Got my shipping notice today!

 

eeek!

[Iving]

Have people any clever solutions for a weight to keep the ER from tilting with heavy cables? I was literally thinking a glass paperweight, but something that did not interfere with heat dissipation. 

 

If you have a clever solution, I'm all ears. Or is it - ERs?  

Although not strictly a weight, my solution is evident in the following posts. Probably my whole system by some standards is over-engineered; nevertheless, there is zero strain/torque on the eR notwithstanding very stiff/heavy cables - and my heatsink was carefully chosen and fitted over an exactly-cut thermal pad.

 

[Iving]

Suppose I should add/explain - my cables are heat-moulded to fit. Even if the eR were not anchored there would be no/negligible strain on it.

[Iving]

1 hour ago, Clockmeister said:

I shall watch this thread with interest

Well - just to mention that you can have your cake and eat it (FBA + EtherRegen advantage) ...

[Iving]

17 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:

What is FBA?

 

"File Based Audio" ...

 

... as opposed to music "streamed" from the internet.

 

FBA is often associated with an internet-offline "streamer"

 

which shows you how muddy terminology can be.

 

afaik @Clockmeister has a bespoke FBA "streamer".

 

I use a computer.

 

I guess most EtherRegen users "stream" music from the internet - and appreciate the ER advantage in a particular way.

 

You were talking about "downloaded" (i.e. FBA) vs. "streamed directly".

 

I am greatly in favour of being internet-offline (and I don't download my music) ...

 

yet I am a great fan of the ER in my RedNet system.

 

Like Clockmeister I don't use SATA - strong preference for Optane - and music is my first love, not tech!

[Iving]

43 minutes ago, Rsbrsvp said:

Please forgive me for the question if this has been covered:

 

Does the ER need to be on 24/7 to sound its best or is a one or two hour warm up enough?

 

It gets so hot, I want to extend it's life so I prefer to turn it on only when necessary.

 

I thought at least to turn it on in the early afternoon and off at night before bed.  I listen to music in the evening....  That would allow a 4-5 hour warm-up time.

 

Whilst the ER works great from cold, the main issue is that the clock needs time - as in weeks - to stabilise optimally for SQ.

 

That said, I have my system off sometimes. But only when I'm busy on other things for those kinds of episodes.

 

The ER isn't something you would ordinarily turn on and off daily.

 

(Like plenty of other ER users I have a heatsink which I hope helps dissipate heat. To the extent that longevity is in play it could help there too - but that is not my particular concern. I think she looks nice with her hat on - that's probably the main reason.)

 

Edit: See also here:

 

[Iving]

My atypical system is offline PC > ER > DDC > DAC.

I had AQ Cinnamons either Side of the ER.

I upgraded ER A Side to a 2020 Sablon. Multiple simultaneous changes so cannot compare directly. But I am very happy with the Sablon. I am confident it is significantly better than the AQ, and presented only positive SQ advantages. No drawback. I am not hearing "coloration" or masking of any kind. If it's there I don't mind it!

Later (having bought an AD clock) I upgraded the ER B Side to an AfterDark Constellation. Again multiple simultaneous changes but the Constellation better than the AQ to my ears during analytics [see links below]. I was thinking I would get another Sablon if the Constellation was weak. But no need. imo the AfterDark Constellation cable is punching way above its price weight.

Reminder that the AfterDark cable is for B Side only/4 wires/100 mbps. Has ground wire option too. Works for me.

May be better reading whatsbest for an impression of the Sablon. Don't know what can be found on using the Sablon ER B Side. I haven't done an "all other things equal" comparison of Sablon/AD Constellation on the ER B Side. Not sure I've read one anywhere.

Detailed reports on my own system upgrades are in the AfterDark Mutec thread.

 

[Iving]

Anyway - Perhaps we "audiophools" don't appreciate that "all ethernet cables sound the same". Researching remote control options, this morning I came across this video. Watch it to the end if you can. The "PPI" is hilarious!!!

 

 

[Iving]

Having redeployed the 12V output of my Paul Hynes SR7T, I'm thinking of ordering a Farad Super3 for my eR.

 

Any good reason not to choose 12V?

[Iving]

31 minutes ago, RDOK said:

I used a standard Farad, no options. In that case I preferred the SR4. Of course it will be system- and personal preference-dependent.

I have no doubt the Farad and SR4 are of comparable quality.

 

On the ER I just compared 12V and 9V with the SR4 and I preferred 9V. So did a friend of mine. We just ordered a 9V Plixir to test it for application on the ER.

 

I would also estimate PH and Farad to be similar in quality - but of course PH no longer available - new anyway.

