UpTone Audio USB Regen Listening Impressions

[logicsound]

Hi Barry:

 

The REGEN ignores any incoming voltage on USB pin-1--it is not connected to ANYTHING on the board. So any audible benefit of having a USB cable with no 5V coming down its length is NOT from keeping 5V out of the REGEN. Rather it is that you are reducing any capacitive coupling of the voltage to the data pair along the length of the wire.

 

So yes, you can use an Sbooster VBUS isolator (or just tape over pin-1 in the 'A' plug at the computer end) and thus have a data-only cable.

 

I've had great success (after rolling about a half dozen USB cables) with the Forza Twin Copper split cable. So with the USB bridges I have tried (more then a few), those that need USB power hand shake (Gustard U12) can get it from a Li Ion battery, those that don't like the Melodius MX-U8 or Hydra Z can use just the separate data line. And if your DDC/DAC needs power (the Hydra has this option) the power line can be connected to a Li Ion (I like the XIAOMI) or LPS. The Hydra Z really likes LPS.

 

Using just the Data line on the Regen is ideal. Available in .5M lengths - no need for messy tape (would hate to get tape glue on the inside USB contacts).

 

Forza Audio Works link: FAW Copper Series Twin USB for Audiophileo/M2Tech - Forza AudioWorks

XIAOMI 16000mAh Li Ion USB pack. Genuine Xiaomi 16000mAh MI Li ion Power Bank Dual USB 5V 2 1A w Authentic Code | eBay

[logicsound]

I posted this on my popular Gustard U12 thread after posting some comments on the Regen tech and getting the Ob trolling:

 

Well, after 30 yrs in high end audio - I don't put much faith in 'measurements' as often the engineers are 'measuring' the wrong thing. For example, in the '70s the move to solid state hifi - all the rage as the test bench IM and THD measures were very good. Better by a factor of 10 over the old tube amps - the declaration that tubes were a relic. How did that turn out?

 

 

 

Stereophile and Audio magazine (I was a long time subscriber) had all the ads and were thick publications, every review replete with 'test bench' charts and graphs. Get one of these on Ebay and read through it - it would make you laugh. Then this little 6" by 6" almost no pictures - and absolutely no ads publication came out - called 'The Absolute Sound' by a fellow named Harry Pearson. He threw out all the "But the Engineers say it must sound better it has lower THD (total harmonic distortion)" common thinking. And spoke of the better sound of tube equipment - he of course was derided by the measurement people. But high quality US manufactures like ARC (Audio Research Corp) and Conrad Johnson and well McIntosh - were selling lot's of very expensive tube gear.

 

 

 

So where are Pioneer, Sansui, Kenwood today? How about Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, McIntosh?

 

 

 

Then came CDs - Wash, Rinse, Repeat...

 

 

 

So go ahead and pick your equipment based on 'measurements' like old HP (now deceased - will miss you 'bro) - I trust my ears. Test equipment does not 'hear' music but my ears sure do.

 

Gustard U12 USB Interface 8 Core XMOS chip - Page 178

 

Edit FYI I just posted this WANTED ad on Headfi:

"Wanted an unloved - Uptone Regen. With all the objectivitists 'posts' about it's supposed terrible 'measurements' there must some folks who are using it as a paperweight.

 

 

 

I'll gladly buy it from you at a premium!" $190

[Nikhil]

Ohh, so you're saying this Array Cable AC filter when used with the stock MeanWell SMPS outperforms the HDPlex LPS. Now there's an eyeopener for someone whose just getting ready to go to bed.

 

Thanks, that'll give me something to dream about now and think about in the morning.

 

 

satfrat, some interesting news for you. I have been using the Regen with the Array Solutions cable filter these past few days and I have to say I am not missing my LPS at all. I tried a little back and forth last night and could only barely notice a difference in sound.

