HOLO Audio MAY DAC

[Bertel]

13 minutes ago, barrows said:

Thank you @Bertel for confirming that your Signature Rendu works with 1.536 MHz PCM on the May!  We (Sonore) have only been able to test up to 768 in house, because we do not have access to any DACs which operate at higher rates.  We have suspected that 1.536 MHZ would work, but we could not make make any promises to customers without being able to test such ourselves.

With great pleasure @barrows, happy to be able to contribute and help.

 

Here‘s one more, just in case this wasn‘t confirmed as well: HQPlayer playing DSD1024 through Signature Rendu as NAA to Holo May KTE (DSD2048 wouldn‘t play though)

[camott]

I was not able to get 1536 to work with the OpticalRendu. Only 768. Maybe @Bertel has the recently updated usb card???

[camott]

Did a quick search but couldn’t find the answer - does the Holo May with L2/KTE USB board require vbus power for initialization or continuously or not needed??

[barrows]

1 minute ago, camott said:

I was not able to get 1536 to work with the OpticalRendu. Only 768. Maybe @Bertel has the recently updated usb card???

Yes, you would need the new USB card to allow Rendu renderers to work with 1.536 MHz PCM.  The previous versions only allow 1.536 MHz PCM with Intel based NAA devices.

[Bertel]

(removed double posting)

[Bertel]

10 minutes ago, camott said:

I was not able to get 1536 to work with the OpticalRendu. Only 768. Maybe @Bertel has the recently updated usb card???

6 minutes ago, barrows said:

Yes, you would need the new USB card to allow Rendu renderers to work with 1.536 MHz PCM.  The previous versions only allow 1.536 MHz PCM with Intel based NAA devices.

Yes indeed I have the latest USB card

[damascato]

I bought my May from Wildism Audio (HK) at the end of May. Must have the older USB card , how to I get the upgrade?

[camott]

That said, I sold my OpticalRendu and am now using a Fitlet2 with optical ethernet. It does PCM1536 via NAA even with older May USB card, has the same sound quality (particularly given the May's USB isolation), has more OS/Software options if you want, and is one third of the price. 

[Hardinge]

3 hours ago, damascato said:

I bought my May from Wildism Audio (HK) at the end of May. Must have the older USB card , how to I get the upgrade?

 

Hey @damascato, I'm the Australian Holo retailer. Gen2.0 is original. The new module is Gen2.1. The Gen2.1 module is included on all dacs shipped by Aug 20th 2021. It’s reason is to support AMD CPUs which had problems with DSD1024 and PCM1.536m on Gen2.0. 

For May L2 and KTE plus Spring 3 KTE bought from May-Aug 2021 there is a free module upgrade but the replaced module must be returned after. For units bought before May 2021 then the Gen2.1 module is 100usd (and still need to return the replaced module). 

[damascato]

21 minutes ago, Hardinge said:

 

Hey @damascato, I'm the Australian Holo retailer. Gen2.0 is original. The new module is Gen2.1. The Gen2.1 module is included on all dacs shipped by Aug 20th 2021. It’s reason is to support AMD CPUs which had problems with DSD1024 and PCM1.536m on Gen2.0. 

For May L2 and KTE plus Spring 3 KTE bought from May-Aug 2021 there is a free module upgrade but the replaced module must be returned after. For units bought before May 2021 then the Gen2.1 module is 100usd (and still need to return the replaced module). 

Thanks mate,

 

I bought it on 15 June, I just checked... could you maybe send me a PM with the procedure to get the new module? I would really appreciate it. 

 

Marco

[Hardinge]

13 minutes ago, damascato said:

Thanks mate,

 

I bought it on 15 June, I just checked... could you maybe send me a PM with the procedure to get the new module? I would really appreciate it. 

 

Marco

 

Sure thing, actually just shoot me an email on hugo[at]indiehifi.com.au and i'll add you to the list. Modules haven't arrived yet but can sort you when they do. This goes for anyone in Australia here on the forum. 

 

Hugo

[luisma]

18 hours ago, musicjunkie917 said:

 

I will certainly listen for myself. But, I don't have an NAA that can do PCM 1.536MHz so I can't listen to that for myself. Also, my old DAC was not a NOS DAC and accepted PCM up to 384kHz only. It did its own internal upsampling with PCM and DSD. That's why I was soliciting opinions.

 

The ultraRendu already uses a minimal OS so I don't suspect that running Jussi's NAA image, even if it were possible, would improve sound quality.