 

Regards voltage, John Swenson says 12V "optimal" [no doubt partly at least less current draw], Alex says "perform exactly the same with 7V input as it will with 12V input" and there has been misc. discussion of this in the past. I guess I'm really after anything new/a more technical argument vs. "preferred". Or can you say in a little detail why you "preferred" [9V]? Describe SQ difference? Thank you

 

One of my fav. Alex posts ascribes "bat-ears" to those of us who can discern a SQ advantage using "fancy power supplies" over the stock SMPS!

The voltage regulation and differential isolation of the EtherREGEN is so good that, as mentioned before, it is going to be hard to hear much difference with fancy power supplies with this switch.  Maybe some with bat-ears will, but for me and John, EtherREGEN (with the SMPS) is "whoa!" obvious, and using a fancy LPS with it is like "maybe?", "not sure", "possibly nothing." YMMV.

[Iving]

30 minutes ago, RDOK said:

I would not claim to have 'bat-ears' by far. But my system, evolving by experimenting (trial and error and being inspired a lot by AS forums) has reached a quite resolving state by now.

I think more people have reported that the ER in fact is responding well to the quality of the PSU used, just as people claim that it is responding to a good external clock as well. This also originally was not to be expected according to Alex.

I have a very high opinion of Alex and John but it seems that the original expectation on the ER, it being not sensitive to the PSU and/or clock, have proven to be not quite right. The good news is that the ER can be pushed very far indeed in terms of sound quality by applying a good PSU and/or clock!

 

As I said, both a friend of mine and I just tested the ER on an SR4 with 9 and 12V and came to the same conclusion. As a small disclaimer I must mention that our systems are quite similar.

 

With respect to the perceived sound quality, at 12 V it was a bit more resolving, and had a slightly more dynamics. At 9V it is a bit more homogeneous and has a better tonality. Also at 9V the sound has more body.
To put it in other words I would say (exaggerating) that at 12V it sounds more 'HiFi' while  at 9V it sounds more musical.

 

Feel free to have a different opinion; this is what I heard with human, not bat ears 😉

 

lol I have bat-ears* but wouldn't say so on ASR!

 

I agree a good LPS is fitting for the eR. The 12V output of my SR7T is now used for my CPU and anyway was massive overkill Amp-wise for eR. [@austinpop is welcome to take credit for an earlier recommendation to power the CPU independently.] This redeployment has enabled me to take the PC to the listening position (it looks very nice there the way I have it!) and use fiber from there into eR thence RedNet D16 AES > DAC. I get SQ advantage of direct CPU supply, SQ advantage of fiber, SQ advantage of PC away from DAC and all the advantages of PC at listening position instead of additional control point. This leaves my eR on stock SMPS pending an LPS. tbh I don't mind - the system is sounding very good indeed - better than before. Likely it will sound better still if I supply the eR (now very close to my RedNet D16 AES and DAC i.e. between the speakers) with a dedicated LPS. I'd probably have gone for a Paul Hynes as I am so pleased with the SR7T (I have serial # 1 to boot), and Farad Super3 seems to me next best. Anyway some people report it's better than a SR4(T).

 

I also agree about clock for eR. I have an AD Triple for eR and Mutec MC3+ USB the latter now an awesome WC for D16 AES and DAC.

 

Thank you for the SQ remark "at 12 V it was a bit more resolving, and had a slightly more dynamics. At 9V it is a bit more homogeneous and has a better tonality. Also at 9V the sound has more body." This is a challenge to me. Usually I recoil from any suggestion of "resolving" or "space" or anything smacking of extra HF as this can be noise mistaken as Hi-Fi - overwhelmingly likely with digits ime. "Body", "Tonality" and "Homogeneity" are the converse to digititis to my ears and, so, your comment leaves me a lot to think about given my 12V hunch. I would love to hear any further V-hinged SQ experiences wrt eR.

 

*I can hear what my wife is doing in the kitchen ...

[Iving]

26 minutes ago, Johnnydev said:

I have 2 EtherRegens in series, both powered by the 2 separate Farads. The first is 12V, and the second which is also coupled with an afterdark OXCO clock and a 12V Farad, this second EtherRegen is equipped with a 9V Farad super3 with all options as described above with good results. I never swapped the 9V for the 12V, but bought it for the main Farad because I'd also heard those rumors that the 9V would sound a little better on the Etherregen for some people.

 

Wow - so more corroboration for 9V.

 

1. Can you refer to "I'd also heard those rumors that the 9V would sound a little better on the Etherregen" please?

 

2. You are in a position to compare Farad 12V vs. 9V on the eR all things equal! I don't have the audacity to ask you to do it! If I lived near you I would try to bribe you.

