LUMIN - Audiophile Network Music Player

[NikosTsaf]

52 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

Following the recent changes to the Lumïn app I will have to review my plans.

    

I was close to buy a Lumïn U2 Mini and the idea was to use only one app to control the U2 Mini and the SOtM sMS200 dedicated to my headphones system, not to mention a couple of systems in my kitchen and bedroom based on raspberry/RoPieeeXL.

   
Unfortunately Lumïn decided to “close the door” to the use of their app with OpenHome compatible systems, since last 8.2 update (for iOS/iPadOS) the app doesn’t work anymore with

• Bubbleupnpserver 
• SOtM sMS200 MPD&Dlna with OpenHome enabled
• Raspberry/RoPieeeXL UPNP&DLNA with OpenHome support enabled

This is a real shame and going with a Lumïn U2 Mini would mean to use different apps to control different systems, this eliminates one of the big advantages of using a Lumïn streamer

.

At this point the choice will likely be a Innuos Pulse line streamer.

.

It is also regrettable that @wklie hastily dismissed the problem by claiming that nothing had changed and that the app works with Linn devices, that could be fine but who cares? A real shame, and hardly understandable, since until yesterday Peter had always been very helpful.

 

 

Does lumin u1 mini still provides UpNp playback software ?

[Nicoben45]

Lumin has always provided an Openhome playback software that could work with all Openhome solutions in the market, the Lumin App is not a upnp playback software, it can manage to work with upnp hardwares if they are Openhome compatible, or Openhome transformed (the work of Bubbleupnp server for example). 
 

So yes the Lumin App work well with the U1mini of course, because all Lumin are Openhome streamers, and the Lumin App is an Openhome software. But with the two last updates of the Lumin app, the app have a problem with other openhome softwares and hardwares (non Lumin and Linn ones). 

[wklie]

4 hours ago, NikosTsaf said:

Does lumin u1 mini still provides UpNp playback software ?

 

Lumin hardware supports UPnP and OpenHome playback, so you can use non-Lumin UPnP control points such as JRiver or mConnect.

 

Lumin app is OpenHome only and has extra features for Lumin hardware such as Tidal and Lumin hardware settings, Lumin firmware upgrade, cloud sync of playlists, etc.

[wklie]

5 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

It is also regrettable that @wklie hastily dismissed the problem by claiming that nothing had changed and that the app works with Linn devices, that could be fine but who cares? A real shame, and hardly understandable, since until yesterday Peter had always been very helpful.

 

I did not say nothing had changed.  I claim it is not a bug of Lumin app.

 

I mentioned Linn not because Linn is more important than other OpenHome renderers, but to prove that:

1. Lumin app pause and other affected operations are still OpenHome compliant; if they were proprietary they would not have worked on Linn hardware

2. It is therefore not a bug of Lumin app.  It is not Lumin app that requires fixing for pause / next / previous actions when using other OpenHome renderers.

[FIndingit]

Surely your $ 14 000 Lumin is worthy of better footers than Cerapuc copies?  May I suggest Ansuz Darkz. 

[stefano_mbp]

13 minutes ago, wklie said:

 

I did not say nothing had changed.  I claim it is not a bug of Lumin app.

 

I mentioned Linn not because Linn is more important than other OpenHome renderers, but to prove that:

1. Lumin app pause and other affected operations are still OpenHome compliant; if they were proprietary they would not have worked on Linn hardware

2. It is therefore not a bug of Lumin app.  It is not Lumin app that requires fixing for pause / next / previous actions when using other OpenHome renderers.

Then something changed … intentionally, without being aware of it … and this is even worse …

I don’t understand why Lumïn app was working fine before updates 8.1/8.2 and now it doesn’t work anymore even if no changes were done in Bubbleupnpserver or RoPieeeXL or in SOtM sMS200 firmware … last Bubbleupnpserver update, 0.9-update43, was released last March 24th 2022 according to the change log.

 

[BlueSkyy]

For what it's worth if, IMHO Lumin thought the X1 needed better footers it probably would have installed them or not provided them at all.  Many companies have decided to not include even a basic power cord or interconnect because they realized they would be headed for the trash bin as a first order of business during any installation.  AC line fuses, on the other hand, I am not so sure.