 

So, anyone with opinions of upsampling everything to DSD versus upsampling DSD to DSD256 and PCM to PCM 768kHz and PCM to PCM 1.536MHz, please post!

Let me repeat this again so you understand what I said before, Jussi's image on an NAA will support the 1.5 even you if you think you don't have an NAA (aka Intel) that supports it, is not the NAA but the USB driver protocol which Jussi modified so most NAA's that can run Jussi's image will support 1.536, maybe even the rendu which I'm not familiar with.

 

Anyone can post their preferences, I will tell you I prefer PCM 1.536 myself, Jussi will tell you he prefers DSD with the May, does that helps you in any way? some random stranger opinions? if it does there you go, I was just trying to help.

 

EDIT:

I believe @barrowscould help confirming if the Rendu supports Jussi's NAA image

 

EDIT 02:

I see barrows and some others have answered so you're good to go if you want to try PCM, if you want to go with the stream and the sweet measurement spot stay with SDM, it sounds terrific anyways, just a matter of preference,

[musicjunkie917]

@luisma

 

Like I said, I don't think the ultraRendu will work with Jussi's images...I could be wrong though! I think I will email Jussi and see what he thinks. Since the ultraRendu boots off of a MicroSD card, it might just work. 

 

But, it appears that does not matter. I assumed the PCM and DSD rate limits listed on the Sonore web site were hardware limits. I did not know that those limits were based on what Sonore could test and not what should work. It's nice to see that the ultraRendu should support both DSD1024 and PCM 1.536 MHz based on other user's usage data.

 

I really do appreciate getting feedback from others on what they like and why. It give me ideas on where to start with my evaluations.

 

Initially, I will setup my system to play PCM as PCM and DSD as DSD while burning in the DAC. I want both the R2R ladder and the DSD resistor network hardware to be exercised and burned in so I can fairly evaluate both when it comes time to do critical listening. I know the May has a reputation for needing many hundreds of hours of use before it is fully burned in.

 

During burn-in, I will listen to PCM upsampled to 1.536 MHz using LNS15 and poly-sinc-ext2 and DSD upsampled to DSD256 using ASDM7ECv2 and poly-sinc-ext2. I'll play with a several different filters for both PCM and DSD.

 

I don't do well with quick A/B testing. I don't have a problem hearing differences. But, I can't always say with certainty that A is better or worse than B. I like to listen over a period of several days to a week. This means I will have many enjoyable hours of listening while I figure out what I like best.

 

Thanks!

[barrows]

I have no idea if the Rendu renderers will be able to run off of Jussi's dedicated NAA OS.  Sonore can only provide support for customers using the dedicated Sonic Orbiter OS, which is optimized for best performance and compatibility and provides flexibility for use as a Roon RAAT device, as well as DLNA, and NAA.

Of course any customer can try the NAA OS and see if it works for them...

 

I will see if I can get any further info on compatibility with the NAA OS from our software guys.

[luisma]

3 hours ago, barrows said:

I have no idea if the Rendu renderers will be able to run off of Jussi's dedicated NAA OS.  Sonore can only provide support for customers using the dedicated Sonic Orbiter OS, which is optimized for best performance and compatibility and provides flexibility for use as a Roon RAAT device, as well as DLNA, and NAA.

Of course any customer can try the NAA OS and see if it works for them...

 

I will see if I can get any further info on compatibility with the NAA OS from our software guys.

Yes of course you can only support your software, when I suggested to use Jussi's image was more like a POC type of thing for @musicjunkie917 to try with what he has, later on if he decides he could get a cheap NAA. My point was he mentioned his NAA doesn't supports 1.5 with the May and last time I checked the limitation was not so much the hardware but the USB implementation on the native OS. Thanks for chiming in

 

[rtsusc83]

I received this from Tim on my order back in August to confirm the capabilities of the new usb card:

Tim Connor (Kitsunehifi) Aug 18, 2021, 4:32 AM PDT Robert, Yes, I found out last Friday several dacs are delayed as we are upgrading all kte may, L2 May and kte spring3 with the new usb module! We have been working on it almost a year now and it’s arriving to our shop this weekend . Completed assembled pcbs ready to install. So you will get this upgrade for free..... and one of the the finest usb modules of any Dac today. Completely compatible with all os, and far more powerful. Better sound quality and far better support for dsd1024 and pcm1.536mhz. So after this weekend I should be able to get you updated soon with tracking. Your dac is “done” but waiting for usb module to be installed. Thanks for your patience! Best -Tim KitsuneHiFi and HoloAudioUSA

 

[Quadman]

On 11/24/2021 at 2:17 PM, camott said:

Did a quick search but couldn’t find the answer - does the Holo May with L2/KTE USB board require vbus power for initialization or continuously or not needed??

