Ryelands Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 17 hours ago, Superdad said: Well there you go! A while back, I made up two short USB cables with a toggle switch in the Gnd lines (PC > Intona > I2S board). The idea was that, once the post-boot handshake was complete, I could break the Gnd lines. SQ was excellent but, as you'd expect, I would forget to restore the connections on next power-up. In the end, I settled for low-value resistors in the wire with little, if any, SQ loss and less hassle. I forget from whom I pinched the toggle-switch idea but seem to recall getting the low-value resistor idea from an old post by JS. (I was going to call the design "The Plagiarise".) However, I've just measured my USPCB and found it has no resistance in the Gnd line. Am I missing something? Link to comment
Superdad Posted March 19, 2019 Author Share Posted March 19, 2019 9 hours ago, Ryelands said: I forget from whom I pinched the toggle-switch idea but seem to recall getting the low-value resistor idea from an old post by JS. You probably read it either in an original USB REGEN thread or in this blog post of mine from nearly 4 years ago: https://uptoneaudio.com/blogs/news/20068483-usb-regen-updated-amazing-bass-all-unshipped-orders-will-be-the-latest Some few cents worth of resistors on the input ground lines was the change we made after the first 100 USB REGENs were sold (and we changed the LED from green to amber to signify). All 100 of the first buyers received the upgrade, and we went on to see close to 4,000 USB REGENs after that. The more sophisticated ISO REGEN design does not require such resistors. 9 hours ago, Ryelands said: However, I've just measured my USPCB and found it has no resistance in the Gnd line. Am I missing something? The 4-layer, impedance-controlled circuit board known as the USPCB A>B Adapter is meant as a pure cable substitute. Its primary application is between a REGEN and a DAC, though people freely purchase and use them in other spots. It would be problematic for us and our clients if we put ground line resistors on the USPCB Adapters as performance and connectivity issues could then arise. UpTone Audio LLC Link to comment
Popular Post Matias Posted March 25, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted March 25, 2019 I am somewhat late but still would like to add that adding an ISO Regen + LPS-1.2 after my ultraRendu + LPS-1 has increased definition and clarity over using ultraRendu + LPS-1.2 alone. I was not expecting this but although not a massive difference it is noticeable and worth it. soares, jamesg11 and Superdad 3 1. WiiM Pro - Mola Mola Makua - Apollon NCx500+SS2590 - March Audio Sointuva AWG 2. LG 77C1 - Marantz SR7005 - Apollon NC502MP+NC252MP - Monitor Audio PL100+PLC150+C265 - SVS SB-3000 3. PC - RME ADI-2 DAC FS - Neumann KH 80 DSP 4. Phone - Tanchjim Space - Truthear Zero Red 5. PC - Keysion ES2981 - Truthear Zero Red Link to comment
DSK6 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I've skimmed most of the pages in this thread and can see that a few people have inserted the ISO/LPS-1.2 between PC or streamer and the SU1, then run I2S to their DAC. Has anyone compared this to removing the SU1 from the path and running the ISO directly into the DAC via USB? I'm running Aries femto (SBooster LPS) > Curious USB > Intona Industrial > Curious USB > Matrix SPDIF 2 (LPS-1) > I2S > Holo Spring 2 DAC > Kinki EX-M1 amp > Silverline Sonata III speakers & Rythmik sub. I could order the ISO without the LPS-1.2 and use the LPS-1 from my Matrix SPDIF 2 if I drop the Matrix and I2S cable from the path and use the ISO and USBPCB directly into the DAC. Is the benefit of the ISO/USBPCB direct into the DAC likely to be greater than any loss from not using I2S? Link to comment
jcn3 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 1 hour ago, DSK6 said: I've skimmed most of the pages in this thread and can see that a few people have inserted the ISO/LPS-1.2 between PC or streamer and the SU1, then run I2S to their DAC. Has anyone compared this to removing the SU1 from the path and running the ISO directly into the DAC via USB? I'm running Aries femto (SBooster LPS) > Curious USB > Intona Industrial > Curious USB > Matrix SPDIF 2 (LPS-1) > I2S > Holo Spring 2 DAC > Kinki EX-M1 amp > Silverline Sonata III speakers & Rythmik sub. I could order the ISO without the LPS-1.2 and use the LPS-1 from my Matrix SPDIF 2 if I drop the Matrix and I2S cable from the path and use the ISO and USBPCB directly into the DAC. Is the benefit of the ISO/USBPCB direct into the DAC likely to be greater than any loss from not using I2S? in your chain, the iso is really more like the intona than the matrix. have you run the same experiment with your intona? (1) holo audio red (hqp naa) > chord dave > luxman cl-38uc/mq-88uc > kef reference 1 (2) simaudio moon mind 2 > chord qutest > luxman sq-n150 > sennheiser hd600 Link to comment
