HQ Player

[Miska]

3 hours ago, Pentagonal said:

If the Mojo is taking in data at 32bits over USB, and possibly processing it at a high bit rate, wouldn’t the quantization distortion be below audibility or the DAC’s S/N ratio?

 

Possibly, but if it is, there is no difference in doing it without distortion using dither either. So you can't win by omitting dither, you can only lose.

 

[Miska]

5 hours ago, jimdukey said:

"appreciate the insights you shared on the sinc-S filter a couple weeks ago)"

 

I like the Sinc S Filter, but missed the explanation. 

Can someone please repost it?

 

sinc-S is like sinc-M, but "made sensible". For example by making the length adapt to conversion ratio. So in all conversion ratio cases it behaves the same. So instead of "million taps" (which it reaches at 256x output) it's length adapts as factor of conversion ratio. Meaning that it's filtering response is the same at all conversion ratios.

 

[DancingSea]

7 hours ago, Miska said:

 

There is (incomplete) list of devices on HQPlayer Desktop product page under "Devices with built-in NAA". Antipodes and few other bigger devices not listed there because they can be configured to also run HQPlayer Embedded and NAA is just an option.

 

 

A brief list it is!  Given all your spare time 😂, it would be helpful to have a more thorough list.  I’m exploring server options that can do both Roon and HQPlayer.  I’m leery of anything that just runs Roon due to SQ issues.  I go to the Roon site, and they have 70 companies with multiple products listed as Roon Ready.  It would take me a month to them visit each website and figure out which ones also handle HQPlayer.  I’m familiar with the Rendus and SOTM, but was curious about component sized options that don’t need a PC or Mac.  A full list of NAA products would be very helpful!

 

Another idea, one I’m sure you won’t do, is what about developing a different name scheme for the filters?  Like naming them after mountains, or rivers?  Something more interesting than the technical geeky names?  Just a thought.  Or names that somehow convey a sound quality?

[Miska]

15 minutes ago, DancingSea said:

I’m exploring server options that can do both Roon and HQPlayer.

 

That is pretty much Antipodes, iCat Inc, PinkFaun and SGC sonicTransporter.

 

22 minutes ago, DancingSea said:

 I’m familiar with the Rendus and SOTM, but was curious about component sized options that don’t need a PC or Mac.  A full list of NAA products would be very helpful!

 

That is different from above, but for "component size" I would expect a full DAC with NAA built in rather than just a NAA.

 

25 minutes ago, DancingSea said:

Another idea, one I’m sure you won’t do, is what about developing a different name scheme for the filters?  Like naming them after mountains, or rivers?  Something more interesting than the technical geeky names?  Just a thought.  Or names that somehow convey a sound quality?

 

I think that is too much of stretch for my engineering driven mind set. Now the naming is pretty much in line with how DAC chip manufacturers call their things on their datasheets.

 

[DancingSea]

1 minute ago, Miska said:

That is different from above, but for "component size" I would expect a full DAC with NAA built in rather than just a NAA.

 

That would be even better.  Does such an all in one DAC/ NAA/ Roon device exist?

[Miska]

8 minutes ago, DancingSea said:

That would be even better.  Does such an all in one DAC/ NAA/ Roon device exist?

 

T+A is NAA + DAC.

 

But if the same box is supposed to have Roon Core and DAC, you would rather want to have HQPlayer Embedded there and then it doesn't make sense to have a NAA. Sure, technically you could one have one box with Roon Core, NAA and DAC and then run HQPlayer in some other computer, but it sounds like a strange solution. It wouldn't make sense either to have Roon Core, HQPlayer Embedded, NAA and DAC in the same box, which is technically possible though.

 

IOW, what you are asking is missing information where HQPlayer is supposed to be running.

 

Closest to what you are asking is DIY server with Roon Core, HQPlayer Embedded and EVGA NU Audio card.

 

[DancingSea]

2 hours ago, Miska said:

 

T+A is NAA + DAC.

 

But if the same box is supposed to have Roon Core and DAC, you would rather want to have HQPlayer Embedded there and then it doesn't make sense to have a NAA. Sure, technically you could one have one box with Roon Core, NAA and DAC and then run HQPlayer in some other computer, but it sounds like a strange solution. It wouldn't make sense either to have Roon Core, HQPlayer Embedded, NAA and DAC in the same box, which is technically possible though.

 

IOW, what you are asking is missing information where HQPlayer is supposed to be running.

 

Closest to what you are asking is DIY server with Roon Core, HQPlayer Embedded and EVGA NU Audio card.

 

What are the choices for separate streamers that are Roon Ready and NAA that use a Mac or PC but are not SOTM or Sonore?

[mfalcon]

6 hours ago, DancingSea said:

What are the choices for separate streamers that are Roon Ready and NAA that use a Mac or PC but are not SOTM or Sonore?

I use a sonore on my main system, but you could get a raspberry pi with naa if you don’t want sonore or SoTM.

