EtherREGEN: Installation, Usage, Difficulty, Questions thread

[Superdad]

1 hour ago, Mike Rubin said:

Alex, I still have the question I raised with you in my email about the SPF port issue.

Hi Mike:

It is Sunday so I’m still in bed on my iPad looking at the forum and skimming the e-mail mountain (until I get up and start testing/burning in a whole batch of JS-2s so they can go out before the 120 EtherREGEN boards arrive this week and all heck breaks loose).

You wrote:

 

”I can reach my optical rendu over the web, it shows there is a DAC connection, and it appears as an end point to HQ Player, DLNA/UPnP, and LMS, I can't get it to play music when I press "play" in any of the control apps.  The music progress bar might appear to make three or four seconds of progress before reverting to the start or it might not move at all. This is functionality that I had but no longer do.”

 

So that is just with an Ethernet CAT cable network feed into the ‘B’ port of the EtherREGEN and optical/SFP connection from the ‘A’ side to your opticalRendu?

If so, where on your network is your music server? And from what is your network router feed coming from?

Is the behavior any different if—as a test—you run your network feed into one of the other ‘A’-side ports of the EtherREGEN?

 

I’m posting this here because I don’t have any other  ideas for you at the moment. Perhaps someone else here will.

[Mike Rubin]

44 minutes ago, Superdad said:

If so, where on your network is your music server? And from what is your network router feed coming from?

Is the behavior any different if—as a test—you run your network feed into one of the other ‘A’-side ports of the EtherREGEN?

 

I’m posting this here because I don’t have any other  ideas for you at the moment. Perhaps someone else here will.

Sorry, Alex. Didn't mean to rush you.  That was just a reminder that the comments here were helpful but that I still have a threshold issue when you have a chance. 

 

The server is a NUC10i7 in my basement office. It is connected directly to the router in the office. The EtherRegen is upstairs, connected to a wall plate connected to a switch, to which the router is connected via a basement wall plate. 

 

I have run the LAN cable into both sides of the EtherRegen while troubleshooting. I now understand why the optical module doesn't work on the B side, but it connects the rendu to the network when on the A side, regardless of which side the LAN cable hits. 

 

I am concerned that the SFP port on the EtherRegen isn't working now because moving the SFP to the optical module at least gets the rendu to join the network.  

 

For now, I have moved my ultrarendu (copper, not optical) upstairs and the LAN cable is connected to it directly. It is working well, although it is not as good as the Signature SE is. To troubleshoot, I will connect the optical module and Sig SE to my desktop DAC. If that works, I will ask you to have a look at the EtherRegen itself. 

 

Thanks for posting here and for your help. 

[agladstone]

5 hours ago, R1200CL said:

You should probably switch on flow control. 
And assign fixed IP addresses to server and endpoint. 

 

Just to be 100% correct. The moat doesn’t have any function or relevance between ports on A side. 
What can and cannot flow between the SFP and a RJ45 vs between RJ45’s is another thing. 
It works as an FMC, but isn’t 100% equal to the opticalModule as an example, the clock is behind the moat.

(which for most shouldn’t matter at all). 
 

I think you yourself is the best person to answer the question. If I understand you correctly, you’re afraid of more network traffic will degrade the SQ. Interesting topic.
 

Not to mention EtherRegen can in theory be managed, but I don’t know if opening for that would allow for controlling where traffic is routed. 

 

However if remove the Aurender from B side, and attach the AppleTV to it, you may find out you need to purchase another EtherRegen 😂

(Better picture has been reported, and photos posted as documentation). 

 

My understanding is Roon need access to internet. Try to start Roon without internet. Maybe I’m wrong. (Assuming you don’t use any streaming services). Of cause you will miss a lot of meta data. 
 

Do you really like to know the full answer to that question? 😂

 

I think I will take your advice and disconnect the EtherRegen from my Aurender B side and try it direct to the Apple TV 4K and see if it makes a big enough improvement to tempt me to get a second EtherRegen! 

I just wish someone had an aftermarket kit or solution available to bypass the Apple TV 4K’s internal Switch Mode Power Supply so I could use an external LPS like I used to my my older generation Amazon FireTV Box. :) 

[Superdad]

16 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

The server is a NUC10i7 in my basement office. It is connected directly to the router in the office. The EtherRegen is upstairs, connected to a wall plate connected to a switch, to which the router is connected via a basement wall plate.

