Pink Faun 2.16

[flkin]

An update about the latest AudioLinux kernel  4.19.37 rt19 1 rt bfq and the 235 menu for Pink Faun 2.16.

 

The CPU Governor under Expert mode doesn't work properly or doesn't display it if it does work. Setting exclusive cores also is slightly buggy. I'm was able to isolate 2 cores sometimes!

 

However from the BIOS, under OC Tweaker, one can set CPU frequency and voltage change to manual and specify a value. The frequency fixed here still doesn't display as fixed under AL Menu Status as fixed. So there's something amiss at this stage. 

 

However during my experimentation I discovered a very nice setting sound wise and is now my preferred setting.

 

In addition to my usual settings for AL -  Extreme priority, Normal Boot mode, Ramroot, I am finding that with the addition of selecting to using only 1 CPU core and setting in Bios the CPU frequency to 2500MHz and voltage to 1.000v the sound becomes a lot more analogue.

 

Initially I though it was less dynamic but on longer listening it was simply more emotional and less hard. Details, focus as good and scale as large as before but smoother. I sat through 3 Beethoven complete symphonies at a single sitting and felt zero fatigue. Switched back and forth many times with the same effect.

 

I'm told that changing the frequency/voltage will break some of the AL scripts and isn't recommended - not until PF/AL makes some fixes to the current software version I suppose. But what I am hearing is very nice so I'm staying with it. Perhaps only for those willing to experiment...

 

 

[flkin]

Just realised that I didn't update the record here with my motherboard and CPU clock switches from normal to extreme as promised earlier. The new clocks are larger than the old ones and proprietary to Pink Faun apparently. Shown below. The board and the other components seem to be much the same as before.

 

 

Installation was at the bottom of the motherboard accessed through a bottom removable panel of the streamer. I requested for this option so the clocks could be attached as close to the motherboard and CPU as possible 

 

 

From my listening notes, I noted that immediately there was more air and space around the music. Deeper soundstage and clearer echos. Somehow the tempo improved and became more infectious - toe tapping. Interestingly the changes are not more of the same as when the USB clock was upgraded. It's more complimentary, with the new clocks working nicely together with the USB one.

 

The sound was however brighter again in the same way I experienced with the initial USB clock change. Bass tighten up to the extent of changing the speaker character. My Wilsons are usually bassy but with the additional 2 clocks has becoming noticeably tighter and bouncier.

 

After 2 weeks or so and with an update of the AudioLinux kernel / AL Menu (described a few posts above), the sound character settled down. Treble balance back down to normal and bass a touch looser again. But the original feeling of soundstage space, depth and lightness remains. How much this has to do with the OS changes and how much the clocks I cant say but the overall effect is a relaxed, enveloping detail sound. Very happy with where I'm at 😁 

[flkin]

On 6/19/2019 at 7:21 PM, flkin said:

An update about the latest AudioLinux kernel  4.19.37 rt19 1 rt bfq and the 235 menu for Pink Faun 2.16.

 

The CPU Governor under Expert mode doesn't work properly or doesn't display it if it does work. Setting exclusive cores also is slightly buggy. I'm was able to isolate 2 cores sometimes!

 

However from the BIOS, under OC Tweaker, one can set CPU frequency and voltage change to manual and specify a value. The frequency fixed here still doesn't display as fixed under AL Menu Status as fixed. So there's something amiss at this stage. 

 

However during my experimentation I discovered a very nice setting sound wise and is now my preferred setting.

 

In addition to my usual settings for AL -  Extreme priority, Normal Boot mode, Ramroot, I am finding that with the addition of selecting to using only 1 CPU core and setting in Bios the CPU frequency to 2500MHz and voltage to 1.000v the sound becomes a lot more analogue.

 

Initially I though it was less dynamic but on longer listening it was simply more emotional and less hard. Details, focus as good and scale as large as before but smoother. I sat through 3 Beethoven complete symphonies at a single sitting and felt zero fatigue. Switched back and forth many times with the same effect.