 

The Array Solutions cable filter might actually appeal to some as sounding better. The sound is a little more airier and transients are a little "springier" - snare drums, rim shots, brushwork, upright bass, etc. sound a little more accented for example. With the LPS back in the sound was just a little denser with a touch less shimmer. That's about all I could note in my listening.

 

The Array cable filter makes the Meanwell SMPS a pretty decent option regardless of price. Based on what I am hearing in my setup, I would not have a problem recommending it to anyone looking at alternatives.

 

As always .... YMMV.

[satfrat]

satfrat, some interesting news for you. I have been using the Regen with the Array Solutions cable filter these past few days and I have to say I am not missing my LPS at all. I tried a little back and forth last night and could only barely notice a difference in sound.

 

The Array Solutions cable filter might actually appeal to some as sounding better. The sound is a little more airier and transients are a little "springier" - snare drums, rim shots, brushwork, upright bass, etc. sound a little more accented for example. With the LPS back in the sound was just a little denser with a touch less shimmer. That's about all I could note in my listening.

 

The Array cable filter makes the Meanwell SMPS a pretty decent option regardless of price. Based on what I am hearing in my setup, I would not have a problem recommending it to anyone looking at alternatives.

 

As always .... YMMV.

 

It seems the Array cable filter would isolate the MeanWell from the rest of the audio components along with filtering the AC power to the MeanWell. Looks like a no-brainer products when paired with Uptone Audio's upcoming Mystery Add-On PS which should further upgrade the DC current from the MeanWell SMPS but would do nothing to isolate the SMPS from your system.

[groovybassist]

I ordered an Array filter for just those reasons - clean up noise the Meanwell may be injecting back into the AC line and bide time until the Uptone mystery PSU is available.

 

I've also ordered the Curious USB cables. Waiting on all these goodies to arrive.

[4est]

It would be cheaper to buy an El Cheapo OS at $69 btw.

I ordered an Array filter for just those reasons - clean up noise the Meanwell may be injecting back into the AC line and bide time until the Uptone mystery PSU is available.

 

I've also ordered the Curious USB cables. Waiting on all these goodies to arrive.

[pl_svn]

Forza Audio Works link: FAW Copper Series Twin USB for Audiophileo/M2Tech - Forza AudioWorks

 

Oh, wow, thanks: right the kind of cables I like (not these USB you linked, their interconnects and LODs)

 

order placed for a silver USB/Lightning LOD and... asked if they can make a USB A/B one with the same specifics

[scirica]

It would be cheaper to buy an El Cheapo OS at $69 btw.

 

I got my El Cheapo in the mail yesterday. Very happy with it!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[groovybassist]

4est:

 

The "el cheapo" would indeed be cheaper, but I'm a bit uncomfortable ordering a power supply from overseas built by an unknown person or company. It's probably fine, but I feel better having ordered from a commercial enterprise in the US, with corresponding warranty.

[logicsound]

I got my El Cheapo in the mail yesterday. Very happy with it!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

If you think their 'El Cheapo' LPS is good - you should hear their DU-U8 USB XMOS Bridge. It's killer good.

 

Just complete a 5 USB bridge Shootout -

Here is the list:

 

Gustard U12

Melodious MX-U8

Hydra Z

iDac DAC2

Audio Breeze DU-U8

 

Including some light modding of the MX-U8 and U12.

 

Previous USB bridges I've had:

 

3 different John Kenny's, M2Tech Highface and Evo, Audiophilleo 2, Musiland 02 and Musiland USB 3.0 USD. Evo fed by a Acopian Yellow Box LPS.

 

Been posting on this Breeze Audio on my Gustard U12 thread for a while.

Gustard U12 USB Interface 8 Core XMOS chip

 

Yet to try the PUC2 Lite. But did get a favorable (well maybe a bit more) mention in the StereoTimes review (yes I'm Mr RB99). :-) Yellowtec PUC2 Lite USB Converter

 

Awaiting delivery on the Regen for extensive listening tests. So far with my friends the results have been outstanding. And nice incremental improvement from the JB as well, but nothing like a LPS TeraDak SB30W R-Core feeding an Regen Amber.

