The true experimental tweak thread

[Cornan]

On 2017-09-15 at 8:01 PM, tapatrick said:

Yes I saw that. A great range of products. It's the noise profiles I'm interested in as that seems to be where the magic is. 

 

Here is an interesting claim by Per-Anders Sjöström. Any support for his claims? ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.com/pages/index.php/hifi-projects/142-ssr01-sjoestroem-super-regulator?showall=&start=1

Is "Super" too much?

Does the design deserve the epithet "super"? Yes, indeed! Can anyone come up with any regulator with less noise and lower output impedance? I don't think so. I would be happy if someone can prove me wrong. This design is extreme in the true sense when it comes to these two parameters. I believe that a couple of more parameters also are state of the art.

 

Quite a lot more expensive than other choices, but very appealing to me I must say! ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.net/shop/super-regulators/18-ssr02-sjostrom-super-regulator-built.html

 

And here is the technical data:

 

Operating voltage:	Max 50 V, less current at high voltage in. Min 4 volts more than output voltage.
Output voltage:	5-40 V, down to 3 volts is possible.
Hum and noise at full output current:	Down to 0.9 µV or below depending of component choices
Max current:	Approx 1 A peak
Max continuous current:	Approx 1 A depending of ambient temperature and mounting (cooling).
Dimensions:	66,0 (2.6") x 38,1 (1.5") mm

[lmitche]

1 hour ago, Cornan said:

 

Here is an interesting claim by Per-Anders Sjöström. Any support for his claims? ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.com/pages/index.php/hifi-projects/142-ssr01-sjoestroem-super-regulator?showall=&start=1

Is "Super" too much?

Does the design deserve the epithet "super"? Yes, indeed! Can anyone come up with any regulator with less noise and lower output impedance? I don't think so. I would be happy if someone can prove me wrong. This design is extreme in the true sense when it comes to these two parameters. I believe that a couple of more parameters also are state of the art.

 

Quite a lot more expensive than other choices, but very appealing to me I must say! ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.net/shop/super-regulators/18-ssr02-sjostrom-super-regulator-built.html

 

And here is the technical data:

 

Operating voltage:	Max 50 V, less current at high voltage in. Min 4 volts more than output voltage.
Output voltage:	5-40 V, down to 3 volts is possible.
Hum and noise at full output current:	Down to 0.9 µV or below depending of component choices
Max current:	Approx 1 A peak
Max continuous current:	Approx 1 A depending of ambient temperature and mounting (cooling).
Dimensions:	66,0 (2.6") x 38,1 (1.5") mm

Isn't this fellow one of your neighbors?  Have you met him?

[Cornan]

8 minutes ago, lmitche said:

Isn't this fellow one of your neighbors?  Have you met him?

 

Yes, he is a Swede as well. Heard about him before, but never met him though.

What about his voltage regulator Larry? Does it look as good as the claims?

I am also looking into Sulzer regulators. Any thoughts about them?

[sandyk]

Obviously Per-Anders Sjöström doesn't believe in the K.I.S.S. principle !

At a quick glance, at least his circuit doesn't appear , unlike some other Super Reg. designs , to need to change components for different voltage outputs. That's why I stick with the old J.L.H (A.K.A. "Ripple Eater") design preceded by a relatively low noise adjustable voltage regulator.

 

Alex

[Cornan]

8 hours ago, sandyk said:

Obviously Per-Anders Sjöström doesn't believe in the K.I.S.S. principle !

At a quick glance, at least his circuit doesn't appear , unlike some other Super Reg. designs , to need to change components for different voltage outputs. That's why I stick with the old J.L.H (A.K.A. "Ripple Eater") design preceded by a relatively low noise adjustable voltage regulator.

 

Alex

 

Thanks Alex!

Nice to see you around! ?

A fixed voltage works for me personally. IMO it make sense that a fixed voltage would reduce noises compared to a adjustable dito, so that would actually be quite optimal. 

Do you have a link to a J.L.H (Ripple eater). Sounds interesting! ?

[Cornan]

I cannot find a ready made ripple eater, but I found this build manual by Rock Grotto (apparently a improved design):

 

Rock Grotto Ripple Eater

 

?

