SACD Ripping using an Oppo or Pioneer? Yes, it's true!

[KVDB010]

 

Quote

I would also be happy for anyone to use my document as a starting point for creating a separate version aimed at users of the Pioneer BDP-160.

 

There is already a good working protocol for the Pioneer BDP-80FD, see the link on page 78.

I use this protocol also for my Pioneer BDP-160 and it works flawless.

[haggis999]

I presume you mean the following post by HiRezGuy on 4 April, 2017. I have made it stand out a bit more in this copy.

 

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

@                                                                                                                                            @

@      Step-by-step instructions for the Pioneer BDP-80FD  (and BDP-160)         @

@      +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++        @

@                                                                                                                                            @

@      https://www.dropbox.com/s/13mq5pihw0enoqy/SACD Image Creation Process for Pioneer BDP-80FD.txt?dl=0       @

@                                                                                                                                            @

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

 

Perhaps Ted should make this a sticky on P1, just like my instructions for the Oppo

[ted_b]

2 hours ago, haggis999 said:

Perhaps Ted should make this a sticky on P1, just like my instructions for the Oppo

Done 

[KVDB010]

For completeness, the Pioneer BDP-80FD should also be included in the list of capable Pioneer players on page 1.

I guess that it has the MT8560 chip. Can somebody confirm this?

In addition the Pioneer BDP-180 may be removed based on the negative posts on this player.

[CatManDo]

23 minutes ago, KVDB010 said:

For completeness, the Pioneer BDP-80FD should also be included in the list of capable Pioneer players on page 1.

I guess that it has the MT8560 chip. Can somebody confirm this?[/quote]

 

It's been confirmed by a couple of users in this thread. The BDP-80FD is the US version of the BDP-170. Both players share the same service manual

 

https://elektrotanya.com/pioneer_bdp-170_bdp-80fd.pdf/download.html

[BlueSkyy]

11 hours ago, haggis999 said:

 

@      Step-by-step instructions for the Pioneer BDP-80FD  (and BDP-160)         @

@      +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++        @

@                                                                                                                                            @

@      https://www.dropbox.com/s/13mq5pihw0enoqy/SACD Image Creation Process for Pioneer BDP-80FD.txt?dl=0      

 

Looks like a great job!

 

Regarding the instructions above, step "H" says to "create a local folder on the root of the Windows PC".  I think it would be clearer to say to "create a local folder in the root directory of the USB drive that was just formatted" or something to that effect.

[haggis999]

10 hours ago, ted_b said:

Done 

 

Thanks, Ted, but your statement on P1 that I had done some 'clean up' work on the document created by HiRezGuy is not correct. I did no more than add the text "(and BDP-160)" to the heading in my copied version of his post, based on the info above from KVDB010.

 

2 hours ago, CatManDo said:

It's been confirmed by a couple of users in this thread. The BDP-80FD is the US version of the BDP-170. Both players share the same service manual

 

Does this mean that the instructions from HiRezGuy should now be labelled as applying to the Pioneer BDP-80FD, BDP-160 and BDP-170?

 

48 minutes ago, BlueSkyy said:

Regarding the instructions above, step "H" says to "create a local folder on the root of the Windows PC".  I think it would be clearer to say to "create a local folder in the root directory of the USB drive that was just formatted" or something to that effect.

 

I don't own a Pioneer machine, but my Oppo experience tells me that those Step H instructions from HiRezGuy are correct as they stand. He's telling you how to create the Windows folder that will eventually store your SACD rips. It's only the three AutoScript files that are stored on the USB drive.

[BlueSkyy]

19 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

 

I don't own a Pioneer machine, but my Oppo experience tells me that those Step H instructions from HiRezGuy are correct as they stand. He's telling you how to create the Windows folder that will eventually store your SACD rips. It's only the three AutoScript files that are stored on the USB drive.

 

My comment wasn't specific to any particular player type or manufacturer.  It was a comment on the particular drive letter designation that the USB drive has been assigned by the Windows PC.  To say "create  a folder in the root of the Windows PC" begs the question which drive.  I know it's implicit but should include the drive letter designation of that USB drive.

[KVDB010]

Quote

I don't own a Pioneer machine, but my Oppo experience tells me that those Step H instructions from HiRezGuy are correct as they stand. He's telling you how to create the folder that will eventually store your SACD rips.

You are entirely correct. I created in step H a folder "SACD" in the root of the PC disk drive to store SACD iso rips of my Pioneer DBP-160. In addition, it also should contain the  sacd_extract.exe file to start the ripping process. Perhaps this might be written more clearly in the instructions.

 

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[KVDB010]

Quote

Does this mean that the instructions from HiRezGuy should now be labelled as applying to the Pioneer BDP-80FD, BDP-160 and BDP-170?

Affirmative as it appears now.

[haggis999]

24 minutes ago, BlueSkyy said:

My comment wasn't specific to any particular player type or manufacturer...

 

Yes it was. You were criticising the wording of instructions aimed at specific Pioneer Blu-ray players.

