Yesterday was a sad day

[Rt66indierock]

I opened up the October issue of Hi-fi news & Record Review since I was traveling. to my dismay the following albums were reviewed; Alice's Restaurant (Arlo Gutherie), Pearl (Janis Joplin), The Complete Bearsville Albums Collection (Foghat) and Album 1700 (Peter, Paul and Mary).

 

Personally I read the record reviews in audio magazines as a guide of what not to buy and it saddens me to think anyone would sit down and listen to a 180 gram remaster of Alice's Restaurant. It is music for Thanksgiving preparation with a kitchen full of family. The others will require rethinking my travel playlists from the sixties and seventies.

[Cycleman]

I know we're an eclectic bunch here at "Computer" Audiophile, but too often 180-gram vinyl seems like a fetish.

[bluesman]

I can't disagree with the sentiment that a better slab o' vinyl won't make anything about Alice's restaurant better. But that album was never intended to be the stuff of audiophile dreams, and the story behind it is actually pretty cool. He actually did drive up to Great Barrington on Thanksgiving '65 to visit his friends Alice and Ray Brock, and he really did take out the garbage for them. The great Barrington dump was closed for the holiday, so he and another guy threw the garbage into a ditch used by locals for that purpose. He was arrested for littering, and that arrest kept him from being drafted.

 

I bet most of you don't know that the official timing of the title song is exactly the same length as the gap in the Nixon Watergate tapes, or that the person who played the blind judge presiding over his littering case in the movie "Alice's Restaurant" was the real judge from the real case (Judge James Hannon). We didn't think much of the movie, though - we saw it once when it first came out.

 

Why anyone would waste the time, effort and money to make an audiophile pressing of this record is beyond me. The album has great impact - it's funny, makes a social statement, and tells a great story that happens to be true. Arlo Gurthrie's a pretty interesting guy. Here's what I think is one of his best quips: “I thought I would be governor of Massachusetts. I stood on a pile of my old albums and said, I’m the only one with a record to stand on.”

 

If you've never heard it, grab a CD or an original vinyl disc - they're less than $10 and very entertaining. But I caution strongly against springing for a 180 gm pressing, as this is simply not that kind of record.

[Jud]

I can't disagree with the sentiment that a better slab o' vinyl won't make anything about Alice's restaurant better. But that album was never intended to be the stuff of audiophile dreams, and the story behind it is actually pretty cool. He actually did drive up to Great Barrington on Thanksgiving '65 to visit his friends Alice and Ray Brock, and he really did take out the garbage for them. The great Barrington dump was closed for the holiday, so he and another guy threw the garbage into a ditch used by locals for that purpose. He was arrested for littering, and that arrest kept him from being drafted.

 

I bet most of you don't know that the official timing of the title song is exactly the same length as the gap in the Nixon Watergate tapes, or that the person who played the blind judge presiding over his littering case in the movie "Alice's Restaurant" was the real judge from the real case (Judge James Hannon). We didn't think much of the movie, though - we saw it once when it first came out.

 

Why anyone would waste the time, effort and money to make an audiophile pressing of this record is beyond me. The album has great impact - it's funny, makes a social statement, and tells a great story that happens to be true. Arlo Gurthrie's a pretty interesting guy. Here's what I think is one of his best quips: “I thought I would be governor of Massachusetts. I stood on a pile of my old albums and said, I’m the only one with a record to stand on.”

 

If you've never heard it, grab a CD or an original vinyl disc - they're less than $10 and very entertaining. But I caution strongly against springing for a 180 gm pressing, as this is simply not that kind of record.

 

What's great is that Arlo at nearly 70 years of age is still among us.

 

Yes it is sad that such a huge fraction of "audiophile" stuff is so old, and that we old farts are so stuck in the era of our musical youth we help by our buying behavior to make it so.

[NOMBEDES]

Maybe some of the old farts remember when music was a social force.

Maybe some of the old farts remember when a university campus was a war zone, not a gender neutral swamp of entitled brats complaining about safe spaces at $50K a year. (4 Dead in Ohio comes to mind.)

Maybe getting rid of the draft has unfocused the younger generations collective mind. (bet, Bush II would have thought twice about invading a hapless Iraq if the draft age population was marching down to the White House.

