Better Roon Endpoints?

[hasticus]

I just share my impression, not trying to convince anybody "pro" or "contra".

iphone is probably close to  microrendu/LPS-1, howeverer sound through iphone is  less natural.  Well-prepared PC still better.

 

[hasticus]

out of topic, but best sound I got with snakeoil/MPD, roon is not as good as this combination. so software player still important. Roon is most convinient to me for my large library(>20TB), MPD is best sounding on same hardware.

[skatbelt]

3 hours ago, hasticus said:

I just share my impression, not trying to convince anybody "pro" or "contra".

iphone is probably close to  microrendu/LPS-1, howeverer sound through iphone is  less natural.  Well-prepared PC still better.

 

 

What iPhone do you use? And did you kill all apps apart from Roon and turn off mobile data?

 

I found iPhone X > USB > USB to optical conversion > optical into my Chord DAVE sound better that direct USB into Chord DAVE and not digital sounding at all compared to microRendu/LPS-1. 

[hasticus]

skatbelt,

thanks, indeed I did not killed all other aps. Will have another try.

[asdf1000]

4 hours ago, hasticus said:

skatbelt,

thanks, indeed I did not killed all other aps. Will have another try.

 

Is your WiFi router inside your listening room? When you were testing your iPhone endpoint?

 

[davide256]

7 hours ago, skatbelt said:

 

What iPhone do you use? And did you kill all apps apart from Roon and turn off mobile data?

 

I found iPhone X > USB > USB to optical conversion > optical into my Chord DAVE sound better that direct USB into Chord DAVE and not digital sounding at all compared to microRendu/LPS-1. 

hmm, I'm curious, what did you use for the iPhone to optical connection?

[davide256]

11 hours ago, davide256 said:

hmm. On reconsideration, now that I have a separate Regen again, I will try Roon out directly from core server. Direct PC USB out was always inferior for SQ with or without Regen compared to DLNA/UPNP fed separate renderer. But Roon core to Roon endpoint has already trounced my prior DLNA/UPNP setup, I'll give direct connect a whirl as nothing to lose if it sounds better.

Ok, this is still the same. Digital artifacts and smearing using Roon and USB direct from core server

[skatbelt]

8 hours ago, davide256 said:

hmm, I'm curious, what did you use for the iPhone to optical connection?

 

I used an 'old' Meridian Explorer. This is a small USB powered DAC. It strangely (for me at least) has optical out. I also happen to own a Mutec MC-3+ USB but I didn't want to bring an extra power supply into the equation.

[davide256]

1 hour ago, skatbelt said:

 

I used an 'old' Meridian Explorer. This is a small USB powered DAC. It strangely (for me at least) has optical out. I also happen to own a Mutec MC-3+ USB but I didn't want to bring an extra power supply into the equation.

Ahh, got it. Peculiar, would not have expected the Meridians USB >optical pass through to sound better than the Chord Dave's direct USB input. But I do believe that a lot more goes wrong in digital handoff to DAC than is widely accepted.

[asdf1000]

11 minutes ago, davide256 said:

would not have expected the Meridians USB >optical pass through to sound better than the Chord Dave's direct USB input.

 

Rob Watt's himself prefers TOSlink over USB, unless the USB source is mobile.

 

[davide256]

Got impatient, so snagged a new 32 gb Touch yesterday. Out of the box it's not as good for Roon endpoint as my iPhone6 Plus... muddier sound. But I'm going to run it for a while to see if per chance a break in period is needed.

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, davide256 said:

Got impatient, so snagged a new 32 gb Touch yesterday. Out of the box it's not as good for Roon endpoint as my iPhone6 Plus... muddier sound. But I'm going to run it for a while to see if per chance a break in period is needed.

 

Interesting. Running the latest iOS update like your 6 Plus? I would have thought not having a cell radio chip would help things with the iPod Touch (even if you can disable it on the iPhone).

The iPhone 6 and Plus share many components to the iPod Touch 6th Gen.

 

It's the later iPhones that would be much more different.

 

I wonder what else is at play.

[davide256]

12 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

 

Interesting. Running the latest iOS update like your 6 Plus? I would have thought not having a cell radio chip would help things with the iPod Touch (even if you can disable it on the iPhone).

The iPhone 6 and Plus share many components to the iPod Touch 6th Gen.

 

It's the later iPhones that would be much more different.

 

I wonder what else is at play.

One possible answer is power stability; the Plus size in iPhone has bigger battery/ more current reserve.

[asdf1000]

15 minutes ago, davide256 said:

One possible answer is power stability; the Plus size in iPhone has bigger battery/ more current reserve.