Bdht Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 1 hour ago, DSK6 said: I've skimmed most of the pages in this thread and can see that a few people have inserted the ISO/LPS-1.2 between PC or streamer and the SU1, then run I2S to their DAC. Has anyone compared this to removing the SU1 from the path and running the ISO directly into the DAC via USB? I'm running Aries femto (SBooster LPS) > Curious USB > Intona Industrial > Curious USB > Matrix SPDIF 2 (LPS-1) > I2S > Holo Spring 2 DAC > Kinki EX-M1 amp > Silverline Sonata III speakers & Rythmik sub. I could order the ISO without the LPS-1.2 and use the LPS-1 from my Matrix SPDIF 2 if I drop the Matrix and I2S cable from the path and use the ISO and USBPCB directly into the DAC. Is the benefit of the ISO/USBPCB direct into the DAC likely to be greater than any loss from not using I2S? My dac has an Amanero usb to i2s card inside the dac. It has an isolator on the i2s output so the card is bus powered, using the iso regen and lps 1.2 the Amanero card is also powered by the lps1.2. Link to comment
DSK6 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 5 hours ago, jcn3 said: in your chain, the iso is really more like the intona than the matrix. have you run the same experiment with your intona? Thanks jcn3. I figured that but was concerned that I could lose some of the "ISO greatness" by having it connected to the Matrix DDC instead of the Spring DAC. So I wondered whether anyone has compared their ISO with and without their SU1 DDC? If there is little or no sonic difference it would save me having to buy another LPS-1.2 and eliminate one box from the chain. You raise a good point … I haven't re-tested the Intona since changing from separates to the integrated Kinki amp recently (it only has about 30 hours on it so far). Link to comment
jcn3 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 35 minutes ago, DSK6 said: Thanks jcn3. I figured that but was concerned that I could lose some of the "ISO greatness" by having it connected to the Matrix DDC instead of the Spring DAC. So I wondered whether anyone has compared their ISO with and without their SU1 DDC? If there is little or no sonic difference it would save me having to buy another LPS-1.2 and eliminate one box from the chain. You raise a good point … I haven't re-tested the Intona since changing from separates to the integrated Kinki amp recently (it only has about 30 hours on it so far). btw -- do you have the level 2 spring dac (original version) or the new 2nd version of the spring dac? if you have the new version, supposedly the usb input is much, much better than the previous version. (i haven't heard either) (1) holo audio red (hqp naa) > chord dave > luxman cl-38uc/mq-88uc > kef reference 1 (2) simaudio moon mind 2 > chord qutest > luxman sq-n150 > sennheiser hd600 Link to comment
Popular Post DSK6 Posted April 11, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 11, 2019 16 hours ago, jcn3 said: btw -- do you have the level 2 spring dac (original version) or the new 2nd version of the spring dac? if you have the new version, supposedly the usb input is much, much better than the previous version. (i haven't heard either) It's the L2 original version. On one of the audio forums a couple of techs in the audio industry checked out the USB input design on the original Spring and felt it was quite decent and comparable with other high end streamers. Although I’ve seen a lot of references to the Spring’s USB input being “poor”, hardly any provide first hand evidence of the writer having done A/B testing themselves. I think many of these people have simply repeated what they read on an audio forum somewhere until it became an accepted fact. I must admit that I didn't do exhaustive A/B comparisons myself, mostly because I am "forced" by the CFO to use a regular cabinet to house my components (not a hifi friendly cabinet) and it has a fixed back and sides that makes swapping equipment and reconnecting cables a real pain. Maybe a streamer with I2S output using an I2S cable directly to I2S input of Spring is better than the USB setup or even the USB/I2S hybrid setup and people inferred from this that