Michael Lavorgna strikes back.......

[Bill Brown]

11 minutes ago, skikirkwood said:

The dude definitely thinks violence is an appropriate response to someone's words.  Probably lives in Alabama and is a big Trump supporter, with an NRA decal on the windshield of his car.

 

More bold, unsubstantiated aspersions proudly declaring your ignorance.  Oy.

[Ralf11]

so who is "Bill Brown" ??

[crenca]

13 minutes ago, Brinkman Ship said:

Same principle. But these services generally use transformers and they are even used in mission critical

medical and military applications.

 

But for hifi, I own 3 different Lan filters/isolaters, and they all work as advertised. i have no experience with the one

linked above.

 

What is "ethernet noise", exactly? How do you know "the all work as advertised" - I assume you are measuring this ethernet noise, or know someone who can?

 

A google search on "ethernet noise" mostly leads to "audiophile" sources, so my voodoo sensor starts chirping...

 

[Brinkman Ship]

Just now, crenca said:

 

What is "ethernet noise", exactly? How do you know "the all work as advertised" - I assume you are measuring this ethernet noise, or know someone who can?

 

A google search on "ethernet noise" mostly leads to "audiophile" sources, so my voodoo sensor starts chirping...

 

to be exact...the models I have direct experience with work as advertised...i cannot speak for all of them.

 

My subjective conclusions were the sound was better, and justified the purchases. 

[crenca]

30 minutes ago, skikirkwood said:

...Probably lives in Alabama and is a big Trump supporter, with an NRA decal on the windshield of his car.

 

Ouch....as someone who has been an NRA member (not currently however - my involvement in the shooting sports has waned over the last few years), lived in the South most of my life, and who sat out this last election....I think I will vote for Trump fur shurre darlin if your goinn to treat me like that.

[crenca]

1 minute ago, Brinkman Ship said:

to be exact...the models I have direct experience with work as advertised...i cannot speak for all of them.

 

My subjective conclusions were the sound was better, and justified the purchases. 

 

no worries...just wondering if there is any measurements or even a rational explanation as to what exactly "ethernet noise" is.

[Ralf11]

opera

 

that's what it is

[skikirkwood]

7 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

so who is "Bill Brown" ??

In one posting he wrote:

 

"...being a fan of westerns and an expert in karate (when honestly, if you did call me a coward I would actually kick your ass if given the opportunity to meet face to face)"

 

In another, he wrote about words being "duel-worthy". Today he writes "...if said in person, would qualify to be challenged, perhaps with a punch in the face"

 

I don't know who Bill Brown is, but it's not hard to see a pattern in his postings.

[Ralf11]

no expert in a martial art would write that

[crenca]

1 minute ago, Ralf11 said:

opera

 

that's what it is

 

I thought it was all the chatter from yankees about how the south and responsible gun owners are the cause of mass murder, that and Weird Al videos...

[plissken]

4 minutes ago, skikirkwood said:

In one posting he wrote:

 

"...being a fan of westerns and an expert in karate (when honestly, if you did call me a coward I would actually kick your ass if given the opportunity to meet face to face)"

 

In another, he wrote about words being "duel-worthy". Today he writes "...if said in person, would qualify to be challenged, perhaps with a punch in the face"

 

I don't know who Bill Brown is, but it's not hard to see a pattern in his postings.

 

Lavorgna has done the face to face stuff with me to. I would like to meet him publicly. Preferably on a panel about Ethernet networking intersects audio.

 

That would be fun. 

 

May be get Plasking and that guy from AQ that doesn't know what he's talking about. Take care of it all at once. 3 turkeys and one stone so to speak. 

[skikirkwood]

2 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

no expert in a martial art would write that

 

I agree.  I do think it's highly likely he is a friend of ML.  Why else would someone try to defend the honor of ML on a forum like this? 

[asdf1000]

33 minutes ago, Brinkman Ship said:

Same principle. But these services generally use transformers and they are even used in mission critical

medical and military applications.

 

When you say 'same principle' do you mean this one doesn't actually use optical isolation?

 

Their "FOIL" trademark stands for fiber optic isolation link so I assume it really is fiber optic.

 

This is a brochure for their older models:

 

https://www.djmelectronics.com/GigaFOILv3 Brochure.pdf

 

[crenca]

1 minute ago, plissken said:

 

Lavorgna has done the face to face stuff with me to. I would like to meet him publicly. Preferably on a panel about Ethernet networking intersects audio.

 

That would be fun. 

 

plissken, what is your understanding of "ethernet noise"?

[plissken]

Just now, crenca said:

 

plissken, what is your understanding of "ethernet noise"?

