Euphony OS w/Stylus player setup and issues thread

[Gbn]

On 22/3/2019 at 18:22, Holzohr said:

 

È possibile installare la versione di prova su hd/ssd. L'ho fatto avviando una chiavetta USB Ubuntu e lo strumento/programma Disks . Prima è necessario decomprimere l'immagine eufonia e spostarla su una seconda chiavetta USB.

 

Al momento ho installato Euphony su un SSD Optane da 32GB. Euphony ha sostituito un'installazione principale di Windows Server 2019 con Fidelizer e AO. Tutto quello che posso dire è che non sono dell'umore giusto per passare di nuovo a Windows.

 

Alcune foto:

[Gbn]

On 22/3/2019 at 18:22, Holzohr said:

 

È possibile installare la versione di prova su hd/ssd. L'ho fatto avviando una chiavetta USB Ubuntu e lo strumento/programma Disks . Prima è necessario decomprimere l'immagine eufonia e spostarla su una seconda chiavetta USB.

 

Al momento ho installato Euphony su un SSD Optane da 32GB. Euphony ha sostituito un'installazione principale di Windows Server 2019 con Fidelizer e AO. Tutto quello che posso dire è che non sono dell'umore giusto per passare di nuovo a Windows.

 

Alcune foto:

Thanks for your valuable advice, I installed it on the SSD and it is actually better, thanks again

[AudioDoctor]

On 1/19/2022 at 11:49 AM, davide256 said:

So I finally have 3 computing devices of reasonable CPU power to play with. And probably to no one’s surprise who is an HQPlayer fan, Roon which sounds “ok” using HQPe to NAA sounds MUCH better if you can run Roon server to separate HQPe server to NAA. Is there a way to duplicate this with Euphony Stylus?

Stylus server > separate HQPe server > NAA

my setup

i3 NUC > i5 PC > Atom PC

 

I found the same thing when I separated Roon and HQPe to their own machines.I still like the sound of HQP by itself more.

 

I don't think there is a way to separate the pieces out from Euphony.

[FooFighter]

On 1/21/2022 at 12:11 AM, AudioDoctor said:

 

I found the same thing when I separated Roon and HQPe to their own machines.I still like the sound of HQP by itself more.

 

I don't think there is a way to separate the pieces out from Euphony.

Just reading through the thread as I was also looking forward to demoing Euphony - unfortunately both my MacBook Pro I5 and Mac mini M1 didn't work (code incompatibility in first case and no alternative boot option in 2nd case).

 

Now reading that it's not possible to address separate HQPlayer servers in Euphony seems to be kind of a bummer.

 

I wanted to try Roon Core connected to HQPlayer Server on a dedicated purist Linux platform (like Euphony) and see if the differences between HQPlayer standalone and Roon-to-HQPlayer are getting smaller.

The SQ difference between both modes is quite shocking to me.

 

[davide256]

1 hour ago, FooFighter said:

Just reading through the thread as I was also looking forward to demoing Euphony - unfortunately both my MacBook Pro I5 and Mac mini M1 didn't work (code incompatibility in first case and no alternative boot option in 2nd case).

 

Now reading that it's not possible to address separate HQPlayer servers in Euphony seems to be kind of a bummer.

 

I wanted to try Roon Core connected to HQPlayer Server on a dedicated purist Linux platform (like Euphony) and see if the differences between HQPlayer standalone and Roon-to-HQPlayer are getting smaller.

The SQ difference between both modes is quite shocking to me.

 

You can do this with Roon under Euphony as its a built in feature of Roon, just enter ip address in Roon HQP setting option.

But current version of Stylus server/player won't send music to a separate HQP server,

[FooFighter]

18 minutes ago, davide256 said:

You can do this with Roon under Euphony as its a built in feature of Roon, just enter ip address in Roon HQP setting option.

But current version of Stylus server/player won't send music to a separate HQP server,

Thx Dave!

What's the consens btw regarding price-value Summus vs self-built solution?

Is there something like a top 5 list like for the NAA devices in Miska's  HQPlayer thread?

E.g Summus > Roon Rock i7 (with Euphony instead of Roon only) >... 

[FooFighter]

Are AMD CPUs supported or better Intel i5/i7?

