Fas42’s Stereo ‘Magic’

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

4 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

I could set up a bot to spam this thread endlessly

Yes but....(as much as that explains a lot)

 

It's 'show and tell' time Frank (as has been requested many times in the past). I have shown you mine, let's see your audio gear. Define "modest equipment" and let's actually see this "modest equipment" and the pictures displaying the method that wroughts this magic that you claim.

 

There can be no more excuses Frank like not being in the headspace to take pictures. There can be no too "fatigued" to take pictures. The amount of energy that you expend bobbing and weaving is enough to make anyone exhausted. Let's just see the goods in situ, in the real world where the rest of us live.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

13 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

Yes but....(as much as that explains a lot)

 

It's 'show and tell' time Frank (as has been requested many times in the past). I have shown you mine, let's see your audio gear. Define "modest equipment" and let's actually see this "modest equipment" and the pictures displaying the method that wroughts this magic that you claim.

 

There can be no more excuses Frank like not being in the headspace to take pictures. There can be no too "fatigued" to take pictures. The amount of energy that you expend bobbing and weaving is enough to make anyone exhausted. Let's just see the goods in situ, in the real world where the rest of us live.

 

Frank, repetition, it works both ways🤷‍♂️

[sandyk]

[Confused]

12 hours ago, fas42 said:

 

Because it implies that there is some magic line, in terms of the equipment one buys, where below that it's impossible to achieve decent SQ - and that above it, that automatically, because of the money spent to acquire such goods, that what you have is always tinged with specialness, which can never be diminished - a dividing line is clearly drawn between the haves, and the have nots.

 

This is why objectivists sneer so much at the subjectivists - they see the latter asserting that because they spent lots of money to acquire "specialness", that this guarantees that they are indeed in a "special place". Of course, they may in fact have produced a very high quality of sound, or, they may have dug a very deep ditch of 'strangeness', in what they are listening to.

 

The reality is that there is no dividing line ... there is merely various levels of weakness in the products; and hopefully more expensive ones have less of such - but there are no guarantees ...

 

I would agree that there is no dividing line.  Indeed, in my experience people tend to talk more about the "law of diminishing returns", that is you can get something better as you climb up in price, but improvements get ever smaller for the cash paid goes up.  I don't think I have ever come across anyone who has placed a "dividing line" somewhere, but they might be out there I guess.

 

As an aside, personally I do not fully believe in the "law of diminishing returns", as such.  In my experience, there tends to be products that out perform rivals in a particular price range, you can then looks at rival products as the price increases, and they remain inferior in comparison with the "killer product".  A lot of personal and subjective preferences here, so others might see this differently.

 

As a very personal example, I auditioned a whole range of speakers in the £10K+ bracket.  Some were better than others, but nothing I listened to was offering enough of an improvement over what I already had to persuade me to part with any cash.  Some were definitely better than what I had, but not by enough of a margin for me to bother upgrading, or at least spending any cash.  Then I heard the Blades, in a very good audition, and that was it for me, and hence I eventually (after other auditions) bought them.  Have I heard anything better that I would swap for the Blades?  Maybe, but only at a MUCH higher price.  So for me the Blades are the "killer product", the law of diminishing returns does not work, I can go more expensive, but I just find things I like less.  This is just my view, I am sure others have their own "killer products", plus there are some lower priced items that in terms of measurements absolutely crush items at many times the price, and also sound good too. 

 

I do think the correlation between price and performance exists, but is perhaps far more tenuous than might be first thought.

[botrytis]

16 hours ago, fas42 said:

Without comment,

 

 

Thoughts?

 

 

I think you can get there without spending more money than I make in two years. I won't deny people who can, it is their money after all.

 

You can't have it both ways Frank and you are definitely trying to.

 

I think you can get a decent sound system w/o spending a ton of money.

[Confused]

18 hours ago, fas42 said:

Without comment,

 

 

Thoughts?