 

24 minutes ago, BlueSkyy said:

It was a comment on the particular drive letter designation that the USB drive has been assigned by the Windows PC.

 

Your original post said nothing about drive letter designations.

 

24 minutes ago, BlueSkyy said:

To say "create  a folder in the root of the Windows PC" begs the question which drive.  I know it's implicit but should include the drive letter designation of that USB drive.

 

Why are you relating the instruction to create a folder in the root of the PC (typically C:/) with the drive letter assigned to a USB memory stick? There is no connection between these two things!

 

Perhaps I'm missing something here, but please have another go at describing your problem...

[BlueSkyy]

Thanks and I will try and, yes, I erroneously stated the USB which was incorrect.

 

The original "step H" said:

 

H. Create a local folder on root of the Windows PC........

As you noted, that is typically C: drive on a Windows PC.  My only point was that, if the user chose another drive/partition on the Windows PC to store the ripped data, it might be good to point out to create that folder in the root of the drive of your choice.

 

No worries from here on out.  This is good work and thanks to those who are doing it!

 

 

[haggis999]

HiRezGuy's choice of words was aimed at the majority of users who just have one drive on their PC, but it would certainly be just as valid to create the folder in the root of a secondary drive. All that matters is that the chosen drive has enough free space to store lots of large DSF files,

[CatManDo]

The recommendation to create a ripping folder at the root of the drive (which can be any drive) is made to minimize the risk of problems with long file names, but it's not a requirement.

 

I created a folder c:/rips/sacd (I have other subfolders for CD and DVD rips, which use other software tools) and never had a problem with ripping to ISO. But when you extract to seperate tracks, the risk of getting too long file names is much higher

[audiventory]

2 minutes ago, CatManDo said:

the risk of getting too long file names is much higher

 

I think, you may slightly reduce the risk if will use root directory. It is issue of both Mac and Windows.

However, short target directory name is not guaranteed decission.

The issue must be solved into ISO extractor via "smart" file-name truncation, as implemented in our software.

Target directory structure is:

Base target directory / Performer / Year - Album / Track name.dsf

 

There length of [base target directory] is calculated. And rest allowable length divided between subdirectories and file name.

Also all wrong (for file system) symbols are replaced to allowable ones.

[haggis999]

47 minutes ago, CatManDo said:

The recommendation to create a ripping folder at the root of the drive (which can be any drive) is made to minimize the risk of problems with long file names, but it's not a requirement.

 

I created a folder c:/rips/sacd (I have other subfolders for CD and DVD rips, which use other software tools) and never had a problem with ripping to ISO. But when you extract to seperate tracks, the risk of getting too long file names is much higher

 

My experience suggests that when ripping classical SACDs to DSF files, it is almost essential to place your ripping folder at the root of a drive. A lot of my rips just hung up for no obvious reason until I realised that excessive path lengths were the cause. Only a short folder name, stored in the root, resolved all those issues.

 

As Yuri Korzunov has pointed out, this ripping process is still not guaranteed to work. The metadata-based filename might simply be far too long for even the shortest target folder name, but I have yet to hit such a problem. If I ever do, I will check out Yuri's software for extracting an ISO with truncated filenames (though I am unclear which of his products does this job).   

 

[audiventory]

3 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

though I am unclear which of his products does this job

 

@haggis999, as rule classical music have too long metadata lenght, that cause file name isues.

 

DEMO should unpack all ISO's tracks (with 2 second silence limitation).

 

File naming functionality available in:

1. Modula-R "ISO (core)" module (DSF output bit-perfect only, without audio processing),

2. Audiophil-E (PCM output),

3. PROduce-R (PCM output),

4. PROduce-RD (DSF output).

 

sacd_extract unpack short name in English. Rest file name processing by metadata and target directories performed without limitaion by English or forbidden symbols and file path/name truncation is applied.

 

[haggis999]

Hi Yuri,
Your website would be much easier to navigate if you reduced almost all the font sizes and greatly reduced (or deleted) various enormous graphic images that serve little purpose and just get in the way. You have to scroll way, way, way down the home page to get a clear explanation that your product called AuI ConverteR 48x44 is available in five different editions (Free, Lite, AudiophilE, PROduce-R and PROduce-RD). That should be at the top, not the bottom!

 

As far as I can work out, AuI ConverteR 48x44 does not enable you to rip an SACD. I assume that you are proposing that anyone who hits problems with the standard SACD ripping processes described in this thread should first use one of these processes to rip to an ISO file (this is an option in Sonore ISO2DSD) and then use your product to generate the DSF files in an intelligent fashion that reduces filename sizes where necessary.

 

Does the Free edition generate DSF files from an ISO in this manner? If not, which edition is required? I am only looking for intelligent filename sizing, not any audio processing capability

 

By the way, I didn't really understand the reference in your post to the Modula-R "ISO (core)" module. Is this a module that is present in all of your five editions? 

