LUMIN - Audiophile Network Music Player

[ThierryNK]

Firmware 2.01 seems to have a bug.

 

DDSD DoP in wave containers no longer works. It is seen as a wave 24/176 PCM by the Lumin.

 

It was seen like that whatever the server and the control point are.

 

It was seen by the 9 French Lumin owners I a speaking for.

 

It was working with previous Firmware.

 

DoP Flac are still working.

 

DoP wave no longer working is very (very very) annoying for those who use Foobar as a UPNP server with the Lumin SACD DoP Plugin for DSD ISO images. Foobar sends DoP in wave containers.

 

Is it possible either to provide a firmware update or to provide a link to the previous firmware.

 

Best and kind regards.

[psme]

Sorry!!! Version 2.01 fixed a playback problem on some AIFF file with unusually data structure. And broke WAV/AIFF DoP file playback!

 

Please update to the new firmware version 2.02.

[ThierryNK]

Thanks a lot for your light speed reactivity. Receive many thanks from the Lumin users here. Best and kind regards

[MikeJazz]

Hi Mikejazz

 

In UPNP, it is always the player which requests the tracks from the server.

What you call "better scenario" is the standard scenario. I do not know a UPNP server/renderer that works with your first scenario. The Lumin? (I do not have one right now to check). You have an example?

 

The control point asks the renderer to ask tracks to the server.

 

Of course, after your post, I have checked that Jriver UPNP server respects this, with UPNP inspector tools. Ad it is OK. From Jremote on iPad, or directly with Jriver as control. (With my Ayon S5 Nerwork Player).

 

You are absolutely right about Jriver weakness on gapless. I am investigating that.

 

Best and kind regards

 

Hi ThierryNK,

What I wanted to say is better said by linn themselves...

By "better scenario" I mean exactly the Playlist mode of Linn. I was not able to function with that "Playlist" when controlling Linn DS from JRMC or with Jremote.

 

They say:

FAQs - LinnDocs

 

"The Linn extensions (Playlist), allows the Linn DS to store the playlist in the Linn DS rather than the playlist residing in the UPnP controller, this allows greater flexibility (mulitple UPnP controllers plus the ability to switch off these controllers and still have Music playing)."

 

From my experience, when the playlist is fully stored in the Linn DS, I then can switch off my control point and all will play.

 

When I have my playlist in JRMC, and hit play on the Linn Zone, the JRiver player needs to stay on, and occasionally I have drop outs (that I think are due to the controlling point having to communicate more frequently). The JRiver laptop also doubles as all purpose pc (internet browsing). I also noticed that when increasing processes/cpu use of that PC, the drop outs are more likely to occur.

[psme]

Latest LUMIN firmware version 2.03 (released on Apr 12) supports Gapless playback with jRiver (release 17?), using UPnP AV SetNextAVTransportURI command.

 

It works also with foobar2000 as a UPnP controller. Though it seems foobar2000 UPnP controller already supports Linn mode/OpenHome mode of operation.

 

The latest firmware also added Invert Phase On/Off option on analog audio output.

[tinman]

Dear psme,

I heard that lumin will support usb audio.

Is it right or not?

It has usb port but now it work for firmware upgrade only.

When it can play with usb input and support dsd(dop)?

[psme]

We are still studying USB audio. We hope to support USB audio output but that is not a high priority task. Besides, it seems some USB DACs are starting to use custom driver (on Windows/Mac), which will never work on LUMIN.

 

LUMIN's power is in it's DAC stage. Now many are even asking for digital Input on LUMIN!

[tinman]

Thank you, PSME.

 

I want to know that Lumin can support USB input for PC audio output.

Not Lumin's USB Audio output support.

Lumin's USB input can receive audio data from PC (USB Audio).

Then, I want to know whether Lumin can be USB DAC or not.

[Holzohr]

I want to know that Lumin can support USB input for PC audio output.

Not Lumin's USB Audio output support.

Lumin's USB input can receive audio data from PC (USB Audio).

Then, I want to know whether Lumin can be USB DAC or not.

 

Can you see any USB B connector on the rear panel? http://www.luminmusic.com/images/gallery/LUMIN-gallery-13.jpg I can not. When you want a USB DAC, why not a Mytek? DSD-ready DACs you can find here DSD-Ready DACs | AudioStream.

The LUMIN is a DSD-streamer! Very unique at the moment.

[ThierryNK]

Why bothering with USB, decoding software jitter on PC or Mac and their OS, and USB cable and its own jitter, when you can get the tracks decoded inside the Lumin, with integration to the DAC?