[Iving]

1 minute ago, Johnnydev said:

Also on this site it is a few times stated that the silver level2 is better than the copper level2.
My experience and several people with/at Farad certainly do not think that is the case. If you have a system that lacks some spice, so be it.
The copper gives a very nice musical balance and better resolution.

 

I have some leftover Duelund silver foil 1.0 and also some Mundorf Silver Gold 1mm and, so, in time can experiment (albeit Ag not Cu). As it happens I have 2 x 3 lengths of the latter making it a bit awkward to exploit the Farad output connector GX16-4 using all of it. According to Mattijs "We cannot change the output connector".

 

4 minutes ago, Johnnydev said:

In some time I could try swapping the 9V with 12V, but not on this moment, sorry.

 

Completely understandable - Thanks

[Iving]

On 1/19/2022 at 10:47 AM, Iving said:

Having redeployed the 12V output of my Paul Hynes SR7T, I'm thinking of ordering a Farad Super3 for my eR.

Any good reason not to choose 12V?

 

On 1/19/2022 at 11:23 AM, Iving said:

Regards voltage, John Swenson says 12V "optimal" [no doubt partly at least less current draw], Alex says "perform exactly the same with 7V input as it will with 12V input"

 

On 1/19/2022 at 12:30 PM, Iving said:

Thank you for the SQ remark "at 12 V it was a bit more resolving, and had a slightly more dynamics. At 9V it is a bit more homogeneous and has a better tonality. Also at 9V the sound has more body." This is a challenge to me. Usually I recoil from any suggestion of "resolving" or "space" or anything smacking of extra HF as this can be noise mistaken as Hi-Fi - overwhelmingly likely with digits ime. "Body", "Tonality" and "Homogeneity" are the converse to digititis to my ears and, so, your comment leaves me a lot to think about given my 12V hunch.

 

Just ordered a Farad Super3 12V Purple Fuse.

It was a tougher buying decision than I expected.

I'd have started thinking Paul Hynes, but PHD is no longer in business. No s/h on market. No s/h of much at audiophile level actually.

Farad would have been next choice - dilemma 9V or 12V - was still deciding (inclined to 9V) but rehearsing checkout I realised +20% at least in taxes etc so doubled back.

Double outputs inc. JS-2 over spec.

High current models over spec.

sps-500 not linear I discovered

Sean Jacobs beyond reach

Teddy Pardo not UK-local

Seriously considered a Plixir Elite BDC for a bit - available in UK so no import charges £500 delivered.

I don't deserve my wife. She went all understanding on me and I ordered the Farad. I may pay best of £700 eventually (no cables - just Purple fuse).

I admit resale possibilities steered me from 9V to 12V - cognitive dissonance will help me be happy.

 

On 1/19/2022 at 1:52 PM, Iving said:

I have some leftover Duelund silver foil 1.0 and also some Mundorf Silver Gold 1mm and, so, in time can experiment (albeit Ag not Cu).

 

Got some GX16-4 connectors from Amazon and will make up Mundorfs first - uses all 4 pins if nothing else.

 

I'm looking forward to hearing the eR Power Supply effect in my new configuration PC > Fiber > eR > RedNet D16 AES > Mutec reclocker > DAC.

 

btw credit to Mattjis for comms. - just answers all the questions.

[Iving]

On 1/23/2022 at 5:38 PM, Iving said:

Just ordered a Farad Super3 12V Purple Fuse.

 

On 1/19/2022 at 1:52 PM, Iving said:

I have some leftover Duelund silver foil 1.0 and also some Mundorf Silver Gold 1mm and, so, in time can experiment (albeit Ag not Cu). As it happens I have 2 x 3 lengths of the latter making it a bit awkward to exploit the Farad output connector GX16-4 using all of it. According to Mattijs "We cannot change the output connector".

 

On 1/23/2022 at 5:38 PM, Iving said:

Got some GX16-4 connectors from Amazon and will make up Mundorfs first - uses all 4 pins if nothing else.

 

Don't usually photo/blog cable-building as too impatient to get listening.

Won't receive Farad for a few days so here goes.

The Mundorf "snips" I have are just the right length for the specific Super3-EtherREGEN run.

So no star quad or anything like that.

Besides - the cable will be only about 10" ...

and the Mundorfs aren't amenable to twisting imo ...

anyway I'm running 2 +ve GX16-4 pins [1 & 3] to Oyaide DC 2.1G +ve and 2 to Oyaide -ve [2 &4] so it's not a 4-to-4 config.