This YouTube clip sounds a little better to me than the previous two "systems clips" that were posted in this thread.  Although I find it hard to judge how much of this is down to the recording or the actual system.  I suspect the equipment and method of recording is actually better for this example.

 

I'd love to hear the system for real, but this would just be out of curiosity, I would not be interested in buying £100k speakers.

 

I would also like to hear the system with different music than included in the clip, but that is just another curiosity.

 

It also occurs to me that I would very much like to hear a Gryphon Diablo, but it is the one thing I have never come across at a show or a dealer.

[botrytis]

2 minutes ago, Confused said:

This YouTube clip sounds a little better to me than the previous two "systems clips" that were posted in this thread.  Although I find it hard to judge how much of this is down to the recording or the actual system.  I suspect the equipment and method of recording is actually better for this example.

 

I'd love to hear the system for real, but this would just be out of curiosity, I would not be interested in buying £100k speakers.

 

I would also like to hear the system with different music than included in the clip, but that is just another curiosity.

 

It also occurs to me that I would very much like to hear a Gryphon Diablo, but it is the one thing I have never come across at a show or a dealer.

 

Well, I know of a dealer in Omaha, NB for Gryphon and was lucky to hear one during a demo, when I walked in and asked if I could listen a bit. Very nice but class A means it is a good heater for winter.

[Teresa]

7 hours ago, fas42 said:

You have shown me yours ... ???...

 

Actually @Audiophile Neuroscience has shown everyone his audio system, just click on his avatar and then click on "Audio System". He has an excellent picture of his audio system with a list of the components and speakers. Or click here.

 

By contrast your "Audio System" page says "In limbo at the moment ..."

 

Hope this helps. 😊

 

Frank as @Audiophile Neuroscience has said over and over, 'show and tell' time for you and there can be no more excuses IMHO. You will notice I don't list my audio equipment either, however I don't make bizarro claims like you.

[botrytis]

@Audiophile Neuroscience Man, I would love to hear your system! Very amazing and impressive.

 

Mine is small beans, in comparison, but it does for me quite well. What I am currently using is bolded in my signature.

 

Nothing fancy, but all that matters is the smile on my face.

[sandyk]

3 hours ago, botrytis said:

@Audiophile Neuroscience Man, I would love to hear your system! Very amazing and impressive

 

 It might even sound half decent once he gets away from flawed USB ! 😜

[fas42]

4 hours ago, Teresa said:

 

Actually @Audiophile Neuroscience has shown everyone his audio system, just click on his avatar and then click on "Audio System". He has an excellent picture of his audio system with a list of the components and speakers. Or click here.

 

By contrast your "Audio System" page says "In limbo at the moment ..."

 

Hope this helps. 😊

 

Frank as @Audiophile Neuroscience has said over and over, 'show and tell' time for you and there can be no more excuses IMHO. You will notice I don't list my audio equipment either, however I don't make bizarro claims like you.

 

Thank you, Teresa - now, was it so hard for David to do that ... apparently so, it's more satisfying for him to behave childishly, than to move on ...

 

OK, my stuff looks a mess - it is set up well enough to tell me what I want to know, I have zero interest in the aesthetics - why should I provide more ammunition to people who want to play smartypants games? I've already posted pics of the bits that make up the channels; seeing that combined is going to tell one a big fat nothing.

 

@kumakuma has asked in a polite way to see more detail - I can do some close up shots, of where it might tell some people something useful - but pics of the scenery, no.

 

Teresa, you know what it's like when one's head doesn't co-operate - the fact that I haven't updated my system page, yet, should ring bells, very loudly, for people with some intelligence ...

[fas42]

9 hours ago, Confused said:

 

I do think the correlation between price and performance exists, but is perhaps far more tenuous than might be first thought.

 

Indeed, tenuous ...