[PavelDosko]

Yes

[davide256]

7 hours ago, FooFighter said:

Thx Dave!

What's the consens btw regarding price-value Summus vs self-built solution?

Is there something like a top 5 list like for the NAA devices in Miska's  HQPlayer thread?

E.g Summus > Roon Rock i7 (with Euphony instead of Roon only) >... 

this is what Miska recommended to me for NAA, its 5v powered so no voltage step down conversion on USB out that could degrade what you get from a good but

higher voltage DC power supply. Boot from USB NAA image is painless to get up and working

 

https://up-shop.org/up-gateway-atom-x5-z8350-w-4g-memory-32g-emmc-board-w-vesa-plate.html

 

This is also popular, runs on 7v DC. I recall some chatter about more headaches with setting it up because default install config needs change for more than 1 onboard

ethernet port

 

https://fit-iot.com/web/products/fitlet2/

 

haven't seen too many Summus users, folks that have money gravitate to the Taiko servers used with their player software of choice

[FooFighter]

Yep, I am yet owning the UP Gateway.

Question was really regarding a more affordable Euphony server hardware.

If HQPlayer Server is  running separately anyway then the requirements for the Euphony server are far lower I suppose, for example hosting only a Roon Core plus the Euphony management.

 

Endpoint can be my existing HQPlayer NAA.

 

Wondering about the sonic advantages if Euphony OS is "only" hosting the traditional components and playback chain is going from the Euphony-hosted Roon to separate HQPlayer and existing NAA.

That might sound identical to what I yet have right now without Euphony?

 

In other words SQ advantages come into play only when using the Stylus backend connected to the DAC?

[davide256]

10 minutes ago, FooFighter said:

Yep, I am yet owning the UP Gateway.

Question was really regarding a more affordable Euphony server hardware.

If HQPlayer Server is  running separately anyway then the requirements for the Euphony server are far lower I suppose, for example hosting only a Roon Core plus the Euphony management.

 

Endpoint can be my existing HQPlayer NAA.

 

Wondering about the sonic advantages if Euphony OS is "only" hosting the traditional components and playback chain is going from the Euphony-hosted Roon to separate HQPlayer and existing NAA.

That might sound identical to what I yet have right now without Euphony?

 

In other words SQ advantages come into play only when using the Stylus backend connected to the DAC?

@AudioDoctor care to opine?

[AudioDoctor]

4 hours ago, FooFighter said:

Yep, I am yet owning the UP Gateway.

Question was really regarding a more affordable Euphony server hardware.

If HQPlayer Server is  running separately anyway then the requirements for the Euphony server are far lower I suppose, for example hosting only a Roon Core plus the Euphony management.

 

Endpoint can be my existing HQPlayer NAA.

 

Wondering about the sonic advantages if Euphony OS is "only" hosting the traditional components and playback chain is going from the Euphony-hosted Roon to separate HQPlayer and existing NAA.

That might sound identical to what I yet have right now without Euphony?

 

In other words SQ advantages come into play only when using the Stylus backend connected to the DAC?

 

Are you able to get Roon on Euphony to output to a separate HQPlayer device? Personally, I think that is an overpriced Roon device as it negates all the advantages Euphony has over Roon, and that's not using Roon but using Stylus instead. However, I can't tell you how to use your stuff, so you do you. I found the best sound quality when using Stylus either by itself or via HQPlayer and leaving Roon out of the equation entirely.

[FooFighter]

17 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

Are you able to get Roon on Euphony to output to a separate HQPlayer device? Personally, I think that is an overpriced Roon device as it negates all the advantages Euphony has over Roon, and that's not using Roon but using Stylus instead. However, I can't tell you how to use your stuff, so you do you. I found the best sound quality when using Stylus either by itself or via HQPlayer and leaving Roon out of the equation entirely.

thx for your honest answer.

I don't have Euphony yet, am just looking for improvements, so all good.

 

The point is that I want to use Roon as a frontend but improve the SQ behind it.

I am yet having an HQPlayer setup running as you might have read.

But the presentation running HQPlayer through Roon vs HQPlayer directly is veiled in favour of direct HQPlayer which is more fleshed out, clearer - I am yet sending harsher filters in HQPlayer to get closer to the non-Roon-presentation but I am feeling compromised knowing how it sounds out of HQPlayer directly.

