Article: Sonore opticalRendu & Signature Rendu SE Optical Review | Part 1

[vortecjr]

4 hours ago, rickca said:

Is the 400GB microSD card included on all opticalRendu and Signature Rendu SE optical units, including the ones that have already shipped?  If so, nobody noticed?  I did see your comment about introductory upgrade pricing, but that seems to apply to the 512GB microSD.

The high capacity cards will be offered as upgrades only for now. Also, these will be available for all Rendu in the current line up. You can buy it for the microRendu, ultraRendu, and Signature Rendu SE (Ethernet or optical).

 

The pricing will be what we pay for the microSD card plus 99 USD. As an introductory offer it will be cost plus 75 USD.

[vortecjr]

4 hours ago, rickca said:

How does using music files on the microSD card sound compared to having them on your NAS?  Is there a perceptible difference in sound quality?

 

I thought you were committed to Roon.  Now you're using iPeng/LMS/Squeezelite.  How do Roon users use this local storage option?  Can you explain the potential conflict between Roon Rock and your local storage option configuration?

 

Do you have an ultraRendu for a comparison between it and the opticalRendu?

I'll let Chris comment on sound quality when his speakers arrive;) What I can say is that the network is not involved in local playback and instead it's only used for control signals when sent.

 

Roon can't be used in combination with local storage as far as I know. Remember though it's easy to switch between these outputs modes. For now you can use MPD and SqueezeLite with local storage. When you are using Logitech Media Server you need to shutdown Roon if it has support for Squeeze Box devices enabled or conflicts will occur.

[vortecjr]

4 hours ago, rickca said:

@vortecjr occasionally people run into problems with their microSD card, and you suggest they order a new one from your website.  Looks like the current price is $29.95 for the non-optical Rendus.

 

How are you going to handle this situation when someone is running a 512GB or 1TB microSD that costs a lot more than $29.95?

Yes, that is correct. Since this is an upgrade you will be able to use your standard card and ship the high capacity card to use for a look see. These cards have a serial number and they will be logged at the factory. The customer is responsive for keeping a backup of the data in a separate location. We will not try to recover files on the micro SD cards and will more likely than not just refresh the cards.  

[vortecjr]

4 hours ago, bobfa said:

Excited.  I did not know the the Signature Rendu had been released with optical update.  The squeezebox stuff re-affirms some things others have found.  SOOO TEMPTING!  A new Single Box solution!

 

Also cannot wait to hear about your new speakers!

What exactly was re-affirmed?  

[vortecjr]

2 hours ago, R1200CL said:

@vortecjr how will the new card affect the power draw ?

 

And why can’t we have the option for a bigger one ?

(Or did I misunderstood there was a limitation? )

 

Any discussion with Roon, to make them open for using this storage option ?

A, it's a micro SD card of course there are limitation. No discussion with Roon, but that doesn't mean we are done:)   

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, bobflood said:

This may appeal to some but I don't think Roon with its robust functionality need be concerned. Also, this is totally against the whole reason for the Rendu series of products. The Rendus were supposed to be an endpoint quiet zone with all the storage, retrieval and associated processing happening elsewhere. This puts it all back in one place.

 

There is still the problem of back-up and additions/deletions. The material for the SD card will have to be archived somewhere else and new material will have to be obtained on a real computer and then moved to the SD card.

 

I tried this for streaming only with both of my Rendus a long time back (it has always been possible to run both Squeezelite and LMS together on a Rendu) and it worked fine but I thought that it sounded better with LMS running on another machine (a sonicTransporter) elsewhere on the network.

 

In the end, no matter how you dress it up, it is still LMS.

 

For those asking if this will work with Roon, I doubt it. Roon core does not run on the Rendus, only Roon Ready which is strictly a rendering function.

I don't expect everyone will need this feature and I would not force the cost on people that don't. This is why it's an option. This don't change the unit in anyway because it's just a micro SD card swap and playback is from RAM as usual. This is computer audio after all and clearly you will need to manage the files. You don't have to use LMS / SqueezeLite and if you prefer you can use MPD / YMPD for local playback. A lot of people use LMS and really like. I think LMS it's great and hard to argue the price...free.