 

BTW. When ordering a built Sjostrom SSR02 voltage regulator you'll need to specify the output voltage.

[sandyk]

53 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Thanks Alex!

Nice to see you around! ?

A fixed voltage works for me personally. IMO it make sense that a fixed voltage would reduce noises compared to a adjustable dito, so that would actually be quite optimal. 

Do you have a link to a J.L.H (Ripple eater). Sounds interesting! ?

 

Unfortunately, the PCBs are currently unavailable, and you would need to etch one yourself.

The single version ( the original design was a dual polarity version) MAY still be able to be ordered  from a PCB maker, but unfortunately they would need to come in a minimum of 10 pieces.

 

http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/default.htm  

Click on "Power Supplies"  for a copy of the original Electronics Today International article, as well details of the modified version , PCB layout etc.

(The modifications and other improvements came from me)

Alex

[Cornan]

11 minutes ago, sandyk said:

 

Unfortunately, the PCBs are currently unavailable, and you would need to etch one yourself.

The single version ( the original design was a dual polarity version) MAY still be able to be ordered  from a PCB maker,

but unfortunately they would need to come in a minimum of 10 pieces.

 

http://users.tpg.com.au/gerskine/greg/default.htm  

Click on "Power Supplies"  for a copy of the original Electronics Today International article, as well details of the modified version , PCB layout etc.

(The modifications and other improvements came from me)

Alex

 

Thanks for the info Alex! Unfortunately I am not a good friend with my soldering iron. Not completely sure I would pull something like that off. I might ask someone to make it for me though. But before I do I'll need to understand it better and start by checking if additional voltage regulators actually could improve things further or not in my perticular setup. ?

[tapatrick]

16 hours ago, TubeMan said:

and what level is that,,,,,,

I think everyone here is looking for better sound ,,

@TubeMan @lmitche Yes absurd levels.The in series LT3045s are 025.uV I believe  My wife thinks I'm a bit nuts pursuing the ultimate sound with this hidden behind my system 

 

[tapatrick]

13 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

Here is an interesting claim by Per-Anders Sjöström. Any support for his claims? ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.com/pages/index.php/hifi-projects/142-ssr01-sjoestroem-super-regulator?showall=&start=1

Is "Super" too much?

Does the design deserve the epithet "super"? Yes, indeed! Can anyone come up with any regulator with less noise and lower output impedance? I don't think so. I would be happy if someone can prove me wrong. This design is extreme in the true sense when it comes to these two parameters. I believe that a couple of more parameters also are state of the art.

 

Quite a lot more expensive than other choices, but very appealing to me I must say! ?

 

http://sjostromaudio.net/shop/super-regulators/18-ssr02-sjostrom-super-regulator-built.html

 

And here is the technical data:

 

Operating voltage:	Max 50 V, less current at high voltage in. Min 4 volts more than output voltage.
Output voltage:	5-40 V, down to 3 volts is possible.
Hum and noise at full output current:	Down to 0.9 µV or below depending of component choices
Max current:	Approx 1 A peak
Max continuous current:	Approx 1 A depending of ambient temperature and mounting (cooling).
Dimensions:	66,0 (2.6") x 38,1 (1.5") mm

They look very interesting @cornan

"Down to 0.9 µV or below depending of component choices"

[Cornan]

9 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

@TubeMan @lmitche Yes absurd levels.The in series LT3045s are 025.uV I believe  My wife thinks I'm a bit nuts pursuing the ultimate sound with this hidden behind my system 

 

 

Looking good Patrick! ?

Your a qualified tweaker for sure! ?

[tapatrick]

@Cornan @octaviars As promised here are some pics of my current set up experiments with the LT3045s. I was cleaning up the big mess of the cabling and tape etc yesterday and took these to show the set up. The sound is very sweet, deep clear bass, smooth treble, very detailed, no sibilance (except if it's on a recording), massive soundstage. 

