fas42 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, The_K-Man said: Is it a production value with that particular recording? No, the rig itself is misbehaving - if you were listening to, yes, a better sorted system then it wouldn't show these symptoms. Why I'm making this point is that this is exactly how I evaluate an unknown audio setup ... I'm listening for misbehaviours of certain types. Link to comment
The_K-Man Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, fas42 said: No, the rig itself is misbehaving - if you were listening to, yes, a better sorted system then it wouldn't show these symptoms. Why I'm making this point is that this is exactly how I evaluate an unknown audio setup ... I'm listening for misbehaviours of certain types. I'm sorry, I just don't hear anything. And I piped the audio through my full-sized system, as well as Sony headphones. I hear a lot of 'room', likely from the camera mic, but that's all. Link to comment
matthias Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 8 minutes ago, The_K-Man said: Great content will shine through, even in circumstances and on gear as you described. Yes, source first rules. Matt The_K-Man 1 "I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe) Link to comment
mansr Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 31 minutes ago, kumakuma said: hubris? Can't be. He used the past tense. Link to comment
Hugo9000 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, mansr said: Can't be. He used the past tense. He never said he won the battle. 请教别人一次是5分钟的傻子，从不请教别人是一辈子的傻子 Link to comment
kumakuma Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, mansr said: Can't be. He used the past tense. There is no indication from his posts that he's overcome this affliction. Sometimes it's like someone took a knife, baby Edgy and dull and cut a six inch valley Through the middle of my skull Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Okay, we'll move along a bit, then - the quality of the sound changes as the clip proceeds - the tonality at the beginning is not the same as at the end of the capture ... in what way? Link to comment
matthias Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 8 minutes ago, fas42 said: Okay, we'll move along a bit, then - the quality of the sound changes as the clip proceeds - the tonality at the beginning is not the same as at the end of the capture ... in what way? Maybe some issues of the recording device, batteries maybe? Matt "I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe) Link to comment
The_K-Man Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 7 minutes ago, fas42 said: Okay, we'll move along a bit, then - the quality of the sound changes as the clip proceeds - the tonality at the beginning is not the same as at the end of the capture ... in what way? Now you're scaring me - you goin' audiophile on us? 😄 fas42 1 Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 Just now, matthias said: Maybe some issues of the recording device, batteries maybe? Matt Yeah, right ... I've been hearing the same behaviour for decades - but because people haven't been told to listen for this, it's probably "invisible" to them ... "its just the way things are, and probably always will be ...". Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, fas42 said: specifically, it's one that I battled with 30 years ago ... A Demon most likely Maxwell's Demon mansr 1 Link to comment
The_K-Man Posted January 18, 2019 Share Posted January 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, fas42 said: Yeah, right ... I've been hearing the same behaviour for decades - but because people haven't been told to listen for this, it's probably "invisible" to them ... "its just the way things are, and probably always will be ...". Just say WTF it is! Distortion? Aliasing? Time issues? Spit it out! Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 24 minutes ago, The_K-Man said: Just say WTF it is! Distortion? Aliasing? Time issues? Spit it out! Distortion ... which varies with time. Objectivists are obsessed with the static nature of a system - that it is must be time-invariant! - sorry, boys and girls, the real world isn't so kindergarten like; the parameters that matter can alter over time - to put it another way, audio systems do have memory; how they behave depends upon what occurred earlier. The silly thing is, they accept this to be the case in some situations - but resolutely refuse to consider it in other areas ... a good, "accepted" circumstance is that power amplifiers should be cooked before testing; rev the guts out of them for a certain period, so that "the results are accurate" - I roll my eyes ... Link to comment
Popular Post diecaster Posted January 19, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted January 19, 2019 1 hour ago, fas42 said: Distortion ... which varies with time. Objectivists are obsessed with the static nature of a system - that it is must be time-invariant! - sorry, boys and girls, the real world isn't so kindergarten like; the parameters that matter can alter over time - to put it another way, audio systems do have memory; how they behave depends upon what occurred earlier. The silly thing is, they accept this to be the case in some situations - but resolutely refuse to consider it in other areas ... a good, "accepted" circumstance is that power amplifiers should be cooked before testing; rev the guts out of them for a certain period, so that "the results are accurate" - I roll my eyes ... ...and anyone who reads this rubbish rolls their eyes! Ralf11 and jabbr 1 1 Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 10 minutes ago, diecaster said: ...and anyone who reads this rubbish rolls their eyes! A trivial example: part of the system relies on battery power - the unit drains steadily, and so the operating characteristics vary - electronics are full of parts that change behaviour for various reasons; it's a constant dance of the elements varying ... of course, it's subtle, and the best designs take all of this into account. But most real world components aren't so robust - and, unfortunately, it's audible ... Experienced engineers in other fields know that you can never assume anything - people's lives may be on the line. In audio it doesn't matter - so they take the easy path ... "it's all in your head", and the other 1,001 lines ... Link to comment