[DuckToller]

10 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

Then something changed … intentionally, without being aware of it … and this is even worse …

I don’t understand why Lumïn app was working fine before updates 8.1/8.2 and now it doesn’t work anymore even if no changes were done in Bubbleupnpserver or RoPieeeXL or in SOtM sMS200 firmware … last Bubbleupnpserver update, 0.9-update43, was released last March 24th 2022 according to the change log.

 

For a proof of theory, Peter @wklie may provide a firmware 8.0 for you to test and verify that everything is fine with your software installation ? At least it could proof/unproof your assumption/findings ? If you're willing to test and Peter is willing to provide. That may help ...

[stefano_mbp]

@DuckTollerthat’s a great idea … anyway I’m not alone with this issue as you can read in previous posts.

On another forum we are at least three with the same issue.

… and it should be interesting to check the Lumïn Android version as “unfortunately” we are all on Apple devices

[Nicoben45]

24 minutes ago, wklie said:

 

I did not say nothing had changed.  I claim it is not a bug of Lumin app.

 

I mentioned Linn not because Linn is more important than other OpenHome renderers, but to prove that:

1. Lumin app pause and other affected operations are still OpenHome compliant; if they were proprietary they would not have worked on Linn hardware

2. It is therefore not a bug of Lumin app.  It is not Lumin app that requires fixing for pause / next / previous actions when using other OpenHome renderers.

Ok Peter , so you changed something in the 8.1 Lumin app that disable these functions for other openhome products than Lumin and Linn, and now it’s the work for all others to find what you made and correct it in their software and firmware.. Lumin app users will appreciate the subtlety and disingenuousness of such a statement, even if you are within your rights to do so.

 

I have always greatly appreciated the quality of Lumin's follow-up for its firmware and software updates which allowed Lumin users but also everyone to benefit from the application, all in your honor and this has contributed to your brand image with all audiophiles in the world. Today you seem to be choosing the path of the Lumin app only working for Lumin devices, hidden behind openhome standards, it's a shame, and unfortunately could be harmful to your image. I sincerely hope that you will change your mind.
 

Sincerely.

[Nicoben45]

8 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

@DuckTollerthat’s a great idea … anyway I’m not alone with this issue as you can read in previous posts.

On another forum we are at least three with the same issue.

… and it should be interesting to check the Lumïn Android version as “unfortunately” we are all on Apple devices

As I said, the Droid Lumin app work flawlesly with bubble server at home, tested this morning. Of course I am ready to test anything to help, but I am not sure the question is there today… hope I am wrong.

[Easterman]

Hi again, the Lumin App for Android 5.1 works flawlessly for me.

is there a Way to get Lumin app version 8, for iOS as that worked for me?

[NikosTsaf]

1 hour ago, wklie said:

 

Lumin hardware supports UPnP and OpenHome playback, so you can use non-Lumin UPnP control points such as JRiver or mConnect.

 

Lumin app is OpenHome only and has extra features for Lumin hardware such as Tidal and Lumin hardware settings, Lumin firmware upgrade, cloud sync of playlists, etc.

or HQ player embedded in lumin app

[Siddhi]

1 hour ago, FIndingit said:

Biztos, hogy a 14 000 dolláros Luminod jobb lábléceket érdemel, mint a Cerapuc példányok? Hadd ajánljam Ansuz Darkzt. 

I tried a few and there is a small difference (i mean just different, but not better), so the overpriced ansuz, which I can't try before for me is not an option. Anyway thanks for the idea 

[bubbleguuum]

7 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

Following the recent changes to the Lumïn app I will have to review my plans.

    

I was close to buy a Lumïn U2 Mini and the idea was to use only one app to control the U2 Mini and the SOtM sMS200 dedicated to my headphones system, not to mention a couple of systems in my kitchen and bedroom based on raspberry/RoPieeeXL.

   
Unfortunately Lumïn decided to “close the door” to the use of their app with OpenHome compatible systems, since last 8.2 update (for iOS/iPadOS) the app doesn’t work anymore with

• Bubbleupnpserver 
• SOtM sMS200 MPD&Dlna with OpenHome enabled
• Raspberry/RoPieeeXL UPNP&DLNA with OpenHome support enabled

This is a real shame and going with a Lumïn U2 Mini would mean to use different apps to control different systems, this eliminates one of the big advantages of using a Lumïn streamer

.

At this point the choice will likely be a Innuos Pulse line streamer.

.

It is also regrettable that @wklie hastily dismissed the problem by claiming that nothing had changed and that the app works with Linn devices, that could be fine but who cares? A real shame, and hardly understandable, since until yesterday Peter had always been very helpful.