 

A little story: audio friend up the road had these tiny Tannoy bookshelfs when I first heard his system. He tried a couple of tweaks on them, prompted by our conversations, etc. Finally, he excitedly announced that he had finally got "decent" speakers, Naims from about 10 years back - the Tannoys were consigned to bedroom duties, hooked up some to ordinary receiver, or something. Then, he pulled them back out, and set up a second rig in the backyard shed - where he could really go to town and try even "more crazy!" tweaks. And for years that was the best system, usually easily outperforming the "good rig", in the lounge room - the Naims were well outclassed.

 

Until the last year or so. He finally got the Naim setup to pull ahead of the Tannoy one - it's now top dog, 😉. But N. doesn't stand still ... he decided to rework the Tannoys - in the phone call a couple of days ago he said, I've rewired the Tannoys - I've learnt so much since I last went inside and tweaked the internals - it was obvious now that improvements could be made; so the wiring has been completely reorganised ... the meetup next week in part will be to hear what this has given.

 

Now, how many slick photos taken of the messy shed interior is going to tell one the slightest thing about what has been done?

[Mayfair]

 

[fas42]

5 hours ago, Confused said:

This YouTube clip sounds a little better to me than the previous two "systems clips" that were posted in this thread.  Although I find it hard to judge how much of this is down to the recording or the actual system.  I suspect the equipment and method of recording is actually better for this example.

 

I'd love to hear the system for real, but this would just be out of curiosity, I would not be interested in buying £100k speakers.

 

I would also like to hear the system with different music than included in the clip, but that is just another curiosity.

 

It also occurs to me that I would very much like to hear a Gryphon Diablo, but it is the one thing I have never come across at a show or a dealer.

 

Okay, my verdict is that plenty is being got right - certainly a much higher standard than usually heard in these situations. But there is still a signature, which, as usual, is a negative one as far as the subjective qualities are concerned - can anyone pick what to me is a very clear audible giveaway to weaknesses in the state of tune of the system, at that time of the recording?

[fas42]

Okay, now that I've seen David's system, I can immediately see things that I would address - unless he has already done something about that. To me, the routing of cabling needs a lot of attention - and would be something I would do before even turning it on.

[kumakuma]

21 minutes ago, fas42 said:

Okay, now that I've seen David's system, I can immediately see things that I would address - unless he has already done something about that. To me, the routing of cabling needs a lot of attention - and would be something I would do before even turning it on.

 

The sax player is also missing his sunnies.

 

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

5 hours ago, Confused said:

I'd love to hear the system for real, but this would just be out of curiosity, I would not be interested in buying £100k speakers.

 

I would also like to hear the system with different music than included in the clip, but that is just another curiosity.

 

It also occurs to me that I would very much like to hear a Gryphon Diablo, but it is the one thing I have never come across at a show or a dealer.

 

I have heard that system and indeed, to my ears it is extraordinarily good. I own the Mephisto amplifier as well as the Pandora preamplifier (featured in the clip) and this is where I think Gryphon totally excel (amplifiers). I have also heard the Diablo and it too is amazing at considerably less cost. Gryphon just do it right when it comes to amplifiers IMO.The kalliope DAC (featured in the clip) also sounds extraordinarily good in my opinion and I also chose it as part of my system. It for example has its own inbuilt super capacitor that powers the USB input section. There is no need for any connection of the 5 V from the computer USB, not even a "handshake" so the 5 V from the computer remains permanently disconnected for better isolation. I did not go with the CD player (building my own server) and I chose the vivid speakers over the Gryphon speakers.

 

5 hours ago, botrytis said:

 

Well, I know of a dealer in Omaha, NB for Gryphon and was lucky to hear one during a demo, when I walked in and asked if I could listen a bit. Very nice but class A means it is a good heater for winter.

 

That is very true, they can get very hot. Most Gryphon amplifiers have adjustable bias into class a, and only really get hot when running at 100% class a. You pay a small sound quality penalty but even at 50% bias into class a, with such a big amp putting out 175 W, you still have plenty of class a available unless you are playing at extremely loud volumes et cetera. The amplifier can also be linked to automatically change the bias depending on the volume level set by the preamplifier. This is an arbitrary arrangement and doesn't pretend to adjust bias by instantaneously tracking the signal (as some schemes claim). Gryphon claim the latter is not really practical as it takes some minutes for the new bias setting to settle and for the amplifier to heat up or cool down accordingly.

