The true experimental tweak thread

[Cornan]

WHAT IS THE TRUE EXPERIMENTAL TWEAK THREAD ALL ABOUT?

I have always wanted a thread where any subject is possible. No experiment is too crazy to add here. No idea is too bold to reveal. 

Take it away! Enlight your thoughts and share your ideas how to improve SQ and how not to. Anyone can encurage and educate you but no one should let you down, deminage you or simply move you to another thread.

 

Everyone is welcome as long as they accepts a different way of thinking!

 

 

TOPIC DIGEST

With a little help of @austinpop I have realised that this thread is all over the place. Even if this is one of the fundamental ideas behind this thread, it could be a good idea to sum-up the things that have proven to be beneficial to SQ in this thread. I will keep it plain & simple.

 

Remember that these are essentially my own findings in my own setup with Tidal FLAC and Tidal MQA as source.

 

As always YMMV! 

 

 

 

LAN

1. Cat 6a U/UTP 500Mhz ethernet cables sounds better than Cat5, Cat5E, Cat6 & Cat7+ in my setup. Ghent Audio Cat 6a ET02 with JSSG shielding and Metz plugs rules them all.

2. Network switch improve SQ with input on port 1 and output on the last port. Possible explanation is QoS and also that the ports are in different magnetic boxes inside the switch.

3. Using a AQVOX switch with better clock improves SQ compared to a D-Link DSG-105 network switch.

4. A wireless adapter/wireless bridge/router in client mode into a network switch sounds better than battery powered FMCs and hardwired LAN. 

5. Router vastly improves SQ with a floating LPS and even more if the floating PSU is connected to a DC blocker trap filter. IME a router upgrade could be beneficial to SQ.

6. Galvanic isolation/DC blocker in the signal path pre the router improves SQ.

7. Wireless adapter vastly improves connected to a floating IT.

8. RJ45 socket enhancers seems to be more efficient on port 4 & 5. Don't ask me why! 

 

 

GND

1. Grounding a metal chassi network switch to a tourmaline grounding box greatly improves SQ.

2. Different tourmaline grounding boxes improves the sound signature in different ways. 

3. Grounding the DC negative terminal of the floating SMPS works great. In my setup it sounds best connected to a grounding box instead of to the power strip safety ground receptacle. Just be aware of possible leakage loops between various network devices. A big thanks @JohnSwenson for this tip.

 

 

USB

1. Covering the outer USB barrels with electrical tape improves SQ slightly with unshielded USB cables. Capasitive coupling between metal barrel and pins?

2. Uptone Audio´s USPCB improves SQ.

3. ATL Hi-Fi´s 8 conductor USB cable with dual unconnected shields (5v+GND & Data- & Data+) with JSSG loop improved SQ compared to other longer (<50cm) USB cables that I´ve tried. 

 

 

DC

1. Network switch sounds best with dual floating PSUs or battery power (but very important to disconnect the battery charger while listening to music). Dual floating PSU is slightly better than battery power, but battery power is slightly better than single floating PSU.

2. Powering several devices with a single floating SMPS sounds better than powering the very same devices with several battery supplies. Also, powering several devices with a single battery supply sounds better than using multiple identical battery supplies. Self-inflicted noise?

3. Canare 4S6 starquad does improve SQ where ever applied. Canare 4S6 with JSSG seems to be even more effective. Thanks to@JohnSwenson!

4. Grounding the DC negative output of a floating SMPS improves SQ. Grounding the chassi/case decrease SQ. Be aware of shared ground paths since this could potensially decrease SQ.

5. Dual LT3045 ultra-low noise voltage regulators in series with 1v drop-down close to the powered device improves SQ quite dramaticly.

6. Kemet aluminium Polymer caps A750 series (25v 560uF) vastly improves LT3045 when added at the DC output. On single LT3045 the Kemet improves on both in- and output.

7. Panasonic FC series type A aluminium electrolytic caps improves on the PSU output terminals. 

 

 

AC

1. A DC blocker trap filter pre a safety isolation transformer improves SQ even though it is dead silent (no hum). DC blockers trap filter pre a floating PSU into a router vastly improves SQ. DC stress reliever?

2. SQ improves when battery chargers is connected to a separate powerstrip connected directly to the AC wall outlet, bypassing the isolation transformer completely.

3. A safety isolation transformer with floating secondary improves SQ more than a Ultra Isolation transformer. A balanced isolation transformer with floating center-tap rules them all!