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, R1200CL said:

I wonder if MQA support now make more sense for Sonore, as you could also play Tidal through iPeng ?

 

No.

[vortecjr]

1 hour ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I don’t speak for them but I’m unsure why Sonore would want to go through the huge hassle and development work (ask any other mfg on Earth) to implement MQA. 

We implement partial decoding and we have a working prototype. However, from my perspective I want MQA to give us a free use license:) I'm also not encouraged with the way they treated you at RMAF.

[vortecjr]

31 minutes ago, bobfa said:

That we are finding Squeezelite sounds really good on a lot of systems.  I think it is wonderful.

SqueezeLite was the reason we made a renderer in the first place. I bet most people don't know the name of the first renderer we made that featured SqueezeLite. Maybe firedog knows:)     

[vortecjr]

43 minutes ago, bunno77 said:

Pretty cool new addition and great that new features are being added to older devices. 

Not something I would use though. I was hoping for native app support or Chromecast. 

There is not much happening on that front.

[vortecjr]

34 minutes ago, bobflood said:

Please don't misunderstand me. As I said, this will appeal to some users especially those who don't wish to pay for software. I used LMS for so many years and although it worked, I was really happy when Roon came along. I don't mind paying them for a very good and getting better product. I can stream Tidal and Qobuz, have great metadata, seamless integration with HQPlayer and I can do it with ease using Sonre and SGC products. I no longer have a local library so MPD/YMPD are not something I would use.

 

Thanks for the continued innovation.

No worries. Let me say this...LMS supports those features including streaming to HQ Player along with hundreds of other plug-ins. Anyways by all means use Roon or whatever else you like because we support it. We are all about options.  

[vortecjr]

7 hours ago, thotdoc said:

Would you mind telling us what "very upgraded PSU" you are using?

 

Many of us are looking for a PS for our ORs.

 

Thank you

 

G

Chris had a Sonore Signature power supply from the microRendu review. So we updated it for this review. It's more or less the PS in the Signature Rendu SE optical he will be reviewing in part two.  

[vortecjr]

5 hours ago, firedog said:

That renderer sounded quite good, especially with a good PS. 
But all of the Rendu series is better, both in terms of sound and performance,  and the OS is much better now. 

Agree. 

[vortecjr]

12 hours ago, bunno77 said:

I personally would be happy to pay for another SD card if the big streaming services Spotify, Tidal, Qobuz, Deezer, Google Play and or Chromecast were added.
There is the thread about Chromecast so others are interested in this too but maybe not so happy to pay.

I want my car to run on water.

[vortecjr]

11 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I believe Google’s requirements to turn an endpoint into a Chromecast endpoint are quite steep and impossible for most. Plus, Google owns StreamUnlimited, the company that makes such endpoints. 

That is a hardware solution and not so much a software solution and there in lies the issues. 

[vortecjr]

10 hours ago, bunno77 said:

Yeah I wouldn't doubt it but more and more companies are beginning to incorporate it. I am just being hopeful.

Don't be because we will not implement that hardware solution. 

[vortecjr]

10 hours ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I'm with you. I'd love it in the Rendu series. 

 

Perhaps Sonore can pull off a Wadia move (getting iPod digital output) and get Casting.

I'm not sure I understand this?

[vortecjr]

9 hours ago, rickca said:

But you can't get this power supply without buying a Signature Rendu SE optical, right?  You can only get the cost reduced version (ultraSupply) for $529.  Does Chris's unit include the Turbo option (Tier II upgrade)?

Pretty much. That cost reduced power supply is really good though:) I don't keep track of these things;) 

[vortecjr]

9 hours ago, ArthurOtt said:

Talk about going back in time 15 years! Click on the link to Sonore's terrible website. They expect you to buy their $3445 Signature Rendu SE optical based on one low-res picture of the front of the unit. No picture of the rear of the unit and the connectivity. Yes, that website is a real blast from the past as it looks like it was designed by a high school kid in 2004. 