 

I'm told that changing the frequency/voltage will break some of the AL scripts and isn't recommended - not until PF/AL makes some fixes to the current software version I suppose. But what I am hearing is very nice so I'm staying with it. Perhaps only for those willing to experiment...

 

 

 

Update on my Pink Faun 2.16x settings for best sound after further experiments in the Bios.

 

Audiolinux settings:

- CPU isolating 1-core

- Normal Boot mode

- Extreme for priority 

- Ramroot

- Roon no upsampling, no HQPe 

- Set ethernet speed 100Mb/s

- Expert exclude modules:

echo 1000 > /proc/sys/vm/stat_interval

echo 0 > /sys/bus/workqueue/devices/writeback/numa

echo 8 > /sys/bus/workqueue/devices/writeback/cpumask *

echo -1 > /proc/sys/kernel/sched_rt_runtime_us

echo 0 >/sys/devices/system/machinecheck/machinecheck3/check_interval

echo 0 > /proc/sys/kernel/watchdog

echo 0 > /proc/sys/kernel/nmi_watchdog

echo 1500 > /proc/sys/vm/dirty_writeback_centisecs

 

Not sure if the above exclusions actually work (doesn't seem to be any harm so far) but this one does:

 

echo 8 > /sys/bus/workqueue/devices/writeback/cpumask

 

* For cpumask, the 8 depends on what which CPU cores are isolated. In this case it’s CPU3 (core 4). Calculate this figure from http://store.tomandmiu.com/cal-cam.php Non hyper-thread, enter the core number and get the affinity number. If the mask number is incorrect, sound becomes more detailed and sharper. Not nice at all.

 

Bios settings:

- CPU frequency 2800Mhz

- CPU voltage at 0.9volts

- RAM voltage at 1.1volts

 

Note : Before experimenting with the Bios, good idea to make a backup at the bottom of the "tweaked" tab. If the streamer hangs (mine did during trials of settings not described here) there is a reset button behind the 2.16x which resets the Bios to original settings. Then you can return to your last working Bios settings from the restore option.

 

Adding a reclocked switch helps my system further. The treble is smoother.

[flkin]

Hi Fred, prior to the 2.16x one box solution I was using the SOtM spaghetti system of which I still own. Part of that system had a standard D-Link switch that was modified by SOtM to add a clock input and linear regulators internally. I then used a Cybershaft OP14 clock through a tx-USBultra to generate the clock signal for the switch. Then I passed the ethernet signal through this D-Link switch before entering my 2.16x. 

 

Its a a little more tricky as I have to power the D-Link and tx-USBultra and so used my existing 2 LPS1 supplies - themselves requiring supplies to operate. And with LPS1 devices you have to ground the negative to drain leakage currents. In total a lot of wires, but something I’m used to from my spaghetti days 😄!

 

Yes I agree that an internal clocked card would be a neater and better solution. I ordered a PF LAN card with OCXO clock a long while ago but, due to intel firmware issues, the card isn’t ready yet. When it does  eventually arrive it will be interesting to see if an external clocked switch still makes a difference.

[flkin]

1 hour ago, Jambo said:

I have ordered my pf 2.16x in this colour. Contact Jord for other colour options and prices. A "pink" Pink Faun. Very nice.

 

Brilliant colour! Nice!

 

[flkin]

18 hours ago, lpost said:

 

My system became unstable at these low (lowest possible) voltages, at least for CPU.  I've returned to default voltages for both and haven't noticed any SQ degradation.  The lower CPU frequency is definitely better sounding to me.  I'm back to using HQPe though, it just sounds more natural to me than Roon alone.

 

I worked with Piero a bit regarding the pstate issues and AMD Ryzen.  He's on holiday but will work on it upon his return, though I'm perfectly happy setting the values in bios and be done with it.