Well that's a lot of hops.  If you were using Roon I would say that is for sure your source of the trouble.  Still might be.

 

16 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

I have run the LAN cable into both sides of the EtherRegen while troubleshooting. I now understand why the optical module doesn't work on the B side, but it connects the rendu to the network when on the A side, regardless of which side the LAN cable hits. 

I'd like to leave the opticalModule out of the equation for troubleshooting. (I can only support one product at a time. )

I asked "Is the behavior any different if—as a test—you run your network feed into one of the other ‘A’-side ports of the EtherREGEN?"  Please let us know the answer to that. 

 

16 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

I am concerned that the SFP port on the EtherRegen isn't working now because moving the SFP to the optical module at least gets the rendu to join the network.

But you reported: "I can reach my optical rendu over the web, it shows there is a DAC connection, and it appears as an end point to HQ Player, DLNA/UPnP, and LMS..."

The SFP of your EtherREGEN is fine. While we have seen some SFP transceiver module incompatibilities (electrical or mechanical), we have never had an instance where an SFP port did not work--the entire 'A' side and entire EtherREGEN would be down then.

 

16 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

For now, I have moved my ultrarendu (copper, not optical) upstairs and the LAN cable is connected to it directly. It is working well, although it is not as good as the Signature SE is. To troubleshoot, I will connect the optical module and Sig SE to my desktop DAC. If that works, I will ask you to have a look at the EtherRegen itself. 

 

Thanks for posting here and for your help. 

Happy to check out your unit but I'd be more interested in you moving some things around and making test with other cables, transceivers, software, and just network web surfing tests. When we test EtherREGENs here, we are not using music players, Rendus, or anything audio.  We are testing that it works as a switch in all modes and with all connections. As long as it does so without any glitches we call that good.  And since there are plenty of optcalRendu (and Lumin X1) EtherREGEN owners using B>A for SFP output, we are confident in compatibility there.

 

Really sorry that this has become a frustrating situation for you Mike.  Computer audio can be a pain but we don't want it to spoil the fun of playing music!

 

Best,

Alex C.

[Mike Rubin]

6 minutes ago, Superdad said:

Well that's a lot of hops.  If you were using Roon I would say that is for sure your source of the trouble.  Still might be.

 

>> I don't disagree, but haven't had a similar issue for the last two years using the identical setup, so I am a bit skeptical.

 

6 minutes ago, Superdad said:

I'd like to leave the opticalModule out of the equation for troubleshooting. (I can only support one product at a time. )

I asked "Is the behavior any different if—as a test—you run your network feed into one of the other ‘A’-side ports of the EtherREGEN?"  Please let us know the answer to that. 

>> Before introducing the optical module to the system upstairs, I tried that during my troubleshooting.  I will try it again.

 

 

6 minutes ago, Superdad said:

But you reported: "I can reach my optical rendu over the web, it shows there is a DAC connection, and it appears as an end point to HQ Player, DLNA/UPnP, and LMS..."

 

The SFP of your EtherREGEN is fine. While we have seen some SFP transceiver module incompatibilities (electrical or mechanical), we have never had an instance where an SFP port did not work--the entire 'A' side and entire EtherREGEN would be down then.

 

>>Just so we are clear, the SFP allows the rendu to see the network when it is fed by the optical module but not when the SFP is connected to the etherRegen's SFP port.  If that makes no difference, I will try that all again, but I have been troubleshooting from that setup for days now.

 

6 minutes ago, Superdad said:

Happy to check out your unit but I'd be more interested in you moving some things around and making test with other cables, transceivers, software, and just network web surfing tests. When we test EtherREGENs here, we are not using music players, Rendus, or anything audio.  We are testing that it works as a switch in all modes and with all connections. As long as it does so without any glitches we call that good.  And since there are plenty of optcalRendu (and Lumin X1) EtherREGEN owners using B>A for SFP output, we are confident in compatibility there.

 

>>I can test with other ethernet cables, but, if I want to test other transceivers and optical cables, I have to buy those as I don't know where I put the ones I had before I purchased the current Finistars.  I guess I can do that.

