Pi 2 Design Mercury Streamer

[Powerman]

So... Another thing... MQA. Yes I know all the drama and don't really care right now... It's actually not that big of a deal, but now I'm curious.

 

I started out on Roon with other equipment. Finally didn't really need it with Volumio. I never really noticed/thought about it with Tidal, but obviously no MQA on Volumio. "IF" I wanted MQA, I would have to go back to Roon correct?

 

But I'm not wired to computer anymore. Yes wifi... Volumio is Roon endpoint with Roon bridge. But would I still have to have PC running for Roon, and then I could still control volumio with app on tablet? Is there an easier way for MQA?

[stefano_mbp]

4 minutes ago, Powerman said:

IF" I wanted MQA, I would have to go back to Roon correct?

Volumio offers the MyVolumio subscription to get access to Tidal Master

[Powerman]

4 minutes ago, stefano_mbp said:

Volumio offers the MyVolumio subscription to get access to Tidal Master

I have subscription... Premium. Next one up? I have MQA on in sources. But unlike listening to tidal, listening in Volumio, I can never tell its MQA or the playback chain for bit like in Roon, or tidal or qobuz for that matter. Know what I mean?

[stefano_mbp]

4 minutes ago, Powerman said:

I have subscription... Premium. Next one up? I have MQA on in sources. But unlike listening to tidal, listening in Volumio, I can never tell its MQA or the playback chain for bit like in Roon, or tidal or qobuz for that matter. Know what I mean?

Premium includes MyVolumio … unfortunately I don’t use Tidal, I’ve just seen it on a friend setup a couple of years ago, therefore I don’t know details.

You should ask on Volumio community forum

[stefano_mbp]

@Powerman just found this guide … and I could remember that volume control must be set to maximum and that you need a full decoder dac

https://help.volumio.com/help/does-volumio-play-tidal-mqa-format

[Powerman]

Just now, stefano_mbp said:

@Powerman just found this guide … and I could remember that volume control must be set to maximum and that you need a full decoder dac

https://help.volumio.com/help/does-volumio-play-tidal-mqa-format

Yes, I saw that the other day. And no, my DAC doesn't do MQA (Pontus) which is what got me here. Before I just assumed because of roon and didn't think of it after roon.

[robi20064]

If you have no MQA capable DAC than Roon will only do the first unfold for you and Volumio won't do any.

[Cebolla]

7 hours ago, Powerman said:

Finally didn't really need it with Volumio. I never really noticed/thought about it with Tidal, but obviously no MQA on Volumio. "IF" I wanted MQA, I would have to go back to Roon correct?

7 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

Volumio offers the MyVolumio subscription to get access to Tidal Master

 

 

Conversdigital (an official MQA Limited partner manufacturer) also provides access to TIDAL's hi-res (but lossy) MQA Masters tracks via all versions of its (Android & iOS) mconnect Player UPnP/DLNA streamer controller apps - the Lite version is free.

 

 

Incidentally, what you are actually getting is the ability to access TIDAL's online server via its Master audio quality connection (through which TIDAL's 24-bit, ie, hi-res MQA tracks are supplied unhindered).

 

However, the 16bit/44.1kHz only HiFi audio quality connection can also supply lossy MQA tracks. If you select a Master labelled track for streaming, the HiFi quality connection sources that very same MQA track for the stream, ie, it does not (magically) provide a lossless version in its place: 

- If it's an MQA-CD track then it streams unhindered;

- if it's a 24-bit MQA track then its bit depth is truncated to 16 bits;

- if the MQA track's (undecoded) sample rate is 48kHz (so its so called MQA 'original sample rate' is a multiple of 48kHz) then it is resampled to 44.1kHz.

 

The track will be lossless only if you have selected a true lossless CD-res track, ie, one that isn't labelled as Master.

    

[Cebolla]

4 hours ago, robi20064 said:

If you have no MQA capable DAC than Roon will only do the first unfold for you and Volumio won't do any.

 

The mconnect Player app has no (software) MQA decoder, so like Volumio it too cannot decode its provided MQA files to the MQA Core signal (aka 'first unfold').

[Powerman]

3 hours ago, Cebolla said:

 

 

Conversdigital (an official MQA Limited partner manufacturer) also provides access to TIDAL's hi-res (but lossy) MQA Masters tracks via all versions of its (Android & iOS) mconnect Player UPnP/DLNA streamer controller apps - the Lite version is free.

