UpTone Audio USB Regen Listening Impressions

[Jud]

My Regen shipped today. I have some thoughts about music I want to listen to with the Regen to test its capabilities (things like flute choirs and strings that can get grainy). What are some specific recordings that Regen users have found to be enhanced by their Regen? Maybe just some categories of music and types of "stressors" to good sound reproduction that the Regen handles well. Want to put it through its paces and therefore would like to spend a few hours training my ears to listen to these recordings on my system before the Regen is installed. Thanks, folks!

 

- Tone: (1) Whatever you've got that is otherwise fairly well recorded but the piano is too "plinky-plinky," if you get an idea what I mean. (If not, ask and I'll be happy to describe further.) (2) Anything with a well recorded acoustic guitar. (3) Whatever you've got, especially classic rock, with a disappointing vocal you remember standing out more on the car radio than it does on your system. (Don Henley, Eagles Hotel California, Rod Stewart....) (4) Whatever you use for a vocal reference (for me, early Beatles, Gillian Welch's The Harrow and the Harvest, Rosanne Cash's The List).

 

- Instrumental line: (1) Jordi Savall's recording of the Brandenburg Concertos. (2) Love in Vain from the Rolling Stones' album "Stripped."

[REShaman]

My Regen shipped today. I have some thoughts about music I want to listen to with the Regen to test its capabilities (things like flute choirs and strings that can get grainy). What are some specific recordings that Regen users have found to be enhanced by their Regen? Maybe just some categories of music and types of "stressors" to good sound reproduction that the Regen handles well. Want to put it through its paces and therefore would like to spend a few hours training my ears to listen to these recordinrgs on my system before the Regen is installed. Thanks, folks!

 

Awaiting my UpTone Audio components and have no experience with Regen green as the Amber will be my first along with JS-2, MMK. Notwithstanding, recommend Miles Davis', Kind Of Blue, as the sessions feature Davis's ensemble sextet, with pianist Bill Evans, drummer Jimmy Cobb, bassist Paul Chambers, and saxophonists John Coltrane and Julian "Cannonball" Adderley. The soundstage is huge. The placement/location of the instruments is quite apparent. As well as my "go-to", Bill Evans' The Complete Village Vanguard Recordings, 1961, Disc 1, HDCD (20Bit). Of course, I could think of a "thousand" other recordings (smile).

 

For female voice, Eva Cassidy, Holly Cole, Diana Krall. Male, Kurt Elling, Kenny Rankin, Lyle Lovett, John Pizzarelli and a thousand others.

 

Enjoy your Regen, and the music,

Richard

[tranz]

...As well as my "go-to", Bill Evans' The Complete Village Vanguard Recordings, 1961, Disc 1, HDCD (20Bit).

 

Hi REShaman,

 

Do you remember how you ripped this one to get back to 20bit? If with DBP, did you flag the +6dB? Thanks

[REShaman]

Hi REShaman,

 

Do you remember how you ripped this one to get back to 20bit? If with DBP, did you flag the +6dB? Thanks

 

Hello tranz,

 

Feeling inadequate (my choice) as I am not technically aware of "how to" accomplish what you queried me. Back in 2011, when I started with computer audio, I merely used XLD (and not Max) at the time I ripped the three (3) disc box set which is a redbook CD (HDCD 20Bit) according to the information accompany the box set.

 

Enjoy the music,

Richard

[kennyb123]

Feeling inadequate (my choice) as I am not technically aware of "how to" accomplish what you queried me. Back in 2011, when I started with computer audio, I merely used XLD (and not Max) at the time I ripped the three (3) disc box set which is a redbook CD (HDCD 20Bit) according to the information accompany the box set.

 

If you would have ripped with dbPoweramp for Windows, you could have ended up with rips that contained extra bits (though padded to 24 bits). The HDCD DSP, when enabled, will decode HDCD.

 

My HDCD rips are all -6dB as a result of this. I'm inferring from tranz' post that there may be a way to offset this.

