T+A DAC 200

[jonniema]

3 hours ago, Mist1Fu said:

Hello everyone,

I’m a new member, but have been reading and following this topic about the DAC-200 and many other posts in the forums. I own a DAC-200 as well and I enjoy very much the quality in all aspects of this device. I wanted to ask OE333 about a change I have noticed since updating the firmware a day ago; the relay doesn’t click anymore when changing resolution of music files, has this changed since the latest firmwares? When I bought the DAC it was on Ver.1.11 and up until the update yesterday the relay clicked for any single track or file with different resolutions, but I just noticed when I started listening to music that it doesn’t click at all but still shows the change in resolution.

Thanks in advance to any reply.

http://updates.ta-hifi.de/firmware/auto_download/DAC200/docs/versions_DAC200.txt

 

Not the complete answer and for sure OE333 would know all details, but the change log does mention a change to the firmware that reduces relay clicking after v1.12

[The Computer Audiophile]

41 minutes ago, linuxprophet said:

I have taken my Hifi Rose RA180... and boxed it like a Model 1 Cylon.

Not surprising. HiFi Rose has put in a nice effort on its products, but they are still severely lacking compared to the best available. 

[OE333]

51 minutes ago, linuxprophet said:

I updated my DAC200 and HA200 via the wonderful MP200 and also noticed the relay clicks have stopped. To be honest, I was a little scared of the clicks, even though I believe they are relays (stand to be corrected).

 

The updates are fine and the devices purr like none other. I am simply so pleased to have purchased such delectable units.

 

 

 

Short answer: yes, you are right, the output-mute relay clicks were minimized in the latest firmware.

 

Longer answer: In the older firmware the output was muted (by relay) on every format change.

It has shown, that such muting was unnecessary on many occasions - like when there is only a change of sample rate.

So in the newer firmware the mute relay will only switch (and click) when there is a DSD <--> PCM change.

A click in this case can not be avoided, because here the whole analog signal path changes and to prevent any pops in the output signal a short muting is required.

Btw.: The reason for using a mute relay is that we at T+A believe that this is the best option for muting analog signals. All semiconductor mute circuits would increase the distortion. So we have decided to use an old fashioned (hernetically sealed gold contact) relay and accept the click in favour of lower distortion.

[jrsub]

4 hours ago, Mist1Fu said:

Hello everyone,

I’m a new member, but have been reading and following this topic about the DAC-200 and many other posts in the forums. I own a DAC-200 as well and I enjoy very much the quality in all aspects of this device. I wanted to ask OE333 about a change I have noticed since updating the firmware a day ago; the relay doesn’t click anymore when changing resolution of music files, has this changed since the latest firmwares? When I bought the DAC it was on Ver.1.11 and up until the update yesterday the relay clicked for any single track or file with different resolutions, but I just noticed when I started listening to music that it doesn’t click at all but still shows the change in resolution.

Thanks in advance to any reply.

My DAC 200 has always only had the solenoid click when switching between PCM and DSD tracks.  Within PCM or DSD a resolution change has no click.  Also, how did you do the firmware upgrade?

[OE333]

1 minute ago, jrsub said:

My DAC 200 has always only had the solenoid click when switching between PCM and DSD tracks.  Within PCM or DSD a resolution change has no click.

 

... then you already have the new firmware.

[linuxprophet]

Response from those who should know.

 

Merci.

[Mist1Fu]

25 minutes ago, OE333 said:

 

... then you already have the new firmware.

And the change of intermittent input light when there’s no signal or audio is part of the update as well then?

[OE333]

11 hours ago, Mist1Fu said:

And the change of intermittent input light when there’s no signal or audio is part of the update as well then?

 

... this seems to be an unintended change in the latest firmware.

The blinking light will come back with the next FW update - promised ;)

[luisma]

Hi everyone have a question.

 

Manual page 43 at the bottom says to use "either balanced XLR or unbalanced RCA connection. Do not use both types of connection at the same time."

 

Then next page 44 says "if the two outputs should be used together the input impedance of both connected devices must be at least 10 kOhm"

 

Does this means the two outputs be used at the same time with the impedance ratio consideration?

 

[OE333]

2 hours ago, luisma said:

Manual page 43 at the bottom says to use "either balanced XLR or unbalanced RCA connection. Do not use both types of connection at the same time."

