A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[the_doc735]

32 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Been there, done that Larry.

 

Back in the Stone Age, when this thread began, I had FMCs fronting my audio gear, but I actually found bridging to sound better. Wireless bridging has its own issues, and had intermittent dropouts at higher resolutions. Since I plan to stream Qobuz, which is streams as high as 24/192, I'm not looking forward to the dropouts.

 

Fair point on the ingress CATV line. I do have a DC blocker on ingress, but not sure if there is an appropriate filter to attenuate noise. Since the cable line is carrying legitimate data at GHz frequencies, not sure what specs to use.

 

But to your point, it sounds like shunting the cable modem, in addition to powering with an LPS may be another safeguard.

 

It is written that there are  'airborn' wireless noise issues when bridging a NAS etc.? i.e. thousands of communication signals and not just inside your property but the signals that come through the wall from other nearby properties!   ....satellites, police, vehicles etc.

 

I'm using this: 'KC'

What is Lightstream?

Lightstream is ultrafast broadband. It connects your home to the internet using fibre optic technology, replacing the copper cables used by standard broadband. We’ve built a network designed for the internet and the way that people use it, so it’s more reliable, faster and future-proof.

 

https://www.kcomhome.com/products/broadband/lightstream/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiav6lc_C3QIVwpPtCh3BoAtoEAAYASABEgIBNvD_BwE

 

I'm getting 215 Mbps.

[lmitche]

40 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Been there, done that Larry.

 

Back in the Stone Age, when this thread began, I had FMCs fronting my audio gear, but I actually found bridging to sound better. Wireless bridging has its own issues, and had intermittent dropouts at higher resolutions. Since I plan to stream Qobuz, which is streams as high as 24/192, I'm not looking forward to the dropouts.

 

Fair point on the ingress CATV line. I do have a DC blocker on ingress, but not sure if there is an appropriate filter to attenuate noise. Since the cable line is carrying legitimate data at GHz frequencies, not sure what specs to use.

 

But to your point, it sounds like shunting the cable modem, in addition to powering with an LPS may be another safeguard.

My experience is different. I'm getting 110 mbps over a dedicated 5 ghz wap link that sits six inches from my wireless router. That should handle qobuz just fine.

 

I'm moving my music hdd to the usb 3 input of the same router and testing that configuration this afternoon. If that goes well, I'll test the sq of the WAP versus the NUCs internal wireless card. The last config will eliminate any chance of a ground loop with only one power supply sharing ground with the NUC. Lastly I may pull out my homemade Nas and setup iscsi boot.

[the_doc735]

41 minutes ago, the_doc735 said:

 

It is written that there are  'airborn' wireless noise issues when bridging a NAS etc.? i.e. thousands of communication signals and not just inside your property but the signals that come through the wall from other nearby properties!   ....satellites, police, vehicles etc.

 

I'm using this: 'KC'

What is Lightstream?

Lightstream is ultrafast broadband. It connects your home to the internet using fibre optic technology, replacing the copper cables used by standard broadband. We’ve built a network designed for the internet and the way that people use it, so it’s more reliable, faster and future-proof.

https://www.kcomhome.com/products/broadband/lightstream/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiav6lc_C3QIVwpPtCh3BoAtoEAAYASABEgIBNvD_BwE

 

I'm getting 215 Mbps.

 

"‘Common mode noise’ is ever-increasing thanks to wireless networking in the home, with mobile phones, wi-fi and Bluetooth bathing us in a sea of airborne interference."

http://www.isoteksystems.com/why-isotek/why-do-i-need-a-power-cleaning-system

 

That's why I don't bridge audio. Until someone proves otherwise.

[look&listen]

3 hours ago, austinpop said:

Wireless bridging has its own issues, and had intermittent dropouts at higher resolutions. Since I plan to stream Qobuz, which is streams as high as 24/192, I'm not looking forward to the dropouts.

@jabbr reports recent experimental success with consistent DSD512 over wireless.

[sandyk]

8 hours ago, the_doc735 said:

Lightstream is ultrafast broadband. It connects your home to the internet using fibre optic technology, replacing the copper cables used by standard broadband. We’ve built a network designed for the internet and the way that people use it, so it’s more reliable, faster and future-proof.

 They are talking about the differences between FTN ( Fibre to the Node, and Fibre FTTP.)

In  Australia at least,  FTTP is connected by Fibre Optic cable all the way, and FTN is normally connected from a " mini  Telephone Exchange"  in the street  via a copper cable pair which may already be present in your house. FTN can be of a decent speed if you are reasonably close to the local Telephone Exchange, but FTTP has the potential for vastly improved speed.

