A novel way to massively improve the SQ of computer audio streaming

[rickca]

I am totally confused (nothing new!). So in Server R2 I can do something called NIC Teaming but not Bridging. Would a NIC Teaming allow me to do a direct connection like Bridging?

No. NIC teaming is link aggregation. Just google it.

[rickca]

But before everyone gets all excited by the prospect of such a product from UpTone, know that we discussed it in relation to another significant Ethernet-related isolation project we have slated for the fall (after his move), and decided that the market for the above-described switch product is much smaller than for the other secret product. So don't expect such from us this year!

Oh good, another secret product! Gives new meaning to the term 'leaky filter'.

Seems a natural extension to your product line.

[rickca]

My networking skills are quite limited, but I'd like to give this a try.

 

I have a PCIE 802.11ac adapter (Asus PCE-56) in my Windows 10 machine that I use to access my router (Asus RT-AC3100). It's plenty fast for my 75 Mbps downstream internet connection and it's stable. Right now, my micro rendu is connected to a LAN port on that router.

 

I also have an unused Intel I219-V on the motherboard. I'd like to try connecting the micro rendu directly to this NIC.

 

I plan to run HQPlayer on this Windows 10 box. My music files are local to this machine.

 

So ... can I use the bridging technique discussed in this thread? If so, I'd appreciate the latest recommended method of implementing it. It seems like the approach has a few variations, and I don't understand enough about subnets and DHCP to evaluate what would work best for me. Thanks!

[rickca]

What is the role of a dummy USB wifi adapter? I have a wireless PCIE adapter that I use to connect to the internet via my router, and I have a motherboard Intel NIC that I plan to use to attach my micro rendu. I thought I could bridge the Intel NIC and the wireless PCIE adapter. Why would I also need a dummy USB wifi adapter?

[rickca]

EDIT: Just gave it a try at 600 X 800. Good call, does make a difference in SQ for the better.

This is too weird! OK, you and Theobetley agree it works, but I wonder why it makes a difference if you aren't running explorer.exe and you run JRiver minimized.

[rickca]

So now I get it. To build a good audio PC, take everything you know about building a modern gaming PC and do the opposite. High resolution display ... bad. NVMe PCIe SSD ... bad. Tons of fast memory ... bad. OK, I'm kidding you guys but really it's kind of funny.

[rickca]

OK, so following on yesterday's success with the M.2 SATA adapter, I decided to install an Intel pcie x1 NIC card and turn off the motherboard NIC. This and 5 of the six SATA ports were disabled in the BIOS.

Here is yet another nice jump in SQ.

Larry, please remind me which motherboard you are using.

 

Wouldn't the results of using an Intel PCIe x1 NIC vs motherboard NIC be motherboard-specific? Certainly if the motherboard has a Realtek or Atheros NIC, an Intel NIC and drivers might be higher quality. Might it not also depend on motherboard design? In most cases, isn't the motherboard NIC already using PCIe lanes?

 

I'm amazed how you turn over every rock and really appreciate your reporting here.

[rickca]

8 minutes ago, greenleo said:

Have you any tools to tell if an X25E is new or just trust the seller?

The SMART statistics will tell you stuff like power on hours, power cycles and so on.

[rickca]

3 hours ago, Silly goose said:

But seems around here I'm the only one.

Right.  Nobody at CA had ever heard about Ravenna or active speakers before you showed up.  We are all lost without your thought leadership.

[rickca]

59 minutes ago, lmitche said:

SATA SAGA update: Just tested the Amphenol 6" Sata cable against the 6" Coboc flat silver cable.  Coboc wins with a much fuller, dynamic sound.  99 cents on Egghead! 10" Coboc sounds good too!

So I shouldn't spend 229 euros on a Pachenko SATA Reference cable? 

[rickca]

5 minutes ago, romaz said:

 

 

If all goes well, my reclocked motherboard will arrive from SOtM sometime next week.  At that point, I will report on the impact of removing as many bad clocks as possible from the server and whether this negates or further enhances the impact of endpoints like the mR or sMS-200.  

Your contribution has been invaluable.  Sorry to hear you need to disengage but of course I understand.  I'm really looking forward to your assessment of the clock upgrades.

[rickca]

I keep wondering why Jesus and John Swenson didn't recommend this 'direct path' from the beginning rather than advising users to connect the micro rendu to their router.  