 

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

[wgscott]

...

If you've never heard it, grab a CD or an original vinyl disc - they're less than $10 and very entertaining. But I caution strongly against springing for a 180 gm pressing, as this is simply not that kind of record.

 

When in college, my then GF dragged me to go see him, and I guess it was ok, but the thing I remember the most is somehow my mother's address was put on his mailing list, and for about the next 10 or 15 years she got this weird, borderline psychotic newsletter from him.

[wgscott]

a gender neutral swamp of entitled brats complaining about safe spaces at $50K a year.

 

I teach Generation Wuss for a living.

[wgscott]

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

 

Doing it now, sir. However, I only have the Pearl Jam version.

[NOMBEDES]

When in college, my then GF dragged me to go see him, and I guess it was ok, but the thing I remember the most is somehow my mother's address was put on his mailing list, and for about the next 10 or 15 years she got this weird, borderline psychotic newsletter from him.

 

 

God, that is a funny story. My son in law used to hack his parents answering machine, and record very odd messages. Not a very amusing story unless you knew that his father was a high ranking Department of Defense Official......

[gmgraves]

Maybe some of the old farts remember when music was a social force.

Maybe some of the old farts remember when a university campus was a war zone, not a gender neutral swamp of entitled brats complaining about safe spaces at $50K a year. (4 Dead in Ohio comes to mind.)

Maybe getting rid of the draft has unfocused the younger generations collective mind. (bet, Bush II would have thought twice about invading a hapless Iraq if the draft age population was marching down to the White House.

 

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

 

Actually as bad a president as Bush Jr. was (we've had a string of 'em, haven't we? More to come - no matter which candidate wins, the American people lose - just as they did with Carter, Bush Sr., Bill Clinton, Bush Jr., Obama, and now either Hillary or Trump. The problem is that the people who SHOULD be running for president don't want the job, so we get the dregs of American Politics), it was not Bush's doing per se that got us into war in Iraq. He was just following orders. The military/industrial complex has kept us constantly at war for the past 30 years. If it wasn't the Balkans, it was Somalia, then Iraq, then Afghanistan. Isis is next then probably Iran before too long and eventually we're going to get into it with N. Korea. See, war makes money for large corporations like Lockheed-Martin, BEA, Northrup, General Dynamics, Newport News Shipbuilding and Dry dock, etc. The more war, the more money. And both political parties are in this - up to their corrupt necks as is the British government, and half of Europe!

[NOMBEDES]

Actually as bad a president as Bush Jr. was (we've had a string of 'em, haven't we? More to come - no matter which candidate wins), it was not his doing per se that got us into war in Iraq. He was just following orders. The military/industrial complex has kept us constantly at war for the past 30 years. If it wasn't the Balkans, it was Somalia, then Iraq, then Afghanistan. Isis is next then probably Iran before too long and eventually we're going to get into it with N. Korea. See, war makes money for large corporations like Lockheed-Martin, BEA, Northrup, Boeing, etc. The more war, the more money. And both political parties are in this - up to their corrupt necks as is the British government, and half of Europe!

 

 

Word.

[Jud]

Maybe some of the old farts remember when music was a social force.

Maybe some of the old farts remember when a university campus was a war zone, not a gender neutral swamp of entitled brats complaining about safe spaces at $50K a year. (4 Dead in Ohio comes to mind.)

Maybe getting rid of the draft has unfocused the younger generations collective mind. (bet, Bush II would have thought twice about invading a hapless Iraq if the draft age population was marching down to the White House.

 

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

 

Good post.

[Jud]

Maybe some of the old farts remember when music was a social force.

Maybe some of the old farts remember when a university campus was a war zone, not a gender neutral swamp of entitled brats complaining about safe spaces at $50K a year. (4 Dead in Ohio comes to mind.)

Maybe getting rid of the draft has unfocused the younger generations collective mind. (bet, Bush II would have thought twice about invading a hapless Iraq if the draft age population was marching down to the White House.

 

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

 

Interesting. I think most of us won't listen to the socially relevant music of our time. We call it "gangsta rap" and claim it isn't even music.