What other software would be a good test?  I have used JRiver, Audirvana, MinimServer, Volumio, Roon, and HQP Desktop and Embedded, controlled by my desktop computer, by web interfaces, on an Android phone, and on an iPad, as the case may be, for troubleshooting all this. 

I do know that B>A can work beautifully as it was great before a few days ago.

 

20 minutes ago, Superdad said:

Really sorry that this has become a frustrating situation for you Mike.  Computer audio can be a pain but we don't want it to spoil the fun of playing music!

 

>>As I have to tell my wife every time she sees me spend hours troubleshooting this stuff, we no longer just put a CD in a tray, close it up, and press "play."  I don't feel like a network novice, but I definitely feel that my knowledge limits and capabilities are being tested.

 

[Chorus]

As a classically untrained, technically challenged person and being totally inept at all electronic pursuits

I have a question. I own an Uptown Audio Etherregen. What is it actually doing between the ethernet line from the router and my streamer? I know it warms up nicely. I bought it because a reviewer I know said to. 

But what about the other devices companies are marketing as "Add Ons" to a digital system?

Green computers, clockers, DDCs. Is there an end or are you designing that product now?

If so please add me to the wait list. 

Yes I know it's tone. Just Josh'in y'all!!

[mattjtaylor2809]

Hello Everyone,

 

Interesting thread, kinda making my head hurt but interesting none the less.

 

So, If I were to go down the EtherREGEN path & use a SFP module into the A side...what do people suggest as a good SPF switch?

 

I've heard about Mikrotick, Ubiquite but which model & what SFP module is compatible with the ER?

 

My modem is the otherside of the house so years ago I ran 25 mtrs of Cat 5 to my music room into a standard TP link 100mbps 8 port switch. I could run fiber from my office to my music room but I'd have to get a professional in so I would prefer to update the network from within my music room.

 

I have already installed x2 MC110's with about a 1 mtr of fibre infront of my Innous Zen Mini streamer which did seem to lower the noise floor & remore some digita sheen from my streamed music.

 

From my Innous Streamer (which is also my ROON Core) it's connected directly to my DAC (PS Audio DirectStream Jnr) via the bridged Ethernet out from the streamer.

 

 

So....where would you place the ER?

 

1. just before the Innous, i.e. replacing the MC110's with the ER being fed via SFP & feeding the B side into the LAN input (output to DAC remains the same although I'm also looking into a DDC like the x-matrix or gustard U18 to feed my DAC via I2S?

 

OR

 

2. after the Innous sitting infront of my PS Audio DAC.....(don't think i can use SFP in this config?

 

Looking at the ER site, they suggest option 1 although I would use the SFP input

 

 

Cheers all

Matt

 

 

[ericuco]

13 minutes ago, mattjtaylor2809 said:

I've heard about Mikrotick, Ubiquite but which model & what SFP module is compatible with the ER?

The Mikrotik 610-8G-2S+IN should work along with most Finisar SPF’s.

[mattjtaylor2809]

Thanks, was actually looking at this model.

 

Finisar SPF's will be compatible with both the Microtek & SPF input on the EtherREGEN?

[GryphonGuy]

On 1/16/2022 at 10:23 AM, mfsoa said:

Thanks again Alex. I remain confused but that's OK.

 

My Roon PC is the only source of audio to my system that uses the network.

 

I can't see how, if I connect my Roon Core PC to the eRegen directly via coax, while also connecting fiber from the eRegen to my router, that the fiber is used at all.

 

How does the data know to leave to PC, go down the coax to the eRegen, NOT go to the B side but instead go back up  the fiber to the router, then back down the fiber and only then cross over to the B side?!?

 

I can't see how the direct wired path from PC to eRegen is not the path that the signal takes when travelling from PC to eRegen 

 

 

 

The Coax connection (BNC Plug) is ONLY for an optional 10MHz timing signal. No music data flows via that connection. Only the RJ45 outlets on A and B sides or the fibre socket on the A side transmit/receive digital music signals (well just ethernet signals really).

 

For music to benefit from the EtherRegen's "magic" a sender of the music (Roon Core PC), for example, must be on 1 side (say "A" side) and the receiver (DAC) must be on the opposite side (in our example, the "B" side).