the USB input on the Spring is no good. Several people have said that the AES/EBU from Aries to Spring DAC is better than using the USB with Intona. I’ve been listening with a decent AES/EBU cable for the last few weeks and I need to swap back to confirm for sure (especially as the new amp is still burning in) but so far I’m not convinced AES is better. Although the bass seems a little fuller (again it could be the amp burning in) there’s also a slight but annoying emphasis in the upper mids that I didn’t hear with the USB/I2S hybrid setup. Apparently the version 2 Spring uses the new XU216 USB whereas the original Spring uses the XU208. I haven’t searched exhaustively but have yet to find any carefully controlled comparisons that show the XU216 to sound consistently better than the XU208. If the new Spring does sound better, how much better is it and what other changes are there in the version 2 Spring that may actually be the cause of the difference? Based purely on what I’ve read in this thread, it seems a safe bet that replacing the Intona with the ISO/LPS-1 would provide a fuller, more natural presentation with slightly fuller bass. But to test this I would need to buy another LPS-1.2, or borrow the one currently powering the Matrix DDC. This in turn would mean dropping the Matrix out of the chain altogether or allowing it to draw power from its 5v USB input (which it does when no external LPS is connected). Either way, it is no longer a purely A/B comparison. I think I’ll order the ISO without the LPS-1.2 initially and see what impact it has when powered by the SMPS and replacing the Intona. If performance is the same or better with the ISO/smps then I’ll move my LPS-1 from the Matrix to the ISO and re-test. If performance is the same or better then I’ll try removing the Matrix as well and re-test. If performance is the same or better then I’ll leave the system like that (i.e. no Intona, no Matrix, no I2S cable, one less Curious USB cable). If I ever got the chance to borrow another LPS-1 I could try re-inserting the Matrix with an LPS-1 to see whether it enhances performance further or not. Hearing is knowing for sure but I would anticipate that the more complex path of Aries > Curious USB > ISO/LPS-1 > USPCB > Matrix/LPS-1 > I2S > DAC is unlikely to sound better than the simpler path of Aries > Curious USB > ISO/LPS-1 > USPCB > DAC … and I do like the idea of less cables and boxes and having the ISO/LPS-1 plugged directly into the DAC via the USPCB, rather than having a DDC and I2S cable between them to possibly undo some of the benefit of the ISO. Sorry for the longer than intended response. 🙂 jcn3 and Superdad 1 1 Link to comment
lmitche Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 After an elaborate Audiolinux,/NUC endpoint and Audiolinux/Server tuning session today, I achieved hands down the best sound ever heard here. While already playing at a high level, the system took on a new level of tonal detail, brass instruments sound golden, guitar strings sound real . . . truly beautiful. So just for grins, I thought to test removing the LPS1.2 powered ISO Regen. What a mistake! I put it right back nestled between two Lush cables. Transients just don't hit the same level without the ISO Regen. What a great device. Superdad 1 Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio Link to comment
BigAlMc Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 51 minutes ago, lmitche said: After an elaborate Audiolinux,/NUC endpoint and Audiolinux/Server tuning session today, I achieved hands down the best sound ever heard here. While already playing at a high level, the system took on a new level of tonal detail, brass instruments sound golden, guitar strings sound real . . . truly beautiful. So just for grins, I thought to test removing the LPS1.2 powered ISO Regen. What a mistake! I put it right back nestled between two Lush cables. Transients just don't hit the same level without the ISO Regen. What a great device. Hi Larry, Apologies if this is covered elsewhere but do you mind confirming, we're talking NUC endpoint USB out to ISO Regen to DAC? Both with Lush originals, not Lush^2? Cheers, Alan Synergistic Research Powercell UEF SE > Sonore OpticalModule (LPS-1.2 & DXP-1A5DSC) > EtherRegen (SR4T & DXP-1A5DSC) > (Sablon 2020 LAN) Innuos PhoenixNet > Muon Streaming System > Grimm MU1 > (Sablon 2020 AES) > Mola Mola Tambaqui DAC > PS Audio M1200 monoblocks > Focal Sopra No2 speakers Link to comment