 

1. the whole chain laid out:

• Aqvox Switch powered by Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 1amp boards

• Iso Regen powered by 2nd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

• WavIo board powered by 3rd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

Ghent audio canare DC cables with Tinned braid shield

Ghent Audio JSSG USB cable

Ghent audio 75ohm BNC cable out from WavIo board

[tapatrick]

Some close ups of the boards:

8v from Teradak DC-30w  into 7.2v>5v LT3045 1 amp  boards into the Aqvox switch

[octaviars]

@tapatrick how hot does your 1amp board get driving the switch? 

[Cornan]

3 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

@Cornan @octaviars As promised here are some pics of my current set up experiments with the LT3045s. I was cleaning up the cabling etc yesterday and took these to show the set up. The sound is very sweet, deep clear bass, smooth treble, very detailed, no sibilance (except if it's on a recording), massive soundstage.

 

1. the whole chain laid out:

• Aqvox Switch powered by Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 1amp boards

• Iso Regen powered by 2nd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

• WavIo board powered by 3rd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

Ghent audio canale DC cables with Tinned braid shield

Ghent Audio JSSG USB cable

Ghent audio 75ohm BNC cable out from WavIo board

 

Thanks a lot for taking the time to remove it and give me such good pictures and info. All crystal clear now! ?

You just convinced me to try your approach with dual LT3045 boards! ?

 

[tapatrick]

Some more close ups of the boards with the ISO R powered by 8v from Teradak DC-30w into 7.5v>5v LT3045 500ma  boards plus the WavIO powered by 8v from Teradak DC-30w into 7.5v>5v LT3045 500ma boards. (NB  the boards are not 7v but 7.2v for the 1 amps and 7.5v for the 500ma, thats how they came)

Hope this helps to understand

[tapatrick]

6 minutes ago, octaviars said:

@tapatrick how hot does your 1amp board get driving the switch? 

@octaviars It doesn't get hot at all.

[octaviars]

5 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

@octaviars It doesn't get hot at all.

 

Nice to hear that. 

 

I still wonder how these boards compare to builds with much more capacitans but perhaps that does not matter so much?

 

I have perhaps got som pcb with 3 LT3045 in parallel on the way but they need to be soldered. 

[tapatrick]

6 minutes ago, octaviars said:

 

Nice to hear that. 

 

I still wonder how these boards compare to builds with much more capacitans but perhaps that does not matter so much?

 

I have perhaps got som pcb with 3 LT3045 in parallel on the way but they need to be soldered. 

@octaviars Not sure as I'm no expert. The 500ma ones have 1 chip, the 1amp ones have 2 chips in parallel. Did you mean these ones with 3 chips in parallel to give 1.5amps? 

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/310402-fs-ultra-low-noise-power-supply-lt3045-based-pcb.html

[Speed Racer]

39 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

@Cornan @octaviars As promised here are some pics of my current set up experiments with the LT3045s. I was cleaning up the big mess of the cabling and tape etc yesterday and took these to show the set up. The sound is very sweet, deep clear bass, smooth treble, very detailed, no sibilance (except if it's on a recording), massive soundstage. 

 

1. the whole chain laid out:

• Aqvox Switch powered by Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 1amp boards

• Iso Regen powered by 2nd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

• WavIo board powered by 3rd branch from Teradak DC30W stepped down from 8v>7v>5v with 2x LT3045 500ma boards

Ghent audio canare DC cables with Tinned braid shield

Ghent Audio JSSG USB cable

Ghent audio 75ohm BNC cable out from WavIo board

 

Just think how much simpler it would be if you got rid of USB all together!

 

I was going down the same path you are on before I realized that simpler really is better. I will soon have a Roon endpoint that is UTP Ethernet in and AES3 out to my Yggdrasil. This endpoint has a built-in LPS and no SMPS. Yggdrasil feeds a Freya via XLR which outputs to a Pioneer M-22 amp. 

 

All these devices are plugged into a Topaz isolation transformer. There are no SMPS wall warts plugged into power strip plugged into the Topaz. UTP Ethernet isolates the endpoint from the electrical mess that are computers. My chain is sickenly simple and sounds incredible:

 

UTP Ethernet > Endpoint > AES3 > DAC > Preamp > Amp > Speakers

 

No decrapifiers, no uber expensive cables, no external LPS units, no LT3045 boards.