 

 

Incidentally, what you are actually getting is the ability to access TIDAL's online server via its Master audio quality connection (through which TIDAL's 24-bit, ie, hi-res MQA tracks are supplied unhindered).

 

However, the 16bit/44.1kHz only HiFi audio quality connection can also supply lossy MQA tracks. If you select a Master labelled track for streaming, the HiFi quality connection sources that very same MQA track for the stream, ie, it does not (magically) provide a lossless version in its place: 

- If it's an MQA-CD track then it streams unhindered;

- if it's a 24-bit MQA track then its bit depth is truncated to 16 bits;

- if the MQA track's (undecoded) sample rate is 48kHz (so its so called MQA 'original sample rate' is a multiple of 48kHz) then it is resampled to 44.1kHz.

 

The track will be lossless only if you have selected a true lossless CD-res track, ie, one that isn't labelled as Master.

    

And that's where I'm a little lost... I still get hi-res... A file in 92hz 24bit....or is that just showing what the file is, but that is not what I'm getting without MQA? A 88hz track shows 88hz on my DAC. That's all I really care about, hirez at what ever file rez it shows. Because of course I don't have to care about that on Qobuz. The actual MQA voodoo isn't as important.

 

I have also used Lumin... Does Lumin do MQA 1st/2nd? Any other players/OS do MQA on Pi4... I assume not.

 

It was my understanding that Roon will do 1st/2nd and send to endpoint. Is that true?

[Riccitone]

Please forgive the side note intrusion…

But I’ve been meaning to ask to anyone here which lps options have been good for you? I’ve been considering a 12v lps from LHY, which Denafrips recommends as a quality and affordable choice. 

 

This one…

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps25va
 

or this one…
 

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps80va

 

Or should go for something else? 
 

Thank you 🙏🏼 

[stefano_mbp]

3 hours ago, Powerman said:

Does Lumin do MQA 1st/2nd?

If it is a U1/U2 Mini or plain (ie no dac included) it will do only the first unfolding, if it is Dx/Tx/Xn (ie with dac) it will do all unfoldings.

3 hours ago, Powerman said:

Any other players/OS do MQA on Pi4

As a general rule no open source sw can do any unfolding (Volumio included) as there are license duty that are in contrast with open source GNU rules.

Audirvana can do the first unfolding and use Pi4/Mercury as a UPNP renderer.

[robi20064]

6 hours ago, Powerman said:

And that's where I'm a little lost... I still get hi-res... A file in 92hz 24bit....or is that just showing what the file is, but that is not what I'm getting without MQA? A 88hz track shows 88hz on my DAC. That's all I really care about, hirez at what ever file rez it shows. Because of course I don't have to care about that on Qobuz. The actual MQA voodoo isn't as important.

 

I have also used Lumin... Does Lumin do MQA 1st/2nd? Any other players/OS do MQA on Pi4... I assume not.

 

It was my understanding that Roon will do 1st/2nd and send to endpoint. Is that true?

No software solution can/allowed to do 2nd unfold but only the DACs with MQA support. But you shall take this into a different topic as this is about Mercury here and not MQA. You know, just like how Holo May one is not about HQPlayer only...

[Powerman]

5 hours ago, robi20064 said:

No software solution can/allowed to do 2nd unfold but only the DACs with MQA support. But you shall take this into a different topic as this is about Mercury here and not MQA. You know, just like how Holo May one is not about HQPlayer only...

Right which I was discussing volumio on my mercury you know, and asked one question about others... Not drone on for 20 pages about it. This tread is pretty good about staying on topic. But that's for your valuable input.

[Powerman]

8 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

If it is a U1/U2 Mini or plain (ie no dac included) it will do only the first unfolding, if it is Dx/Tx/Xn (ie with dac) it will do all unfoldings.

As a general rule no open source sw can do any unfolding (Volumio included) as there are license duty that are in contrast with open source GNU rules.

Audirvana can do the first unfolding and use Pi4/Mercury as a UPNP renderer.

That makes it easy.

[Powerman]

10 hours ago, Riccitone said:

Please forgive the side note intrusion…

But I’ve been meaning to ask to anyone here which lps options have been good for you? I’ve been considering a 12v lps from LHY, which Denafrips recommends as a quality and affordable choice. 

 

This one…

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps25va
 

or this one…
 

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps80va

 

Or should go for something else? 
 