 

As I now understand that it's not changing anything if I am running Roon just from a different platform my next question is if a Stylus endpoint is sounding better than HQPlayer out of Roon?

Can HQPlayer still be added after the Stylus endpoint or is it an either-Stylus-or-HQPlayer-decision? 

 

 

[AudioDoctor]

2 hours ago, FooFighter said:

thx for your honest answer.

I don't have Euphony yet, am just looking for improvements, so all good.

 

The point is that I want to use Roon as a frontend but improve the SQ behind it.

I am yet having an HQPlayer setup running as you might have read.

But the presentation running HQPlayer through Roon vs HQPlayer directly is veiled in favour of direct HQPlayer which is more fleshed out, clearer - I am yet sending harsher filters in HQPlayer to get closer to the non-Roon-presentation but I am feeling compromised knowing how it sounds out of HQPlayer directly.

 

As I now understand that it's not changing anything if I am running Roon just from a different platform my next question is if a Stylus endpoint is sounding better than HQPlayer out of Roon?

Can HQPlayer still be added after the Stylus endpoint or is it an either-Stylus-or-HQPlayer-decision? 

 

 

 

I haven't tried a Stylus endpoint yet, but I do have HQP NAAs around the house and i much prefer those to a direct USB connection from the HQP server. The Stylus endpoint works much like the NAA, I think, after that it goes to the DAC only. If I were using Euphony right now, I would user Stylus > HQP > either an NAA or a Stylus endpoint.

[al2813]

5 hours ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

I haven't tried a Stylus endpoint yet, but I do have HQP NAAs around the house and i much prefer those to a direct USB connection from the HQP server. The Stylus endpoint works much like the NAA, I think, after that it goes to the DAC only. If I were using Euphony right now, I would user Stylus > HQP > either an NAA or a Stylus endpoint.

I am exactly in the same spot as I will be introducing a NAA as my endpoint. However I understand from the Stylus manual that if I choose HQP embedded, I will need yet another machine elsewhere to run the Roon core (in order to use Roon as the control SW)? 

[AudioDoctor]

30 minutes ago, al2813 said:

I am exactly in the same spot as I will be introducing a NAA as my endpoint. However I understand from the Stylus manual that if I choose HQP embedded, I will need yet another machine elsewhere to run the Roon core (in order to use Roon as the control SW)? 

 

not necessarily, they can run on the same computer. I don't recommend it, and I don't even recommend Roon, but you do you.

[al2813]

1 hour ago, AudioDoctor said:

 

not necessarily, they can run on the same computer. I don't recommend it, and I don't even recommend Roon, but you do you.

 

I am not a big fan of Roon either (this is why I moved to Stylus player) but I will be trying out the IFI ZEN Stream with a highly customized LPS. The Zen stream can run stand alone or as UPNP/DLNA/NAA/Roon client. With Euphony Stylus player I can only do UPNP but then Stylus does not show bit rates and format (although my DAC does show them and trying with a RPI it is seems to be bit perfect). Was then considering to try NAA with Hqplayer but then I do not have a control app (the HQplayer one looks too basic to my taste). 

[FooFighter]

17 minutes ago, al2813 said:

 

I am not a big fan of Roon either (this is why I moved to Stylus player) but I will be trying out the IFI ZEN Stream with a highly customized LPS. The Zen stream can run stand alone or as UPNP/DLNA/NAA/Roon client. With Euphony Stylus player I can only do UPNP but then Stylus does not show bit rates and format (although my DAC does show them and trying with a RPI it is seems to be bit perfect). Was then considering to try NAA with Hqplayer but then I do not have a control app (the HQplayer one looks too basic to my taste). 

that's my biggest gripe with basically most audio player besides Roon and the streaming service native players.

Their library management is very basic and if you like to try new music then all these basic local library players won't do the job.

But if SQ is the main goal, you are playing from local library only or know exactly what you want to play then this seems to be necessary, have seen even worse interfaces on TOTL audiophile DAPs like L&P P6...

 

Regarding Zen Stream I can highly recommend it - am using it as my secondary streamer connected to SPDIF while my main streamer is running on an UP Gateway as NAA.