[NOMBEDES]

Interesting. I think most of us won't listen to the socially relevant music of our time. We call it "gangsta rap" and claim it isn't even music.

 

 

Very good point. If white folks were being shot by ill trained police officers* we might have Taylor Swift on the ramparts!

 

 

*Believe me, I have attended the same training as police and military. I think many of the problems we are having are a result of faulty training. Many good officers have no idea how to deal with a disturbed person. Many good officers have no idea how to calm a confused situation. We need to re train many police agencies and we need to re evaluate the basis for the training that is in existence now.

[gmgraves]

Very good point. If white folks were being shot by ill trained police officers* we might have Taylor Swift on the ramparts!

 

 

*Believe me, I have attended the same training as police and military. I think many of the problems we are having are a result of faulty training. Many good officers have no idea how to deal with a disturbed person. Many good officers have no idea how to calm a confused situation. We need to re train many police agencies and we need to re evaluate the basis for the training that is in existence now.

 

What we need to do is change the way minorities and other "disenfranchised" see themselves and how the rest of society sees them, so that they stop looking on themselves and the rest of society stops seeing them as victims. One of the great problems of our society (as I see it) is that in their quest for the votes of the so-called "downtrodden", the left in this society, has taught generations that their only hope is the noblesse oblige of the ruling classes. This drives the unfortunates in our society to look on crime as their salvation from being dependent on society's largess. This naturally engenders a "them vs us" mentality with powers that be and the underprivileged. This causes the erroneous attitude with law enforcement that every encounter with minorities is most likely going to end bad.....and so it does - too often! In any of these encounters that have gotten so much press lately, I'll guarantee that if the "citizen" involved had been white, there would have been a far different and less tragic result. We need to fix the problem by changing perceptions, not by applying a bandaid in the guise of more sensitivity training for law enforcement. When law enforcement and minorities can approach each other without the assumption that one is bent on harming the other, then this problem will go away. IOW the liberal progressive notion of patronage is not the answer.

[firedog]

Alice's Restaurant: I like the movie, think it is quite entertaining. Worth a stream for those that haven't seen it. Great period piece, too.

[anji12305]

What we need to do is change the way minorities and other "disenfranchised" see themselves and how the rest of society sees them, so that they stop looking on themselves and the rest of society stops seeing them as victims. One of the great problems of our society (as I see it) is that in their quest for the votes of the so-called "downtrodden", the left in this society, has taught generations that their only hope is the noblesse oblige of the ruling classes. This drives the unfortunates in our society to look on crime as their salvation from being dependent on society's largess. This naturally engenders a "them vs us" mentality with powers that be and the underprivileged. This causes the erroneous attitude with law enforcement that every encounter with minorities is most likely going to end bad.....and so it does - too often! In any of these encounters that have gotten so much press lately, I'll guarantee that if the "citizen" involved had been white, there would have been a far different and less tragic result. We need to fix the problem by changing perceptions, not by applying a bandaid in the guise of more sensitivity training for law enforcement. When law enforcement and minorities can approach each other without the assumption that one is bent on harming the other, then this problem will go away. IOW the liberal progressive notion of patronage is not the answer.

You're out of your depth, off topic and ranting...again.

 

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

[Priaptor]

What we need to do is change the way minorities and other "disenfranchised" see themselves and how the rest of society sees them, so that they stop looking on themselves and the rest of society stops seeing them as victims. One of the great problems of our society (as I see it) is that in their quest for the votes of the so-called "downtrodden", the left in this society, has taught generations that their only hope is the noblesse oblige of the ruling classes. This drives the unfortunates in our society to look on crime as their salvation from being dependent on society's largess. This naturally engenders a "them vs us" mentality with powers that be and the underprivileged. This causes the erroneous attitude with law enforcement that every encounter with minorities is most likely going to end bad.....and so it does - too often! In any of these encounters that have gotten so much press lately, I'll guarantee that if the "citizen" involved had been white, there would have been a far different and less tragic result. We need to fix the problem by changing perceptions, not by applying a bandaid in the guise of more sensitivity training for law enforcement. When law enforcement and minorities can approach each other without the assumption that one is bent on harming the other, then this problem will go away. IOW the liberal progressive notion of patronage is not the answer.