[rickca]

6 hours ago, romaz said:

First, I'm not sure anyone yet knows just how good the clock implementation in the ISO Regen is compared against SOtM's new clock and so no assumptions should be made.

I'm so glad you brought this up.  It may be possible to get some very exciting results without the 'ultra' expensive SOtM clocks.  At what point does a clock upgrade become overkill relative to overall design and implementation?

[rickca]

2 minutes ago, ElviaCaprice said:

But I greatly doubt that this clock will be superior to the sotm new clocks.

I'm not saying the Crystek 575 is going to beat the SOtM clock modules.  I'm just saying that at some point a more expensive clock becomes overkill.  There's a huge price gap between these clocks, so it's an interesting question.

[rickca]

8 hours ago, austinpop said:

In my simplistic way of thinking, this "ultra" switch's role is nothing but an Ethernet "regen" with the ultra clock.

Now that is really interesting insight!  Maybe Uptone can design something even more effective than a switch with an upgraded clock or passive network isolators like Emo. 

 

How about it @Superdad and @JohnSwenson? 

[rickca]

41 minutes ago, Superdad said:

Yes Rick, up-thread I already outlined the recipe for seriously great "audiophile" Ethernet switch with high signal integrity and isolation.

Thanks for the link, Alex.  I'd forgotten that you had already provided quite a lot of detail.

[rickca]

Is the SOtM sCLK-EX based on an OCXO?  I've read the material on the SOtM website and it just says it's a custom designed ultra low phase noise oscillation circuit.

[rickca]

1 minute ago, ElviaCaprice said:

No it's not.  If it we're you would see the ovens, which are pretty big. 

Thanks.  I can barely recognize the oven in my kitchen, never mind on a circuit board.

[rickca]

Just got pre-order email from Crux Audio.  Hmm, SMS-200Ultra is $1200 without master clock connector, 10% discount code good until 6/30.  Mucho dinero, but hard to ignore the fantastic feedback.

[rickca]

Does anyone plan to test just tx-USBUltra without SMS-200Ultra or micro rendu?  Maybe compare it to an ISO REGEN soon?

[rickca]

Why does it make sense technically that signals that are repeatedly reclocked get better?  Why can't a single reclock just before the DAC do the job as well?

 

If we need multiple reclocks, why can't we just put several clocks in the same box?

[rickca]

1 hour ago, austinpop said:

SOtM are in the process of acquiring a loaner Codex from their distributor in Korea to see if they can troubleshoot the problem in-house. I should know more in a few days how that is going. 

 

Yes, I am very satisfied with their level of commitment in resolving this issue.

That certainly sounds like excellent service.

[rickca]

2 hours ago, HeeBroG said:

Why not use the 3 redundant clocks included in the tX-USBultra and upgrade your sMS-200 to Ultra level. Sure it won't be as neat as the new unit but better than nothing and much cheaper. 

I'm confused by the SOtM nomenclature.  It says the tX-USBultra comes with a sCLK-EX12 board.  That board is listed under the heading of 'single clock frequency for interface system' on the sCLK-EX webpage.  So does the sCLK-EX12 board have 4 clocks or just one?

 

One other question.  Using the sCLK-EX and transplanting some of the clocks from say, a tX-USBultra to a switch or SMS-200, you have wires interconnecting various devices sharing the sCLK-EX.  Don't these wires somewhat degrade the clock compared to each device having its own clock board?

 

I'd appreciate a response from @romaz, @austinpop, @mozes or anyone else who has experience with this approach.

[rickca]

2 minutes ago, mozes said:

Exactly and it looks like this

Thanks @mozes and @limniscate.  I did see that picture of the connectors in a previous post from @Johnseye.  I remain confused about the SOtM nomenclature ... are all 4 clock taps 12 MHz on a sCLK-EX12?  Certainly the connectors are more convenient than hardwiring, but I'm still wondering whether the interconnection degrades the clock signal.

[rickca]

15 minutes ago, austinpop said:

But then they use confusing ambiguous terms like sCLK-EX12 board. Go figure.

OK good, so I'm not the only one who finds this puzzling!  I did see that earlier post from May, and the sCLK-EX ordering information nomenclature is explained in the sCLK-EX instruction manual.  They refer to the sCLK-EX12 board as the 'internal reference clock' of the tX-USBultra.

 

And in a Seinfeld moment, what's with this SOtM predilection for unpredictably mixing upper and lower case characters?

 

How in the world did @romaz initially figure out how this was meant to work?