4. Daisy chained floating grounds (dual floating grounds) sounds better than a single floating ground. In my setup floating SMPS's improve SQ connected to a floating IT, even surpassing battery supplies. Thanks for the suggestion @lmitche!

5. AC mains starquad power cables greatly improves SQ.

6. AC mains voltage regulators improves SQ on the signal chain. Even cheaper versions are effective. Not as effective on high power devices such as active speakers and amp due to a still unknown reason.

 

 

 

[Cornan]

I can start off this thread with one of my several coming experiments. I have quite a few coming. Some more crazy than the other. This one is a USB data enhancer which contains a USB A female plug>Vactrol VTL5C1 analogue linear optocoupler (opto-isolstor)>USB A male plug.

I want to test if USB data wires are sensitive to noises caused by over-voltage, DC currents and leakage loops. I am not expecting a big improvement initially...but are very curious to "turn that stone" to see what is hiding there.

 

I will post my experiences here when all the parts for it have arrived!

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

I can start off this thread with one of my several coming experiments. I have quite a few coming. Some more crazy than the other. This one is a USB data enhancer which contains a USB female plug>Vactrol VTL5C1 analogue linear optocoupler (opto-isolstor)>USB A male plug

 

How will you handle initial device detection?

[Cornan]

How will you handle initial device detection?

 

This is the "experimental" parts of this thread. No experiment is too crazy to try. A hunch is enough to get going. I have already ordered the parts and expect to get a result by a week or two. The worst case scenario is that it doesn't improve anything..but at least I have not left that stone unturned!

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

I recently built this 100Base-TX cable which is an improvement over Audioquest forest, Audioquest Cinnamon, Supra Cat 7+ and Supra Cat 8.

 

 

It contains 22awg silver plated wires with teflon sleeving connected to Deltaco tool-free RJ45 plugs and screw terminal RJ45 plugs. Connected to pin 1&2 plus 3&6 on a distance to reduce capacitive coupling.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

I also added external grounding to my router with great result using a similar construction with Deltaco tool-free plugs and silver plated teflon sleeved wires (connected to pin 4&5).

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

Next step will be to build a twisted pair SAT cable with the same silver plated wires and these F plugs

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

This is the "experimental" parts of this thread. No experiment is too crazy to try. A hunch is enough to get going. I have already ordered the parts and expect to get a result by a week or two. The worst case scenario is that it doesn't improve anything..but at least I have not left that stone unturned!

 

I expect it to not work at all. USB device detection uses pullups on the data lines to indicate presence and supported speed. An optical isolator will prevent that. This is the same reason the ground wire needs to be connected for initial handshake.

 

To achieve full isolation you'd need some active circuitry on both sides exchanging side-channel signals to provide the achieve the correct responses to both sides. I guess the Intona device does something like this.

[Cornan]

I expect it to not work at all. USB device detection uses pullups on the data lines to indicate presence and supported speed. An optical isolator will prevent that. This is the same reason the ground wire needs to be connected for initial handshake.

 

To achieve full isolation you'd need some active circuitry on both sides exchanging side-channel signals to provide the achieve the correct responses to both sides. I guess the Intona device does something like this.

Thanks mansr!

I know very little about optocouplers. Instead of endless search for answers I have ordered the parts that make sense to me. In any case I will give it a try. But do I understand you correctly that these optocouplers might need a 2-leg dip switch to work?

I mean like USB GND needs a switch to be disconnected?

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

Thanks mansr!

I know very little about optocouplers. Instead of endless search for answers I have ordered the parts that make sense to me. In any case I will give it a try. But do I understand you correctly that these optocouplers might need a 2-leg dip switch to work?

 

Bypassing the optocoupler during the handshake might work.

[Cornan]

Bypassing the optocoupler during the handshake might work.

Thanks a million! That really made my day!

I will add a 2-leg dip switch to my order and report back asap.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

Bypassing the optocoupler during the handshake might work.

Also recall that USB is bidirectional. Your optocoupler needs to transfer signals both ways.

[Cornan]

Also recall that USB is bidirectional. Your optocoupler needs to transfer signals both ways.

Not sure how that will change things in my experiment? My USB cables are data only after handshake...so no power and no GND. I will connect the Vactrol to the Data+ & Data- on both ends with a 2-leg dip switch which I will turn off when the GND handshake is performed. Not bidirectional?

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

Not sure how that will change things in my experiment? My USB cables are data only after handshake...so no power and no GND. I will connect the Vactrol to the Data+ & Data- on both ends with a 2-leg dip switch which I will turn off when the GND handshake is performed. Not bidirectional?