 

Then next page 44 says "if the two outputs should be used together the input impedance of both connected devices must be at least 10 kOhm"

 

Does this means the two outputs be used at the same time with the impedance ratio consideration?

 

You can safely use both outputs together at the same time. No problem, nothing will break.

 

The impedance should be >10kOhms, because the RCA output is fed from the positive branch of the balanced output amplifier.

So any device connected to the RCA output will cause a slight imbalance of the XLR load resistance.

As long as the impedance of the device connected to the RCA socket is high enough this effect can be neglected. Hence the 10kOhms recommendation.

 

Even if you connect a RCA device with 1kOhm input resistance, it will not break anything nor will it cause audible effects.

 

 

[luisma]

25 minutes ago, OE333 said:

You can safely use both outputs together at the same time. No problem, nothing will break.

Thank you for answering so promptly.

[Allan F]

On 12/20/2022 at 2:40 AM, OE333 said:

There is good news about the PC based firmware update for the DAC200.

T+A is willing to support this and they will offer the required USB -> E2Link  programming adaptor through the T+A webshop.

 

I will give an update on this topic as soon as all details are clear.

 

Any recent news about when this will be available?

[azabu]

T+A DAC 200 is now on my short list. 

 

 

[lsantista]

21 hours ago, OE333 said:

any device connected to the RCA output will cause a slight imbalance of the XLR load resistance.

even if the RCA device is completly powered off? (btw that device is a single ended preamp, so Im using the Line output)

 

[lsantista]

DA 200 received Thursday. So far, enjoying it very much.

@Miska would you recommend NOS1 or NOS2 for using with HQP?

[linuxprophet]

Congratulations @isantista: I still relish the unboxing experience!

Personally, I use the NOS2 setting with HQP with Ubuntu 22.04 LTS. Tried NOS1 but... na!

[jonniema]

I also prefer NOS2 mode. To me it sounds the best with good resampling (even when upsampled by roon)

[Miska]

3 hours ago, lsantista said:

DA 200 received Thursday. So far, enjoying it very much.

@Miska would you recommend NOS1 or NOS2 for using with HQP?

 

You should use only DSD output mode with HQPlayer. This setting is not applicable in that case. There's just the lowpass setting of 60 kHz or wide. I use 60 kHz on my loudspeaker system on DA 200, and wide mode with Solitaire P headphones on HA 200.

 

[linuxprophet]

Confession time...

I've been toying around with NOS2 on the DAC 200 and importing a BNC signal to it from the Chord M-scaler connected to the Oppo BDP203, just to see what it would sound like with CDDA up sampled to 176.4K.

 

I'm sure the true expert would probably cringe at the thought but...

[agisthos]

20 hours ago, azabu said:

T+A DAC 200 is now on my short list. 

 

 

 

I have a very good PC audiophile setup, which allows one to hear comparative differences on youtube equipment tests quite easily. I thought the T&A 200 was the winner here, on most of the tracks at least. And its the cheapest of them all?

[lsantista]

sorry for the question, but how do I do firmware update? the menu on the device shows Ver 1.03 and USB ver 1.10

latest USB driver installed on PC

[jonniema]

36 minutes ago, lsantista said:

sorry for the question, but how do I do firmware update? the menu on the device shows Ver 1.03 and USB ver 1.10

latest USB driver installed on PC

The simper way is to connect DAC200 to a MP200 connected to the internet (you can try asking your dealer if you are lucky they have one currently in stock)

[linuxprophet]

I concur...

 

Updating firmware via PCs is a dodgy enterprise at best. Anything could go wrong, from sudden power drops, to missed connections, to Cylons sucking the power dry at the worst moment.

 

Even using the MP200, I had to run the process a couple of times for each of the DAC200 and HA200, but the MP200 is very well designed, and best suited to carry out the job where a failure occurs.

 

As @jonniema suggested, if you don't own an MP200, please find a dealer who does, and take your prized device there for an update.

 

I especially would not attempt this update with any version of MS Windows... IMHO!

[lsantista]

huh, it didn't have to be like that, or did it? I mean, the physical rj45 for a stable internet connection is there. right?

 

 

[linuxprophet]

Just my thoughts on the subject. I usually treat any firmware updates with great caution, given some past bad experiences over the years.

 

It's only a personal opinion and not a professional one of which I'm no authority.