Is computer audio maturing?

[AudioDoctor]

IMO, and based on solely my own personal feelings and observations, Computer Audio is now maturing to the point where, much like the rest of audiophilia, there are those that do things the "old fashioned" way for no reason other than that's the way it's been done versus those that are always trying the next new thing or wondering if the AppleTV (for example only) is the future of Computer Audio while some of us will get rid of our USB connected DACs when you pry them out of our cold dead hands...

 

Your thoughts, and please keep your comments about my perfectly constructed run on sentence to yourself. ;-)

[Zakus]

Until I am satisfied that streaming is bit perfect in the audio files resolution the usb DAC stays in my gorilla hand grip.

[sdolezalek]

We are all maturing every day and unlike some of us, that is a good thing when it comes to audio. But I think we are just in the first, or maybe second wave and there is still a lot to come.

 

Change isn't yet close to done in either hardware configuration or software capabilities. I see us migrating ever further toward a configuration that looks like software player > computer > dac > powered speaker; largely eliminating conventional preamplifiers, pushing the crossover network back into the computer and the amplification into the speaker. I think we are also learning how to minimize the manipulation of bits and of analog waves by things like jitter, but also by filtering. Figuring out just where a single D-to-A conversion should occur and how to minimize messing with it in destructive ways is an unfinished task.

 

As we strip away the layers of distortion, I think we will become even more critical of just how music is recorded in the first place. And, I think we will discover that some "truths" we assumed to be true (like 24/192 is better than 16/44) may turn out to be less true and other complicating factors will be revealed as playing a bigger role than previously thought.

 

I also think we can also get a lot closer to real performances. Think about how great it would be if you could automatically download to your iTunes account a live song as you were listening to it. Not because you recorded a bootleg, but because the performance was recorded and streamed to subscribers in real time.

 

The fun is just beginning... ;-)))

[mayhem13]

Certainly evolving on all fronts, but for the mainstream convenience and content will always be ahead of sound quality sadly. Streamed and App content IMO is what's growing the fastest so I do agree that network players like the ATV will become more numerous. One could only hope that these mainstream type content streamers also allow for higher bitrates and improved SQ all around. Only time will tell.

 

The DIY guys are doing their best to advance things on their own with devices like the Raspberry Pi ARM processors and the like. The affordable answer to high end network audio might just be birthed in someone's garage in the next few months.

[4est]

Certainly evolving on all fronts, but for the mainstream convenience and content will always be ahead of sound quality sadly. Streamed and App content IMO is what's growing the fastest so I do agree that network players like the ATV will become more numerous. One could only hope that these mainstream type content streamers also allow for higher bitrates and improved SQ all around. Only time will tell.

 

The DIY guys are doing their best to advance things on their own with devices like the Raspberry Pi ARM processors and the like. The affordable answer to high end network audio might just be birthed in someone's garage in the next few months.

 

I am with mayhem on this one. UPnP is till maturing in usability, and the hardware is largely there via the big guys. The task seems to be taking the best advantage of the hardware options in so that we might exploit it for our small scale needs. The large companies will have little interest, as the market is too small, and the grass roots developers and little guys are most likely to make the right combinations.

 

Ultimately, I feel it is anything but mature. We are still using regular boxes and doing incantations to get then to suit our needs. True high fidelity embedded type device such as Apple TV are probably it, but Apple TV is not one.

[mav52]

I am with mayhem on this one. UPnP is till maturing in usability, and the hardware is largely there via the big guys. The task seems to be taking the best advantage of the hardware options in so that we might exploit it for our small scale needs. The large companies will have little interest, as the market is too small, and the grass roots developers and little guys are most likely to make the right combinations.

 

Ultimately, I feel it is anything but mature. We are still using regular boxes and doing incantations to get then to suit our needs. True high fidelity embedded type device such as Apple TV are probably it, but Apple TV is not one.

 

Wow, I also agree with 4est and mayhem on their position. My opinion on the Maturity Level of computer audio; infant stage = walking on it's own.

[Guidof]

Lots of room for growth still before it reaches maturity, in my view.

 

Guido F.

[iago]

My impression is that we are on the second slope of Gartner's technological hype cycle.

 

The actual position largely depends on which segment of the market one is looking at, since the lower slope usually signifies an adaption rate of probably 5%. Some segments. like music downloads and portable devices have a much higher market saturation already, while music servers (players, streamers) still have a way to go.