lmitche Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 54 minutes ago, BigAlMc said: Hi Larry, Apologies if this is covered elsewhere but do you mind confirming, we're talking NUC endpoint USB out to ISO Regen to DAC? Both with Lush originals, not Lush^2? Cheers, Alan Hi Alan, Yes, NUC endpoint USB out to ISO Regen to DAC. Two lush cables. A short lush 2 with default config to the ISO Regen. A longer lush 1 out with shielding configured as the lush 2 default. So the latter is a diy lush 2. The galvanic isolation from the ISO Regen lps1.2 and wifi connection combo prevents any ground loops to the NUC and DAC, and it matters. At long last, I am content with the sound quality. Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio Link to comment
ray-dude Posted April 12, 2019 Share Posted April 12, 2019 2 hours ago, lmitche said: After an elaborate Audiolinux,/NUC endpoint and Audiolinux/Server tuning session today, I achieved hands down the best sound ever heard here. While already playing at a high level, the system took on a new level of tonal detail, brass instruments sound golden, guitar strings sound real . . . truly beautiful. So just for grins, I thought to test removing the LPS1.2 powered ISO Regen. What a mistake! I put it right back nestled between two Lush cables. Transients just don't hit the same level without the ISO Regen. What a great device. I'm looking forward to upgrading my AL NUCs this weekend to the latest greatest, but I want to echo the feedback on the ISO Regen. By pure chance I had a 2nd ISO Regen in house so I put two in series (powered by LPS 1.2 with a Ghent splitter DC cable) and the lift over a single ISO Regen was startling. At this point, with 2 ISO Regen's in series and the LPS 1.2, my AL NUC end point and Roon Bridge is sounding VERY close to the SQ I get with SqueezeLite and large buffers. Absolute winner Superdad 1 ATT Fiber -> EdgeRouter X SFP -> Taiko Audio Extreme -> Vinnie Rossi L2i-SE w/ Level 2 DAC -> Voxativ 9.87 speakers w/ 4D drivers Link to comment
jamesg11 Posted April 13, 2019 Share Posted April 13, 2019 What might be the reason for such an improvement, with the 2x usb? macmini M1>ethernet / elgar iso tran(2.5kVa, .0005pfd)>consonance pw-3 boards>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360)>etherRegen(js-2)>ghent ethernet(et linkway cat8 jssg360) >ultraRendu (clones lpsu>lps1.2)>curious regen link>rme adi-2 dac(js-2)>cawsey cables>naquadria sp2 passive pre> 1.naquadria lucien mkII.5 power>elac fs249be + elac 4pi plus.2> 2.perreaux9000b(mods)>2x naquadria 12” passive subs. Link to comment
lateboomer Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 On 4/13/2019 at 5:18 AM, lmitche said: Yes, NUC endpoint USB out to ISO Regen to DAC. Two lush cables. A short lush 2 with default config to the ISO Regen. A longer lush 1 out with shielding configured as the lush 2 default. So the latter is a diy lush 2. Hi. Is it possible to use the Startech 4-Port USB 3.1 (10Gbps) Pcie Card at the NUC endpoint to output usb to ISO Regen and provide good external ps to Startech? I know you think highly of the card, so have you try out this setup? If it is workable then what NUC can installed with the card and how? Link to comment
lmitche Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 4 hours ago, lateboomer said: Hi. Is it possible to use the Startech 4-Port USB 3.1 (10Gbps) Pcie Card at the NUC endpoint to output usb to ISO Regen and provide good external ps to Startech? I know you think highly of the card, so have you try out this setup? If it is workable then what NUC can installed with the card and how? Hi LB, I haven't tried any PCIE experiments with NUCs. The existing NUC USB ports sound great to my ear, probably due to the SOC design, and with a LPS1.2 ISO Regen they really sing, so I'm not inclined to experiment. The Startech card is still at the heart of my server with two channels, one to an external USB hard disk and Startech enclosure delivering USB 3.1 gen 2 speeds at 10gbps and the second channel with a usb nic connected to a Linksys re9000 wireless extender. Powering the Startech card with an external triple regulated LT3045 12 volt chain sounds wonderful. Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio Link to comment
Quasar Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 Hello. As if it is useful, I used a riser pciexpress connection and this in turn to a USB multiport card and has not been an impediment to get a very good sound with the IsoRegen and the rest of the USB chain. Link to comment
