Getting rid of CD's?

[Teresa]

15 hours ago, barrows said:

...I am not aware whether there is CD recycling, anyone?

 

Yes, there is: CD Recycling Center of America

[Audio_ELF]

6 hours ago, DancingSea said:

I'd like to take this opportunity to invite everyone to Maui.  After two weeks of sand, sun and surf, it will not be so important that strangers on the internet have a different opinion than yourself.

Really? Seams like it’s pretty important to you that we understand and accept your views on the legal and moral position on copyright legislation!

[DancingSea]

7 hours ago, Audio_ELF said:

Really? Seams like it’s pretty important to you that we understand and accept your views on the legal and moral position on copyright legislation!

 

Peace. Let's give it all a rest.  May we each find our way to the best of our abilities. 

[foodfiend]

1 minute ago, DancingSea said:

 

Peace. Let's give it all a rest. 

Sounds like a brilliant idea!

 

I don't think OP expected such heated debate over a simple, innocent question...

[agladstone]

31 minutes ago, foodfiend said:

Sounds like a brilliant idea!

 

I don't think OP expected such heated debate over a simple, innocent question...

The OP Definitely didn't! 

It made for some good 'ole fashion debating and entertainment for a few days, but I think it's time to put this thread to rest:) 

[Ralf11]

if you store your old CDs in bookcases along the side walls you can stagger them to act as diffusors

[Bystander]

18 minutes ago, agladstone said:

The OP Definitely didn't! 

It made for some good 'ole fashion debating and entertainment for a few days, but I think it's time to put this thread to rest:) 

Or maybe one can discuss what the OP originally intended the thread to be abput:

 

On 7/30/2017 at 10:24 PM, Grayson64 said:

Well, when I started this thread, it was not meant to generate such a

lengthy discussion on copyright law and ethical handling of music content. It was really about the concept of collecting and letting go.   

 

Why are any of us holding on to physical digital media? I've always thought there would be a market for selling physical albums with literally everything but the actual plastic disc and including a download code with it. This also somewhat fits in with the fact that a non-negligible number of people buy vinyl records (a lot of which come with a download code these days) despite not actually owning a record player. The paper packaging of vinyl records is also much nicer than the frankly distasteful plastic CD jewel cases.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/music/news/half-the-people-buying-vinyl-dont-actually-bother-listening-to-i/

[agladstone]

6 minutes ago, Bystander said:

Or maybe one can discuss what the OP originally intended the thread to be abput:

 

 

Why are any of us holding on to physical digital media? I've always thought there would be a market for selling physical albums with literally everything but the actual plastic disc and including a download code with it. This also somewhat fits in with the fact that a non-negligible number of people buy vinyl records (a lot of which come with a download code these days) despite not actually owning a record player. The paper packaging of vinyl records is also much nicer than the frankly distasteful plastic CD jewel cases.

Interesting idea! (Buy the CD or LP just for the covers, booklets, etc) and have it include the download code for the actual media! 

The problem now that I suspect (my experience with Blu-Ray Audio or CD's that I own that come with a download code), is that the download code is for Lossy MP3 or equivalent! What we need is to be able to buy the LP or CD jacket and booklet only and have a download code for 24bit FLAC files of that Media! That there would be a market for!! (a very small market I'm sure, but it would exist)! 

[foodfiend]

11 minutes ago, agladstone said:

The problem now that I suspect (my experience with Blu-Ray Audio or CD's that I own that come with a download code), is that the download code is for Lossy MP3 or equivalent! What we need is to be able to buy the LP or CD jacket and booklet only and have a download code for 24bit FLAC files of that Media! That there would be a market for!! (a very small market I'm sure, but it would exist)! 

Yup, I am disappointed when I see that the download code is only for mp3s, especially for Blu-Ray audio purchases!

[Bystander]

I've had a few instances of vinyl records coming with a code for a lossless (sometimes even hi-res) download. But too often it is indeed for MP3 versions. Unfortunately you can't really rely on it being one or the other. In some cases, it is specified beforehand that a CD will be included, so you know you'll get lossless versions at least.