[djn04]

I'm looking for some help setting up a Roon and HQplayer system. My setup is a Synology NAS with Roon Core installed and a desktop PC with an i7 9700k with USB output to a Topping D90/A90 stack.

 

My plan is to have the Roon Core remain on the NAS and install HQPlayer on the PC. I would like to upsample to DSD 256 and use convolution for AutoEQ wav files for my headphones.

 

I can install HQPlayer on either Windows 10 or macOS. Is one better than the other for my setup? Can HQPlayer output DSD 256 natively in macOS? Does it matter if it's native or DOP for the D90?

 

AutoEQ has 44.1k and 48k stereo wav files for convolution. HQPlayer seems to require mono files. Will the stereo files work? If so, should I use 44.1k or 48k? Can you have more than one convolution setting in HQPlayer like the presets in Roon?

 

Are these the correct/preferred settings to output DSD 256 to the D90 in macOS?

[Miska]

1 hour ago, djn04 said:

I'm looking for some help setting up a Roon and HQplayer system. My setup is a Synology NAS with Roon Core installed and a desktop PC with an i7 9700k with USB output to a Topping D90/A90 stack.

 

My plan is to have the Roon Core remain on the NAS and install HQPlayer on the PC. I would like to upsample to DSD 256 and use convolution for AutoEQ wav files for my headphones.

 

I can install HQPlayer on either Windows 10 or macOS. Is one better than the other for my setup? Can HQPlayer output DSD 256 natively in macOS? Does it matter if it's native or DOP for the D90?

 

If the DAC can accept 705.6/768k PCM, then likely also DSD256 over DoP on macOS will work. RME ADI-2 being example of such which offers same capabilities on all platforms.

 

DoP wastes 50% of transfer bandwidth on modern 32-bit interface DACs, but otherwise it works fine.

 

macOS has it's good sides, good side on Windows are ASIO drivers. So there is no clear answer which platform to prefer. I personally prefer Linux.

 

1 hour ago, djn04 said:

AutoEQ has 44.1k and 48k stereo wav files for convolution. HQPlayer seems to require mono files. Will the stereo files work? If so, should I use 44.1k or 48k? Can you have more than one convolution setting in HQPlayer like the presets in Roon?

 

You would need to split stereo WAV into two mono WAV. Using 48k would be better option and enable "HF Expand" option in HQPlayer.

 

If you configure convolution in matrix pipeline setup of HQPlayer, you can have various profiles you can switch between.

 

1 hour ago, djn04 said:

Are these the correct/preferred settings to output DSD 256 to the D90 in macOS?

 

It is better to make macOS use something else like buit-in audio device as default audio output device, and select the DAC as audio output device explicitly in HQPlayer instead of "Default" device. Using default output device is prone to conflicts with system sounds and other applications. But otherwise looks fine as long as your CPU can cope with ASDM7EC modulator to DSD256 output (for example iMac with i9-99000K can).

 

[Miska]

20 hours ago, DancingSea said:

What are the choices for separate streamers that are Roon Ready and NAA that use a Mac or PC but are not SOTM or Sonore?

 

I have totally no idea about Roon Ready. But maybe Antipodes for example.

 

[asdf1000]

Hi @Miska

 

When you are using Acourate, are you creating minimum phase target impulse responses?

 

Or since you like linear phase HQP upsampling filters (like ext2) do you make Acourate create linear phase filters to match?

 

 

[Miska]

4 hours ago, asdf1000 said:

When you are using Acourate, are you creating minimum phase target impulse responses?

 

I have to say I don't remember at all. Last time I touched Acourate was like two years ago or so when I created some correction filters. Since my speakers and room have not changed since, there has been no reason to touch the filters.

 

Linear phase correction filters tend to be tricky because it brings pre-ringing right into middle of audio band. So if you do it with linear phase you'd likely want to keep correction steepness very gentle to keep the ringing short.

 

[jacquesr]

On 5/27/2020 at 5:21 AM, Miska said:

 

Since it doesn't have LNS15 noise shaper, you can settle on NS9 instead for example. But otherwise the same settings.

 

 

 

Hello Miska,

I upgraded to V4. But I only realized today that it is not working!

I added the Aqua LinQ to my setup AND I upgraded at about the same time.

The sound was good, but not great.... until I figured out I was running Roon "naked".

I want "my" sound back! LOL

Please check the attached image and let me know how to fix that. Thanks!!

[dean70]

Tried sinc-L and DSD256 ASDM7EC on i7-10700k system and drops audio every few seconds. Will play fine with sinc-S from any PCM rate. Yet to try overclocking.

 

Unfortunately old GPU (GTX970) either died or is not compatible with new M/B so running using iGPU until I get replacement. Damn Noctua NH-D15 cooler on Gigabyte Vision D m/b blocks the PCI-x 16 slot by about 5mm. Poor design. Looking at water cooling replacement.

 

[asdf1000]

5 hours ago, Miska said:

 

I have to say I don't remember at all. Last time I touched Acourate was like two years ago or so when I created some correction filters. Since my speakers and room have not changed since, there has been no reason to touch the filters.

