HOLO Audio Spring DAC - R2R DSD512

[ted_b]

8 minutes ago, barrows said:

Amanero is not better than XMOS.  In fact, if one is interested in sending native DSD, for example, XMOS tends to be a little better platform if one is using a Linux source.  Amanero native DSD capability with Linux is beta, and sketchy right now...

The Holo DAC Cyan (not sure on the Spring) has an isolated USB interface, as well, and the Amanero board itself is not isolated.

I cannot think of any reason to replace the existing interface with anything else. 

+1

[ted_b]

As you should.  I pointed out NOS playback with my review (which Michael references) here on CA.  It's one of the main selling points of this dac's architecture...to use much more powerful, flexible, cleaner filter engines to upsample BEFORE you get the data to the dac. 

 

In the case of USB, I agree with the above posters that the likely major reason many of us prefer the input from the SU-1 is due to its better (or at least more musical) clocking.  There is nothing inherently wrong with Holo's XMOS USB chipset that would make anyone want to change it, and going to Amanero just makes things worse if you want to do native DSD via Linux streamers or servers in the near term.

[ted_b]

No, DSD256 is max, and only via USB out from Sonore ethernet renderers.  No direct from Windows, for example.

 

Still, would be interesting to hear that combo.

[ted_b]

10 minutes ago, barrows said:

Ted, have you had a chance to test the uDigital?  I am not sure of the actual capabilities, but I would be surprised if it could not do DSD 512 via Linux in and I2S out...

As you mention I have no experience with an ASIO driver for Windows.  I guess it is officially not supported, but again, maybe the SingXer ASIO drivers will work... 

Barrows, no I have not.  And yes, might work. 

[ted_b]

Audiobang, if you are so enamored with the marketing for the Amanero, have at it.  The result will be a chipset that does the same or less than the XMOS (especially currently in Linux) but I guess you'll get that to-do off your list.  You'll also have a driver that is not supported by Holo.

[ted_b]

I am not sure what point Jussi was making; I could have sworn he said not to change out the Holo USB chipset either. 

 

BTW, could we move the "Amanero firmware/does it work yet on 512" stuff to a different thread.  It is irrelevant to this Holo thread.  Thanks.

[ted_b]

11 hours ago, WenYee said:

My new dac:

Nice.  Talk about it over on the Cyan thread.  They need some user feedback.

[ted_b]

48 minutes ago, WenYee said:

It is native DSD512 now!

And has been for at least 18 months.

[ted_b]

Since I was referred to: with the Holo I do not convert formats; I upsampled PCM to 352/384 and remodulate DSD to DSD512 (although when my system is put back together I may follow the new conventional wisdom of using EC modulators to DSD256 instead)

[ted_b]

11 hours ago, Jacky820 said:

@ted_b Thank you for your sharing.

So you are upsampling PCM to 352/384 with HQPlayer? and DSD64 to 512 and 256?

Yes, back when my system was working I used HQPlayer and sent all PCM to 352/384 and all DSD to DSD512.  When my new system (and room) is built then I will use the latest HQPlayer and may, as conventional wisdom teaches, use the newer EC modulators and DSD256.  I will report back, but it will be awhile. 

[ted_b]

1 minute ago, Jacky820 said:

I tested DSD256 and DSD512! I will vote for DSD256!  🙂

Not with the new EC modulators, though.  DSD512 won't work (too cpu intensive for current cpus)

[ted_b]

Just a comment from the peanut gallery (as most know my system is still boxed up from last years move and no audio room build yet):

my Holo review, now quite old, declared that I found the I2S thru the Singxer to be quite a bit better than straight USB. I’m not sure whether these “USB bests I2S” real world comments are coming from those who have updated/upgraded the Holo’s USB interface. And I will go on record that my decently trained ears do not like more jitter. 😀 But I can’t sit here and tell you why I2S sounded so good (I use 1m Nordost silverscreen hdmi cable).  And my USB path is well maintained. 

[ted_b]

Barrows

yes that is why I am asking whether these comparisons are against an upgraded Holo. And as I said my USB signal path was no slouch, with upgraded Linear powered Femto and USB 3.1 USB cards to the Singxer or direct, as well as Regen etc

[ted_b]

Jacky820, my system is not up right now.  I am referring to what my system was when I did the review and updates.  It's documented there.

[ted_b]

Tim,

I'm VERY interested once the room is done, but by then others will hopefully have chimed in.  Nice work by you, Jeff (of course) and others.  What are the PCM/DSD rates available?

 

Really wish ASR 7 page "review" thread would have had at least some words about sq. 

