Article: Immersive Music and Some Current Favorites, Part 4

[The Computer Audiophile]

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[ted_b]

"Hearing these items has more to do with a mix that's equivalent to an exploded-view drawing/image, than anything else."

 

Chris, that is a perfect analogy for immersive music (done right).  I really appreciate these immersive music articles cuz, frankly, I worry that folks think it's gimmicky or ping-ping in 3D.  Or worse, they hear a bad Atmos mix (all Warner stuff, for example) and are underwhelmed at best case.  It's not gimmicky (when done right, as I like to caveat).  And the good mixes are a revelation.  It's a view into music that actually has always existed in three dimensions anyway.  And now we get to hear it.

 

I had a buddy over yesterday (the carpenter/master woodworker that built the room to my and Jeff Hedback's spec, in fact) and he was blown away (a phrase used unsparingly and overtly dismissed in most examples).  He really was.   For example (and I have many but will hold back) when I played him an Apple Music-compressed fifty year old live concert......and I introduced it that way.....he could not get over the fidelity, the creativity of the mix, and the ability to pick out his favorite guitar licks (left surround with some height).  He was mesmerized that a seemingly average, normal Grateful Dead concert could turn out to be one of the best things he'd heard "in a LONG time".  Steven Wilson's middle-of-the-band mix of Europe '72 deserves a physical (or, like Mr Big, at least a TrueHD uncompressed download) release, as does American Beauty.  And yes, I own just about every remix and remaster of American Beauty that includes vinyl, cd, DVD-Audio and now compressed streams.  And I'll take the compressed stream, thank you!  It's revelatory, as is Europe '72.

 

Moreover, there is SO much new music that I am experiencing lately, some of which I've had laying around here for years (more than one 2L bluray disc, listened for awhile and then used sparingly as demos in 5.1).  Now, the entire catalog, in Auro-3D (and Atmos, but I lean toward Auro-3D when I can; probably a processor sweet spot) is unfolding in front of me and I can't get enough.  Whole evenings spent lost in beautiful spheres of real live music (not literally, but you can't tell my brain that).  Amazing!

 

Anyway, thanks for the new immersive music article. 

[bobfa]

Yesterday I set up my living room 2-channel system to evaluate a product I am reviewing. I listened for a while to some tracks that I understood very well. Things work fine, yet the system sound is off. I shrug and go back down to my office. Something about the upstairs system is bugging me, so I fire up the ATMOS system and play the same tracks. They sound "right, really right ."OH, Bob, you silly person, the ATMOS system is DSP corrected; my brain and ears are not broken. As I am working, I put the Audiophile Style ATMOS playlist on. The snow globe of music around me is back again, and all is right with the world, well, this little part of it.

 

 

"Quaid, Free Your Mind" I am not a mutant mind reader on Mars; I am not in a chair at Recall; I am at home immersed in music that touches my core.

 

 

Now to make WAV files to listen to Mr. Big! in TrueHD. Thanks for the tip on that one. I did not open the email!

[bobfa]

10 hours ago, ted_b said:

And the good mixes are a revelation.  It's a view into music that actually has always existed in three dimensions anyway.  And now we get to hear it.

I would like to add that the artists have a new dimension to explore.  And to ask those at the mixing console to let us hear what you and the performer can do.  No not crush your work!  

[ted_b]

Bob, yes the extra dimension can be used in a number of ways.  And in each example the extra room that an instrument (or voice) has to occupy helps us hear it resonate and decay in real space.  That "alive" feeling, that experience at the beginning of a track when the presence of the amps are turned on or the air in the recorded space is clearly transferred to our listening room, even before the first notes, is something to hear and feel.  Even in compressed streams.  Which is why I just dropped another $49 (with shipping from Germany) for more stuff from IAN Records.  These guys are doing it right.  After hearing their Jazzmachine "24" on Apple I had to have it, and last night, after listening to Alessandro Quarta Plays Astor Piazzolla I had to have that one too.  The presence is beyond palpable.  😎

[The Computer Audiophile]

11 hours ago, ted_b said:

"Hearing these items has more to do with a mix that's equivalent to an exploded-view drawing/image, than anything else."

 

Chris, that is a perfect analogy for immersive music (done right).  I really appreciate these immersive music articles cuz, frankly, I worry that folks think it's gimmicky or ping-ping in 3D.  Or worse, they hear a bad Atmos mix (all Warner stuff, for example) and are underwhelmed at best case.  It's not gimmicky (when done right, as I like to caveat).  And the good mixes are a revelation.  It's a view into music that actually has always existed in three dimensions anyway.  And now we get to hear it.