Use 2 Ethernet cables, a switch, Fooobar or Jriver on your PC, and you are all set. Including DoP or DSF or DFF tracks sent by UPNP server to the Lumin that will do all the work, from tracks decoding to analog DAC output.

 

All the best.

[Holzohr]

Why bothering with USB, decoding software jitter on PC or Mac and their OS, and USB cable and its own jitter, when you can get the tracks decoded inside the Lumin, with integration to the DAC?

 

D'accord!

Thierry, may I ask did you buy the LUMIN in France? I am shocked a bit about the price difference of the LUMIN in France and Allemagne.

[michael123]

Why bothering with USB, decoding software jitter on PC or Mac and their OS, and USB cable and its own jitter, when you can get the tracks decoded inside the Lumin, with integration to the DAC?

 

- Because some of us run filters or EQ on the PC.

- Because we prefer freedom of choice in software rather than sticking to proprietary solution

- Because PC has greater flexibility when it comes to various formats

 

[ Saying that, I am using SlimDevices Transporter ]

[Holzohr]

- Because some of us run filters or EQ on the PC.

- Because we prefer freedom of choice in software rather than sticking to proprietary solution

- Because PC has greater flexibility when it comes to various formats

 

I prefer it more simple. All my music is on a NAS. So, all I still need now is a DSD-ready streamer. (I had a USB-DAC 1,5 years ago with foobar, jriver installed on a netbook. Controlled via smartphone app.)

 

[ Saying that, I am using a Squeezebox Touch, with EDO-app ]

[airguitar]

I prefer it more simple. All my music is on a NAS. So, all I still need now is a DSD-ready streamer. (I had a USB-DAC 1,5 years ago with foobar, jriver installed on a netbook. Controlled via smartphone app.)

 

[ Saying that, I am using a Squeezebox Touch, with EDO-app ]

 

Your Squeezebox Touch is probably as good as you ever need streaming and sound quality wise, unless you really hanker for DSD or a bit of shiny silver bling...

 

I can't speak from direct experience though (apart from comparing other streamers and using PCs), I haven't heard the Lumin, but that would be my best guess

[ThierryNK]

SBT is a very good product. I wrote a "coup de cœur" about it on my (French) blog.

Hifiatubes: Musique dématérialisée » Archives du Blog » Coup de coeur: La Squeezebox Touch

 

But it seems useful to see the technological and working principles differences between products, and not just using words as "streamer".

 

SBT DAC is OK to connect to amplified computer type speakers. It is very convenient to get music in several rooms.

On a HIFI system, well, it is not the right DAC.

 

You can of course connect it to an external DAC and get much better results.

 

But you remain with SPDIF jitter and digital cable effects, without speaking about clock and power supply quality on the final result.

 

The design advantage of Network Players is to eliminate, by design, audio flux transport on long distances between tracks decoding and the DAC, and to integrate decoding, transport to DAC and DAC in the same device.

 

It was the same for CD players. I never heard a DAC connected to a CD drive by SPDIF or AES/EBU giving better results than THE SAME DAC integrated with the CD Drive inside a CD player.

Splitting decoding/transport/DAC provides the "perverse" impression of freedom to upgrade a system element by element, forgetting the headaches and the aspirin required to correct the defaults of splitting elements.

 

Best regards

Thierry

[Holzohr]

Your Squeezebox Touch is probably as good as you ever need streaming and sound quality wise, unless you really hanker for DSD or a bit of shiny silver bling...

 

I can't speak from direct experience though (apart from comparing other streamers and using PCs), I haven't heard the Lumin, but that would be my best guess

 

I agree with you! Especially after my experience with the (for my taste) also overpriced T+A Music Player Balanced. The Squeezebox Touch is hard to beat. I should be happy with my streaming solution.

 

I blame Oppo! When they announced the DSD-file playback, I was looking for an UPnP server that supports such files and found the MinimServer. Thanks to the MinimServer I detected the LUMIN. I have all my SACDs on hard disk and would like to stream DSD-files natively.

[ThierryNK]

In my opinion, Mimimserver is not really a good software.

 

For UPNP serving DSD, you have the following choices:

- Foobar from a PC

- Jriver from a PC or a Mac

- ANY UPNP server on any platform after converting DSF, DFF or ISO files to DoP (DSD over PCM) with Foobar and the conversion plugin provided by the Lumin guys.

 

Converting to DoP require some time and hard drive space, but it is a portable solution to any UPNP server.