 

3 hours ago, botrytis said:

@Audiophile Neuroscience Man, I would love to hear your system! Very amazing and impressive.

 

Thanks. It is certainly the best sound I've ever heard and I've heard a lot of high-end systems including ones significantly more expensive than mine.

 

3 hours ago, botrytis said:

Mine is small beans, in comparison, but it does for me quite well. What I am currently using is bolded in my signature.

 

Nothing fancy, but all that matters is the smile on my face.

 

You look to have quality gear so I have no doubt that it brings a smile to your face. I suspect it would also bring a smile to my face. I would be surprised if it didn't

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

1 hour ago, fas42 said:

5 hours ago, Teresa said:

 

Actually @Audiophile Neuroscience has shown everyone his audio system, just click on his avatar and then click on "Audio System". He has an excellent picture of his audio system with a list of the components and speakers. Or click here.

 

By contrast your "Audio System" page says "In limbo at the moment ..."

 

Hope this helps. 😊

 

Frank as @Audiophile Neuroscience has said over and over, 'show and tell' time for you and there can be no more excuses IMHO. You will notice I don't list my audio equipment either, however I don't make bizarro claims like you.

 

Thank you, Teresa - now, was it so hard for David to do that ... apparently so, it's more satisfying for him to behave childishly, than to move on ...

 

Not quite sure why you need this level of instruction from Teresa.It is not difficult to list gear under "audio section" in one's profile and supply a photo. It is quite simple as Teresa quite correctly points out. I also totally agree with Teresa characterising your claims as bizarro

 

 

1 hour ago, fas42 said:

I've already posted pics of the bits that make up the channels; seeing that combined is going to tell one a big fat nothing.

 

Could it be that "a big fat nothing" as you put it (I am sure that that is an unfair assessment), is all there is to see?

 

1 hour ago, fas42 said:

 

@kumakuma has asked in a polite way to see more detail - I can do some close up shots, of where it might tell some people something useful - but pics of the scenery, no.

 

Teresa, you know what it's like when one's head doesn't co-operate - the fact that I haven't updated my system page, yet, should ring bells, very loudly, for people with some intelligence ...

 

Just excuses Frank. Your "head cooperates" to post thousands of posts bragging about your method. Post the pics.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

25 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

The sax player is also missing his sunnies.

 

 

Yeah, somehow the sunglasses got split in two. I must try and fix them and update the photo

[fas42]

3 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

Not quite sure why you need this level of instruction from Teresa.It is not difficult to list gear under "audio section" in one's profile and supply a photo. It is quite simple as Teresa quite correctly points out. I also totally agree with Teresa characterising your claims as bizarro

 

Because you specifically said, "I have shown you mine" - you did not say, "A photo of my rig can be found in my profile". You have not "shown me" anything.

 

3 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

Could it be that "a big fat nothing" as you put it (I am sure that that is an unfair assessment), is all there is to see?

 

Yes, pictorially it's indeed a big fat nothing - digital speakers with a link cable between right and left, a Toslink cable to a very boring Samsung DVD player - and a messy arrangement of mains cabling going to the two ... that's all that's meaningful, to the sound, externally.

 

3 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

 

Just excuses Frank. Your "head cooperates" to post thousands of posts bragging about your method. Post the pics.

 

Doing the attitude thing, David, will get you nowhere - try and put your brain into gear, and we can get somewhere.

[kumakuma]

12 minutes ago, fas42 said:

 

Doing the attitude thing, David, will get you nowhere - try and put your brain into gear, and we can get somewhere.

 

 

I don't see this as attitude. 

 

David is just expressing natural skepticism.