 

No it does not

[camott]

31 minutes ago, Quadman said:

 

No it does not

 

Thanks!

[Extreme_Boky]

1 hour ago, Quadman said:

 

No it does not

 

Please read-on... 

 

11 hours ago, rtsusc83 said:

I received this from Tim on my order back in August to confirm the capabilities of the new usb card:

Tim Connor (Kitsunehifi) Aug 18, 2021, 4:32 AM PDT Robert, Yes, I found out last Friday several dacs are delayed as we are upgrading all kte may, L2 May and kte spring3 with the new usb module! We have been working on it almost a year now and it’s arriving to our shop this weekend . Completed assembled pcbs ready to install. So you will get this upgrade for free..... and one of the the finest usb modules of any Dac today. Completely compatible with all os, and far more powerful. Better sound quality and far better support for dsd1024 and pcm1.536mhz. So after this weekend I should be able to get you updated soon with tracking. Your dac is “done” but waiting for usb module to be installed. Thanks for your patience! Best -Tim KitsuneHiFi and HoloAudioUSA

 

 

 

Hi Tim,

 

Could you please see the photos I attached and correct me if I am wrong.

 

The Original USB Card.JPG photo shows the original card; I circled in red the area of the PCB that needs to get the supply voltage from somewhere. It cannot get that supply voltage from the May mortarboard PCB because there are those I2S isolator ICs. So, the only way the red circled section can obtain power is from the computer, or a streamer - through the USB cable. UNLESS, there is a wire connecting the May motherboard and the USB card, located underneath the USB card, that provides a clean source of the +5V voltage for the USB card. It would be good to get the clarification.

 

Now, further to your statement that the new USB card is much better than the old one, please see the (best I could obtain photo of) New USB card with ALTERA Max II CPLD.JPG. It seems that the new USB card has an additional ALTERA Max II CPLD to ensure compatibility with a non-Intel based USB controllers (running at the source-end).

 

This additional source of high frequency switching (even though it is a low power CPLD... it will still be polluting that ground fill) is still supplied from the same +5V rail. So, the price we have to pay for that 1.536MHz and 1024DSD non Intel based USB controllers' support is quite steep. The penalty being the additional noise.

 

Wouldn't it be better to keep the original USB card that has only USB transceiver and XMOS IC's, than have an additional Altera Max II CPLD being supplied from the same +5V rail (irrelevant of where that +5V rail might be sourced from), sitting on the same USB card ground fill..... if only an Intel-based USB controllers are used at the source-end?

 

 

 

 

[Foggie]

Just messing around the other day I was able to do 1411, as shown.  Played most of that album w/o issues.  Sounded great.  Tried again a couple days ago with same settings shown, and it was mostly static.  Weird. 

 

I don't recall the HQP v3.x settings (auto-rate, set to 1411 or 1536 etc..) but again the pic shows most of what HQP was set to at the time.  I've tried a few other settings in HQP, but still get static at those two rates.  I'll try some more tests as well as a new HQP version

[Foggie]

16 hours ago, Quadman said:

 

No it does not

Can you elaborate on this - are you using a "non powered" USB cable or other device that removes vbus power?

[Extreme_Boky]

The whole USB card needs a constant +5V rail coming from the laptop / streamer (not just during the initial hand-shake, but at all times). I just confirmed it - removed the PCB and checked myself.

 

It pays to know that the total current consumption is around 200 - 300mA (the XMOS chip nominal current draw is 170mA according to the spec sheet). So, I'd suggest an as-clean-as-possible USB +5V supply (at the source-end), and a decent USB cable - maybe a cable that has a vBus feed (wire) done (which runs) externally.

[Franzschubert]

Has anyone tried a transformer volume control with the Holo Audio KTE ?  I was hoping to use my Music First Audio TVC with silver wire in lieu of an active preamp.

[Musikfan]

Hi, I'm thinking of buying the Holo May KTE Dac.  I'd like to pair with the Musica Pristina A Cappella III streamer via i2s.   I'm wondering if there are any changes or settings I need to set on the May dac, or will it be plug and play?  Any help or recommendations  are appreciated.   Thanks, James

[ted_b]

The May has configurable I2S but only via HDMI connectors. Not sure what pin layout your streamer uses, but if it’s one of the “standards” then you’ll be ok.