 

Yes changing the bios settings to more extreme values make the system less stable especially if left on continuously. I’m getting between 1 to 7 days stability before I have to reboot. Not for all people I suppose, only tweakers like us! 😄

 

 Many here would focus on the sound of streamer optimisations but in reality the sound is the entire system including pre-amps, power, speakers, room etc. So there isn’t really an optimal adjustment, only what works for each of us. I used to be very into HQP / room correction before and during that time it really helped my system too.

 

Look forward to Piero’s fixes too. I’m finding the CPU governer settings are not working in the AL menu. It’s causing inconsistencies.

[flkin]

8 hours ago, lpost said:

@flkin  Darn you, now you having dreaming about upgrading my last gen clocks in the 2.16.  I have I2S board, CPU and motherboard clocks.  I suspect the I2S board would benefit the most from the new uber clock.

 

Finding my system's stable values:

 

This is sounding really fantastically good! But I'm at the limit I care to tolerate for Roon responsiveness.  It most certainly likes core GHz performance.  I've also tried other combinations of BIOS set numbers of cores.  System runs 1-2C cooler with 4 or 6 cores but I'm maintaining 39C at idle to ~41C-45C cpu temp with all 8 and I really don't notice enough difference to matter.  

 

Reducing CPU freq has the largest impact, followed by reducing voltages - along with RAM voltages and values like 2133/1886.

 

...carefully saving the bios preset to avoid losing current settings.  I keep a log too but it's tedious to go through some of these value changes.

 

What BIOS version are you running.  

 

Bios settings:

- CPU frequency 2400Mhz

- CPU voltage at 0.95volts

- RAM voltage at 1.15volts

 

 

Its never ending 😄, we’ll always find something else to add or adjust eventually!

 

The new clocks made a very nice change for me, not to say that the old ones were lacking in any way but it’s another step towards reality. The i2s will have to wait will I change my DAC but intriguing given the number that have switched from USB. But something definitely I will go for in the future. I do have a number of DSD files so that might be a consideration. That said I’m not finding that DSDs are 64 times the resolution of redbook cds only that they tend to be thicker sounding with slightly more ambient details in my system so limited loss. Hmmmm...

I’m talking myself into trouble!

 

I haven’t updated my Bios before. It’s still at P4.70. Have there been any changes?

 

These bios changes are making my sound more organic and analogue, more true to reality. But tends to reduce dynamics. I compensate with higher volume and its till ok since the noise level is so low anyway.

[flkin]

Hi @EliteDJ

 

The standard settings as delivered by PF has all 8 cores working. The Audiolinux OS allows you to play with isolating and using only certain cores and my preferred setting is using only 1 core. 

 

And yes there is a video card inside so you can access the bios for adjustments. But since it consumes power and probably affects the sound, I usually disconnect it during normal playback. But to make it easier to reconnect I’ve added a cable extension for the card socket that leads outside the unit. So I can plug in and remove the card easily.

 

 

[flkin]

On 8/1/2019 at 9:47 PM, EliteDJ said:

Hi Flkin,

 

I adjusted my processor order to the AMX 1700X so it matches the PC components that make up the 2.16 music server.  You mentioned that yours came with a video card that you use for setting your BIAS adjustments.  Do you have the make and model of that video card?  I figured that I'd add the one that they send with their servers to my system.  Thanks for your past responses and the information that you have shared. Dave

Hey Dave,

 

Sorry for late reply, travelling overseas currently.

 

Can't remember off hand what the card name is (might be a generic one without name actually) but it doesn't really matter what you use since it isn't really necessary for playback. Only need it during the setting up of the Bios, so you can remove it after.

 

Have fun with the build,

 

Best, Kin

 

 

[flkin]

Had a chance to install the latest menu/system and 5.1 kernel. Went smoothly for me executed from the old menu update page.

 

I want to discuss the new option Expert option "ENABLE/DISABLE realtime manual assignment"

 

On questioning Piero in detail about what this was all about it's to do with IRQ and audio application priorities - very important things actually! AudoLinux is already pretty compact as it's a built-up OS rather than a cut down from a large OS. But unless the assignment of priorities of what is going on internally is set correctly, the computer won't rank important priorities like "play back" over say less important priorities like "displaying/searching lists of music" correctly. 