[Holzohr]

- Foobar from a PC

- Jriver from a PC or a Mac

 

That`s a downside to me. I don`t want to run a pc or netbook for serving music. I was already practicing this. I have my NAS (the same as you have). Btw, the new version of the MinimServer supports DoP.

[ThierryNK]

It was just for information that I provided other UPNP servers supporting DSD.

 

There is nothing special to support DoP files, they are seen as standard Flac (or wave/AIF) files by UPNP servers.

Any UPNP server is able to send DoP files, without any upgrade.

 

When I discovered Jriver/Jremote functions, ergonomy and interface, I decided to get back to a Mac as a UPNP server. Interface is what I see each time I listen to music. I do not care about what kind of computer is used. NAS are very convenient ccomputers, but they do not have UPNP servers with a really advanced interface.

 

All the best.

[tinman]

I bought Lumin for DSD streaming.

Now, I use Minim server for DSD streaming but I have many SACD ripping files with ISO.

 

So, I use foobar with SACD plugin but can't find how to DoP streaming to Lumin.

 

If I use Minim server, I should extract track files with DSF from ISO SACD images.

 

Is there any kind of guide about how to streaming with DoP on Foobar ?

 

Please let me know.

[ThierryNK]

Install Foobar

Install Foobar UPNP plugin

Install Foobar SACD plugin that has bien modified by Lumin (download address is upper in this thread). For this plugin, you just have to copy the .dll file inside the components directory of Foobar.

 

Make Foobar Library watch the directory where the ISO are (I suggest a folder with one ISO to tune and check the setup).

 

UPNP Foobar server has to be restarted each time you add an album to the library.

 

Configure Foobar UPNP Streaming profiles with

44 to 2820000

stereo only

 

Configure SACD with

DSD over PCM in DSD2PCMMODE

Stereo

Editable tags

 

You are all set.

 

Launch Kinsky or other Control Point software and choose Foobar as UPNP server.

You should see the album and the tracks.

 

You can edit tags from Foobar, from the Library Album list, NOT FROM a playlist.

 

You should see "DSD" on Lumin screen when playing an ISO track in this configuration.

 

If you have difficulties, I can provide screen captures of the configuration menus.

 

Be aware: half of my 350 SACD have DST tracks (looseless compressed DSD).

A weak processor and/or not enough memory will not be good for real time decompressing DST and DoP conversion. You may have big dropouts.

A first generation I5 is not enough. An I5 2500K works fine for all this real time business.

A first generation I5, or even an I3 may be enough for non DST ISO tracks.

If memory is not at least 4GB or maybe 6GB you may also have dropouts due to swapping tasks.

 

Here is the guide to stream DoP from Foobar

 

Best regards

[tinman]

Thank you very much, ThierryNK.

 

I'll try now.

 

Thank you so much.

[thingswelike]

If you want to go through the process of extracting DSF from ISO and keeping minimserver, I've been using sacd-ripper - SACD ripping software using a PS3 - Google Project Hosting with great success.

 

It's a command line utility that produces DSF files from ISO.

 

Usage: sacd_extract [options] [outfile]

-2, --2ch-tracks : Export two channel tracks (default)

-m, --mch-tracks : Export multi-channel tracks

-e, --output-dsdiff-em : output as Philips DSDIFF (Edit Master) file

-p, --output-dsdiff : output as Philips DSDIFF file

-s, --output-dsf : output as Sony DSF file

-I, --output-iso : output as RAW ISO

-c, --convert-dst : convert DST to DSD

-C, --export-cue : Export a CUE Sheet

-i, --input[=FILE] : set source and determine if "iso" image,

device or server (ex. -i192.168.1.10:2002)

-P, --print : display disc and track information

 

Help options:

-?, --help : Show this help message

--usage : Display brief usage message

 

 

So for example, I've been using:

sacd_extract -2 –s –c –i”SACDNAME.iso”

 

Then I've been using JRiver to tag the DSF files as MP3TAG doesn't support them yet.

[ted_b]

No reason to use command line. I have several bat files that automate it all (for multiple ISOs). It's in my guide, but a mini-primer here:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/carbon-playback-buffering-issue-sacd-files-server-design-flaw-or-config-issue-15909/#post222823

[thingswelike]

Thanks Ted. That makes life easier! (although I've already done my back-catalogue).

 

I just wish MP3TAG would hurry up and add DSF support, then my ripping for Minimserver and Lumin workflow would be about as good as I could hope for.