[sdolezalek]

My impression is that we are on the second slope of Gartner's technological hype cycle.

 

At the time I posted, I wasn't sure we had yet witnessed a trough of disillusionment. But perhaps the newly released iTunes 11 will represent that trough, as often it is the attempted revenge of the entrenched players that must be overcome before we see real maturation of the latest technology.

[realhifi]

I would agree on the maturation except for the fact we are so fractured on file types, resolution, how to purchase, ownership, cost, etc.. The file format is the most troubling aspect of computer audio to me. It is easier and easier to play good files and to have them sound superb in traditional Hifi systems with not insanely expensive equipment so the onus rests on the files themselves and how do you get universally high resolution files that are universal in their ability to play on any system.

 

In short, the hardware guys are doing their job and now it's up to the software and recording industry to get their act together and form a truce like in the old days of the RIAA standard whereas there was at least a common ground for playback. It appears that Apple is at least starting that with their "Mastered for iTunes" push in getting at least 24/96 files to start with (and hopefully end with).

 

It's really an exciting time for audio and I hope that computer audio will continue to breathe new life into music!

[4est]

I would agree on the maturation except for the fact we are so fractured on file types, resolution, how to purchase, ownership, cost, etc.. The file format is the most troubling aspect of computer audio to me. It is easier and easier to play good files and to have them sound superb in traditional Hifi systems with not insanely expensive equipment so the onus rests on the files themselves and how do you get universally high resolution files that are universal in their ability to play on any system.

 

In short, the hardware guys are doing their job and now it's up to the software and recording industry to get their act together and form a truce like in the old days of the RIAA standard whereas there was at least a common ground for playback. It appears that Apple is at least starting that with their "Mastered for iTunes" push in getting at least 24/96 files to start with (and hopefully end with).

 

It's really an exciting time for audio and I hope that computer audio will continue to breathe new life into music!

 

Hmmm, not so sure about this one David. I often agree with your stances, but in this I feel I may not entirely. As an active proponent for discerning the differences in file types, I am not sure if a standard would help as much simply negate the competition ala VHS and Beta. I am also not so sure that it is a software issue as much as it may be a software-hardware interaction or pre processing issue.

[realhifi]

Hmmm, not so sure about this one David. I often agree with your stances, but in this I feel I may not entirely. As an active proponent for discerning the differences in file types, I am not sure if a standard would help as much simply negate the competition ala VHS and Beta. I am also not so sure that it is a software issue as much as it may be a software-hardware interaction or pre processing issue.

 

Good point. More of a "can't we all just get along" point of view when looking at the number of file types and how each should be able to play on anything. Certainly we don't need a winner take all scenario but at least narrow the field to a manageable size.

 

We run the danger of people being scared off by yet another dizzying array of things that may or may not open on their favored music system. Maybe not US crazies but the general populous doesn't need to worry about "will this play on MY system" much like when someone receives an email with an attachment that won't open for them on their computer.

 

For the man in the street this is a very real and very frustrating barrier to embracing computer audio as it stands now. For you and I, not so much.

[4est]

Good point. More of a "can't we all just get along" point of view when looking at the number of file types and how each should be able to play on anything. Certainly we don't need a winner take all scenario but at least narrow the field to a manageable size.

 

We run the danger of people being scared off by yet another dizzying array of things that may or may not open on their favored music system. Maybe not US crazies but the general populous doesn't need to worry about "will this play on MY system" much like when someone receives an email with an attachment that won't open for them on their computer.

 

For the man in the street this is a very real and very frustrating barrier to embracing computer audio as it stands now. For you and I, not so much.

 

Agreed... It would help is Apple would just drop ALAC in favor of FLAC. Not to bash Mac btw...

[AudioDoctor]

Perhaps I am the only curmudgeon who likes it the way it is with my AIFF and USB and doesn't see a need for change...

 

That's ok, I still have vinyl and tubes too...

 

I also think audiophiles tend to make Mount Everest out of mole hills quite frequently...

[AudioDoctor]

and don't let me forget my Mac Mini...

[DigiPete]

Computer Audio

 

If computer audio is:

 

Computer -> DAC -> Traditional equipment

 

Then computer audio is probably pretty far along.

 

 

Digital Audio

 

But we have hardly gotten started, if we are looking to get the most out of having music in a digital format.

What do I mean by that, what other advantages could there possibly be?