[audiventory]

16 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

You have to scroll way, way, way down the home page to get a clear explanation that your product called AuI ConverteR 48x44 is available in five different editions (Free, Lite, AudiophilE, PROduce-R and PROduce-RD). That should be at the top, not the bottom!

Hi Haggis999,

Thank you for feedback. It is insight for me. I will think about site usability for clearer showing of its content.

 

18 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

As far as I can work out, AuI ConverteR 48x44 does not enable you to rip an SACD. I assume that you are proposing that anyone who hits problems with the standard SACD ripping processes described in this thread should first use one of these processes to rip to an ISO file (this is an option in Sonore ISO2DSD) and then use your product to generate the DSF files in an intelligent fashion that reduces filename sizes where necessary.

 

I will think about connecting sacd_extract utility, that is managed by AuI ConverteR, to music server.

While I work under refactoring of my converter internal structure to future functionality. I plan next release in July.

I will learn the connection issue in background. Thank you for idea.

 

22 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

Does the Free edition generate DSF files from an ISO in this manner? If not, which edition is required? I am only looking for intelligent filename sizing, not any audio processing capability

 

Free edition (in frame of ISO to DSF conversion) allow to estimate quality of sound and click removing. Also it make file paths like commercial editions.

However, as I wrote before, there is silences in middles of each track. So you can view how will work commercial editions of the software.

 

30 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

By the way, I didn't really understand the reference in your post to the Modula-R "ISO (core)" module. Is this a module that is present in all of your five editions?

 

Modula-R is separate edition. It can be "assembled" from modules.

Module is a part of functionality (module = license key).

You can order only functionality (modules), what you need. As example, via configurator.

Modules may be ordered separatelly. Purchased license key of a module entered to Modula-R and "open" the module's funtionality.

"ISO (core)" is core module. It can be purchased and work without other modules. "ISO (core)" is automation under sacd_extract to solving extraction issues and provideing graphical interface.

 

Modula-R's modules can't be connected to integrated editions Lite, Audiophil-E, PROduce-R and PROduce-RD.

However, integrated editions are cheaper than identical Modula-R's module kits.

[haggis999]

Hi Yuri,
Just as another example of the confusing layout of your website, the 'Comparison of Editions in Details' section only lists the five editions I mentioned in my previous post, while the 'Comparison of Editions in Short' section lists six editions (the extra edition being Modula-R).

 

However, I still don't know which edition or which module would let me extract DSFs from an ISO file with automatic control of filename length (so far, you have only made it clear that the free edition of your product will not do this job). Please clarify.

[audiventory]

16 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

However, I still don't know which edition or which module would let me extract DSFs from an ISO file with automatic control of filename length (so far, you have only made it clear that the free edition of your product will not do this job). Please clarify.

 

Hi Haggis999,

 

Minimal configuration to convert ISO to DSF is Modula-R in single-module configuration (purchased onle 1 module/license key):

1. "ISO extract (core) module"

See here order links http://samplerateconverter.com/soft/audio-iso-converter.php#prices-select

"ISO to DSF bit-perfect (without resampling/processing) extractor (Modula-R edition)"

 

Free edition is demo only. It allow check sound quality, functionalty (including path length) and compare it with alternatives.

 

Free edition allow convert PCM files (up to 24-bit/192 kHz) without batch processing.

But for any 1-bit audio file, free edition have 2 second silence limitation.

 

 

[audiventory]

@haggis999

I just seen help of sacd_extract, there -i parameter may be assigned to IP adress:port instead file name.

Me need learn how it will compatible with existing ISO extract automation and model replacing of the file name to address. If IP adress work (may be there will need modify something), I will upload beta of free DEMO (after fixing of current new-modification bugs) to testing with music servers.

 

[haggis999]

Hi Yuri,
The order link quoted in your post takes me to your ISO Extract module, which costs $22.30.

 

This module's description is shown below. However, no mention is made of the ability to control filename lengths or to eliminate illegal characters found in the metadata. Given that that is the reason why readers of this thread might benefit from your software, perhaps you ought to update the description.

• ISO to DSF bit-perfect (without resampling/processing) extractor (Modula-R edition). Extracting without resampling and clickless processing. Audio data (binary audio content) extracted "as is" from audio 1-bit ISO to DSF audio file.

[audiventory]

27 minutes ago, haggis999 said:

Hi Yuri,
The order link quoted in your post takes me to your ISO Extract module, which costs $22.30.

 

This module's description is shown below. However, no mention is made of the ability to control filename lengths or to eliminate illegal characters found in the metadata. Given that that is the reason why readers of this thread might benefit from your software, perhaps you ought to update the description.

• ISO to DSF bit-perfect (without resampling/processing) extractor (Modula-R edition). Extracting without resampling and clickless processing. Audio data (binary audio content) extracted "as is" from audio 1-bit ISO to DSF audio file.

 

 

Hi Haggis999,

Yes. It is that module.

Thank you for suggestion. I will add description. Because I not once get answer what is difference between free software and my converter.

 

P.S. It's current net price (without possible  taxes in some countries).

[KVDB010]

@ted_b

Nice update of the first page,