 

Excellent post. Couldn't agree more.

 

One of the most fascinating anecdotal examples of what you posted are the business and benevolent acts of a black man and former great basketball player, Magic Johnson. He basically applied the beliefs of Jack Kemp, which were never enacted, to those neighborhoods he felt were ripe for pickings. Lo and behold, he turned around blighted crime filled neighborhoods with vital low crime good business neighborhoods where crime was basically eradicated; the latter nothing to do with the police. And Magic is one of the nicest guys and a "liberal" Democrat to boot; yes hard for me to swallow that such a great person is a liberal Democrat, but he is what I like to call an "old time Democrat"

 

The answer to these blighted communities as you say does NOT lie with DC, at least not in the manner we have witnessed for the last 65 years.

[gmgraves]

You're out of your depth, off topic and ranting...again.

 

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

Perhaps, but at least *I* am aware that the traditional solutions aren't working any better today than they were 50 years ago, yet so called "progressive" liberals have no new ideas and keep pushing the same methodologies, even though they have shown continually that they don't work. What's that definition of insanity, again? Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different result? Looks a lot like a definition of so called "progressives" to me!

[Jud]

Perhaps, but at least *I* am aware that the traditional solutions aren't working any better today than they were 50 years ago, yet so called "progressive" liberals have no new ideas and keep pushing the same methodologies, even though they have shown continually that they don't work. What's that definition of insanity, again? Doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different result? Looks a lot like a definition of so called "progressives" to me!

 

I think what doesn't work is expecting *any* global set of instant doctrinally rigid (and helplessly inconsistent) solutions to be effective, progressive, conservative, what-have-you.

 

Now that's settled, may we get off the political kick and back to our more enjoyable discussion?

[mordante]

actually as bad a president as bush jr. Was (we've had a string of 'em, haven't we? More to come - no matter which candidate wins, the american people lose - just as they did with carter, bush sr., bill clinton, bush jr., obama, and now either hillary or trump. The problem is that the people who should be running for president don't want the job, so we get the dregs of american politics), it was not bush's doing per se that got us into war in iraq. He was just following orders. The military/industrial complex has kept us constantly at war for the past 30 years. If it wasn't the balkans, it was somalia, then iraq, then afghanistan. Isis is next then probably iran before too long and eventually we're going to get into it with n. Korea. See, war makes money for large corporations like lockheed-martin, bea, northrup, general dynamics, newport news shipbuilding and dry dock, etc. The more war, the more money. And both political parties are in this - up to their corrupt necks as is the british government, and half of europe!

 

qft

[christopher3393]

Arlo Guthrie's granddaughter:

 

 

from the end of a Rolling Stone Interview, "Arlo Guthrie Looks Back on 50 Years of 'Alice's Restaurant'"

I love that all my kids play and sing. I don't care if they do it professionally or not. My father told me once when I was very young, "Music will be your best friend. Learn to play the guitar music will be your best friend." And he was absolutely right. It had nothing to do if it was professional or back porch picking. It had nothing to do with the genre of music. It had to do with speaking a language that anyone could understand around the world. And I believe that, and so I'm happy to see my kids and grandkids participate in that.

 

That's what matters to Arlo.

[Priaptor]

I think what doesn't work is expecting *any* global set of instant doctrinally rigid (and helplessly inconsistent) solutions to be effective, progressive, conservative, what-have-you.

 

Now that's settled, may we get off the political kick and back to our more enjoyable discussion?

 

Not so sure of that.

 

Plus why do you ALWAYS determine "when it's time to get back in topic"? When a thread takes a turn you don't like. Your bias shows. You couldn't asked to go back in topic long ago but chose to wait until graves made a post you obviously don't agree with despite your claimed neutrality!

 

Now back on topic

[anji12305]

Maybe, just maybe it's because people who have an interest in music don't come here to have the latest half-baked tropes trotted out at every turn.

 

Those of us that read this forum more often have been exposed to the same glurge have a reduced tolerance for it.

 

http://www.politirant.com

 

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[Allan F]

Maybe some of the old farts should play Dylan's Masters of War loud....real loud.

Personally, I think Dylan's 'With God On Our Side' was even more powerful.