 

Can you explain in more detail, perhaps with a circuit diagram, how you intend to wire this up?

[Cornan]

I just got a delivery of a $70 linear lab PSU for my router

 

 

Added a Deox-it treated AHP gold fuse and measured the galvanic isolation with my multimeter set on continue-mode. No beep, no value & no nothing. I'll guess it is a winner! I am still waiting for my 4mm banana plug>2,1/5,5mm DC wire to arrive before I can evaluate it. In any case to these eyes it looks pretty amazing for the price!

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

Can you explain in more detail, perhaps with a circuit diagram, how you intend to wire this up?

I have no circuit diagram, but it is quite straight forward.

I will connect USB pin 2 & 3 to the VTL5C1s two channels at both ends with a 2-leg dip switch in-between.

It will essentially serve as a USB A female to male adaptor. I will actually make two since I have one USB cable from my Aries Mini to USB Regen and one from USB Regen to my DAC.

If it'll improve things I want to add them to my copper Ethernet and my twisted pair SAT cable as well...if I just can figure out how.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

I have no circuit diagram, but is is quite straight forward.

I will connect USB pin 2 & 3 to the VTL5C1s two channels at both ends with a 2-leg dip switch in-between.

 

Two channels? The VTL5C1 consists of an LED illuminating a photoresistor. It is decidedly unidirectional. Moreover, it has a response time measured in milliseconds. That's not enough even for low-speed USB. You need something with sub-nanosecond response time for USB2.

[Cornan]

Two channels? The VTL5C1 consists of an LED illuminating a photoresistor. It is decidedly unidirectional. Moreover, it has a response time measured in milliseconds. That's not enough even for low-speed USB. You need something with sub-nanosecond response time for USB2.

OK, any suggestions of a sub-nanosecond respons time optocoupler?

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[mansr]

OK, any suggestions of a sub-nanosecond respons time optocoupler?

 

Sorry, can't help you there. What's in the Intona isolator?

[YashN]

Sorry, can't help you there. What's in the Intona isolator?

AFAIK, it's FPGA-based, custom code/hardware description.

[Cornan]

Sorry, can't help you there. What's in the Intona isolator?

My coming experiment are starting to look like a failure before it have even started. Just got word from John Swenson that even if you use two optocouplers and a switch it is not likely to succeed, probably due to lack of speed as you pointed out.

 

I do not own a Intona...but are you sure that Intona also isolate the data+ and data-?

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

AFAIK, it's FPGA-based, custom code/hardware description.

Not a off-the-shelf solution in other words. Anyway, this experiment do not seem to be possible to pull off as is. Needs serious re-thinking or a nice little throw into the trash can.

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Middy]

Even I hoped that Otpo emulating chip I found would just work by soldering a few wires to the legs. But it takes electrical knowledge and a custom circuit just to get it working. The isolation in the intona being a small transformer between the 2 FPGA'S.

There is a cheaper version mentioned on here but I can't remember it's name.

I think there are bi directional Optos models but that IC PDF shows some average MEGS PS.

This a what if thread, so a thousand no's is still a valued learning experience.

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

Even I hoped that Otpo emulating chip I found would just work by soldering a few wires to the legs. But it takes electrical knowledge and a custom circuit just to get it working. The isolation in the intona being a small transformer between the 2 FPGA'S.

There is a cheaper version mentioned on here but I can't remember it's name.

I think there are bi directional Optos models but that IC PDF shows some average MEGS PS.

This a what if thread, so a thousand no's is still a valued learning experience.

 

 

 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Computer Audiophile mobile app

 

That is the whole idea by creating this thread. To share experiments that you have inside your head. With some friendly advices everyone can gain knowledge by success and failure.

 

I have found this little CESYS USB isolator interesting http://www.cesys.com/products/usb-isolator/

 

 

https://m.conrad.se/Galvanisk-separering-%28GND-Lift%29-fr%e5n-v%e4rddator-och-USB-enhet-CESYS-C028149.htm?websale8=conrad-swe.01-aa-m&pi=1165503&ci=SHOP_AREA_17630_0406153

 

It isolates the data wires as well. Have you or anybody else heard of it?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app

[Cornan]

Personally I would have something else than a USB isolator. I do not want yet another device in the chain. I'll rather await the coming uber-Regen and cross my fingers it will have galvanic isolation of the data wires! ?

 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Computer Audiophile mobile app