I was wondering if my big setup with dedicated NAA and 1,5Mhz upsampling is really worth the fuss vs putting that Zen Stream just there and let it do everything you like but within its limitations of up to 32/386 and DSD256

[al2813]

2 minutes ago, FooFighter said:

that's my biggest gripe with basically most audio player besides Roon and the streaming service native players.

Their library management is very basic and if you like to try new music then all these basic local library players won't do the job.

But if SQ is the main goal then this seems to be necessary, have seen even worse interfaces on TOTL audiophile DAPs like L&P P6...

 

Regarding Zen Stream I can highly recommend it - am using it as my secondary streamer connected to SPDIF while my main streamer is running on an UP Gateway as NAA.

I was wondering if my big setup with dedicated NAA and 1,5Mhz upsampling is really worth the fuss vs putting that Zen Stream just there and let it do everything you like but within its limitations of up to 32/386 and DSD256

 

I am not that keen on upsampling (unlike most of those who go HQPlayer). But i do understand HQplayer is brilliant even if you do not upsample

[stefano_mbp]

17 minutes ago, al2813 said:

Was then considering to try NAA with Hqplayer but then I do not have a control app (the HQplayer one looks too basic to my taste). 

You could try HQPlayer Embedded in an UPNP based setup.

Mine is:

Minimserver as UPNP mediaserver

Bubbleupnpserver for renderer OpenHome compatibility 

Lumïn app as control point

HQPlayer Embedded as renderer

HQP NAA (RoPieeeXL) as end point

This setup works for local music and Qobuz streaming service (thanks to the recent HQP functionality)

 

[al2813]

10 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

You could try HQPlayer Embedded in an UPNP based setup.

Mine is:

Minimserver as UPNP mediaserver

Bubbleupnpserver for renderer OpenHome compatibility 

Lumïn app as control point

HQPlayer Embedded as renderer

HQP NAA (RoPieeeXL) as end point

This setup works for local music and Qobuz streaming service (thanks to the recent HQP functionality)

 

 

Can you describe this setup in more details (i.e. where do you run HQPlayer embedded)? 

[stefano_mbp]

2 minutes ago, al2813 said:

Can you describe this setup in more details (i.e. where do you run HQPlayer embedded)?

Music archive is on a LaCie 8TB usb external hdd

MinimServer2 (Full license with MinimStreamer) and Bubbleupnpserver run on Intel Nuc8i3/16GB ram/Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS

Lumin app on iPhone/iPad 

HQPlayer Embedded runs (for now) on Intel Nuc10i3/16GB ram, it boots from usb stick.

HQP NAA runs on:

- raspberry pi4/4GB ram using RoPieeeXL 

- SOtM sMS200 Neo

 

[stefano_mbp]

14 minutes ago, al2813 said:

Can you describe this setup in more details (i.e. where do you run HQPlayer embedded)?

…. as control point you can also run

- Bubbleupnp or MConnect on Android (no need of Bubbleupnpserver)

- Linn app or Linn Kazoo on iOS /iPadOS (Bubbleupnpserver is needed)

[Lukasluis]

1 hour ago, al2813 said:

 

I am not a big fan of Roon either (this is why I moved to Stylus player) but I will be trying out the IFI ZEN Stream with a highly customized LPS. The Zen stream can run stand alone or as UPNP/DLNA/NAA/Roon client. With Euphony Stylus player I can only do UPNP but then Stylus does not show bit rates and format (although my DAC does show them and trying with a RPI it is seems to be bit perfect). Was then considering to try NAA with Hqplayer but then I do not have a control app (the HQplayer one looks too basic to my taste). 

Ifi Zenstream, it is! 

[al2813]

39 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

Music archive is on a LaCie 8TB usb external hdd

MinimServer2 (Full license with MinimStreamer) and Bubbleupnpserver run on Intel Nuc8i3/16GB ram/Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS

Lumin app on iPhone/iPad 

HQPlayer Embedded runs (for now) on Intel Nuc10i3/16GB ram, it boots from usb stick.

HQP NAA runs on:

- raspberry pi4/4GB ram using RoPieeeXL 

- SOtM sMS200 Neo

 

 

Understood - it confirms I still need 2 machines which I am trying to avoid.....

Have you compared this with Stylus? Also interested in your choice to use Hqplayer as renderer and not player.