[tranz]

Hello tranz,

 

Feeling inadequate (my choice) as I am not technically aware of "how to" accomplish what you queried me. Back in 2011, when I started with computer audio, I merely used XLD (and not Max) at the time I ripped the three (3) disc box set which is a redbook CD (HDCD 20Bit) according to the information accompany the box set.

 

Enjoy the music,

Richard

 

Hi Richard,

 

Thanks. Since I had been reading up on HDCD and PM DACs I thought perhaps you had found another way to rip HDCD. You are currently listening to 16bit, but you can use a program like DBPoweramp to squeeze that last bit out of the HDCD. No need to re-rip, you can just use their HDCD decoder on your current rip. Might sound even better.

 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f11-software/hdcd-mac-or-dbpoweramp-mac-20428/

 

Cheers

[REShaman]

If you would have ripped with dbPoweramp for Windows, you could have ended up with rips that contained extra bits (though padded to 24 bits). The HDCD DSP, when enabled, will decode HDCD.

 

My HDCD rips are all -6dB as a result of this. I'm inferring from tranz' post that there may be a way to offset this.

 

Hi Richard,

 

Thanks. Since I had been reading up on HDCD and PM DACs I thought perhaps you had found another way to rip HDCD. You are currently listening to 16bit, but you can use a program like DBPoweramp to squeeze that last bit out of the HDCD. No need to re-rip, you can just use their HDCD decoder on your current rip. Might sound even better.

 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f11-software/hdcd-mac-or-dbpoweramp-mac-20428/

 

Cheers

 

Hello tranz and Kenny,

 

Thank you for the feedback. Yes, I know enough to appreciate that I am HDCD or not, the rip is 16Bit. I merely mentioned 20Bit as pre-rip information about the box set. And thank you for the information about the actual resolution (for accuracy).

 

If I remember correctly, I just thought of a way to play the actual Disc through my W4S Dac2 DSDse which decodes HDCD but that would require I play the physical HDCD disc. Also, Amarra Symphony with iRC, if I remember correctly, decodes HDCD and allows a user to play CD directly through Amarra Symphony. I am recalling (correctly?) all of this from memory so I will need to do my due diligence and research the accuracy of my assertions.

 

I own dbPoweramp for Windows. I am willing to purchase the Mac version which others like Melvin have spoken highly about. I really appreciate the thoughtful replies. These are examples of the best of CA forums and the services we offer each other.

 

Best,

Richard

[Tony Lauck]

If you would have ripped with dbPoweramp for Windows, you could have ended up with rips that contained extra bits (though padded to 24 bits). The HDCD DSP, when enabled, will decode HDCD.

 

My HDCD rips are all -6dB as a result of this. I'm inferring from tranz' post that there may be a way to offset this.

 

The way to offset this is to turn up your volume control when you play back the decoded 24 bit file. You will be getting the full HDCD resolution at this point.

[kennyb123]

The way to offset this is to turn up your volume control when you play back the decoded 24 bit file. You will be getting the full HDCD resolution at this point.

 

Yes of course that's exactly what I do. The downside is that these files are best not being mixed with non-HDCD files in a playlist, particularly when shuffling through it.

[kennyb123]

I own dbPoweramp for Windows. I am willing to purchase the Mac version which others like Melvin have spoken highly about. I really appreciate the thoughtful replies. These are examples of the best of CA forums and the services we offer each other.

 

Note that the Mac version does not include the ability to decode HDCD.

[JohnSwenson]

Anyone had the opportunity to try the Regen with a Melco N1A or N1Z? I have an N1A into a Devialet 200 and I'm looking for a cost-effective upgrade to my Chord Silver Plus USB cable. The Regen gives the intriguing possibility of giving a decent improvement of a 'budget' cable as opposed to splashing out on a more expensive one.

My fear with the Regen is that the Melco is already optimised for clocking/jitter so the benefits may not be so significant. I guess the lower impedance/distance of the Regen to the DAC is going to be positive though. If a USB data stream is already pretty good jitter/clocking-wise will the Regen improve it over and above a poorer quality stream, or is it (as I'm assuming) going to regenerate the stream regardless of the quality of the input?