 

[seeteeyou]

FYI - yet another USB DDC with 10MHz reference clock input

 

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=577443097616

http://www.erji.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2122902

https://www.facebook.com/GustardAudio/posts/1062856460558624

https://www.facebook.com/GustardAudio/posts/1066113400232930

 

[rickca]

2 hours ago, seeteeyou said:

FYI - yet another USB DDC with 10MHz reference clock input

Thanks, that looks awesome.  First time I've ever heard about ES8620.  Why does it say Chinese mainland buyers only?

[seeteeyou]

9 minutes ago, rickca said:

Thanks, that looks awesome.  First time I've ever heard about ES8620.  Why does it say Chinese mainland buyers only?

 

For the very first batch, it makes sense for a relatively small company to save international orders for the future just in case Murphy's Law might give them a hard time. Even if there were less than positive feedback, it's relatively easy to deal with domestic customers. Shipping electronics from China should be a piece of cake, while returning something back to China could be trickier because customs and import duties might still be applied no matter what we're declaring.

 

Other than that, I couldn't tell if any trade wars were making a difference or otherwise.

[lmitche]

My Gustard U12 is still in service at a friend's house and does a great job with his spdif only dac. Given it's age, we have been talking about an upgrade.  This one looks like a great candidate. I look forward to hearing more.

 

Many thanks,

 

Larry

 

P.S. great to see Ess take on the Xmos monopoly.

[shadowlight]

19 hours ago, austinpop said:

Back in the Stone Age, when this thread began, I had FMCs fronting my audio gear, but I actually found bridging to sound better. Wireless bridging has its own issues, and had intermittent dropouts at higher resolutions. Since I plan to stream Qobuz, which is streams as high as 24/192, I'm not looking forward to the dropouts.

 

I have been using wireless for close to 18 months with DSD 512 with out any issues related to dropouts.   My setup is wireless router on the half wall between family room and kitchen, HQP Embedded system system plugged into switch in basement, NAA in basement music room connected to the DAC.

 

That includes streaming Qobuz converted to DSD512 for the last couple of weeks.

[austinpop]

1 hour ago, shadowlight said:

 

I have been using wireless for close to 18 months with DSD 512 with out any issues related to dropouts.   My setup is wireless router on the half wall between family room and kitchen, HQP Embedded system system plugged into switch in basement, NAA in basement music room connected to the DAC.

 

That includes streaming Qobuz converted to DSD512 for the last couple of weeks.

 

Thanks. I’m trying to picture it. Do you have a wireless bridge in your basement that feeds your switch to the NAA?

[shadowlight]

56 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Thanks. I’m trying to picture it. Do you have a wireless bridge in your basement that feeds your switch to the NAA?

Nope, but the router in question has triple band support 2.4 and 2 x 5GHz band (one of the Netgear Nighthawk with 6 antennas).  I setup one of the 5Ghz band dedicated for music with it's own SSID.  So I have three separate SSID running.  One dedicated for mobile phones and tablets, one for laptops and one for music.

 

Fios --> Fortinet Firewall --> HP Switch --> Wireless Router (I believe I have it setup in AP mode and not router mode, I will have to confirm later tonight).  HQPe server is connected to HP Switch which is the distribution switch for wired connection in family room, basement and study.  I also have a small switch in the music room connected to HP Switch for devices that do not support wireless connectivity.

[austinpop]

7 hours ago, seeteeyou said:

FYI - yet another USB DDC with 10MHz reference clock input

 

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=577443097616

http://www.erji.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2122902

https://www.facebook.com/GustardAudio/posts/1062856460558624

https://www.facebook.com/GustardAudio/posts/1066113400232930

 

 

Thanks for the great find. This looks very promising! 

 

Other than the toroidal transformer, did you see any more details of the power supply? If the PSU is a high quality LPS, this could be a killer piece. 

[the_doc735]

13 hours ago, sandyk said:

 They are talking about the differences between FTN ( Fibre to the Node, and Fibre FTTP.)

In  Australia at least,  FTTP is connected by Fibre Optic cable all the way, and FTN is normally connected from a " mini  Telephone Exchange"  in the street  via a copper cable pair which may already be present in your house. FTN can be of a decent speed if you are reasonably close to the local Telephone Exchange, but FTTP has the potential for vastly improved speed.

 

mine has Fibre Optic cable all the way to the property, and into an ONT.

[BigGuy]

5 hours ago, rickca said:

Thanks, that looks awesome.  First time I've ever heard about ES8620.  Why does it say Chinese mainland buyers only?

Press "1" for English.

[austinpop]

I've been thinking about it more, and the other possibility is simply that the (very slight) difference I'm hearing between network playback on the SE through the Ethernet interface and local playback from the SSD is just inherent differences in the particular adapters chosen in the SE.

 

So I could just be chasing a phantom problem upstream.

 

Have others with the Zenith SE experimented and tested the SQ between local SSD and network streams? Your experiences, please!  