[logicsound]

Oh, wow, thanks: right the kind of cables I like (not these USB you linked, their interconnects and LODs)

 

order placed for a silver USB/Lightning LOD and... asked if they can make a USB A/B one with the same specifics

 

For A $79 cablevery good and better then the USB Supra I have - of course the Supra was $49.

 

Let me know if they'll do that (pretty sure they will) and what they charge.

 

But for those folks doing the taping thing - much better to go with a completely separate data and power line like the Forza. And .5 Meter length available.

[sandyk]

But for those folks doing the taping thing - much better to go with a completely separate data and power line like the Forza. And .5 Meter length available.

 

It's still better to isolate the +5V right at the PC's USB -A plug, or if using a front panel USB port, right at the motherboard plug from the front panel USB ports, or in the case of a SOtM USB card, at the +5V isolation switch.

A degree of RF/EMI from the PC's SMPS +5V supply can still couple into the black wire (0 volts/earth return) as they are a twisted pair.

[logicsound]

It's still better to isolate the +5V right at the PC's USB -A plug, or if using a front panel USB port, right at the motherboard plug from the front panel USB ports, or in the case of a SOtM USB card, at the +5V isolation switch.

A degree of RF/EMI from the PC's SMPS +5V supply can still couple into the black wire (0 volts/earth return) as they are a twisted pair.

 

Well I had SOtM USB board and didn't notice a bit of difference flipping off the switch vs a split cable (Light Harmonic). I mean theoretically yes, but practically no - you're over analyzing this. Besides the taping maneuver is just a testing standby (God I hope!).

 

Edit BTW I use a LPS on my PC not a SMPS. That does make a difference. ;-)

[ElviaCaprice]

Well I had SOtM USB board and didn't notice a bit of difference flipping off the switch vs a split cable (Light Harmonic). I mean theoretically yes, but practically no - you're over analyzing this. Besides the taping maneuver is just a testing standby (God I hope!).

 

Edit BTW I use a LPS on my PC not a SMPS. That does make a difference. ;-)

 

Why would you think it needs to be a standby if you never remove that USB cable from the PC's USB A plug? Heck of a lot cheaper and works just as good, plus you have a good chord for future endeavors.

[satfrat]

It would be cheaper to buy an El Cheapo OS at $69 btw.

 

$94 actually with the $25 shipping charges included from China.

[lmitche]

You can negotiate with the Chinese eBay sellers. They will combine items into a single shipment as well.

[sandyk]

Well I had SOtM USB board and didn't notice a bit of difference flipping off the switch vs a split cable (Light Harmonic). I mean theoretically yes, but practically no - you're over analyzing this. Besides the taping maneuver is just a testing standby (God I hope!).

 

Edit BTW I use a LPS on my PC not a SMPS. That does make a difference. ;-)

 

No, I am not overanalysing this. You made a general statement.

I base my findings on what I have previously seen on a C.R.O. (among other things.)

If you had stated that you were using a Linear PSU, I wouldn't have made that statement, as in that case there is no SMPS noise to couple into the USB 0 volts line .

[logicsound]

No, I am not overanalysing this. You made a general statement.

I base my findings on what I have previously seen on a C.R.O. (among other things.)

If you had stated that you were using a Linear PSU, I wouldn't have made that statement, as in that case there is no SMPS noise to couple into the USB 0 volts line .

 

Well You are the master of the obvious and make a lot of assumptions (how does that go when you assume>?) about peoples system. As you make your pretentious AR proclamations.

 

Another BS armchair 'audio engineer' speaking out his ass.

 

Enjoy your tape glued USB connected cable abortions.

[logicsound]

This is why I left this jackass forum 4 yrs ago. I see nothing has changed - the full range from the vaulted iPhone itunes 128kb MP3 fed iDACs (held as the epitome of audio standards) to AR JA's like snadyk with his 4 Regens serialed but still worrying about a .000001 of SMPS 'noise' across his monstrously noisy (hey wiz read JS posts why don't you!) USB feed. Then clogging his USB connection with tape glue. Insanity.