 

True, bigger battery but I would think the max output current wouldn't be any different? 

 

We're now going deep into the unknown of course, but guessing can be fun.

[davide256]

@Em2016   I've had to go back to the original USB 2 CCK connector. As I was playing some of my music that can be "aggressive" sounding  it made me realize that the music had become irritating. Examples - CD version of Tron Legacy -  HDTracks 24/44 version of Alice through the Looking Glass. Ive isolated the sound degradation to the USB3 version of CCK connector. Wondering if you have compared?

[asdf1000]

53 minutes ago, davide256 said:

@Em2016   I've had to go back to the original USB 2 CCK connector. As I was playing some of my music that can be "aggressive" sounding  it made me realize that the music had become irritating. Examples - CD version of Tron Legacy -  HDTracks 24/44 version of Alice through the Looking Glass. Ive isolated the sound degradation to the USB3 version of CCK connector. Wondering if you have compared?

 

Interesting. I haven’t but I’ll look for a USB 2.0 version on eBay and give it a try. I haven’t been irritated so far though.

[R1200CL]

This one ?

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MD821AM/A/lightning-to-usb-camera-adapter

[asdf1000]

33 minutes ago, R1200CL said:

This one ?

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MD821AM/A/lightning-to-usb-camera-adapter

 

Yep that's the USB 2.0 model.

 

[davide256]

It looks like Paul Pang makes a Thunderbolt to USB B cable for $59. Will be ordering as I want to simplify the CCK/USPCB combination to 1 cable and will share impressions after it arrives and breaks in.

http://ppaproduct.blogspot.tw/2013/07/usb-cable.html

[asdf1000]

3 hours ago, davide256 said:

It looks like Paul Pang makes a Thunderbolt to USB B cable for $59. Will be ordering as I want to simplify the CCK/USPCB combination to 1 cable and will share impressions after it arrives and breaks in.

http://ppaproduct.blogspot.tw/2013/07/usb-cable.html

 

Interesting, you mean Lightning to USB. Will be interested if it works...

 

Apple and their MiFi certification are anal about what is allowed to connect and work with the Lightning port...

 

If you use a counterfeit or uncertified Lightning accessory, you could see these issues:

• Your iOS device could become damaged
• The cable might be easily damaged
• The connector end might fall off, get very hot, or might not fit properly into your device
• You might not be able to sync or charge your device

https://support.apple.com/en-au/HT204566

 

 

[davide256]

13 hours ago, Em2016 said:

 

Interesting, you mean Lightning to USB. Will be interested if it works...

 

Apple and their MiFi certification are anal about what is allowed to connect and work with the Lightning port...

 

If you use a counterfeit or uncertified Lightning accessory, you could see these issues:

• Your iOS device could become damaged
• The cable might be easily damaged
• The connector end might fall off, get very hot, or might not fit properly into your device
• You might not be able to sync or charge your device

https://support.apple.com/en-au/HT204566

 

 

I heard back, no go for the reason below, will keep looking.

 

"Sorry!
My current Lighting chip doesn't support audio function with the new iOS.
Have not buy the newer Lighting chip yet."

 

 

[asdf1000]

6 hours ago, davide256 said:

I heard back, no go for the reason below, will keep looking.

 

"Sorry!
My current Lighting chip doesn't support audio function with the new iOS.
Have not buy the newer Lighting chip yet."

 

 

 

Hehe yes the chip is also what Apple themselves discuss. 

 

Even if he buys the newer chip today that works, Apple can (will) kill functionality of fake chips on the next iOS update.

 

No different to fake ink cartridges with chips. It may work for a short time but it’s a ticking bomb.

 

Stick to Apple MiFi approved to avoid headaches.

 

[davide256]

Just saw this mentioned in Roon forum, hopefully its more flexible than just Roon. AC powered so no PS tweaking possible

 

https://metrumacoustics.com/roon/

 

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ambre-new-roonready-endpoint/40195

[Miska]

At least for once for one device there is clear instruction to use UTP ethernet cable...

 

[eintom]

On 21.3.2018 at 11:09 PM, davide256 said:

Just saw this mentioned in Roon forum, hopefully its more flexible than just Roon. AC powered so no PS tweaking possible

 

https://metrumacoustics.com/roon/

 

 

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/ambre-new-roonready-endpoint/40195

 

my silver one is on order now, they will ship this thing in a few weeks, after roon certification.

 

as an advantage, I promise myself a better sound by using a I2S connection to my Metrum Acoustis Adagio DAC, which gets a I2S Card from Metrum.

 

regards

tom