jabbr Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 2 hours ago, fas42 said: Distortion ... which varies with time. Objectivists are obsessed with the static nature of a system - that it is must be time-invariant! - sorry, boys and girls, the real world isn't so kindergarten like; the parameters that matter can alter over time - to put it another way, audio systems do have memory; how they behave depends upon what occurred earlier. Is this like a reality distortion field? Ralf11 1 Custom room treatments for headphone users. Link to comment
The_K-Man Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 9 minutes ago, jabbr said: Is this like a reality distortion field? Yes! Similar to the works of Dr. John von Neumann and his role in the Navy's 'Invisibility Project'! Link to comment
audiobomber Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 5 hours ago, fas42 said: ... it's an actual, very marked characteristic - specifically, it's one that I battled with 30 years ago ... I' m picturing this... Main System: QNAP TS-451+ > Silent Angel Bonn N8 > Sonore opticalModule Deluxe v2 > Corning SMF with Finisar FTLF1318P3BTL SFPs > Uptone EtherREGEN > exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk-II DAC > Meitner MTR-101 Plus monoblocks > Bamberg S5-MTM sealed standmount speakers. Crown XLi 1500 powering AV123 Rocket UFW10 stereo subwoofers Upgraded power on all switches, renderer and DAC. Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 26 minutes ago, jabbr said: Is this like a reality distortion field? If it doesn't fall into exactly the right baskets ... try another example, shall we - an "accepted" behaviour is that speaker drivers can overheat, suffer "compression distortion" - so that it "sounds different", because just previously we cooked the voice coil ... sometimes, it can be just hard for encrusted brains to step out of their comfort zone - but, hey! I'm a reasonable guy ... Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 Okay, no-one is able to pick it so far ... why am I not surprised ... ? Link to comment
diecaster Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 27 minutes ago, fas42 said: Okay, no-one is able to pick it so far ... why am I not surprised ... ? Because you live in an alternate reality where the physics that relate to sound and electronics operate on different foundational principles? Link to comment
fas42 Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 24 minutes ago, diecaster said: Because you live in an alternate reality where the physics that relate to sound and electronics operate on different foundational principles? Fortunately, I live in a reality where the difference between audio reproduction which is not audibly faulty, and that which is, is very clear. Those that that need to bounce around the room, insisting I'm invoking some bizarre version of science to explain why that can happen, should get a grip - poor engineering, human laziness, the need to get to product out there and make some money, is plenty enough reasons for why this is so. What doesn't make logical sense is why so many in audio need to live in a fairyland, where the factors that matter in other fields of human endeavour magically disappear - that's a mystery, to me . jabbr 1 Link to comment
semente Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 11 hours ago, The_K-Man said: I know. For audiophiles, great sound is not possible with fewer than 6 drivers per cabinet! It's about how much of the recorded music you wish to listen to. I have a friend who loves classical music but is content with listening through the speakers of his TV set. Some people are a bit more demanding. Audiophiles are interested in the sound quality as much as in the music and just like a racing driver wants to extract the maximum performance from his car to get the best handling and the fastest lap time, they want to get the best and/or the most accurate possible reproduction of the recordings. daverich4 1 "Science draws the wave, poetry fills it with water" Teixeira de Pascoaes HQPlayer Desktop / Mac mini → Intona 7054 → RME ADI-2 DAC FS (DSD256) Link to comment
matthias Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 13 hours ago, The_K-Man said: I know. For audiophiles, great sound is not possible with fewer than 6 drivers per cabinet! For me, two-way systems are best, maybe with an additional sub woofer. Matt "I want to know why the musicians are on stage, not where". (John Farlowe) Link to comment
semente Posted January 19, 2019 Share Posted January 19, 2019 14 hours ago, The_K-Man said: I know. For audiophiles, great sound is not possible with fewer than 6 drivers per cabinet! It's not the amount that is important but the number of ways. But you wouldn't know... Try playing a symphony with a single-driver speaker, but listen to the same work live first. "Science draws the wave, poetry fills it with water" Teixeira de Pascoaes HQPlayer Desktop / Mac mini → Intona 7054 → RME ADI-2 DAC FS (DSD256) Link to comment
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