 

Back to Headfi I go.

[sandyk]

Well You are the master of the obvious and make a lot of assumptions (how does that go when you assume>?) about peoples system. As you make your pretentious AR proclamations.

 

Another BS armchair 'audio engineer' speaking out his ass.

 

Enjoy your tape glued USB connected cable abortions.

 

Charming.

If you had been reading what I have posted on many occasions, you would know that I remove the USB-A plug, and fit a solder type USB-A without the red +5V wire connected, then fit heatshrink over it..I have also been posting, along with several others, about improved USB power supplies for several years now, and well before the SOtM USB and iFi USB became available. In fact, around 4 years several members including sjoc 2000 and myself reported that inserting a series resistor in the 0 volts return line resulted in a SQ improvement, just as John Swenson has done recently in his Amber Regen.

I also use a single Amber Regen given to me as a gift by Alex C., powered via a low noise +9V Linear PSU.

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f6-dac-digital-analog-conversion/continuing-pursuit-power-supply-improvements-and-improved-digital-analogue-converter-performance-14165/

 

[Nikhil]

I ordered an Array filter for just those reasons - clean up noise the Meanwell may be injecting back into the AC line and bide time until the Uptone mystery PSU is available.

 

I've also ordered the Curious USB cables. Waiting on all these goodies to arrive.

 

Awesome! Please share your findings when you get your Array Filter.

I really would like to know how it sounds from others.

 

 

It would be cheaper to buy an El Cheapo OS at $69 btw.

 

You are right - if price is the only consideration.

I do think that the Array Filter is pretty good in it's own right - regardless of price.

[j3294]

satfrat, some interesting news for you. I have been using the Regen with the Array Solutions cable filter these past few days and I have to say I am not missing my LPS at all. I tried a little back and forth last night and could only barely notice a difference in sound.

 

The Array Solutions cable filter might actually appeal to some as sounding better. The sound is a little more airier and transients are a little "springier" - snare drums, rim shots, brushwork, upright bass, etc. sound a little more accented for example. With the LPS back in the sound was just a little denser with a touch less shimmer. That's about all I could note in my listening.

 

The Array cable filter makes the Meanwell SMPS a pretty decent option regardless of price. Based on what I am hearing in my setup, I would not have a problem recommending it to anyone looking at alternatives.

 

As always .... YMMV.

 

So it would be possible to multiply this improvement if this Array cable filter is connected in front of a power distributor and make improvement to all the sockets?

[4est]

You are correct in that it is likely a good product. I have debated on purchasing one several times since reading it is J Smith's book. My point was more towards "why use a SMPS band aid when you can use something that does not have that issue for less"?

You are right - if price is the only consideration.

I do think that the Array Filter is pretty good in it's own right - regardless of price.

[Nikhil]

So it would be possible to multiply this improvement if this Array cable filter is connected in front of a power distributor and make improvement to all the sockets?

 

Not really sure about this but my experience has been the effect is less once you have some sort of conditioning in place.

 

You are correct in that it is likely a good product. I have debated on purchasing one several times since reading it is J Smith's book. My point was more towards "why use a SMPS band aid when you can use something that does not have that issue for less"?

 

Good point. Although I'm not sure if an SMPS is a bad thing by itself. There was a discussion on another thread where a Teddy Pardo PS was pretty much the same thing - an SMPS plus a filter.

[sandyk]

. My point was more towards "why use a SMPS band aid when you can use something that does not have that issue for less"?

 

Exactly.

Can it also get rid of that consumer grade SMPS designed in leakage problem, that sees the DC output of the supply having an AC voltage of up to half the mains supply voltage and frequency, along with the noisy HF ripple on it between it and Earth ? It's not only the SMPS switching frequency and it's harmonics getting back into the AC mains supply that matters.