 

On a properly implemented PHY it's simply not a problem. It's certainly nothing that a cable is going to fix. Plug a cable in, turn up the volume on your computer, start a large data transfer. Hear anything? Measure anything? 

 

Do the same thing again and play back a 1Khz tone and measure. Anything other than 1Khz? 

 

Do the same and use a 11025Khz signal (16/44.1) and using ARTA and a decent ADC. Look for jitter components both with a file copy going on and without. See any difference? 

 

Ethernet will send data ahead of what is needed. The computer/streamer (NAIM's newest cache ~2:30 worth of 16/44.1) will buffer it, and often put the PHY into low power or no power modes. 

 

There was a run of Pi's that the PHY didn't have a magnetics package. You knew it because both the video and audio outputs were swapped with EMI. 

[Brinkman Ship]

15 minutes ago, crenca said:

 

no worries...just wondering if there is any measurements or even a rational explanation as to what exactly "ethernet noise" is.

i would say that purportedly isolating your streaming device from the rest of the network is really the selling point...and by the way i do use modestly prices Supra and Rosewill Cat 7 cables. No $1000 cables here.

[Brinkman Ship]

12 minutes ago, Em2016 said:

 

When you say 'same principle' do you mean this one doesn't actually use optical isolation?

 

Their "FOIL" trademark stands for fiber optic isolation link so I assume it really is fiber optic.

 

This is a brochure for their older models:

 

https://www.djmelectronics.com/GigaFOILv3 Brochure.pdf

 

correct. these are the devices i own: 

 

https://www.amazon.com/EMO-Systems-EN-30-Network-Isolator/dp/B00OL54Y7U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1520390618&sr=8-1&keywords=emo+ethernet

 

and

 

https://sotm-usa.com/products/iso-cat6-lan-single-noise-filter

 

fyi, i did not pay anywhere near $350 for the SOtM.

[asdf1000]

5 minutes ago, Brinkman Ship said:

correct. these are the devices i own: 

 

https://www.amazon.com/EMO-Systems-EN-30-Network-Isolator/dp/B00OL54Y7U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1520390618&sr=8-1&keywords=emo+ethernet

 

and

 

https://sotm-usa.com/products/iso-cat6-lan-single-noise-filter

 

fyi, i did not pay anywhere near $350 for the SOtM.

 

Yes those are transformer based isolators (filters).

 

Optical isolation should provide better isolation (in theory) against RF and leakage currents, so I'm interested to hear more about this Gigafoil thing. 

 

If it turns out to effectively be a pair of FMC's in one metal box it could be interesting.

 

I do see from the photo it needs 5Vdc input.

[Brinkman Ship]

1 minute ago, Em2016 said:

 

Yes those are transformer based isolators (filters).

 

Optical isolation should provide better isolation (in theory) against RF and leakage currents, so I'm interested to hear more about this Gigafoil thing. 

 

If it turns out to effectively be a pair of FMC's in one metal box it could be interesting.

 

I do see from the photo it needs 5Vdc input.

Yes, good synopsis. My devices are passive.. 

[Ralf11]

1 hour ago, crenca said:

 

I thought it was all the chatter from yankees about how the south and responsible gun owners are the cause of mass murder, that and Weird Al videos...

 

I also grew up in the South and everybody had guns (that's how we got a lot of our food too) but there were never any school shootings.  There was a set progression for kids - you started with a Daisy BB gun, a few years later, you got a pellet gun (Benjamin pump), later a .22 and a small shot gun, etc.  Something has changed; I don't think it is the # guns per capita.  Reducing the # guns and rate of fire would help for sure.

[Ralf11]

oh yeh - where I am from, I am a "Yankee" -- and I introduced myself that way at a Symposium in Cajun Country one time.  It means a white guy who is not French or Spanish.

[Ralf11]

1 hour ago, Em2016 said:

 

Yes those are transformer based isolators (filters).

 

Optical isolation should provide better isolation (in theory) against RF and leakage currents, so I'm interested to hear more about this Gigafoil thing. 

 

If it turns out to effectively be a pair of FMC's in one metal box it could be interesting.

 

I do see from the photo it needs 5Vdc input.

 

 

@jabbr has opto-isolators IIRC; they are not costly

[asdf1000]

2 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

 

 

@jabbr has opto-isolators IIRC; they are not costly

 

Something DIY or a fully assembled product that can be purchased by people like myself that lack these DIY skills?

 

[Ralf11]

it looked like more trouble than I wanted - OTOH, I use WiFi to provide elec. isolation, and got tired of soldering things up decades ago

[asdf1000]

Just now, Ralf11 said:

it looked like more trouble than I wanted - OTOH, I use WiFi to provide elec. isolation, and got tired of soldering things up decades ago

 

I continued this Gigafoil discussion in this thread: