The true experimental tweak thread

[mozes]

I disconnected my intona so my chain now looks like this:

Nimitra>>tX USBultra>>Brooklyn

 

I have to say that I hardly noticed any difference in sound, maybe a bit more dynamics but a notch brighter. I put it back but again hard to detect differences, if any it has to be subtle.  I feel that it is redundant in my chain now, it doesn't give the big boost that I used to get from it like before.

 

I removed it and soon will be going to the resale market. It seems that the tX is excellent on its own.

I also tried the battery on the tX, but I didn't like it made it softer and lost microdynamics. Then I used a Y adapter to power both the Brooklyn and tX from the VR MINI, but I didn't like it at all, sounded harsh and musicality was lost. I also tried the 3rd option which is to swap the pwoer supplies to I put the JS-2 on the Brooklyn and the VR on the tX, I prefered the original setup as I felt some magic was lost.

So now the best configuration to my ears is:

NImitra (JS-2)>>tX (JS-2)>>Brooklyn (VR MINI)

 

My learning is that it may not be a good idea to share the same power supply through Y adapters, but this is only in my system and keep in mind that the Y adapter is a cheapo from ebay not my OCC copper wire with Oyaide connectors.

 

 

[Cornan]

16 minutes ago, moussaobeid said:

I disconnected my intona so my chain now looks like this:

Nimitra>>tX USBultra>>Brooklyn

 

I have to say that I hardly noticed any difference in sound, maybe a bit more dynamics but a notch brighter. I put it back but again hard to detect differences, if any it has to be subtle.  I feel that it is redundant in my chain now, it doesn't give the big boost that I used to get from it like before.

 

I removed it and soon will be going to the resale market. It seems that the tX is excellent on its own.

I also tried the battery on the tX, but I didn't like it made it softer and lost microdynamics. Then I used a Y adapter to power both the Brooklyn and tX from the VR MINI, but I didn't like it at all, sounded harsh and musicality was lost. I also tried the 3rd option which is to swap the pwoer supplies to I put the JS-2 on the Brooklyn and the VR on the tX, I prefered the original setup as I felt some magic was lost.

So now the best configuration to my ears is:

NImitra (JS-2)>>tX (JS-2)>>Brooklyn (VR MINI)

 

My learning is that it may not be a good idea to share the same power supply through Y adapters, but this is only in my system and keep in mind that the Y adapter is a cheapo from ebay not my OCC copper wire with Oyaide connectors.

 

 

 

That's great Moussa! Finally a Intona free setup! Very simple and straight forward. Me like! ?

There you go. You'll never know for sure what works the best until you try. I did'nt expect that JS-2 powering two devices would end up sounding best, but I'll guess the answer might be hidden in your dedicated mains!??

Just Curious. Did you try with Elijah USB cables or Curious USB cables? ?

[mozes]

5 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

That's great Moussa! Finally a Intona free setup! Very simple and straight forward. Me like! ?

There you go. You'll never know for sure what works the best until you try. I did'nt expect that JS-2 powering two devices would end up sounding best, but I'll guess the answer might be hidden in your dedicated mains!??

Just Curious. Did you try with Elijah USB cables or Curious USB cables? ?

Curious cables only? The EA are too short to work in the current setup. The tX design where the usb input and output made it a nightmare with short cables.

 

I like my new setup with one gadeget, but I know myself and just like @Cornan said I will be adding something soon to the chain  No No I shouldn't well maybe not for the coming month

[Cornan]

1 hour ago, moussaobeid said:

 

I like my new setup with one gadeget, but I know myself and just like @Cornan said I will be adding something soon to the chain  No No I shouldn't well maybe not for the coming month

 

Enjoy the simple setup while it lasts! ? Considering your upgrading speed a month is like a lifetime for many others! ?

[mozes]

4 minutes ago, Cornan said:

 

Enjoy the simple setup while it lasts! ? Considering your upgrading speed a month is like a lifetime for many others! ?

I only play around with the digital setup, analogue amplification and speakers are fixed. Again for now If I haven't done all these upgrades and tweaks, I wouldn't have learned much

[austinpop]

Thanks for trying these experiments, Moussa. Other than @romaz you may be the first to have gotten the tX-USBultra in hand. Maybe this deserves a new thread?

 

As you know, I should soon (in a couple weeks or so) have my own tX-USBultra and modded sMS-200 back from SOtM, so your experiments are helping me prepare and get a preview!

 

3 hours ago, moussaobeid said:

I disconnected my intona so my chain now looks like this:

Nimitra>>tX USBultra>>Brooklyn

 

I have to say that I hardly noticed any difference in sound, maybe a bit more dynamics but a notch brighter. I put it back but again hard to detect differences, if any it has to be subtle.  I feel that it is redundant in my chain now, it doesn't give the big boost that I used to get from it like before.

 

I removed it and soon will be going to the resale market. It seems that the tX is excellent on its own.

 

Great to hear this. I need to sell some stuff to justify the cost of the tX and other mods!

 

Quote

I also tried the battery on the tX, but I didn't like it made it softer and lost microdynamics. Then I used a Y adapter to power both the Brooklyn and tX from the VR MINI, but I didn't like it at all, sounded harsh and musicality was lost. I also tried the 3rd option which is to swap the pwoer supplies to I put the JS-2 on the Brooklyn and the VR on the tX, I prefered the original setup as I felt some magic was lost.

So now the best configuration to my ears is:

NImitra (JS-2)>>tX (JS-2)>>Brooklyn (VR MINI)

 

Very interesting, especially the experiment with the Y adapter with the VR Mini. One possible explanation is that many DACs actually have galvanic isolation between their input and DAC stages, so by using the Y, you may be defeating that isolation. I have no info on what the Brooklyn's design is in this regard. But it's a theory.

 

A similar factor may be coming into play with the swapped PSes. I had forgotten the JS-2 was also powering the Nimitra. Even though the 2 rails of the JS-2 are floating and "isolated" from each other, I wonder if there is a potential for defeating isolation and creating leakage loops by spanning an isolation boundary in the DAC.

 

Quote

My learning is that it may not be a good idea to share the same power supply through Y adapters, but this is only in my system and keep in mind that the Y adapter is a cheapo from ebay not my OCC copper wire with Oyaide connectors.

 

I think it's not necessarily the Y-connector or sharing power, but the specific use case, and whether the components sharing the power supply have the potential for leakage loops.

 

More depressingly, the safest answer seems to be the most expensive - use separate power supplies!

[mozes]

15 minutes ago, austinpop said:

Thanks for trying these experiments, Moussa. Other than @romaz you may be the first to have gotten the tX-USBultra in hand. Maybe this deserves a new thread?

 

As you know, I should soon (in a couple weeks or so) have my own tX-USBultra and modded sMS-200 back from SOtM, so your experiments are helping me prepare and get a preview!

 

 

Great to hear this. I need to sell some stuff to justify the cost of the tX and other mods!

 

 

Very interesting, especially the experiment with the Y adapter with the VR Mini. One possible explanation is that many DACs actually have galvanic isolation between their input and DAC stages, so by using the Y, you may be defeating that isolation. I have no info on what the Brooklyn's design is in this regard. But it's a theory.

 

A similar factor may be coming into play with the swapped PSes. I had forgotten the JS-2 was also powering the Nimitra. Even though the 2 rails of the JS-2 are floating and "isolated" from each other, I wonder if there is a potential for defeating isolation and creating leakage loops by spanning an isolation boundary in the DAC.

 

 

I think it's not necessarily the Y-connector or sharing power, but the specific use case, and whether the components sharing the power supply have the potential for leakage loops.

 

More depressingly, the safest answer seems to be the most expensive - use separate power supplies!

Although I am happy with the sound I got, I am still not 100% content with the fact that I lost two isolation devices in my system, LPS-1 and intona. These two isolation tweaks gave me a big boost in sound in my previous setup, and now that I have a better sound without these isolation devices in the chain, I am wondering whether I am getting the full potential of the super clock in the tX. 

In other words the gain from the tX is bigger than the loss of 2 isolation units, what if the isolation is still there?

[mozes]

I started a new thread for the tX

[mozes]

I measured the current of the tX-USBultra and Brooklyn with my new AC/DC multimeter, but I am not sure that the results are correct. I checked the voltage and on both devices I got 12V, so I think my connections are ok.

 

Here are the numbers:

Brooklyn (music playing, Dac only no headphone, screen lights off): 0.05mA

tX-USBultra (music playing): 0.04mA

 

These numbers are way too small, they don't make sense. I attached the pictures for your reference and I used this multimeter https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01NAVAT9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[austinpop]

18 minutes ago, moussaobeid said:

I measured the current of the tX-USBultra and Brooklyn with my new AC/DC multimeter, but I am not sure that the results are correct. I checked the voltage and on both devices I got 12V, so I think my connections are ok.

 

Here are the numbers:

Brooklyn (music playing, Dac only no headphone, screen lights off): 0.05mA

tX-USBultra (music playing): 0.04mA

 

These numbers are way too small, they don't make sense. I attached the pictures for your reference and I used this multimeter https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01NAVAT9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Yeah, those numbers make no sense. Even if you assume the units are amps, not mA, that's still only 40 and 50mA respectively, which is kind of low.

 

Not sure what to tell you. It's a mystery.

[mozes]

2 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Yeah, those numbers make no sense. Even if you assume the units are amps, not mA, that's still only 40 and 50mA respectively, which is kind of low.

 

Not sure what to tell you. It's a mystery.

thanks will wait for @Cornan to wake up and see what he thinks. I am sure there is something wrong in how I am measuring current. I can only get the voltage right!

[mozes]

11 minutes ago, moussaobeid said:

thanks will wait for @Cornan to wake up and see what he thinks. I am sure there is something wrong in how I am measuring current. I can only get the voltage right!

I think I figured out the problem, to measure current you have to break the circuit so the current flows through the multimeter which I didn't do. I will crack it no matter what

[austinpop]

Yes of course!

 

BTW - did you just change your handle name?

[mozes]

1 hour ago, austinpop said:

Yes of course!

 

BTW - did you just change your handle name?

Yes I made it shorter as it was looking funny with the letter d on a second line by itself

[mozes]

Ok here are the current measurements for the tX and Brooklyn after figuring out how to measure current:

-Brooklyn (music playing, Dac only no headphone, screen lights off): 0.843 Amps so at 12V, it consumes 10.116 watts

-tX-USBultra (music playing): 0.477Amps so at 12V, it consumes 5.724Watts. This includes powering the VBUS for the Brooklyn

@austinpop, I think you should be fine powering the tX from an LPS-1

 

[austinpop]

2 minutes ago, mozes said:

Ok here are the current measurements for the tX and Brooklyn after figuring out how to measure current:

-Brooklyn (music playing, Dac only no headphone, screen lights off): 0.843 Amps so at 12V, it consumes 10.116 watts

-tX-USBultra (music playing): 0.477Amps so at 12V, it consumes 5.724Watts. This includes powering the VBUS for the Brooklyn

@austinpop, I think you should be fine powering the tX from an LPS-1

 

 

Ah, very promising!

 

When I get mine, I will confirm it works with my existing LPS-1 and then order another one.

[austinpop]

BTW - I got my Drok meter today as well.

 

This is the USB inline version, so I used it to measure the current flowing from my RUR to the Codex DAC on the USB bus.

 

The highest I'm seeing is 250 mA.

 

[austinpop]

22 minutes ago, mozes said:

Ok here are the current measurements for the tX and Brooklyn after figuring out how to measure current:

-Brooklyn (music playing, Dac only no headphone, screen lights off): 0.843 Amps so at 12V, it consumes 10.116 watts

-tX-USBultra (music playing): 0.477Amps so at 12V, it consumes 5.724Watts. This includes powering the VBUS for the Brooklyn

@austinpop, I think you should be fine powering the tX from an LPS-1

 

 

Can you measure the current on the USB drawn by the Brooklyn?

[Cornan]

7 hours ago, mozes said:

Although I am happy with the sound I got, I am still not 100% content with the fact that I lost two isolation devices in my system, LPS-1 and intona. These two isolation tweaks gave me a big boost in sound in my previous setup, and now that I have a better sound without these isolation devices in the chain, I am wondering whether I am getting the full potential of the super clock in the tX. 

In other words the gain from the tX is bigger than the loss of 2 isolation units, what if the isolation is still there?

 

I can see why you are a bit concerned. Personally I would just get a isolation transformer with floating secondary for the JS-2 and be 100% content. It will work with any future changes as well. Just make sure to find a silent one with low inter-winding capasitance!

[Cornan]

2 hours ago, mozes said:

thanks will wait for @Cornan to wake up and see what he thinks. I am sure there is something wrong in how I am measuring current. I can only get the voltage right!

 

I see you have figured it out already Moussa! ? 

You've got yourself a new name and profile picture as well. Nice!

 

[mozes]

7 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

I see you have figured it out already Moussa! ? 

You've got yourself a new name and profile picture as well. Nice!

 

Yep a brand revamp

[mozes]

7 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

I can see why you are a bit concerned. Personally I would just get a isolation transformer with floating secondary for the JS-2 and be 100% content. It will work with any future changes as well. Just make sure to find a silent one with low inter-winding capasitance!

I tried before an Elgar IT 2.4KVA but it hsed to hum, and my small BK IT also hums and my famous Naim transformers also hums. so enough humming in my world

 

I am tempted by trying the ISO Regen upstream of the tX, I already sold one LPS-1 and the RUR and Intona are listed in the market so this should fund itself 

[mozes]

7 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

Can you measure the current on the USB drawn by the Brooklyn?

Will do this later today

[mozes]

7 hours ago, Cornan said:

 

I can see why you are a bit concerned. Personally I would just get a isolation transformer with floating secondary for the JS-2 and be 100% content. It will work with any future changes as well. Just make sure to find a silent one with low inter-winding capasitance!

My pace is very fast @Cornan just like digital

Iooking at the humble power consumption of my devices I don't think I need the JS-2 it is a beast. It may be replaced by a VR 

[mozes]

57 minutes ago, mozes said:

Will do this later today

Very low power consumption on the Vbus from the tX to the Brooklyn, 0.06A does it make sense?