 

First squashed a 2.5mm silver ferrule over 2 white Mundorfs, soldered, snipped to length

 

clamped and soldered to Oyaide -ve

 

temporary tape holds 2 Mundorf yellow, solder, trim

 

solder to Oyaide +ve

 

rehearse/investigate wiggle room Oyaide shell

 

add shrink to hold 2 +ves together and 2 -ves together

 

rehearse again

 

2 lengths 2mm cotton tube over

 

tape holds cable in 180 approx. shape as will be used

 

shrink tube over

 

Oyaide shell on - needed a bit of lube (washing-up liquid)

 

cuff strengthens Oyaide joint and adds buffer for JSSG

 

GX16-4 connector looks fiddly for soldering - 2.5mm silver ferrules fit nicely over each connector

 

trim cotton tubes, also excess shrink, GX16-4 shell on, with a bit of extra shrink for future use - trim Mundorfs rehearsing locations in GX16-4 connector

 

solder Mundorfs inside ferrules on GX16-4 connectors

 

basic cable completed

 

test continuity all 4 pins

 

add JSSG cuff to GX16-4 connector

 

open flat copper braid with old knife sharpener

 

rehearse length copper shield and feed over JSSG wire

 

tape copper shield both ends

 

shrink over whole length, tie and solder JSSG wire, trim

 

two more cuffs, a mid-way clasp for JSSG, and add spacer on Oyaide for EtherREGEN

 

I did try a couple of dressing braids but they were fussy about heat notwithstanding usual shielding precautions using heat gun. I'm OK with the end-result.

 

I'm just a hobbyist at this. I have learned from others here on AS - taking what I need and learning from imperfections. Hope this is a similar contribution.

[Iving]

2 hours ago, Encore said:

Big thanks for this 👍 If I ever attempt to build my own cable, I'll be following your photos.

 

So far, I'm at the stage where I'm toying with the idea of wrapping cables in aluminum foil and connecting each end with a wire tape of the foil.

 

Thanks

General approach may be varied depending on connectors required at each end.

Aluminium not as good a conductor as copper.

Trial by experience definitely the way to go and great fun provided confident enough electrically safe.

Hope you post your own experiments.

[Iving]

On 1/25/2022 at 3:08 PM, Iving said:

Don't usually photo/blog cable-building as too impatient to get listening.

Won't receive Farad for a few days so here goes.

I'm just a hobbyist at this. I have learned from others here on AS - taking what I need and learning from imperfections. Hope this is a similar contribution.

 

Update: Farad arrived yesterday

 

Here is my DC cable, dressed for dinner, in situ. It's very thick - even thicker than reported above - so it must sound Ace ;-)

This post is a quick note on "all other things equal" SQ delta, the result of changing from EtherREGEN stock smps to Farad Super3 12V (with Purple fuse and Furutech AC inlet upgrades) combined with DIY DC cable.

 

System is atypical - internet offline:
PC > Fiber > EtherREGEN > RedNet D16 AES > Mutec MC-3+ USB > DAC.

 

AfterDark Triple feeds 10 MHz EtherREGEN and Mutec, the latter WC to D16 and DAC.

 

First impression with new Super3, new DIY DC cable and with system cold:
Potential for digital calm / energy spread
Grip
Space and detail affording prat
Punch
but veil recognisable new equipment / cables

 

+20 hrs
Veil gone
Punch and thud
Space around instruments and voices which have more texture - both male and female voices more "personal"
Curious elevation in timing aka prat
Worthwhile reduction in digital effrontery which I hope will deepen over coming days/week or two

 

Summary: unambiguous and significant SQ uplift over stock smps in my system - I would grade it as higher-than-average bang-for-buck

 

[Iving]

27 minutes ago, Encore said:

Cool system! 👍 Always warms my heart to see old Snell A speakers 😊 What is the clothed contraption in front of/under the midrange driver? Is it to block first reflections from the floor?

 

Also got inspired on how to keep the eR in place with thick, unwieldy cables going into it 👍

 

ty

 

These are Snell Type A III.

Bought them years ago - had them under tarpaulin in a hiatus after which got the surrounds fixed with love. Built the whole sytem in front of them.

The cloth below the midrange is stuffed/stapled on by manuf.. It hides the upper. xover. Yes I think also it has the function you mention. I've never (yet) de-stapled to check the caps. Sometimes I'm tempted, but then an upgrade like this one makes me plenty happy for now. Usually all this is hidden by the grilles over the upper chamber - but you have to remove these to get at the mids - and replacing the upper cloth is just not worth it. Maybe they sound better this way. Qvortrup says mine look "agricultural". My wife hears me murmur "agricultural" in my sleep. That's how much I love my Snells.

The ER is strapped down -  safe with inflexible cables exactly engineered!