[foodfiend]

11 minutes ago, Bystander said:

I've had a few instances of vinyl records coming with a code for a lossless (sometimes even hi-res) download. But too often it is indeed for MP3 versions. Unfortunately you can't really rely on it being one or the other. In some cases, it is specified beforehand that a CD will be included, so you know you'll get lossless versions at least.

From memory, I only got access to hi-res downloads, with Peter Gabriel's vinyl remasters. I also got hi-res downloads with the Blu-Ray audio for Tears For Fears' "Songs from the Big Chair", but unfortunately, no joy for "The Hurting".

[Paul R]

23 hours ago, stuck limo said:

 

Who, besides on this forum and the Hoffman forums, are sitting around having a debate and a moral wrestle with themselves/others over the fact they may or may not be legally able to be playing a file?

 

Who else does this keep up at night? Who is sitting around hesitating before they hit "play" and dreading the fact they may make the wrong decision?

 

And your point is - what exactly?   That if someone takes care to ensure their music collection is legal, they are wasting their time? 

 

So everyone speeds. Pretty much everyone gets a ticket at some time or another too. You play, you pay.  I don't think speeding and/or  getting a ticket keeps people up at night either. 

 

-Paul 

[foodfiend]

@Paul R I have realised that no amount of discourse on this topic (keeping rips after one sells/gives away one's CDs) is going to change the minds of people who already do.

 

While many recognise that it is against the prevailing law, they rationalise that some failure in the law (policing) or the corrupt nature of the music industry (unequal distribution of income), then allows them to disregard the law. While some have also admitted that they are willing to face any consequences, if prosecuted for their actions, others have been painfully silent (I think some of them may go so far as to even support P2P distribution of pirated music, just to spite the music labels).

 

As some have proposed, and I agree to, let us just agree to disagree...

[Ralf11]

"to live outside the law, you must be honest
I know you always say that you agree"

[DancingSea]

3 hours ago, foodfiend said:

While many recognise that it is against the prevailing law, they rationalise that some failure in the law (policing) or the corrupt nature of the music industry (unequal distribution of income), then allows them to disregard the law.

 

Without returning to CD copyright law issues, I believe there is a deeper core.  Its the different natures of laws and morality.   Laws are not always moral.  No matter what society determines is "the law", we must each make a *personal* decision of whether a given law is moral and just - whether we ought to follow it, and what the consequences of not following it are.  

 

Our county has a checkered past of unjust laws (slavery, Jim Crow, civil rights, suffrage, etc etc).  People questioned and defied those laws to bring about substantive change.  Many paid a heavy price, just look at the Civil War.  And many heroes have arisen, Martin Luther King, Gandhi, etc...

 

And that's the core issue.  One's sovereign right to discern, free of any authority, whether or not a law is just.  To rely upon one's innate ability to question, to explore, to find out.  And from that centered point, make their *personal* decision about how to relate.   When we strip the surface layers of society away, we are not robots running on auto pilot.  Each day, each moment we are making choices.

 

And in the discussion of our potentially different conclusions, to remain honest with, yet kind towards our perceived opponent.

[foodfiend]

23 minutes ago, DancingSea said:

And that's the core issue.  One's sovereign right to discern, free of any authority, whether or not a law is just.  To rely upon one's innate ability to question, to explore, to find out.  And from that centered point, make their *personal* decision about how to relate.   When we strip the surface layers of society away, we are not robots running on auto pilot.  Each day, each moment we are making choices.

Well said. I do agree that it is up to each of us to understand the law, and to question and challenge it, if we think it unjust. However, there are those who would want to take advantage of the law (and whatever loopholes that exist) for their own benefit; and simultaneously not taking responsibility for their actions.

 

Like some of us agree, break the law with your eyes wide-open and ready to bear any consequences. Some would try to place the blame on others, and plead personal ignorance or similar, to escape from such prosecution. Hence I believe that we should put it in black and white, lest people claim that we in the forum never warned them of these potential ramifications of their actions.

[Bystander]

1 hour ago, foodfiend said:

Well said. I do agree that it is up to each of us to understand the law, and to question and challenge it, if we think it unjust. However, there are those who would want to take advantage of the law (and whatever loopholes that exist) for their own benefit; and simultaneously not taking responsibility for their actions.