 

Regards

GG

[ericuco]

1 hour ago, mattjtaylor2809 said:

Finisar SPF's will be compatible with both the Microtek & SPF input on the EtherREGEN?

l don’t have a eR so can’t say for certain but Finisar’s have worked for me without fail in several different components … opticalRendu, fitlet2, Intel NIC, QNAP switch, Mikrotik switches, plus other off-brand switches.

[Mike Rubin]

8 hours ago, Superdad said:

Well that's a lot of hops.  If you were using Roon I would say that is for sure your source of the trouble.  Still might be.

 

I'd like to leave the opticalModule out of the equation for troubleshooting. (I can only support one product at a time. )

I asked "Is the behavior any different if—as a test—you run your network feed into one of the other ‘A’-side ports of the EtherREGEN?"  Please let us know the answer to that. 

 

But you reported: "I can reach my optical rendu over the web, it shows there is a DAC connection, and it appears as an end point to HQ Player, DLNA/UPnP, and LMS..."

The SFP of your EtherREGEN is fine. While we have seen some SFP transceiver module incompatibilities (electrical or mechanical), we have never had an instance where an SFP port did not work--the entire 'A' side and entire EtherREGEN would be down then.

 

Happy to check out your unit but I'd be more interested in you moving some things around and making test with other cables, transceivers, software, and just network web surfing tests. When we test EtherREGENs here, we are not using music players, Rendus, or anything audio.  We are testing that it works as a switch in all modes and with all connections. As long as it does so without any glitches we call that good.  And since there are plenty of optcalRendu (and Lumin X1) EtherREGEN owners using B>A for SFP output, we are confident in compatibility there.

 

Really sorry that this has become a frustrating situation for you Mike.  Computer audio can be a pain but we don't want it to spoil the fun of playing music!

 

Best,

Alex C.

Stop me if you have heard this one before, but I again, by some miracle, have the EtherRegen feeding the Sig SE over the SFP on the B side. I plugged it in again late this afternoon and it decided to work. I didn't do a thing differently than I did during the two years in which the EtherRegen fed the SE before the last few days or what I did during my troubleshooting the last four days, so luckily I was insane enough to believe that I could do something the same way and achieve a differing outcome. 

 

Fingers crossed now. 🤞

[PhilSLG]

I think I've had the same experience - I previously posted that I thought my etherREGEN had died, then attributed it to the audiophile Ethernet cable, as a no-name cable got it working again.  I have subsequently tested the audiophile ethernet cable with my computer and got it surfing the net, so I replaced it with the etherREGEN and it worked.  Next day it didn't, but re-starting the etherREGEN got it working again.  Not sure what the go is, but it is working at the moment. 

[Iving]

Just a 2c which may be helpful ...

The order in which devices are booted may determine whether things work or apparent / mysterious problem.

Something to do with assignment of IP addresses?

In my system - I think - eR likes to boot last.

[Iving]

Startech SFP1000LXST is good in my eR A Side:

[FrankMA]

9 hours ago, mattjtaylor2809 said:

Thanks, was actually looking at this model.

 

Finisar SPF's will be compatible with both the Microtek & SPF input on the EtherREGEN?

I don't have the Microtek but the Finisar's below have worked perfectly between my OpticalModule and ER:

 

FTLX1475D3BTL

FTLF1318P3BTL

FTLF1421P1BTL-NN

[mfsoa]

Gryphon and everyone else,

 

I misspoke - I meant "wired ethernet" when I said coax. Sorry for the error.

 

I still think that if I use wired ethernet directly from my PC to the eRegen, then that is the path the signal from my PC will take, and not use a fiber that goes from eRegen to a router. 

 

I will wait for my new internet service and house re-networking to evaluate further.

 

My FTLF1318P3BTL work fine w/ the eRegen.

[Mike Rubin]

7 hours ago, Iving said:

Just a 2c which may be helpful ...

The order in which devices are booted may determine whether things work or apparent / mysterious problem.

Something to do with assignment of IP addresses?

In my system - I think - eR likes to boot last.