[ted_b]

1 minute ago, exdmd said:

The Holo Audio May is the only DAC under $5000 USD that would tempt me to switch from Yggdrasil, but I am in no hurry. I am more concerned it would be a side grade rather than an upgrade so would need some really compelling side by side reviews.

As I pointed out in my now old Holo Spring Level 3 review here, buying a Holo (Spring or now May) gets you TWO dacs for that price (i.e two discrete paths).  You already own a great PCM dac (the Yiggy) but owning a May will likely get you a great PCM dac and a great DSD dac, and there are LOTS of DSD recordings you are missing out on (or converting down to lossy levels).  My $.02

[ted_b]

6 hours ago, juanitox said:

is it me or do you also find that PCM 1.4 or 1.5 is a little better on good recordings than DSD 256 even with ECmodulator?  it s not easy to go against my belief ,  but for sure with this dac PCM rules again :)    , with difficult ones the DSD round touch makes the things more easy :)

Two questions:

1) do you mean PCM recordings, or is this with DSD to PCM too?

2) "with this dac PCM rules again" refers to your (signature) T+A or this thread's subject, the Holo (If Holo, which one)?  Edit: Nevermind, I see you sold your T+A, and have the Spring 2.  :)  Update your signature sometime.  :)  And Happy New Year.  :)

[ted_b]

40 minutes ago, juanitox said:

the T+A needs an Usb isolator to shine the  HOLO seems more immune to the Usb source.🙂

So my original Holo Spring (Kitsune edition) really needs the SU-1.  Are you saying the Holo 2 shines with direct USB?  That would be very nice.  You think May dac can jettison the SU-1 (or any DDC) too?

[ted_b]

3 minutes ago, wouterk said:

I used to have the SU-1 on my original Holo Audio - Level 2. I since use the ISO Regen with linear PSU, and found the SU-1 just another link in the chain which did not improve performance. My current setup works well for me:-)

Yes, I have the ISO Regen in line, too (Into the SU-1), but still find I2S into the Holo is the king.  I know that all the Holos have since undergone new USB interfaces so maybe that's the differentiator.

[ted_b]

Just upgraded my Holo Spring KTE (original) to the newer XU208 XMOS USB module (driver 5.00 and firmware 21.16).   I will break in a bit and then compare to the I2S input via tweaked SU-1. 

[ted_b]

The gap between the sq of my Holo Spring KTE's USB input (good, grade 85) and its I2S input via an externally powered Singxer SU-1 DDC (excellent, grade 95) has changed.  As I previously stated I ordered and recently installed the newer XU208 XMOS USB module in my Holo.  Immediate comparisons had the gap only closing by a point or two, as the new cold module (and driver/firmware) exhibited quite a bit of congestion, but yet was able to gain traction based on almost identical (to SU-1 I2S) dynamics, timbre and overall musicality.  Everything but clarity, a sort of veil or dirty window feeling.

 

I've let the module "break-in" (I guess, don't know any other way to explain :) ) and now the gap is, according to my b-s arbitrary scoring, less than 5 points..more like 1 or 2.  The SU-1 is still worth it, but only cuz it's not thousands of dollars, and for a few hundred I get marginally better sq.  All this in rarified air where some decisions to improve sq by a point or two could cost BIG money.  So I'm sticking with my depreciated SU-1 for now, but I gotta assume a well-integrated XU208 USB module (i.e original equipment) in the Spring 2 or May would make a decent DDC like the SU-1 moot.  Not saying a theoretically better DDC wouldn't push any Holo forward.....unknown but would not surprise me.  As always YMMV. 

[ted_b]

I've done the same upgrade a couple months back.  No issues, but I seem to remember that I also updated the driver (Windows) to V5.0.0   You may be using Linux, so that's irrelevant.  I'd certainly restart the server, NAA or whatever machine the USB is getting it's music from.

[ted_b]

54 minutes ago, pis99 said:

DSD material has nothing to do with EC modules. I was told by Miska not too long ago!

?? EC modulators are about NOTHING BUT DSD.  If you are upsampling either PCM to some version of DSD, or upmodulating lower bit rate DSD to hgher bit rate DSD (DSD256 max at this point in time with EC) then EC modulators are the best modulator you can use, assuming cpu strength.  What is NOT involved is when you upmodulate DSD to another DSD...then PCM filters are not involved.

[ted_b]

7 hours ago, caesee said:

But hqp only support dsd 256 7ecv2.

Not true.  HQP will support whatever the driver of the dac will support.  Please explain.