 

What's wrong with that? 

 

Quote

Like some of us agree, break the law with your eyes wide-open and ready to bear any consequences. Some would try to place the blame on others, and plead personal ignorance or similar, to escape from such prosecution. 

 What prosecution? Has anyone ever actually been prosecuted because she held on to digital copies for her own usage of a personal CD collection she sold, even in the US (where it may be against the law)? I'd be flabbergasted. Would you actually cheer on such prosecution? What about if someone destroyed their CDs but held on to digital copies? Am I right in assuming that's when she supposedly loses her usage rights and thus could be similarly prosecuted for keeping digital copies?  I can't even imagine how such a case would ever proceed in practice as it's so different from the act of illegally obtaining (let alone freely sharing) digital music where the point at which you're committing an illegal act is pretty obvious.

[stuck limo]

8 hours ago, Paul R said:

 

And your point is - what exactly?   That if someone takes care to ensure their music collection is legal, they are wasting their time? 

 

 

Yes, that's a GREAT way to put it. Also, fretting over whether someone else's collection is legal is also a big waste of time. Also, it unnecessarily causes fighting on the forums. 

[fheller]

Everything is illegal.

Just build a wall around your Cds.

Is the law legal? Made up by the clowns?

[stuck limo]

8 hours ago, fheller said:

Everything is illegal.

Just build a wall around your Cds.

Is the law legal? Made up by the clowns?

 

Clowns are illegal too!

http://www.businessinsider.com/arrested-wearing-a-clown-mask-2016-10

[Paul R]

21 hours ago, DancingSea said:

 

Without returning to CD copyright law issues, I believe there is a deeper core.  Its the different natures of laws and morality.   Laws are not always moral.  No matter what society determines is "the law", we must each make a *personal* decision of whether a given law is moral and just - whether we ought to follow it, and what the consequences of not following it are.  

 

Our county has a checkered past of unjust laws (slavery, Jim Crow, civil rights, suffrage, etc etc).  People questioned and defied those laws to bring about substantive change.  Many paid a heavy price, just look at the Civil War.  And many heroes have arisen, Martin Luther King, Gandhi, etc...

 

And that's the core issue.  One's sovereign right to discern, free of any authority, whether or not a law is just.  To rely upon one's innate ability to question, to explore, to find out.  And from that centered point, make their *personal* decision about how to relate.   When we strip the surface layers of society away, we are not robots running on auto pilot.  Each day, each moment we are making choices.

 

And in the discussion of our potentially different conclusions, to remain honest with, yet kind towards our perceived opponent.

 

It would wonderful is life was that simple, but it just is not. Life is complex and messy - just like deciding on whether or not an action is moral, legal, something you want to pursue, or something one would much rather not do. For whatever reasons. 

 

When one chooses to live within a community, one gives up many of the rights to individual choice and freedoms - that is the price you pay to be a member of any group. When the group is a diverse, opinionated, and flat out as smart as this group is, the price can become quite steep. You have to give up a lot, but perhaps, just like with any other group, you gain back much more than you give up. 

 

Just my $0.02, and you are welcome to disagree. Just not to insist that I agree with you, or ridicule me because I don't see the plain wisdom on your words. Or believe in Xemu or whatever.  

 

-Paul

[Ralf11]

I suggest you guys submit this question (and the thread) to the THE ETHICIST column that runs in the NY Times.

[beerandmusic]

i doubt there is one person here that doesn't have in their possession at least one copyrighted sound track,video,picture, or movie they didn't pay for.....

[Ralf11]

Hey - can anybody lend me some CDs?

 

 

[paul_riordan]

On 8/20/2017 at 8:58 PM, foodfiend said:

From memory, I only got access to hi-res downloads, with Peter Gabriel's vinyl remasters. I also got hi-res downloads with the Blu-Ray audio for Tears For Fears' "Songs from the Big Chair", but unfortunately, no joy for "The Hurting".

I actually bought the Peter Gabriel vinyl in order to get the high resolution downloads as they are not available elsewhere... One day I will get my turntable setup and listen to some of the vinyl I have bought.... I think it must be at least 15 years since I actually listened to vinyl...