 

I believe that is what the Extreme modes and Normal modes are already doing when AL allows one to select them. But you can get much finer control over the settings.

 

What follows are specific to the Pink Faun 2.16x and my particular set up but it might be useful for general computers as well. 

 

There are 2 files being controlled by the realtime manual assignment switch. When it is on, the rtirq.conf and rtapp.conf priorities for IRQ and audio applications respectively are in place and active. Both seem to affect the sound.

 

 

1. rtirq.conf (IRQ priority)

 

I used File Editor as Root and went to /etc/rtirq.conf

 

From suggestions on this link https://www.audio-linux.com/html/realtime.html I did the checked rtstatus and rtcards to figure out which IRQ item referred to my connected DAC. For my computer it turned out to be xhci_hcd. The original IRQ priority was simply any connected usb. If I had other USB devices connected, my PF would have given the same priority to any connected USB device - clearly not want I want. The connected DAC should be first. So

 

Original  RTIRQ_NAME_LIST=“usb”

To           RTIRQ_NAME_LIST="xhci_hcd"

 

 

2. rtapp.conf (audio app priority)

 

I found the following on a French discussion board http://forum-hifi.fr/archive/index.php?thread-4783-14.html where someone asked and RoonLab support replied to define the Roon apps being used during playback. Seems that RoonAppliance engages in both foreground and background processes in different threads, and adjusting process-level priority would unduly elevate background work. So perhaps it shouldn't have a higher priority as an audio app.

 

After some back and forth with Piero and some analysis of what is running in the computer when playing music, we came to the following few options for listening tests: 

 

I again used File Editor as Root and went to /etc/rtapp/rtapp.conf

 

Original APPLICATIONS="jackd mpd hqplayer hqplayerd RoonAppliance RoonBridge mediacenter24 networkaudiod deadbeef a2jmidid ardour-5.12.0 rosegarden audacity”

 

This lists priority of apps with names in the order of the priority. So HQplayer has higher priority than RoonAppliance and RoonBridge etc.Technically you can remove all names of apps not being used. But leaving them there should make no difference ... or does it...?!

• Option 1 - Disable rtapp
  • Disabling rtapp by command: systemctl disable rtapp.timer then rebooting means no priority for applications but continue to have priority for irq makes my system duller, treble is affected.
• Option 2 - Disable both rtapp and rtirq
  • Disabling realtime manual assignment makes my system much less clear, imaging far softer. I prefer it on
• Option 3 - Using rtapp APPLICATIONS="RoonAppliance"
  • Makes the image fatter and less separated. 
• Option 4 - Using rtapp APPLICATIONS="RoonBridgeHelper RAATServer”
  • Nice. Clear but not bright, engaging and good imaging. But slightly too forward imaging.

For flexibility, it should be possible to add back the other unused apps in the rtapp file but for some unknown reason, it doesn't sound as good to me! Perhaps I am imagining it.. If added back it would then be:

 

APPLICATIONS="jackd mpd hqplayer hqplayerd RoonBridgeHelper RAATServer RoonBridge mediacenter24 networkaudiod deadbeef a2jmidid ardour-5.12.0 rosegarden audacity”

 

 

 

Summary

 

This sounds really good - but might need some speaker adjustments as the image is slightly more forward than before.

 

rtirq.conf (IRQ priority)

RTIRQ_NAME_LIST="xhci_hcd"

 

rtapp.conf (audio app priority)

APPLICATIONS="RoonBridgeHelper RAATServer”

[flkin]

Nope! Wish I had! 😄

 

Did you manage to find better rtapp apps? I'm not sure if listing the RoonBridgeHelper actually helps ..

[flkin]

I'm having difficulty with the latest kernel. I'm preferring the older v4.7 to the current v5+.

 

I'm finding the sound a little too forward for my taste 

[flkin]

I think it might also have to do with the new Realtime Manual Assignment function also. I'm finding it better without at this time. Which means that rtapp and rtirq isn't being adjusted manually. But setting extreme priority is still essential.

[flkin]

Hi Matt, I wouldn't know for sure but I guess they have to select shows to attend due the effort involved?

[flkin]

Congratulations Jord for the award! Nice 😄

[flkin]

Hi Brett,

 

Switched to Euphony and haven’t looked back since. Far easier to setup/use/upgrade and next step in sound (when I was using the older AL). 

[flkin]

You’ll need to burn the download to a usb dongle. I use a free download Etcher for this. The usb has a setting to move the OS into RAM and usb removed. Try this. 
 

I’m going to return to the last update of the Pink Faun Audiolinux to see how that sounds in comparison. Jord suggests it’s quite an improvement. 

[flkin]

I believe the limitation of the demo Euphony is a 30 day trial and that it can’t be installed into a drive. 
 

Its intriguing that you find Euphony the same as the latest version of Audio Linux. At the time that I switched to Euphony half a year ago I found it quite a step up from AL, especially using the Stylus player. But I really miss the Roon interface. 

 

I’ve just install the version 3.1 Pink Faun, and I will have a chance to try it out this weekend. If it plays as good as stylus in my system, I’ll switch back in a heartbeat to use the Roon interface. 

[flkin]

Has anyone been about to get squeezelite in AL3.1 to work? Doesn’t seem to in my PF. 

[flkin]

In the menu there is:

9. Squeezelite select DAC

10. Squeezelite start and enable 

After install the squeezelite, 

Selected 9 and it asks for a DAC configuration. Selected it. 
Selected 10 and nothing much happens. Roon cannot find my DAC under squeeze box. 

 

Is there an obvious step I’ve missed?

[flkin]

Yes I have, sometime back.
 

 

Have a look at my notes on that. 

[flkin]

The pictures you show above are not the ultra PF clocks but the standard OCXO clocks PF also uses made by Connor Winfield. FYI

[flkin]

A lot of the space inside the 2.16 is used for the many isolated power supply systems which is still necessary even for thin applications. 

[flkin]

When I asked Jord about a streamer/renderer 2 box solution, he just said to buy two 2.16 units. 😄
 

Email them and ask for your requirements. They are open to modifying boards and have a good approach to power management. But perhaps not as lean as you might want. 

[flkin]

10 hours ago, ASRMichael said:

Presume you are using AudioLinux? Would be interesting to know how the PF performs using Euphony-HQPlayer. 

 

I have PF USB Ultra clock, love it. Especially powered by Sean Jacobs rail. Once I upgrade my CPU/MB I plan for PF MB clock mods. 

 

I've been switching back and forwards between AudioLinux and Euphony Stylus each time a major update takes place. At the present time, it's Stylus for me despite the poor user interface. I run 2 systems at the same time - the Stylus for playback and another Roon system on a separate server which I use for music discovery or searching my PF database to find stuff.

 

It would be interesting to try an external supply for the PF USBUltra card but I don't have a superior supply like the SJ or a PH yet so not much point at this time. 

 

 

11 hours ago, Armsan said:

 

You will be amazed with that upgrade. The noise level will drop significantly, which contributes to this completely stress free flow of the music that I’m experiencing.

 

 

Great to hear you're enjoying your Pink Faun. It takes a long time to break in but I found my unit had quite a jump in performance after a while. So you're in for a treat later.

 

I currently don't upsample anymore also having tried many times. As the system improves and focus is better, I'm finding that upsampling isn't required to get a clearer image as my system tends to loose an organic feel to the music. It's always a compromise despite the sharper image with upsampling.

 

If you do try Stylus, try their version of upsampling. It gives me similar results to HQP but I'm able to upsample to DSD512 without any problem with CPU overloading. Not possible with HQP - only up to DSD256 and only with some filter settings.