 

I had a buddy over yesterday (the carpenter/master woodworker that built the room to my and Jeff Hedback's spec, in fact) and he was blown away (a phrase used unsparingly and overtly dismissed in most examples).  He really was.   For example (and I have many but will hold back) when I played him an Apple Music-compressed fifty year old live concert......and I introduced it that way.....he could not get over the fidelity, the creativity of the mix, and the ability to pick out his favorite guitar licks (left surround with some height).  He was mesmerized that a seemingly average, normal Grateful Dead concert could turn out to be one of the best things he'd heard "in a LONG time".  Steven Wilson's middle-of-the-band mix of Europe '72 deserves a physical (or, like Mr Big, at least a TrueHD uncompressed download) release, as does American Beauty.  And yes, I own just about every remix and remaster of American Beauty that includes vinyl, cd, DVD-Audio and now compressed streams.  And I'll take the compressed stream, thank you!  It's revelatory, as is Europe '72.

 

Moreover, there is SO much new music that I am experiencing lately, some of which I've had laying around here for years (more than one 2L bluray disc, listened for awhile and then used sparingly as demos in 5.1).  Now, the entire catalog, in Auro-3D (and Atmos, but I lean toward Auro-3D when I can; probably a processor sweet spot) is unfolding in front of me and I can't get enough.  Whole evenings spent lost in beautiful spheres of real live music (not literally, but you can't tell my brain that).  Amazing!

 

Anyway, thanks for the new immersive music article. 

 

Hi Ted, thanks for the kind words. That analogy just came to me as I was listening. I think it's perfect and really hits home once people hear immersive audio done right. Us audiophiles always talk about hearing what is heard in the studio or as close to a real event as possible. Immersive audio gets us 20 steps closer to that ideal, than anything possible with stereo. When we first got high resolution stereo, many of us thought we'd hit the jackpot. It was unreal to then get stereo high resolution streamed from Qobuz. The whole time, we had many new developments in hardware and software to make stero even better. In my experience, nothing that has come before, even comes close to the huge leap of immersive audio. 

 

I still absolutely love stereo and can't wait to publish my review of the dCS Rossini Apex, but would love a 12 channel dCS :~)

 

As you said, there are some bad mixes, but I don't think there are more bad immersive mixes than there are bad mixes/masters in stereo (on a percentage basis). 

 

It's funny you mention Grateful Dead. That's another band I couldn't get into. I liked the pop-esque Touch of Grey, but never anything more. Once I heard America Beauty in Atmos, it was game over. Now even my 10 year old daughter knows Grateful Dead. She asked for Truckin' on the way to school this morning. Not only that, she wanted to know why Truckin' was more popular than some of the other tracks, becuae they are better. Immersive audio was the gateway to my new appreciation and enjoyment of Grateful Dead. I'll be in heaven is we get a lossless TrueHD Atmos of American Beauty.

 

Last note, sometimes I publish these articles and think "nobody" likes them. I'm happy to read your comments. I believe in immersive audio so much, that I will continue writing about it until I run out of ink. This time is very different from multichannel efforts of old. I realize it's not trivial to install such a system, but 99% of the world thinks the average audiophile two channel system is way beyond trivial as well. A little research, a little planning, and a little creativity are what's needed to take the plunge. 

 

 

[Jud]

I have no idea if there's an immersive mix, but what got me into the Grateful Dead in my youth was "Uncle John's Band" from Workingman's Dead. There's also of course "Casey Jones" from that album, and "Dire Wolf" also became a favorite because how could you not love the lines "When I awoke, the dire wolf, Six hundred pounds of sin, Was grinning at my window, All I said was, 'Come on in.'"

[ted_b]

Working Man's Dead is available in a very nice Mickey Hart-led 5.1 mix on DVD-Audio, released in 2002, but not yet an immersive release.  That album, like American Beauty, was released in 1970.  What a year for them!

[sandston]

Speaking of immersive audio and the Dead. We are just about to board a plane to Mexico to see the 3 of the remaining members work it out for three glorious nights in the sand. Doesn't get anymore immersive than this. ;-)

[The Computer Audiophile]

58 minutes ago, sandston said:

Speaking of immersive audio and the Dead. We are just about to board a plane to Mexico to see the 3 of the remaining members work it out for three glorious nights in the sand. Doesn't get anymore immersive than this. ;-)

WOW!