 

I find this hard to believe, someone so technical like you would forget something this important ! 😁

 

But all joking aside, it sounds like if you were to re-do your room EQ filters, you would use minimum phase room correction filters, but in combination with reconstruction filters it’s ok (technically) to also use linear phase reconstruction filters, in combination?

Eg no technical issues with: 

 

minimum phase convolution filter + linear phase ext2 reconstruction filter?

 

[Miska]

8 hours ago, jacques_racine said:

I upgraded to V4. But I only realized today that it is not working!

I added the Aqua LinQ to my setup AND I upgraded at about the same time.

The sound was good, but not great.... until I figured out I was running Roon "naked".

I want "my" sound back! LOL

Please check the attached image and let me know how to fix that. Thanks!!

 

That shouldn't be fatal, but likely makes auto-discovery not work (which Roon doesn't support anyway). It is some problem with network configuration.

 

[Miska]

5 hours ago, asdf1000 said:

But all joking aside, it sounds like if you were to re-do your room EQ filters, you would use minimum phase room correction filters, but in combination with reconstruction filters it’s ok (technically) to also use linear phase reconstruction filters, in combination?

 

They are unrelated. For example REW always gives you minimum phase filters. So kind of room correction filter doesn't matter in relation to upsampling filters.

 

5 hours ago, asdf1000 said:

Eg no technical issues with: 

 

minimum phase convolution filter + linear phase ext2 reconstruction filter?

 

No problem at all.

 

[Miska]

5 hours ago, dean70 said:

Unfortunately old GPU (GTX970) either died or is not compatible with new M/B so running using iGPU until I get replacement. Damn Noctua NH-D15 cooler on Gigabyte Vision D m/b blocks the PCI-x 16 slot by about 5mm. Poor design. Looking at water cooling replacement.

 

Good to know since I'm looking into same motherboard! On the motherboards I've used it has been OK, tight, but still fit. But usually I've needed to run with just one fan because taller RAMs like HyperX Predator don't leave space for the second fan.

 

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, Miska said:

 

They are unrelated. For example REW always gives you minimum phase filters. So kind of room correction filter doesn't matter in relation to upsampling filters.

 

 

No problem at all.

 

 

Thanks Jussi !

[asdf1000]

1 hour ago, Miska said:

Damn Noctua NH-D15 cooler on Gigabyte Vision D m/b blocks the PCI-x 16 slot by about 5mm.

 

What about NH U14S? 14cm, so may be ok.

 

This is what I have. It is recommended by Noctua for my i9-9900K and has been really quiet.

 

[dean70]

1 hour ago, asdf1000 said:

 

What about NH U14S? 14cm, so may be ok.

 

This is what I have. It is recommended by Noctua for my i9-9900K and has been really quiet.

 

 

This cooler also blocks the PCI-ex16 slot. Basically any mainboard with the PCI-ex16 slot as the first slot is incompatible with the larger Noctua coolers. The 10th gen CPUs can draw 250w+ & need lots of cooling.

[jacquesr]

Hello Miska,

Can you be a bit more precise?

I am not sure what too so at this stage.

Nothing has changed with my network.

I still have the v3 version on my server (but it is not running of course).

But it no longer works either.

When I start a track in Roon, HQP does not react.

Thanks

[Miska]

3 hours ago, dean70 said:

This cooler also blocks the PCI-ex16 slot. Basically any mainboard with the PCI-ex16 slot as the first slot is incompatible with the larger Noctua coolers. The 10th gen CPUs can draw 250w+ & need lots of cooling.

 

Usually there should be also another 16x slot if the board supports SLI, and it shouldn't fall back to 8x or similar if the other 16x is not occupied. But always good to check.

 

On Vision-D the middle 16x slot should be just as fine too.

 

[Mike Rubin]

Rather than scroll 702 pages of posts for guidance on this, I ask Miska please to indulge my just asking this question here:

 

I have a Dell XPS8390 with current version i7 processor, 16gb RAM, Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050ti, a 256gb system SSD, and 1tb HDD.  Music is stored on a NAS.  I do not have the computer connected to any audio equipment by USB and, instead, play back to a microRendu on my office desktop, an ultrarendu in my basement, and a Signature Rendu in my living room.  I presently use JRiver MC over DLNA for library maintenance and some playback and Audirvana over DLNA for some playback. I also am testing Roon on a free trial. I control using the computer when seated at it or with iPad and Android apps when using the apps remotely.

 

All music on JRiver is native resolution and both Audirvana and Roon are upsampled to DSD 256. All sound good, but Roon sounds best.  However, I despise the Roon experience for reasons that I don't need to share here, so haven't yet decided whether to subscribe when the trial is over.

 

I don't spend a lot of time at the computer, but, when I do, I am working on word processing, financial management, surfing the web, or running utilities and, at the same time, listening on my desktop system with the microRendu.

 

So, here's the question:. Given that I cannot dedicate this computer exclusively to audio, do I have enough horsepower to run HQP with all files upsampled to DSD256?