 

 

 

BubbleUPnP dev here.

 

BubbleUPnP Server will need to be updated to work with the new Lumin app.

I will look into it but no promise if/when it will be.

[One and a half]

Slow update saga

 

After adding a superfast wireless network, the behavior of the Lumin app still takes over an hour to add new music. I noticed when the Lumin app was cataloging and finishing (?) the app crashed just after the rescan minimserver rescan started. It can also crash while scanning, the version was 8.2.0 (?), I think.

The Esoteric app counted the albums, left it run overnight to see them all, in the morning, there's nothing to show.

 

Right then.

 

Had enough of this BS. Both Lumin and Esoteric apps are removed from the iPad. I will install the Lumin app to configure the U1, that's about it. Minimserver will also be gone, it serves no purpose. A few months ago I tried an Android app to work with minmserver, picked up the library very quick, but playback was pretty poor. 

 

The music playback system is now Audirvana Origin % Remote) -> UPNP to the Lumin U1, this works SQ wise better than JRiver. A few days ago Origin had an uplift to Version 2.0, indexing is a lot quicker but no cigar. Audirvana Remote isn't bad either, so will stick with this system for the time being.

 

Current chain: Dell 3460 workstation 32GB ECC RAM Windows 10 Pro for Workstations + Audirvana Origin V2.0.0. -> Cat5E network -> DX Filter(s) >EtherRegen A side -> EtherRegen B side -> Lumin U1 > Ifi USB3 Micro -> Accuphase E-450 & DAC-50 -> KEF LS50. The EtherRegen is powered from the original U1 linear PSU (pins 1&2).

Will try to add in the JCAT NET XE and Optimo supply in the chain, need to punch holes, add Keystone wall jacks to make this happen. 

 

[Ropet]

2 hours ago, One and a half said:

Had enough of this BS. Both Lumin and Esoteric apps are removed from the iPad.

How can you be so sure that it is the Lumïn or Esoteric apps that are the problems? Maybe it is. I can't say. What I can say is that I have no issues of what so ever. Both apps works on Android via Xperia and Samsung mobiles and Samsung Galaxy as well over my iPad. 

 

I follow the Lumïn recommendation set up by using MinimServer (in a Synologoy NAS) and ethernet connection to Lumïn U2 Mini (previously U1 Mini). Everything works flawless and direct without delays playing from my NAS, from TuneIn, Qobuz (and previously Tidal as well) in the Lumïn app. Rescan 60,000 files takes about 1 minute and update with new albums max 2-3 minutes. 

 

Maybe there is something else that is the "BS" in your chain? I do not know of course, but if it is the Lumïn / Esoteric app that is the bad guy it should be the same for everyone to give it a BS title. My experience from digital equipment mixing a number of brands and tools is not the best recommendation. It seems there are lack of standards or that everyone are not on their toes and in line when there continuesly are new versions and updates coming out. Last time I experienced this was with my printer (from Windows Vista time) after Windows 11. It ended up with a new one.

[gbr]

9 hours ago, One and a half said:

Slow update saga

 

After adding a superfast wireless network, the behavior of the Lumin app still takes over an hour to add new music. I noticed when the Lumin app was cataloging and finishing (?) the app crashed just after the rescan minimserver rescan started. It can also crash while scanning, the version was 8.2.0 (?), I think.

The Esoteric app counted the albums, left it run overnight to see them all, in the morning, there's nothing to show.

 

Right then.

 

Had enough of this BS. Both Lumin and Esoteric apps are removed from the iPad. I will install the Lumin app to configure the U1, that's about it. Minimserver will also be gone, it serves no purpose. A few months ago I tried an Android app to work with minmserver, picked up the library very quick, but playback was pretty poor. 

 

The music playback system is now Audirvana Origin % Remote) -> UPNP to the Lumin U1, this works SQ wise better than JRiver. A few days ago Origin had an uplift to Version 2.0, indexing is a lot quicker but no cigar. Audirvana Remote isn't bad either, so will stick with this system for the time being.

 

Current chain: Dell 3460 workstation 32GB ECC RAM Windows 10 Pro for Workstations + Audirvana Origin V2.0.0. -> Cat5E network -> DX Filter(s) >EtherRegen A side -> EtherRegen B side -> Lumin U1 > Ifi USB3 Micro -> Accuphase E-450 & DAC-50 -> KEF LS50. The EtherRegen is powered from the original U1 linear PSU (pins 1&2).