Thank you 🙏🏼 

I'll let you know... I don't have one of those, buy frankly, the first looks like a rebadged Fiio PL50, and the second looks like a SBooster. Typically $150 and $400 respectively. 🤷

 

I was debating between the two and went Fiio because I didn't want to find out if it even matters. Mercury needs 12V. Mine is supposed to show up tomorrow. I ordered from US reseller instead of from aliexpress. We'll see.

[Powerman]

On 1/28/2023 at 6:31 PM, Superdad said:

 

Since you continue to be nasty about this towards me--on this forum and elsewhere--when I was just trying to help you out, I bought another microSD card (my others were bad), made a Volumio image ran the following test:

 

This is Volumio running on a Pi2Design (V1; only thing making it "beta" unit is acrylic case before their aluminum cases were ready) playing DSD64 (over DoP) via I2S to a Holo Spring DAC (original Spring, not Spring 2 or Spring 3).

 

 

So can you help me out... I've asked, and others here have said Pi can't play DSD, it has to be over DoP... But then looking at other stuff.... Volumio plays DSD, supposedly anyone with Pi4 can play with several players. What is the issue with DSD on mercury/Pi4, and is there conflicting info that says it can/can't play DSD native to a DAC that supports DSD native?

[Superdad]

45 minutes ago, Powerman said:

What is the issue with DSD on mercury/Pi4,

Pi2Design’s Mercury plays DSD just fine—but only framed as DoP, and only up to DSD64 (methinks).  Nothing wrong that. 

[mitch751]

I have Pi2Design's Mercury and can confirm it plays DSD with not issue ... Yes only DSD64 .... 

[Powerman]

1 hour ago, mitch751 said:

I have Pi2Design's Mercury and can confirm it plays DSD with not issue ... Yes only DSD64 .... 

And is that DoP?

[mitch751]

2 minutes ago, Powerman said:

And is that DoP?

Yes DoP ... But DoP is still DSD

[stefano_mbp]

2 hours ago, Powerman said:

And is that DoP?

As any rpi4 with HAT (HiFiBerry Digi+Pro, Allo Digione and others) only DSD/DoP is possible.

DSD/DoP is nothing but a native DSD incapsulated into a PCM with a 8bit header that is recognized by the dac which will treat it as a DSD.

The only drawback of DSD/DoP is the it uses the double of the bandwidth used by a native DSD.

Here you can find detailed information about DSD/DoP

[Powerman]

9 hours ago, stefano_mbp said:

As any rpi4 with HAT (HiFiBerry Digi+Pro, Allo Digione and others) only DSD/DoP is possible.

DSD/DoP is nothing but a native DSD incapsulated into a PCM with a 8bit header that is recognized by the dac which will treat it as a DSD.

The only drawback of DSD/DoP is the it uses the double of the bandwidth used by a native DSD.

Here you can find detailed information about DSD/DoP

I read that, thanks. I was just curios about the whole up sampling thing. Seems to me I have to forget mercury altogether and just do straight PC to DAC thru USB. Exactly what I don't want to do, and what I don't want to use. That pretty much takes care of curiosity. Not that I can't, just don't want to work that hard to listen to music. I specifically got mercury to simplify and run I2S.

[Powerman]

On 2/9/2023 at 9:28 PM, Riccitone said:

Please forgive the side note intrusion…

But I’ve been meaning to ask to anyone here which lps options have been good for you? I’ve been considering a 12v lps from LHY, which Denafrips recommends as a quality and affordable choice. 

 

This one…

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps25va
 

or this one…
 

https://www.beatechnik.com/product-page/lps80va

 

Or should go for something else? 
 

Thank you 🙏🏼 

I got my Fiio yesterday... I actually think it's better. I'm reluctant to say stuff like that. I'm fine without night and day difference, I sort of trust sum of all parts. But I think it's cleaned stuff up. Now... I can't A/B. Changing cords is fast enough, but then mercury has to boot up. So... Couple minutes. But for $124...it didn't break the bank. (Normally $150,the seller on eBay $120l

[Riccitone]

3 hours ago, Powerman said:

got my Fiio yesterday... I actually think it's better. I'm reluctant to say stuff like that. I'm fine without night and day difference, I sort of trust sum of all parts. But I think it's cleaned stuff up. Now... I can't A/B. Changing cords is fast enough, but then mercury has to boot up. So... Couple minutes. But for $124...it didn't break the bank. (Normally $150,the seller on eBay $120l

Thank you for this, and that’s great news to me! Seems worth it. I’m with you on the incremental approach to power components. But if it adds up to overall improvement , I’m all about it. 
 

really appreciate your help! 
 

🙏🏼