lmitche Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 9 hours ago, Quasar said: Hello. As if it is useful, I used a riser pciexpress connection and this in turn to a USB multiport card and has not been an impediment to get a very good sound with the IsoRegen and the rest of the USB chain. How about a picture please? Pareto Audio aka nuckleheadaudio Link to comment
lateboomer Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 11 minutes ago, lmitche said: How about a picture please? Yes. That would be a great help and the link to the riser used. Link to comment
Popular Post Quasar Posted May 25, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted May 25, 2019 Hello. Sorry, I use a translator, I hope to express myself well. The initial components that probe and worked for me are the following. It probably can also work with similar ones. There are many models. Each equipment and combination, can have different characteristics and can give different results, work or not work, but in my case, these two components have worked well for me.They are not expensive and to prove you lose little. In some cases, photos, I have interspersed a USB Startech extender. Whether interspersed or not, the ISO REGEN has worked. The ISO REGEN has also worked, either when using it as an SD card reader, or directly in the USB path to the digital-digital converter, whenever I have used a USB 3.0 card, but not 3.1. I would advise using USB 3.0 cards. With the 3.1 I have not been able to make it work. https://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B073VKSB6R/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 https://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B00NU2JSF8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 I will modern and old photos. In the new and old configurations, not only includes the USB section, they are also included in the photos, power supplies and regulators for DAC, headphone amplifier and PC. I think it is the set of improvements in all the sections, starting with the alternate power, they are what I have achieved good results. The photos with the scattered components are the first test, the oldest and the checked ones. In your day and post them in the forum. In modern photos, the Riser Card components and USB cards are different (Matrix audio), but they are not yet properly tested This current configuration and settings not yet conveniently tested. (metal boxes). I am modifying the transformer box and I have not finished yet to prove it. This riser pci express has worked for me but I only tried a few moments. Initial tests working. Final configuration with better results. Curiously using a card reader as transport in the ISO REGEN. The ISO REGEN with this configuration, together with the startech extender and obviously the DDC, would say that they are the components that contribute most to the improvement. Bdht and Superdad 1 1 Link to comment
musicguy Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Question about the 5 volts input on isoregen. If i tape over the output on my mac mini to isoregen. Does this shut the 5 volts off on the isoregen output? My eitr needs 5volts input, but can i shut down the 5v out of mac mini and the isoregen make it on its own, and I leave the a/b connector on? I would love to get rid of the 5 volts in my usb cable. mac mini 5volts off - isoregen makes 5volts output to eitr- a/b connector on- eitr - dac still works? musicguy Link to comment
Bdht Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 12 minutes ago, musicguy said: Question about the 5 volts input on isoregen. If i tape over the output on my mac mini to isoregen. Does this shut the 5 volts off on the isoregen output? The 5v from usb powers the silanna isolation chip. If you disable it then maybe you could block the 5v usb. Link to comment
musicguy Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 OOPS, So sorry, Im powering the isoregen by the fantastic lps 1.2. Musicguy Link to comment
musicguy Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 I would like to buy a data only cable for my isoregen. Made by j maxwell. musicguy Link to comment
jcn3 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 36 minutes ago, musicguy said: I would like to buy a data only cable for my isoregen. Made by j maxwell. musicguy the isoregen is expecting 5v over the usb cable. if you use a data only cable, the isoregen won't work. (1) holo audio red (hqp naa) > chord dave > luxman cl-38uc/mq-88uc > kef reference 1 (2) simaudio moon mind 2 > chord qutest > luxman sq-n150 > sennheiser hd600 Link to comment
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