I keep mine on all the time, rebooting only when I have to restart both the DAC and the renderer. My renderer always requires the DAC to go on first and it needs its reserved IP address before it can be used at all. In that scenario, I have to reboot the EtherRegen first. 

 

That said, I just spent four days trying to get it to pass a signal. I will try booting it last next time. 

[Iving]

52 minutes ago, Mike Rubin said:

I keep mine on all the time, rebooting only when I have to restart both the DAC and the renderer. My renderer always requires the DAC to go on first and it needs its reserved IP address before it can be used at all. In that scenario, I have to reboot the EtherRegen first. 

 

That said, I just spent four days trying to get it to pass a signal. I will try booting it last next time. 

 

Please do post back if this works!

[Mike Rubin]

1 hour ago, Iving said:

 

Please do post back if this works!

Will do, but I hope never to have to worry about the issue again. 🤣

[Mihaylov]

20 hours ago, mattjtaylor2809 said:

Hello Everyone,

 

Interesting thread, kinda making my head hurt but interesting none the less.

 

So, If I were to go down the EtherREGEN path & use a SFP module into the A side...what do people suggest as a good SPF switch?

 

I've heard about Mikrotick, Ubiquite but which model & what SFP module is compatible with the ER?

 

My modem is the otherside of the house so years ago I ran 25 mtrs of Cat 5 to my music room into a standard TP link 100mbps 8 port switch. I could run fiber from my office to my music room but I'd have to get a professional in so I would prefer to update the network from within my music room.

 

I have already installed x2 MC110's with about a 1 mtr of fibre infront of my Innous Zen Mini streamer which did seem to lower the noise floor & remore some digita sheen from my streamed music.

 

From my Innous Streamer (which is also my ROON Core) it's connected directly to my DAC (PS Audio DirectStream Jnr) via the bridged Ethernet out from the streamer.

 

 

So....where would you place the ER?

 

1. just before the Innous, i.e. replacing the MC110's with the ER being fed via SFP & feeding the B side into the LAN input (output to DAC remains the same although I'm also looking into a DDC like the x-matrix or gustard U18 to feed my DAC via I2S?

 

OR

 

2. after the Innous sitting infront of my PS Audio DAC.....(don't think i can use SFP in this config?

 

Looking at the ER site, they suggest option 1 although I would use the SFP input

 

 

Cheers all

Matt

 

 

I'm using this configuration (green lines):

 

 

 

NUC with two ethernet controllers (one is native, the second is usb ethernet adapter), one controller for communication with the Internet, the second for communication with DAC via ip forwarding to isolate network traffic between roon server and DAC.

[mattjtaylor2809]

Hello Everyone,

 

I've ordered a 2nd hand ER from a fellow Hi-Fi nut here in Australia but he only has the US plug. If I were to buy a basic iFi low noise power supply, which 7, 9 or 12V version do people suggest as the amps are a little higher across the range than what's suggested in the ER manual?

 

 

 

Or any other alternatives that don't cost a bomb as I'm reading that a LPS doesn't make a big diff.

 

Cheers

Matt

 

[FIndingit]

@mattjtaylor2809 I strongly recommend i2s connection to your PS Audio jr. It’s by far the best input in it. 

[mattjtaylor2809]

Hello @FIndingit

 

Yes, working on that too, maybe via x-matrix 2 or Gustard U18.

 

Just trying to work out what low noise power supply is the best fit & value for money.

 

Cheers

Matt

 

[GryphonGuy]

51 minutes ago, mattjtaylor2809 said:

Hello Everyone,

 

I've ordered a 2nd hand ER from a fellow Hi-Fi nut here in Australia but he only has the US plug. If I were to buy a basic iFi low noise power supply, which 7, 9 or 12V version do people suggest as the amps are a little higher across the range than what's suggested in the ER manual?

 

 

 

Or any other alternatives that don't cost a bomb as I'm reading that a LPS doesn't make a big diff.

 

Cheers

Matt

 

 

They only come with a US plug as far as I know. The power supply provided is pretty good. So to get you going, just buy an Aussie power cable.

 

The more you invest in a power supply for the EtherRegen, the more it will step up and reward you. Sadly I have the now defunct Paul Hynes supplies for mine. IFi is a market entry level brand according to their own reps.

 

Regards

GG