 

Your moaning about not having the energy to take pictures just doesn't track with the fact that you've been able to make 7759 often lengthy posts to this forum and spend what appears to be hundreds of hours on tweaking your equipment.

[Audiophile Neuroscience]

34 minutes ago, fas42 said:

 

Because you specifically said, "I have shown you mine" - you did not say, "A photo of my rig can be found in my profile". You have not "shown me" anything.

 

Oh pleeease. Are you telling me you didn't think to look in my profile? Also, on at least  2 to 3 previous occasions you have singled out the Gryphon components and I have mentioned the vivid speakers in threads that you have been in

 

 

Quote

 

Yes, pictorially it's indeed a big fat nothing - digital speakers with a link cable between right and left, a Toslink cable to a very boring Samsung DVD player - and a messy arrangement of mains cabling going to the two ... that's all that's meaningful, to the sound, externally.

Doing the attitude thing, David, will get you nowhere - try and put your brain into gear, and we can get somewhere.

 

Well we're up to 77 pages and we haven't got anywhere yet.

 

So less talk and bring out those pics. We want to see the "modest gear" and pics of the method that produce the magic. The tweaks in all their glory and detail. Unlike myself, since you are a great believer in posting video/audio clips as being representative of the playback system quality I am sure the members here might appreciate a video as well. You can even describe the sound in the video as a kind of educational gesture on your part. You know, like listen to this, you too can achieve this level of sound magnificence by simply doing this that and the other (as you can clearly see in the pics and in the video).

[fas42]

35 minutes ago, kumakuma said:

 

I don't see this as attitude. 

 

David is just expressing natural skepticism.

 

Your moaning about not having the energy to take pictures just doesn't track with the fact that you've been able to make 7759 often lengthy posts to this forum and spend what appears to be hundreds of hours on tweaking your equipment.

 

There will never be a 'bling' photo - because there is none to see. What would count is a whole series of very precise photos showing highly specific things done to parts of the system - which is what really counts. And since this is, a Work In Progress, they would be unfair, because everything could change in a month's time - everything is always evolving, there is no fixed, That's All Folks!

 

The system is Edifier speakers, and a Samsung DVD player - there's nothing more special than that, to see. I've largely burnt out on doing this tweaking stuff, which is why the NAD/Sharp combo are in limbo, most of the time - and people whinged like crazy, about that! The new digital speakers have got me fired up again, because they get so much right, out of the box ... I'm hoping that they still keep up, as I push them further ...

[fas42]

2 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

Oh pleeease. Are you telling me you didn't think to look in my profile? Also, on at least  2 to 3 previous occasions you have singled out the Gryphon components and I have mentioned the vivid speakers in threads that you have been in

 

Yes. Sometimes, the answer is very simple.

 

2 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

 

Well we're up to 77 pages and we haven't got anywhere yet.

 

Well, the Edifying Journey thread is about what I'm working on - ever thought of looking over there?

 

2 minutes ago, Audiophile Neuroscience said:

 

So less talk and bring out those pics. We want to see the "modest gear" and pics of the method that produce the magic. The tweaks in all their glory and detail. Unlike myself, since you are a great believer in posting video/audio clips as being representative of the playback system quality I am sure the members here might appreciate a video as well. You can even describe the sound in the video as a kind of educational gesture on your part. You know, like listen to this, you too can achieve this level of sound magnificence by simply doing this that and the other (as you can clearly see in the pics and in the video).

 

Actually, I thought just before about doing a sound capture using my very cheap smart phone - and posting it, here ... when I'm happy with how they're shaping up ... interested?

 

BTW, no reaction to my comment about the cabling of your rig, as in the photo ... ??

[sandyk]

41 minutes ago, fas42 said:

Because you specifically said, "I have shown you mine" - you did not say, "A photo of my rig can be found in my profile". You have not "shown me" anything.

A photo of David's room and system has already been posted for all to see, but perhaps you don't remember seeing it  😋