 

a) Sterling recordings

b) A consumer friendly setup and integration

c) Wireless speakers

d) Automatic room correction

e) Pure digital amplification, like a power DAC, like Lyngdorf or other PVM like amplifier

f) Elimination of all analogue links and the losses/coloration's associated

g) Easy adjustment of sound footprint to ones liking

h) Automatic sub(s) integration

i) Easy wireless network integration of all parts along the line of UpNP

j) Self optimization units for sound and energy consumption

k) Sound and pictures always in sync when running a screen

l) Low pricing taking advantage of smart design rather than

m) Surround sound taking over the market to enhance sense of reality

 

And probably a lot more that I have forgot about or that have not been thought of yet.

 

I say we have hardly scratched the surface of Digital Audio!

[Jsmith]

Interesting if we focus on Digital Audio because I think there can be an argument we are pretty far along. On the format there has been Digital Audio Tapes, CDs, MP3, and Hi-Res just to name a few.

 

Players, DACs, servers, streamers, computers, and software have all made a large impact to the playback of the above mentioned formats.

 

I am in no way stating we are near the end of the journey or that the future doesn't hold great opportunity. Just that we should not take for granted how far we have come.

[bluesman]

Although we've witnessed some amazing improvements in the end product, we really haven't seen a major change in the basic nature of "digital audio" since the first PCM-recorded vinyl circa 1970. Pulse code modulation's been around for about 100 years, although modern use for audio recording is only about 75 years old. We've seen a lot of improvement in how we create, process, store and reproduce digital audio - but the basic process is almost as archaic as magnetic tape by now.

 

I'm sure there will be major changes in computers (bacterial nanocomputers, anyone?) that will revolutionize digital audio. I can imagine a totally new approach resulting in a continuous stream of data that somehow mirrors the audio input - an uninterrupted data stream analogous to an audio signal but generated with energy other than electrical. Fortunately, since I don't anticipate living long enough to buy a Dell Streptoputer, what we have now is pretty good. But it's still just refinement of the way we've been making and listening to recorded music for decades now.

 

To the future.........

[Metralla]

I say we have hardly scratched the surface of Digital Audio!

I'm inclined to agree.

[ItemAudio]

My impression is that we are on the second slope of Gartner's technological hype cycle.

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The actual position largely depends on which segment of the market one is looking at, since the lower slope usually signifies an adaption rate of probably 5%. Some segments. like music downloads and portable devices have a much higher market saturation already, while music servers (players, streamers) still have a way to go.

 

That's exactly where I think we are! Although over here in the UK, major chunks of the market have only just progressed past the Technology Trigger. In fact, a segment of it hasn't spotted there is a graph yet.

 

The penny is only just beginning to drop seriously that a computer has to be designed like a good old-skool CD transport (without the disc spinner) for uncompromised performance.

[sandyk]

The penny is only just beginning to drop seriously that a computer has to be designed like a good old-skool CD transport (without the disc spinner) for uncompromised performance.

 

But good old-skool CD transports didn't have to contend with SMPS supplies, and were of a solid construction !

[ItemAudio]

But good old-skool CD transports didn't have to contend with SMPS supplies, and were of a solid construction !

 

In the 80s there was a famous bumper sticker: 'To err is human; to foul things up completely requires a computer.”

[Metralla]

But good old-skool CD transports didn't have to contend with SMPS supplies, and were of a solid construction !

Very solid. Have you tried to buy a CD ROM these days to rip the odd CD? Very cheaply made - audiophiles, even computer audiophiles, would "gladly" (yeah, alright) pay extra for a well made piece of kit. But there doesn't seem to be something like the Plextor of 5 years ago.

[sandyk]

Geoff

I get excellent results using internal LG BR writers.(around $100)Their optical block appears to be above average due to the need for precice focussing and tracking with the very much smaller pits and lands of a BR Disc.

They do of course have an additional red laser for reading CD etc.

A friend of mine gets great results from an external Plextor BR writer using a DIY linear PSU.

It is expensive though.

Regards

Alex

[4est]

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Very solid. Have you tried to buy a CD ROM these days to rip the odd CD? Very cheaply made - audiophiles, even computer audiophiles, would "gladly" (yeah, alright) pay extra for a well made piece of kit. But there doesn't seem to be something like the Plextor of 5 years ago.

 

Heh, sad but true. A short while back I paid the high dollar for a NIB Plextor px-230 just for ripping!