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Amir at ASR claims Uptone won't sell the ISO regen to him...


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22 minutes ago, Fitzcaraldo215 said:

Alex says he will not sell to Amir for undisclosed PERSONAL reasons

 

Careful, you're getting too presidential there, and not helping anything :(  Alex clearly stated his reasons a number of times, in this thread !!

 

It pays to pay attention  :)

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59 minutes ago, jabbr said:

So, assuming this is valid with a larger number of evaluators

 

I have seen it valid on the previous model; much larger number of evaluators.

 

 

59 minutes ago, jabbr said:

a proper measurement would be able to distinguish something that is audible

 

I suggest that "suggest" is a better word here  :)

 

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6 minutes ago, Jud said:

The best reason to respond is because...

 

I think your trees are hiding the forest  :(

 

 

7 minutes ago, Jud said:

I definitely don't feel bullied by Dennis

 

Other have a different feeling  :(

 

And that comment was about the whole thread, not just this particular interaction.

 

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1 hour ago, rb2013 said:

The ONLY truth is the smile on one's face while listening to great music.

 

ahhh... do you mean 'listening to great music in great sound' ?

 

I'm suprised at how often on CA I see those two basic ideas conflated. It's really quite odd considering our common hobby !?!

 

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45 minutes ago, Fitzcaraldo215 said:

If Swenson wants to be a big boy audio engineer, which he was not... plus an adequate understanding of audio measurement... going off on flights of ...

 

For over the top assholery, I now, with great relief, throw you into my IGNORED USERS list !

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re: the sound of jitter...

 

37 minutes ago, rb2013 said:

Would surprise me - but of course logic would argue against that

 

Logic ?!?!  Unless you have a logic diagram of all the connections and pathways of the audiophile hearing systems in the brain, I don't see how 'logic' has anything to do with it !

How folks respond to the sound of jitter can only be measured, not reasoned, or intuited.

 

But of course, you knew that, and it was only a slip of the tongue  B|

 

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3 minutes ago, jabbr said:

there are fundamentally different types, with different underlying mechanisms and which presumably have very different "sounds"

 

I would go along with the "different sounds", but not the "very". Why do you assume they would sound significantly different ?

 

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58 minutes ago, jabbr said:

Just because in my experience different waveforms have different sounds. White noise vs sine wave vs squarewave are each very different to me , for example

 

I see, but then those waveforms are quite different in character compared to statistical distributions of 'phase error'. I can see it more like noise through.

Hopefully we shall know one day, if someone can put together some relevant experiments.

 

But only ones that can stand up to the scrutiny of the tough crowd here at 'Amateur Scientist' xD

 

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1 hour ago, AJ Soundfield said:

Sound more like Jud is beta testing different versions of the device vs each other, rather than Regen vs no Regen

 

Duh, that's what he has been saying thru dozens of post, re-posts, quotes, re-quotes, til I'm sick of reading the same simple, straightforward listening report over and over and over again !

 

And in most cases it was repeated due to some 'questioner' with IMHO a less then honorable agenda :(

 

I'm not saying that is you. maybe you are just catching up with a thread I've watched since the beginning, but, it does give me pause...

 

It is what it is. move on...

 

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5 minutes ago, jtwrace said:

I guess it will continue to go on the merry-go-around with purely subjective views.

 

Yes, as it should be, since they are the only relevant measure of a device intended for use by human ears.

 

Get used to it !
 

Look over the content of the CA forums, and you'll find the majority of posts are listening reports, listening comparisons, guesses as to how various gear combinations might sound, requests for listener opinions, and so on. Measurements are few and far between ! With all the aggressively vocal 'objectivists' here on CA you might think it would be different, but no. And most of the DIY measurements I have seen here were, to be kind, lame :( And when pinned to the wall, as has happened in this thread, their arguments generally fall away like chaff from the wheat.

 

I have no problem with technical measurements. There are absolutely necessary, but are only part of the tool kit. I have a big problem with people who think that they are the only tool.

 

I respect them as much as I would respect a man who went into a machine gun fight armed only with a sword. Some may applaud his bravery. I only see a dead fool...

 

CA is rife with misunderstanding and myths about human hearing, and thus does a disservice to all audiophiles. Jud's long post a little ways back is a case in point. He in some ways acts as a kind of a Computer Audiophile institutional memory, which is really great, but... I don't have time to go into detail now, but that post was laden with myths and misapprehensions that have built up over time here with the eager assistance of the bully boys of the extreme 'objectionist' faction. Not exactly a free exchange of ideas :(

 

So please cut out this ridiculous dismissal of the power of human hearing. It only makes you less smart :(

 

P.S. this is not just for @jtwrace, but for everyone who thinks listening reports are useless (and you know who you are)

 

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17 minutes ago, AJ Soundfield said:

OTOH, objective claims are. Especially when "White Papers" are posited for objective claims.

 

Oh my, an Objective Extremist !  Well, you did kind of wear your biases on your sleeve, with "friend of Amir", "member of AES" :(

 

23 minutes ago, AJ Soundfield said:

I have no issue with any such device being bought for purely subjective reasons.

 

Well, you have surely missed the point of my post, and declared your opposition to all things 'subjective' as you belittle it so sweetly.

 

Continue on now sharpening your sword.  ;)

 

 

P.S, I generally find that it's better for newbies to lurk for a little, or long, while before jumping into a fray without knowing the territory. Otherwise it tends to end badly...

 

 

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11 minutes ago, crenca said:

While I would encourage you to encourage others to "tone down" the personal attacks, this thread is in some ways getting to the root of the matter in a way I do not recall happening here at CA

 

On this we agree !!

 

Through I do remember a long, contentious, thread that got to the bottom of the serious problems with DBT/ABX. Chris made that one go invisible... :(

 

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7 minutes ago, AJ Soundfield said:

I said there were no details of the bias suppression/test methods. You could be biased by just the lettering.

That isn't the point. You stated the tests were "unbiased". I asked, via what methods? How many trials, etc, etc.

IOW, details critical to "unbiased", valid listening tests.

 

Asked and answered previously in this thread (many times). All you have to to is to go back through the thread and read. Or, go to Jud's Profile page and read his past activity.

 

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3 minutes ago, crenca said:

Well yes, manufactures have an agenda...

 

I find that ridiculous. The situation is far more complex and nuanced then that, and I really have no use for such misplaced obsessions and misinformation. Thus you get to join my 'Ignored Users' list  :)

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33 minutes ago, christopher3393 said:

To try to demonstrate that this is relevant to meta-questions provoked by threads like this

 

Gentlemen,

While I confess to following along with some interest to this digression, it is clearly Off Topic, and this is a confusing enough thread. Would you please start your own thread on this ?  TIA

 

-----------------------------------------------

While I'm at it, and this is directed to every poster, I am getting really tired of trying to read this thread and having to scroll over the same post, quoted in it's entirety, over and over and over again, or even just once ! It doesn't add anything, and makes it harder to get see what you have to say that's new.  I assume that most of you feel the same way, when you think about it ^_^

 

So please, try and get in the habit of selecting some relevant text in a post, and click on the little pop-up 'Quote This' button. It will start your reply with only that text, not the whole thing ! You can go back and do it again for other points, but the point is to minimize the useless 'noise' in your signal.. uhh.. post. Then you can write a nice long reply of your own, and have a better chance of your 'pearls of wisdom' being seen  9_9

TIA

 

(or you can just punch the 'Quote' button under the post and select and delete the unnecessary quoted text. Many ways to the goal, choose yours...)

 

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