Will try to add in the JCAT NET XE and Optimo supply in the chain, need to punch holes, add Keystone wall jacks to make this happen. 

 

Usually I do not use the lumin categories (tabs) to navigate the minimserver content, so I did not recognize that it takes so long until a new album appears. But today I added a new album, did minimserver let do a rescan and checked if the album appears in the artist tab after some minutes. It did not. Even 2 hours later it is not there.

 

But when using the tab with the folder icon to browse the minimserver content directly, the new album can be seen instantly. This is the way I am using always because the meta data of too many tracks on my NAS is rubbish.

 

Also I often notice that the spinner icon in the lumin app is spinning all the time. It seems that I nearly never find it having finished.

[Hypercell]

Hello,

I don’t know if someone else already rise this problem: in the past, I mean 1 year ago more or less, the Lumin app was taking in memory the Qobuz log and pw also for several months. Since long time and after several fw release, I have to log in Qobuz all the time. There is the way to solve this?

thank you

Maurizio

[gbr]

Yes this is the case since the second last version (8.1.0?). The qobuz login pops up, but you can simply ignore it and press the qobuz icon again.

[pl_svn]

close to 4 years with my U1 Mini and only entered my Qobuz login/password when I first set it up

so...  Lumin app is not the culprit

[BlueSkyy]

10 minutes ago, pl_svn said:

close to 4 years with my U1 Mini and only entered my Qobuz login/password when I first set it up

so...  Lumin app is not the culprit

From a wholistic, system-level view, it could be a contributing factor.

[Hypercell]

22 minutes ago, gbr said:

Yes this is the case since the second last version (8.1.0?). The qobuz login pops up, but you can simply ignore it and press the qobuz icon again.

Thank you I will try 👌

 

20 minutes ago, pl_svn said:

close to 4 years with my U1 Mini and only entered my Qobuz login/password when I first set it up

so...  Lumin app is not the culprit

In the past also to me, then it was starting to pop up the Qobuz log in. Meantime I did not change any  hw in my setup, strange

[gbr]

2 hours ago, pl_svn said:

close to 4 years with my U1 Mini and only entered my Qobuz login/password when I first set it up

so...  Lumin app is not the culprit

It started for me after updating the lumin app, so I think the app is the problem. But ok, maybe on qobuz server side something did change. Who knows....

 

But IIRC I did not see the login requester for a while now. So maybe it is fixed in 8.2.0 already?

[One and a half]

10 hours ago, gbr said:

Usually I do not use the lumin categories (tabs) to navigate the minimserver content, so I did not recognize that it takes so long until a new album appears. But today I added a new album, did minimserver let do a rescan and checked if the album appears in the artist tab after some minutes. It did not. Even 2 hours later it is not there.

 

But when using the tab with the folder icon to browse the minimserver content directly, the new album can be seen instantly. This is the way I am using always because the meta data of too many tracks on my NAS is rubbish.

 

Also I often notice that the spinner icon in the lumin app is spinning all the time. It seems that I nearly never find it having finished.

Also to @stefano_mbp, @Ropet, looking at which BS is to blame, IT has many culprits, so which one is guilty?

 

The usual view is the recent folder. Here the time taken to update is where the problem is. As @gbr advises, if the standard folder view is accessed, the new albums are there after the rescan almost immediately can be found. So it takes some time (an hour or more) to add the new albums to the recent folder. and also the album view.

 

As an experiment, again, the Lumin app (V8.2.0) on the iPad Pro was removed and re-indexed.

This time, the total time to collect all 9439 albums, 143559 'items, took about 10 minutes.

Add two new albums, folder view instantaneous after rescan from Minimwatch

Took about another 10 minutes to add the two new albums to the recent and album views.

 

*** WHAT A TURNAROUND **

 

The secret: Removed BitDefender Total Security from the PC which stores the music files. Using the standard Windows Defender and Firewall instead. Minimserver is a severe disk access acivity, with som many files to scan when accesses slowed the Lumin app so much, it ended up with the times as it was.

 

In one way I'm relieved that the slow indexing problem is solved, the other that I paid money for Bitdefender that is supposed to do its job and not cripple and pi$$ about with performance as shown. I doubt I will get my subscription just renewed last month refunded but will try.