 

My experience is that the biggest improvements seem to happen with medium quality input, but that does not mean it is useless with really good input, far from it. With a really good input the REGEN raises it to OMG, WOW! status. Its just that the difference from without to with is less, the ultimate result is better than without.

 

With a really bad source/cable the difference with the REGEN is large, but a really good source without REGEN can be better than a really bad with. In other words the REGEN does not make a really bad system into a really good system, but it can make a medium quality system into a really good one. And it will take really good one and make it into something you have never heard before.

 

Note this is just my experience with what I have heard in several systems with what I have had on hand. YMMV etc.

 

John S.

[Tony Lauck]

My experience is that the biggest improvements seem to happen with medium quality input, but that does not mean it is useless with really good input, far from it. With a really good input the REGEN raises it to OMG, WOW! status. Its just that the difference from without to with is less, the ultimate result is better than without.

 

With a really bad source/cable the difference with the REGEN is large, but a really good source without REGEN can be better than a really bad with. In other words the REGEN does not make a really bad system into a really good system, but it can make a medium quality system into a really good one. And it will take really good one and make it into something you have never heard before.

 

Note this is just my experience with what I have heard in several systems with what I have had on hand. YMMV etc.

 

John S.

 

These are USB hubs, right? So you can gang a number of them, right? If so, does this seem to further reduce the upstream affects of sources and cables?

[The Computer Audiophile]

These are USB hubs, right? So you can gang a number of them, right? If so, does this seem to further reduce the upstream affects of sources and cables?

Kind of like - if one is good, is two better?

 

 

Off topic:

I was talking about my preference for not using a preamp with someone (running direct from DAC to amps) and this person stated his preamp made things sound better. I wondered if two preamps would make it even better :~)

[rickca]

I would like to spend a few hours training my ears to listen to these recordings on my system before the Regen is installed.

It's really easy to hear the difference with REGEN. I don't think you need to do this to be confident in your assessment. It took me about 10 minutes to convince myself this thing was great, and I'm usually pretty skeptical.

 

As far as instrument timbre, I found that flute and cello were remarkably better with the REGEN.

[jiminlogansquare]

Awaiting my UpTone Audio components and have no experience with Regen green as the Amber will be my first along with JS-2, MMK. Notwithstanding, recommend Miles Davis', Kind Of Blue, as the sessions feature Davis's ensemble sextet, with pianist Bill Evans, drummer Jimmy Cobb, bassist Paul Chambers, and saxophonists John Coltrane and Julian "Cannonball" Adderley. The soundstage is huge. The placement/location of the instruments is quite apparent. As well as my "go-to", Bill Evans' The Complete Village Vanguard Recordings, 1961, Disc 1, HDCD (20Bit). Of course, I could think of a "thousand" other recordings (smile).

 

For female voice, Eva Cassidy, Holly Cole, Diana Krall. Male, Kurt Elling, Kenny Rankin, Lyle Lovett, John Pizzarelli and a thousand others.

 

Enjoy your Regen, and the music,

Richard

 

Richard, thank you. Your favorite Bill Evans recording has been among my dearest favorites from a long while before I encountered you and your enthusiasm for it on these forums. That times about three for Kind of Blue. That all said, thank you for the admonishment to listen to these chestnuts critically through the Regen. I am somewhat atwitter with anticipation! Jim

[jiminlogansquare]

It's really easy to hear the difference with REGEN. I don't think you need to do this to be confident in your assessment. It took me about 10 minutes to convince myself this thing was great, and I'm usually pretty skeptical.

 

As far as instrument timbre, I found that flute and cello were remarkably better with the REGEN.

 

Good news. I am the world's leading non-flute playing expert on what a flute can or should sound like in any listening circumstance you can imagine and some you would rather not (1992 Toyota Tercel driving along I-75 toward a fruitless audition in Knoxville, for example.)

[sandyk]

Off topic:

I was talking about my preference for not using a preamp with someone (running direct from DAC to amps) and this person stated his preamp made things sound better. I wondered if two preamps would make it even better :~)

Chris

Many commercial DACs have output stages that are markedly affected by cable vagaries due to not having a low enough output impedance. A high quality Preamp with a low Z output stage may have worthwhile advantages in that case.

At a listening session a while back, we compared digital volume control with a DSD capable W4S with a preamp capable of driving a 75 ohm cable directly, (if needed) and the Preamp route was preferred by all those present.

I do however strongly agree with you about well implemented Digital vs. Vinyl though. (grin)

 

Regards

Alex

[jtwrace]

Listening to Amber now.

[wisnon]

Listening to Amber now.

and?

[jtwrace]

and?

 

It works! Woohoo!!!!

[pl_svn]

how's the colour compared to the JS-2 led?

[jtwrace]

how's the colour compared to the JS-2 led?

 

Bright and luckily I don't see it. Otherwise I'd rip it out. No visible lights for me.

[REShaman]

Chris

Many commercial DACs have output stages that are markedly affected by cable vagaries due to not having a low enough output impedance. A high quality Preamp with a low Z output stage may have worthwhile advantages in that case.

At a listening session a while back, we compared digital volume control with a DSD capable W4S with a preamp capable of driving a 75 ohm cable directly, (if needed) and the Preamp route was preferred by all those present.

I do however strongly agree with you about well implemented Digital vs. Vinyl though. (grin)

 

Regards

Alex

 

Kind of like - if one is good, is two better?

 

 

Off topic:

I was talking about my preference for not using a preamp with someone (running direct from DAC to amps) and this person stated his preamp made things sound better. I wondered if two preamps would make it even better :~)

 

I concur with the findings articulated through Alex's experiences relative to the use of a preamp based on my experience with my W4S Dac 2 DSDse with and without my W4S STP-SE Stage 2 in my system. While awaiting the return of my W4S STP-SE preamp which was sent back to EJ Sarmento for the Stage 2 upgrade, I had extended listening time for the first time with my Dac2 DSDse in stand-alone mode without the preamp. First impressions: Fine and dandy without the preamp. Different? Yes! Different better? To be determined.

 

With the return of my W4S STP-SE now with a Stage 2 upgrade to my system, the difference in SQ, bass response, volume control and all the characteristics we use to discern high quality SQ attributes, the difference was apparent with the preamp reinstated. Different? Yes! Different better? In my opinion, discernibly different better. However subjective my assessment. I could be misguided but one preamp proved adequate for my preferences.

 

Whether one or preamps in a system was meant as humor, sarcasm, irony, an antidote/challenge for a rational perference, I feel no need to contradict Chris Connacker's preference or anyone's preference for a system-less preamp in the chain as I never argue with perception. What could I possibly do or offer to prove or disprove the correctness of his assessment and with no desire to do so? Too much of a good thing is enough in moderation. And for me, the music's the thing. The equipment seduces.

 

Richard, thank you. Your favorite Bill Evans recording has been among my dearest favorites from a long while before I encountered you and your enthusiasm for it on these forums. That times about three for Kind of Blue. That all said, thank you for the admonishment to listen to these chestnuts critically through the Regen. I am somewhat atwitter with anticipation! Jim

 

Jim, my apologies for omiiting reference to Wynton Kelly on the Kind Of Blue album. He's a wonderful jazz pianist. The performances of Evans and Kelly as well as Adderley and Coltrane, Chambers, Cobb, Davis are the masters that rendered this album at it's level of magnificence. My slight was unintentional. Hoping the techniques and musicality of all those artists will be even more focused with the addition of the Regen Amber to your system. How that compares to the Regen Green is to be discovered. As with preamps, I am guessing one Regen will suffice. But I am open to possibilities (smile).

 

I am green with envy in the best possible sense for the delivery of your Regen Amber and contribution to your enjoyment of the music while I await the delvery of my UpTone Audio components whenever that will be.

 

Enjoy the music,

Richard

[kennyb123]

REGEN in place easily between my Aries any Mytek DAC. I've been really impressed with the improvements I've been hearing. Most remarkable is the improvement in clarity and realism.

 

I'll post more detailed impressions later. I'm having too much fun listening now.

[wisnon]

It works! Woohoo!!!!

cop out!