[seeteeyou]

7 minutes ago, austinpop said:

Thanks for the great find. This looks very promising! 

 

Other than the toroidal transformer, did you see any more details of the power supply? If the PSU is a high quality LPS, this could be a killer piece. 

 

No problem.

 

It should be fairly simple to swap that out since the following picture is clearly showing its 9V @ 1.1A (YELLOW) plus another 9V @ 1.1A (GREEN) outputs respectively

 

http://wx2.sinaimg.cn/large/6e8c4de1gy1fvctnb77kuj215o0v94qp.jpg

[austinpop]

2 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

 

No problem.

 

It should be fairly simple to swap that out since the following picture is clearly showing its 9V @ 1.1A (YELLOW) plus another 9V @ 1.1A (GREEN) outputs respectively

 

http://wx2.sinaimg.cn/large/6e8c4de1gy1fvctnb77kuj215o0v94qp.jpg

 

Should be - but only if you're a handy DIYer. Not for the rest of us. Unless these guys (Gustard?) could be convinced to offer it with a DC input jack?

[seeteeyou]

1 minute ago, austinpop said:

Should be - but only if you're a handy DIYer. Not for the rest of us. Unless these guys (Gustard?) could be convinced to offer it with a DC input jack?

 

No worries, these guys already made something for Singxer SU-1 with a somewhat similar (i.e. 2-pin on Singxer SU-1 versus 4-pin on Gustard U16) power connector

 

https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc99.html

https://kitsunehifi.com/product/singxer-su-1-dc-power-conversion-kit-kitsunehifi-2-1mmx5-5mm/

 

Most likely it shouldn't be that difficult to modify the panel / replace the power connector IMHO.

[austinpop]

5 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

 

No worries, these guys already made something for Singxer SU-1 with a somewhat similar (i.e. 2-pin on Singxer SU-1 versus 4-pin on Gustard U16) power connector

 

https://www.ghentaudio.com/part/dc99.html

https://kitsunehifi.com/product/singxer-su-1-dc-power-conversion-kit-kitsunehifi-2-1mmx5-5mm/

 

Most likely it shouldn't be that difficult to modify the panel / replace the power connector IMHO.

 

Ah yes, good old Ghent Xu!

 

Yes, you're right. I'd be really interested in trying this Gustard with DACs that accept I2S. Would have been nice to have for my recent review of the Terminator, for example.

[rickca]

22 minutes ago, BigGuy said:

Press "1" for English.

What?  What is your point?

[austinpop]

BTW - is that ¥ referring to yuan (CNY) or yen (JPY)?

 

I'm assuming yuan as, if that were yen, the cost would be about $15!

[seeteeyou]

1 minute ago, austinpop said:

I'd be really interested in trying this Gustard with DACs that accept I2S.

 

Finding the right HDMI cable should be the key for an I2S connection, pretty much the same deal as clock cables because we've gotta get something that's short and sweet

 

https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-0-3m-Short-Speed-Cable/dp/B00K3HF276

https://www.amazon.com/Wireowrld-Island-Cable-Meter-Length/dp/B00C6IOQ7W

https://www.amazon.com/WIREWORLD-Chroma-Audio-18Gbps-Cable/dp/B00BUMO350

https://www.amazon.com/WIREWORLD-Ultraviolet-Audio-Video-Cable/dp/B00C6GTI72

https://www.amazon.com/Wireworld-Silver-Starlight-Cable-Meters/dp/B00C6FSQ5I

https://www.amazon.com/Wireworld-Platinum-Starlight-Cable-Meter/dp/B00C6FDG8U

 

Besides, let's hope that Gustard U16 is compatible with the I2S pinout of PS Audio

 

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/denafrips-terminator-the-king-of-r2r-dac.851085/page-4#post-14199895

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1h5PMUBkldkpt1rCnAR4ZHYGZNeCe-vwIFyKWYMZWsX0

 

1 minute ago, austinpop said:

BTW - is that ¥ referring to yuan (CNY) or yen (YEN)?

 

I'm assuming yuan as, if that were yen, the cost would be about $15!

 

OMG, are you implying that you'd like to support something that's even more unthinkable than sweatshop operations?

 

I guess that 15 bucks could cover (part of) the tariffs, depending on what the percentage is gonna be.

[austinpop]

2 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

Besides, let's hope that Gustard U16 is compatible with the I2S pinout of PS Audio

 

Yeah, this is where I really like the Terminator approach. You can select from multiple pinout standards from the front panel. More DAC vendors should do this.

 

2 minutes ago, seeteeyou said:

OMG, are you implying that you'd like to support something that's even more unthinkable than sweatshop operations?

 

Relax - I was just kidding! That's why I had this ->  

[BigGuy]

28 minutes ago, rickca said:

What?  What is your point?

None of the links took me to sites in English.