If your going to be a dork at least get the website correct. That is the SGC website (our dealer and partner) and not our website. Mind you I'm not saying our website is any better:) However, if it comes down to spending $10,000.00 on a cute website or buying hight quality / expensive components for our units it's a pretty easy decision for me to make.

[vortecjr]

9 hours ago, charlesphoto said:

 

Paul Hynes barely has a website and people are paying and cueing up years in advance for his power supplies. Last least with Sonore one can see if the product is in stock and order from the site. Website aesthetics is really is a non-issue in this hobby, imo, esp for gear that works and is available now, and isn't just some magic pixie dust in an EE's imagination. 

LOL

[vortecjr]

24 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

It was a reference to Wadia back in the day when the company, out of nowhere, announced the world’s first device to take digital audio out of an iPod. All sanctioned by Apple. 

 

Thus, I was dreaming that you guys could be the new Wadia and work with Google on cast support 😁

That is a high bar to set:) I have customer that works at Google and he can’t help so...

[vortecjr]

4 minutes ago, bunno77 said:

If you're going to be a dork at least be funny

You already knew the answer when you posted here so don’t expect any humor. If you don’t want to buy the upgrade card for what it is don’t buy it. If you want Chromecast contact them and ask them to open source it. 

[vortecjr]

15 hours ago, R1200CL said:

 

And why not not add AirPlay? Limitations in bitrate maybe ? (24/48 max ?)

 

Other possible future updates could be a second SD slot, and you can add your own SD card for music. And then why not another USB input for a SSD and a requirement for external power of that SSD. 

 

And further, how about external power for Vbus, so people can use two of LPS-1 series power supplies. On the other hand that would probably only please those that only owns one of those power supplies from before.

 

Unless such a setup beats a Uptone JS-2 or Sonore’s $529 PS 😀

We support Shairport Sync for those looking to stream from Apple devices. I assume you meant Airplay2.  Again, we are not going to add a chip level integration type features from third party companies. If an open source solution pops up we can look at it then. We would not add external power VBUS to a Rendu. The VBUS power output on the opticalRendu has dual low noise LDOs in parallel in a properly designed circuit from John S. That is not a feature you want to bypass with a hack.       

[vortecjr]

32 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said:

I'll disagree all day long with this. 

 

Do some real world testing of pressing play on a track stored locally and a track stored on a NAS. The NAS will never be faster to start playing. It's really angles on the head of a pin because the difference is minuscule most of the time.

 

I believe you are excluding any processing that needs to happen when a file comes over the network in your comparison. Easy access of local disk requires less than receiving the file over a network and dealing with SMB protocol file transfers. 

 

If you want to bring in music server processing then all bets are off because that's a different game all together. 

I have to agree with Chris on this one. I know people will try to decide what sounds better and that is fine with me. From my perspective this is about giving people options. Chris focused on LMS / SqueezeLite because he wanted to integrate other streaming services. I have been using MPD for the ultimate through back experience:) IMO MPD is the king of local playback. Also, we have an option to mount remote drives if you prefer that. 

[vortecjr]

2 hours ago, jabbr said:

 

Options are great. My statement was in regard to local vs network music storage ... streaming is the ultimate network, my library is terabytes, I don't want to search through directories, so again how does storing music on a SD help me?

 

It does occur that you or anyone with an oR could test this by, as you note, mounting a 1 Tb network drive with the same contents as a 1Tb SD card and then comparing user experience. In the process of optimizing my network (for video processing) I compared local vs network file access speeds. This can be easily done for the oR!

Maybe it doesn’t help you but that is not a requirement for others. If I have a customer that needs or wants local storage this is a great solution for that. Not a lot of people mount a drive because it a pain for them. If you turn on the unit with local storage you know where the content is each time. With remote file sharing the IP address can change and require one to reconfigure things.