[bobfa]

On 1/11/2023 at 9:29 AM, The Computer Audiophile said:

Last note, sometimes I publish these articles and think "nobody" likes them.

Thank goodness there is an infinite amount of digital ink

 

We have it stuck in our collective heads that Stereo is “all we can do”.  

 

As you said above:

“My musical world has opened up very wide since I installed my system. “

 

 

Does it feel odd that we have to be “advocates” for Immersive Audio?

 

 

 

[bobfa]

Oh and I like the audio transcripts!

[The Computer Audiophile]

1 minute ago, bobfa said:

Thank goodness there is an infinite amount of digital ink

 

We have it stuck in our collective heads that Stereo is “all we can do”.  

 

As you said above:

“My musical world has opened up very wide since I installed my system. “

 

 

Does it feel odd that we have to be “advocates” for Immersive Audio?

 

 

 

100% Bob!

 

We are listening to music like it has never been heard, and in the case of some recordings, identical to the multitrack studio master. 

[ted_b]

1 hour ago, bobfa said:

Does it feel odd that we have to be “advocates” for Immersive Audio?

Well, the unfortunate thing about immersive audio setups is that it requires some money and some work, quite a bit beyond simple 2 channel.  Headphones are a relatively cheap 2 channel investment, but immersive is not really portable (regardless of what Apple or Smyth try to tell you) and takes it even further than surround (i.e quad, 5.1 or 7.1), and requires one to look up to the wall/ceiling junctions, and the ceiling real estate to accomplish the final pieces.  WAF is a tougher nut to crack.  And then it's the additional equipment.  So....is it worth it?  YES YES YES.  Doe we need to advocate, constantly and consistently?  YES YES YES  🙂

[AnotherSpin]

On 1/11/2023 at 5:29 PM, The Computer Audiophile said:

[..]

It's funny you mention Grateful Dead. That's another band I couldn't get into. I liked the pop-esque Touch of Grey, but never anything more. Once I heard America Beauty in Atmos, it was game over. Now even my 10 year old daughter knows Grateful Dead. She asked for Truckin' on the way to school this morning. Not only that, she wanted to know why Truckin' was more popular than some of the other tracks, becuae they are better. Immersive audio was the gateway to my new appreciation and enjoyment of Grateful Dead. I'll be in heaven is we get a lossless TrueHD Atmos of American Beauty.

 [..}

 

 

Grateful Dead's recorded legacy stands apart anyway. Their studio albums represent only a very limited view of the band's legacy. True Deadheads are primarily interested in their live recordings, and by virtue of the special attitude of the band, which allowed to record freely at concerts, a huge array of amateur recordings has been circulated since then. We are talking about hundreds and hundreds of live recordings, of which not so many approach industry standards of sound quality. Hundreds of concerts have been officially published in better quality in recent decades. Nevertheless, the tapers recordings are still highly esteemed among the diehard followers of the Dead. This is the real Dead for many.

 

On the other hand, the sound reproduction at Dead's concerts in the 70's and later was much more sophisticated and qualitative than that of almost all other rock music bands. Nevertheless, I can't tell whether we should expect recordings of Dead concerts in Immersive audio in the near future. Something tells me the surviving members of Dead are not much interested in reissue formats. 

As far as studio albums go, my first one was Terrapin Station in 1977 or 1978, and it's still my favorite of their studio works, along with Blues for Allah, and other albums from seventies. And, American Beauty and Workingman's Dead. 

[ted_b]

Europe '72 is the first of, I think, many immersive Grateful Dead live albums (as has been said, there's no paucity of material, assuming these tapes are multitrack like when Warner Bors. gave the Dead a 16 track recorder for these live tracks in '72).  Steven Wilson and others have hinted such.  And if they are anywhere near the immersion (middle of the band) of Europe '72 I am quite stoked. 

[AnotherSpin]

The 22 concerts of the Europe 72 tour were released in a set of 73 CDs. At the same time, touring in Europe was more of an exception -- it was always important for Dead to remain close to their roots, to be continuously in the familiar environment, to stay connected with their followers. They didn't perform abroad very often, not alike many and many famous bands harvesting money wherever they can fly. And while the band is notable for its live performance level consistency in the seventies, the other years were the best: '77, '78, '76, '73, and so on.

 

But, again, Dead's vast array of non-commercial recordings, which remain valuable to Deadheads, are far from industry standards of sound quality, and the very principle of free amateur taping is as far as anything from the recording industry juggernaut. More than any other important band in history, the Dead were out of the corporate recording system loop.