 

The power is super clean coming from a Topaz wired for balanced power. There are no SMPS bricks to contaminate the power. All devices have their own linear power supplies. No ground or power problems make it to the endpoint. Simple and very clean. 

[Cornan]

6 minutes ago, Speed Racer said:

 

Just think how much simpler it would be if you got rid of USB all together!

 

I was going down the same path you are on before I realized that simpler really is better. I will soon have a Roon endpoint that is UTP Ethernet in and AES3 out to my Yggdrasil. This endpoint has a built-in LPS and no SMPS. Yggdrasil feeds a Freya via XLR which outputs to a Pioneer M-22 amp. 

 

All these devices are plugged into a Topaz isolation transformer. There are no SMPS wall warts plugged into power strip plugged into the Topaz. UTP Ethernet isolates the endpoint from the electrical mess that are computers. My chain is sickenly simple and sounds incredible:

 

UTP Ethernet > Endpoint > AES3 > DAC > Preamp > Amp > Speakers

 

No decrapifiers, no uber expensive cables, no external LPS units, no LT3045 boards.

 

The power is super clean coming from a Topaz wired for balanced power. There are no SMPS bricks to contaminate the power. All devices have their own linear power supplies. No ground or power problems make it to the endpoint. Simple and very clean. 

 

No doubt. The USB chain is complicated to optimize, but it is just impossible to question the great SQ you'll get deep down that path and you do not want to leave that rabbit hole until it is totally explored! ?

[tapatrick]

50 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

No doubt. The USB chain is complicated to optimize, but it is just impossible to question the great SQ you'll get deep down that path and you do not want to leave that rabbit hole until it is totally explored! ?

@Cornan @Speed Racer Looks great Speedracer and yep there many paths to nirvana. Agree about your main suggestions Topaz, no smps. There are also many great threads extolling the virtues of ethernet v USB chains, both with very convincing arguments and claims. Wish we could all get to listen to each others set ups! I'm sticking with USB for now, seems there is much more to discover here the I originally believed. I don't consider any of the components in my USB chain expensive compared to my main units and my what fun there is to be had learning and tweaking! Thanks Cornan for this ongoing thread..

[tapatrick]

19 hours ago, mozes said:

If one uses LPS-1s to power his gear, I guess there is no need for these regulators. 

I currently use a cheap 12v unregulated battery to power my Asus bridge, can I use one of these regulators to improve the performance?

 

@mozes would think its worth a try based on my findings but can't be sure

[octaviars]

As I see it if you have a DAC with really good clock USB might be a better way as the DAC controlls the flow of audio and re-clock the signal. If you use spdif or AES the clock in the transmitter is responsible for the clocking of the signal if I get it right.

By this I dont mean that usb is better than spdif/AES it all depends on the DAC. 

 

I have two different plans right now but cant really decide what to do. Everything will run on linear PSU.

 

Both systems will use a ROON ROCK NUC. 

 

1. ISP fiberconverter->ethernet->Ubiquiti Router->ethernet->Aqvox switch-> ethernet->Sonore ultraRendu->USB-> DAC. 

 

2. ISP fiberconverter->ethernet->Ubiquiti Router->ethernet->Ubiquiti switch with SFP->fiber->FMC TP Link MC220L (custom built by SOtM with clock input and linear regulators)->SOtM SMS 200 Ultra (clock output to FMC)->USB-> DAC. 

 

System one will be less stuff to fiddle with and less PSU:s but I still wonder if the fiber solution with the custom built FMC will bring any benefits? 

[octaviars]

2 hours ago, tapatrick said:

@octaviars Not sure as I'm no expert. The 500ma ones have 1 chip, the 1amp ones have 2 chips in parallel. Did you mean these ones with 3 chips in parallel to give 1.5amps? 

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/310402-fs-ultra-low-noise-power-supply-lt3045-based-pcb.html

 

Yes that is the ones, but you just get the PCB and needs to solder on all of the components. You get a BOM list and a how-to-do it with the PCB.

 

With these boards you just supply AC voltage that suits the DC output you want and there is the possibility to trim the output under load so you get the right voltage.